Again, working from specifically the Final Fantasy 20th Anniversary Ultimania File 2: Scenario guide. This post is a follow-up to the “Sources of Power in FF” article I just posted, which also included translations from the FF 20th Anniversary Ultimania File 2: Scenario book.
Actually, this post might better be characterized as a follow-up to the “Love Triangle Debate- over” article that Ryushikaze posted a couple of days ago. That article included selected translations from the section which I am now posting a translation of in its entirety.
I think you’ll find that the ramifications for the Love Triangle Debate are even more obvious when you can read the entire page. Do enjoy.
FOR THE ONE I LOVE
Through the long journeys, the love of the protagonists develop. Occasionally they become separated, but the two’s value to one another gives them the great strength to overcome whatever crisis may come.
III – The diligent soldier and the meek princess
The love between the soldier and princess of Sasune Castle was divided by social status; Ingus tried to supress his feelings, but Sara would not hide hers.
IV – World just for the two of us
When rescuing Rosa, Cecil frankly declares his true feelings. The two reunited, they tightly embrace for all eyes to see.
VI – Result of the chance encounter
The imperial general and the anti-empire organization member — Celes and Locke’s relation to one another is like ships passing in the night; it’s a long period before they get to communicate their feelings completely.
VII – Secret date
At the Gold Saucer, Cloud receives an invitation from one of his companions. Who comes around with the invitation is dependent on Cloud’s behavior.
VII – The night before the final battle
Thanks to Tifa, Cloud regains himself, and before the final battle with Sephiroth, without using words, he confirms with her that their feelings match.
VIII – Witch Rinoa’s knight
Just before she can be sealed due to being a witch, Squall retakes Rinoa. “I don’t care that you’re a witch” are his words to her, putting her mind at ease.
IX – For the one I must protect
Beatrix becomes the woman to whom Steiner will let no harm befall. For his homeland’s protection and for hers, Steiner brandishes his sword.
IX – Guidance on an investigation of life
Zidane left the company of his companions in front of the Iifa Tree. He survived for the sake of going back to “the place I’ll return to someday,” where the one he loves was waiting for him.
X – Macalania Spring
Yuna is betrayed by the temples she had completely believed in and had made the foundation of her life. Tidus decides to comfort her in this way.
Extra Thread
Scenes involving “love” other than romantic love
In the “FF” series, there’s not just the romantic love between men and women; there are various forms of love depicted. In “FFV,” there’s familial love between Galuf and Krile, as well as the brotherly love between Edgar and Sabin depicted in “FFVI”; and in “FFIX,” there’s an instance of love between Eiko and Mog that goes beyond race. Also, in “FFVI,” there’s the scene where Terra recovers her ability to fight and comes to understand the emotion called “love”; when talking about “love,” this is a scene that shouldn’t be left out.
During the event where Terra recovers her ability to fight, she regains her power and says “I’ll fight to protect the people I love”; she then throws herself back into battle.
To those who can read/write Japanese: why not go to any Japanese Final Fantasy sites/blogs/forums/etc you can find and ask there what the final thought of the Japanese people is?
I can assure you, there is no “final thought of the Japanese people,” any more than there’s a final thought among English speakers for something such as Harry Potter pairings. The Japanese fans are just as capable of closing their minds to logic as anyone else.
OKAY ALL YOU NON-BELIEVING NON-JAPANESE PEOPLE WHO KEEPS ON LOOKING AT DIFFERENT TRANSLATIONS AND NOT SHUTTING UP ABOUT IT BY TRYING TO FIND SOMETHING WRONG WITH EVERYTHING ALREADY IN FRONT OF YOU, DON’T MAKE ME BRING MY DAD AND GRANDMA IN HERE. THEY’RE SO TOTALLY GOING TO WHIP YOUR MISTRANSLATED BUTTS TO THE GROUND WITH YOUR DISRESPECT TO THE JAPANESE LANGUAGE. SERIOUSLY. SHUT UP ABOUT IT.
By the way, I’m a neutral Clack. So you can’t tell me I’m being biased.
I’m also wondering what the heck is “put to test” supposed to mean. What. Someone tell me.
cool story bro
INORITE
ooo ooo I think I can give an example! Did you ever read FAKE manga by Sanami Matoh? In the last volume, Ryo basically has to test if his feelings for Dee are really love by having sex with him XD
XD OMG. Yes. I read that! I can’t believe I forgot about that.
But LOL wtf. This means that since Cloud is testing his feelings of love for Tifa by having sex with her… and with the example given… we can only come to the logical conclusion that Cloud actually loves Zack! IT MAKES PERFECT SENSE!
I have now realized the truth of the LTD. As I always have.
Hey…people….my point of view…is that page can`t say anything clear…
Don`t kill me please XD …it`s just my point of view….
“no, you`re just a clerith!” <– No way! ARGH!!!!!! I`m not. I`m Cloti. XD
But…see…even this page say this , this isn`t what square say. In my point Of view Cloud of course love Aerith, but is strange that he only love her after she is "dead?" ….
And in On a way to Smile Cloud where beying…stupid with Tifa, and he don`t seem really to liked the ideia of he and Tifa be a Family. The things really looked bad in this history. And about Advent Children…the end…You just see Cloud in the end and in a moment Aerith, with a very cool music. "F*ck , what are you trying to say?" Well I`m designer and artist , when we want to do something romantic in a scene we do just things like that.
After play the Crisis Core, FFVII, and see Advent Children, I need to say that seens that the pairing started like CloudxTifa and ZackxAerith and ended like Tifa and Zack with a platonic love and Aerith and Cloud in love. Really…this is very stupid…. fall in love with a dead person and only live in "whatever" way just waiting for the DEATH to stay with your love……..That seems that cloud is too weak to accept the future and just leave the past buried…..and just live suffering with his BUTT-HURT XD (EMO)
Well….if the square state that this ultimania book is right, ok so , but … just seems that they changed they mind again. Or just stated that Cloud falled in love with aerith after she die. XD Or he just like both o_o`gross….
btw… Its just me that think that Denzel seems to be son of Cloud and Aerith? (just in appearence).
Well is that what I think. Of course I`m totally Cloti, but I don`t let my opnion affect the reality of the things. (yes, I need to have courage to say that all, because the fans never let they proud behind to say what they really see….-_-)
I think is more easy nojima just say after years what was the real thing. -_-
My brain hurts after reading that.
And yes this is the final definitive answer to the LTD. If you think the story played out differently then you were just wrong.
agreed.. my brain also hurts after i read his/her opinion..
to be honest.. i did not understand a thing the very first time i read it…
hehehheheh
What I tried to say , is: Nothing was clear
Even in the game the love triangle was very confusing.
If your brain hurt , was more easy just don`t read.
But I think just hurt because you never used it 8B~
LOL… dear brother.. don’t blame me brain.
blame your grammar.. it is you whose not using your
brain, you know why? well, of course you don’t coz
as i’ve said, you’re not using your brain..
i think the ultimanias/RF cleared things up..
ごめん、私わからない。
Lol I love you guys. You keep going on about how, “CLOUD LOVES TIFA THE LOVE TRIANGLE IS OVER FULL STOP,” but whenever someone mentions otherwise you just add to it with, “NOO YOU’RE WRONG HERE’S SOME REASONS WHY!”
… Really? Are you that desperate to have your point proven? You’re all contradicting yourselves, which is pretty silly! If CloTi was announced as canon forever and ever and ever, then it would actually be ANNOUNCED. Not vague stuff like these bad translations, not some essay by a fan, actually crystal clear from Square, “oh btw these guys are in love okay.”
P.S. Stop sucking up to the mods guys! They aren’t better than you. They just think they are.
Also hi! I’m not a Clerith! So if you accuse me of being one, that would prove my point further.
Because I have better things to do than to desperately try and prove my ships are canon. Because in FFVII at least, nothing Cloud related is.
Oh, and don’t try accusing me of wasting my time here either. It took me no time at all to write! And it’s late and I’m about to go to bed.
Treyu, I’d like to respond to your comments.
–”You’re all contradicting yourselves, which is pretty silly!”
Examples, please.
–”If CloTi was announced as canon forever and ever and ever, then it would actually be ANNOUNCED.”
What, with a press conference? What makes it any less likely to be done in an Ultimania?
Hell, when people were saying that Kazushige Nojima’s comments about the two being in a relationship — he even went as far as to refer to a CloudxAerith relationship in hypothetical terms, with “Perhaps things would have gone well with Aerith, but …” — weren’t really implying that, the argument they made was that it would be done in an Ultimania, not in an interview. And then we discover this Ultimania page, which came before that interview.
So, where is the goal post being moved now? What’s the standard become this time?
I tire of this game, personally.
–”Not vague stuff …”
There’s nothing vague about a page announcing that it’s going to discuss FF couples who love one another romantically (“renai” is the Japanese word used in the opening sentence of the page) and then shows a caption of a scene that it describes as a scene in which Cloud and Tifa confirm their feelings — which have been established by the opening sentence to be “renai” (“romantic love”) — for each other to be the same.
Especially when said page goes so far as to have a separate section for types of love that it specifically identifies as being non-romantic love.
There is absolutely nothing vague about this.
–”… these bad translations …”
Why are they bad? Do you have superior translations? Do you have an alternate translation at all?
Can you show your work if you claim that you do?
Until then — and I’m going to say this as kindly as possible — remain silent about the quality of the translations, please. You only look foolish in claiming something to be of poor quality without being able to offer a reason as to why.
–”actually crystal clear from Square, ‘oh btw these guys are in love okay.”’
Which is what the page I translated says.
–”Because I have better things to do than to desperately try and prove my ships are canon. Because in FFVII at least, nothing Cloud related is.”
His birthday isn’t? Hair color? Entire history?
This is an extremely asinine claim.
And like all your other claims, it suffers from a severe lack of examples.
–”Oh, and don’t try accusing me of wasting my time here either.”
Worse. You wasted *my* time.
Everything you just said was wrong
Okay then.
You’re wrong.
And there’s no reason why.
I still don’t get where “to test” comes from. I couldn’t be bothered to ask actual Japanese speaking people because that would be too boring (and I might be accused of making people up), so I went to look at various translation sites instead… and here’s what I got.
Translation of the line 「ティファのおかげで自分を取り戻したクラウドはセフィロスとの最後の戦いを前に言葉では伝えられない想いを彼女と確かめ合う」
Babel Fish:
As for the cloud which recover by your with favor of [teihua] her to verify the thinking which last fight with [sehuirosu] before in word is not conveyed
“to verify” = “to confirm”, yes? Granted, I have no idea what this translation is trying to say.
Excite.co.jp:
Cloud who regains me thanks to [tei;fa] and she confirm the desire to which the last fight with [sefirosu] is not told in the word each other.
“confirm” = there it is again. Unfortunately, this translation seems to imply that Cloud regains “me” thanks to Tifa, and she confirms that she has no desire to speak of the last fight with Sephiroth to each other. …LOLWAT.
Worldlingo.com:
As for the cloud which recover by yourself with favor of [teihua] her to verify the thinking which last fight with [sehuirosu] before in word is not conveyed
We get “to verify” again. But… the whole line doesn’t make any sense.
Babylon:
The cloud which regained oneself thanks to ティファ makes sure of the thought that isn’t conveyed for each other with her by the words ahead of the last fight with セフィロス
Hmm, an incomplete translation. But it’s a lot clearer than most. Cloud “makes sure”. Yup.
So…er…
LOL. It is now up to your interpretation.
FINALLY!!! I was tired of three things:
1) Cloud moping over having not been able to protect Aeris/Aerith.
2) NOT seeing that Tifa could handle her own, and go out like Aerith.
3) Claerith fangirls….she’s DEAD, Cloud’s officially moved on, follw suit. Lol!
[...] in its entirety with her permission. For some context, this essay is in part a response to my and Squall of Seed’s recent articles, as well as the Love Triangle Debate that has plagued much of Final Fantasy [...]
Reading all of this made me get a massive headache.
1. This page is about romantic love. The quote under the picture of Cloud and Tifa is about Cloud and Tifa confirming their romantic love without words. The picture under C/A does not talk about Aerith. It only mentions the infamous date scene.
2. This page is merely the latest (and most damming) official word of God on the subject that has been translated. And short of ignoring it completely it can’t be taken out of context.
3. Utterly meaningless or taken out of context.
4. Keep your wonderful clerith delusion alive nond. It is an endless source of amusement.
koibito got debunked numerous times? Don’t tell me koispacebito means anything to you.
Define ‘debunked’, cause it seems you are using a different meaning than the one I’m aware of.
Get over it, okay?
This is not your typical romantic story as your preferance. I see nothing on this arguing the meaning of the word. Well some may critisizing IF she/he could prove she/he is right. MEANS FACTS, PLEASE!
And i really appreciate the work of SoS. I don’t think something with no base on it and have been approved would be here, to be read by many fans who, maybe in a chance, fluent in Japanese too.
Well if the translation itself can’t satisfied some people, guess to post the original one-in japanese-would be sufficient enough to invite open arguments and let see which one has lost his/her mind in ship that she/he can’t think clearly.
I don’t mean to offend anyone. I just want people to think clearly, seperating your mind with your feeling since feeling won’t work when the FACTS in it.
And no, you wouldn’t hurt because your ship isn’t canon, because you still can love it, with all of your heart.
Question please! Didn’t one of the creators of FF7 say that there were no canon relationships, that he liked the fans to decide? Wouldn’t his word trump all?
No. That was never said.
The only thing close I can think of is “the answers are all there”.
And even if something like that was stated back in 1997 or whenever. SE has made it clear who the canon couple of FFVII is by this time.
Hahaha…
Ive been readıng alot of threadsss regardıng thıs Love Trıangle but none of them made me realıze that Tıfa and Cloud have mutual feelıngs.
The thıng that Aerıth/cloud fans have to accept ıs Aerıth ıs dead. But ın return, to be faır, thıs ıs a fantasy and a fıctıonal story, we couldn’t know the truth ıf the evıdences are ınsuffıcıent. Square Enıx should made another sequel for the Ps3 console to know the answer to thıs undead ıssue.. LOL..
Except SE has told us flat out multiple times that Cloud and Tifa reveal their mutual feelings under the Highwind. And they have told us multiple times those feeling are of desire/romantic love.
Seriously what else do you need to reach a conclusion?
Phew!
I keep on readıng all over agaın.
I kept on smılıng when there ıs a defender of CLoTı, but people who keep on tellıng that ıt ıs Clorıth, ı become confuse agaın.
Who does Cloud loves???
The wrıter doesnt seem to answer ıt perfectly.
Maybe they are aware about thıs argument and all they have to do ıs to laugh about thıs. Well, thıs regaın a popularıty for Fınal Fantasy VII. It was been a year sınce ı last watched the AC..
I guess, there should be another part… That answers ıf cloud marrıed tıfa and say ı love you then have embraces and kısses..
Hehehehe..
I kept on belıevıng that Aerıth just appear on the AC to remove the guılt that cloud carrıes after her death. Then fınally cloud fınally set her guılt free after Aerıth uttered, “see, everythıng ıs alrıght” wıth hondsome Zack on the sıde,
Well, that ıs the fınal appearance of dear Aerıth and may she rest ın peace together wıth Zack, and dont come back to buıld conflıct wıthın the relatıon of Lovely Tıfa!! LOL..
Well, ıs there an offıcıal statement from the wrıter that tells everyone that cloud ıs for tıfa? Well, maybe another questıon that dıdn’t make everyone move on. Oh my God, ı am confuse!!! Hahaha.. But ı fınd all CloTı fans answers really logıcally ıntellıgent.. Keep ıt up.. I belıeve on YOu guys!!
Thıs ıs really what ı feel when ı want Leon Kennedy for Claıre, but he establıshed a feelıngs for Ada when they subtıtute the scenarıos that made me deppressed but well then, konamı ıs contınue to buıld up another sequel so there ıs at least 1% chance for theır reunıon. Ahahaha,
Hopıng that Fınal Fantasy VII too… I am crazy and can’t get over thıs!!
Are you going to make sense at some point? As for who Cloud loves. It is spelled out as plainly as it can be on this very page. Tifa.
Are you honestly confused about this? Or is this some attempt to cast doubt by pretending confusion?
Oops ıt should be *conflıcts on the relatıonshıp of cloud and tıfa
Typo error due to excıtement! Bye :p
Eı @vendel, ı am not makıng fıght here. Hopefully you are mısınterpreted wıth my post (T_T)
Thanks for your kınd explanatıon and ı wıll fully accept ıt. Maybe thıs ıs just a result of readıng threads about the love trıangle because have theır own explanatıon. I just so love tıfa for cloud that’s why.
Yeah, ı am truly confuse. I am satısfıed to your answer! I guess, ı must be contented to what ı have read ın Wıkıpedıa that they really have mutual feelıngs but ı have to vısıt the other threads for confırmatıon, but there are CloRıth fans whose tryıng to conclude that aerıth ıs the one that cloud truly love.
Once agaın, thank you…
Dont get me wrong. I was just attached to the story and ı love the characted of Tıfa. Perfect for Cloud.
I wouldn’t really go anywhere else to get official word on this whole mess.
This site has the relevant translations you need. Done by people that even Wikipedia uses as sources.
Also if you were genuinely confused then let me apologize. But the vast majority of people that claim that “there is no answer” or they are “not convinced”. Are simply desperate Cloud/Aerith shippers.
[...] I believe the answer is and always pretty much has been Tifa and one of the main reasons is this: Translations from the FF 20th Anniversary Ultimania — For the One I Love | The Lifestream That clearly states that Cloud and Tifa share a romantic night under the highwind while saying [...]
Tifa looks like a slut.
Why don’t you try to buy a mirror and take a GOOD, HARD look at it…
So, are you PERFECT to just say that someone looks like a slut or something?
Who are you anyways?
I wish you should just DIE.
SUFFER IN HELL YOU BEAST.
…I read all your comments and….
I think I need a cold compress. haha.
What’s wrong with being a Clerith and being a Cloti?
(except for the fact that Zack was being left out while Cloud got all the attention.. haha)
Please, we can all survive by minding our own business without bashing the other side’s opinion.
I’m a certified CLOTI btw, but I don’t go to CLERITH websites and say “YA’LL ARE LUNATICS, YA’LL GONNA DIE!!”
And even if I turn CLERITH, I wouldn’t do that to CLOTIs either.
I’m a sixteen year old girl, English isn’t my native language but I’m pretty good at it, I don’t know how to read or speak Japanese but, what the heck, I don’t even need to know that.
I just enjoy the moment, accept what Square-Enix does with their video game, and be thankful that it even existed.
But… then, I think again… If Cloud and Aerith is really meant for each other…
HOW ABOUT POOR ZACK??? he’s all alone… :’( heehee…
(and to the person who said Tifa looks like a slut…
No one’s interested in your opinion whether if Tifa looked like a slut. Sorry, YOU’RE PERFECT… Why don’t you just keep your big PIE-HOLE shut, DIE in a corner and stay away and compete with God since you believe you’re all “THAT”?)
P.S.: Thank God he even created such PEOPLE like you. (are you even a human being? haha I guess not.)