Hopes for Remake & Rebirth (story/content)

[Jairus]

Square addressed that back in the first FF 20th Anniversary Ultimania in 2008. Last Order was designated as non-canon way back then.

Yeah, but you specifically said here "all the events" - by the nature of that statement, that includes contradictory ones, which makes no sense.

No one said anything about "instead of another," but it's on the page that she was thinking about it at that moment. =|

Why would it have to be in OTWAS at all and not at some point during the remake series itself? You think she can only ever think of the bombings at that time and no other ever?

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Yeah, but you specifically said here "all the events" - by the nature of that statement, that includes contradictory ones, which makes no sense.

I did not word it as "all the events," but even had I done so, Last Order was described as "a work outside the Compilation." So "the events of the Compilation" (my actual wording) does not include LO anyway.

Why would it have to be in OTWAS at all and not at some point during the remake series itself? You think she can only ever think of the bombings at that time and no other ever?

Dude, you're killing me. x_x

 

[Jairus]

I did not word it as "all the events," but even had I done so, Last Order was described as "a work outside the Compilation." So "the events of the Compilation" (my actual wording) does not include LO anyway.

And what about other contradictory events in the Compilation? LO was just one example.

Dude, you're killing me. x_x

That's not an answer to my question.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

And what about other contradictory events in the Compilation? LO was just one example.

The scene from "Episode:Tifa" is not one of them, so why are you fixating on this??

That's not an answer to my question.

Your question is an absolute non sequitur.

I commented on how a specific post-FFVII scene would be ruined for me if your proposed idea were adopted; now you're asking me why I'm saying Tifa can only think about the reactor bombing in that one scene. What you're asking does not connect in any way with what I said. You are the only one talking about that odd notion.

I even said "No one said anything about [that scene] 'instead of another'" back here and you're still running with this!

 

[Jairus]

The scene from "Episode:Tifa" is not one of them, so why are you fixating on this??

I wasn't talking about that in relation to the Episode:Tifa scene. Just in terms of your statement of including all events of the Compilation in the remake's canon. It had nothing to do with E:T.

Your question is an absolute non sequitur.

I commented on how a specific post-FFVII scene would be ruined for me if your proposed idea were adopted; now you're asking me why I'm saying Tifa can only think about the reactor bombing in that one scene. What you're asking does not connect in any way with what I said. You are the only one talking about that odd notion.

I even said "No one said anything about [that scene] 'instead of another'" back here and you're still running with this!

You said thinking about the bombing in that scene would ruin it for you. I was saying it didn't have to be that moment when she thought about it, but a different moment. You misunderstood me.

 

[jazzflower92]

I think my issues with the Compilation is a lot of times it tries to retcon in things that don't mesh with the original games themes. Or shoehorn in melodrama that goes over the top. I think the Compilation should have been something that expanded on material that we didn't really see in the originally like Sephiroth's childhood, the Wutai War, More information on the Cetra, etc. But I think it just opens up new questions about other material.

 

[Random Nobody]

Spoiler

I've seen it argued that the plate drop is enough to establish Shinra's ruthlessness, and that them also being responsible for the reactor is redundant.
If this were the original game, I'd agree, but it isn't. From what I understand, plate fall happens well into the remake. Over half way through. So there's potentially 20 hours of gameplay before then. Shinra needs to be established as the ruthless group they are earlier than that.

Spoiler

I'm not sure I buy that as satisfactory reason, given that Shin-Ra's demonstrable corporate evil is evidenced all around the setting and could be further (and more subtly) illustrated through side content and environmental story telling.

If the change is "necessary", to iterate that point, it's probably less that plate fall happens late in the game and more that

Spoiler: BIG TICC spoilers about remake platefall from the script

allegedly....no one dies during it but Biggs and Jessie because everyone else managed to evacuate

....Which would still be a result of another massive diversion that wasn't strictly necessary and is frankly baffling.

 

[Makoeyes987]

That's not true, nor frankly even possible.

People live on the surface of the plate too. In the OG people died from being crushed and from the catastrophe of being on a plate dropping 100 meters from the sky onto the ground. Casualties are guaranteed.

Anyways fixating on the reactor detail and having it be the hill to die on is ignoring the entirety of the whole story and what gets built from around it. Just wait and see before making such judgment.

 

[Random Nobody]

Spoiler

The mention was strictly of those in the slum as far as evacuation goes -- particularly Marle and the rest of the more prominent NPCs. What supposedly becomes of those on the plate, I don't know, but I can't be assed to ctrl+f because I also don't much care.

One would hope this particular detail false, but so far near everything that came along with it has been confirmed by the demo and teaser footage, down to the lines.

But I'm not making any judgement. The changes are baffling to me because I have no further context for them. But as far as feelings about the Remake go, I have none whatsoever.

 

[Clement Rage]

For what it's worth, I am waiting and seeing. But that particular detail isn't my favourite thing to hear.

I think my issues with the Compilation is a lot of times it tries to retcon in things that don't mesh with the original games themes. Or shoehorn in melodrama that goes over the top. I think the Compilation should have been something that expanded on material that we didn't really see in the originally like Sephiroth's childhood, the Wutai War, More information on the Cetra, etc. But I think it just opens up new questions about other material.

The thing about the Wutai war is, it doesn't really work as the focus of a game. Many games have their leads dip their toes in a war, but they nearly always avoid dropping them in it completely. The lead characters are always doing the critical mission that's somewhere apart from the main battle, because if they're fighting on the frontlines, individual people can't do anything important, and any realistic battles will be boring and repetitive.

Take that hill, retreat from that hill, take the hill again, take the windmill 300 yards south of the hill, you've been flankattacked, retreat to the hill.

From FF9 to Mass Effect, games stay out of direct war because it doesn't work.

 

[Theozilla]

Regarding the

Spoiler

the Sector 7 plate drop, the notion that it causes zero casualties aside from the Avalanche trio I think can confidently be said to be false. More people in the Sector 7 slums evacuating doesn’t equal no causalities (or even imply that all of the slums were evacuated). I mean in addition to Marlene, Johnny was also another NPC in the OG who survived the plate drop. I’m betting in the Remake it probably be the gameplay mechanic NPCs that survive, like the Materia and weapons/armor upgraders. Also it isn’t unreasonable to have some of the Sector 7 slums survive, it wouldn’t be out of choice for Aerith to warn as many people as possible in the Sector 7 slums to get the fuck out of dodge as she was going to retrieve Marlene.

 

[Ite]

Regarding the

Spoiler

the Sector 7 plate drop, the notion that it causes zero casualties aside from the Avalanche trio I think can confidently be said to be false. More people in the Sector 7 slums evacuating doesn’t equal no causalities (or even imply that all of the slums were evacuated). I mean in addition to Marlene, Johnny was also another NPC in the OG who survived the plate drop. I’m betting in the Remake it probably be the gameplay mechanic NPCs that survive, like the Materia and weapons/armor upgraders. Also it isn’t unreasonable to have some of the Sector 7 slums survive, it wouldn’t be out of choice for Aerith to warn as many people as possible in the Sector 7 slums to get the fuck out of dodge as she was going to retrieve Marlene.

Spoiler

Johnny was at the Honeybee Inn when the plate falls, that’s why he survives. This is supposed to be the lowest point of the Midgar story, lessening its impact and it’s consequences on the game (taking away shops, characters, etc.) shows how cowardly and lilywhite the writers have become.

 

[Theozilla]

Spoiler

Johnny was at the Honeybee Inn when the plate falls, that’s why he survives. This is supposed to be the lowest point of the Midgar story, lessening its impact and it’s consequences on the game (taking away shops, characters, etc.) shows how cowardly and lilywhite the writers have become.

How

Spoiler

Johnny happened to survive doesn’t negate the fact that he still survived in the OG. And besides the Avalanche trio (who are still gonna die in the Remake, I’m skeptical of the rumor that Wedge is surviving for no apparent reason) there weren’t really any major story NPCs who died in the plate drop in the OG. And there was like one shop IIRC in the Sector 7 slums in the OG. In the Remake there are multiple gameplay mechanic characters who are utilized over several chapters, I’m guessing them surviving is more a timesaver on the developers from having to program and create entirely new gameplay mechanic NPCs than anything else. A couple of new NPCs surviving the plate drop really doesn’t lessen the impact of plate drop IMO. Thousands of civilians are still going to die in the Remake, there will be no shortage of causalities. I really think parts of the leaks have been taken out of context and/or presumed on too much without proper context.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Spoiler

Johnny was at the Honeybee Inn when the plate falls, that’s why he survives. This is supposed to be the lowest point of the Midgar story, lessening its impact and it’s consequences on the game (taking away shops, characters, etc.) shows how cowardly and lilywhite the writers have become.

That's a tad harsh an indictment for vague speculation. =P

 

[Ite]

That's a tad harsh an indictment for vague speculation. =P

PREORDER CANCELLED TRRAAAUUGGH
(you’re quite right lol, but I’m probably right too bahahaha, going stir crazy can’t do shit except fret about video games and death lol)

 

[Elisa Maza]

Spoiler

With the Compilation remaining canon, people are definitely dying when that plate falls; it is a major plot point and a critical point in Tifa and Barret's OtWtaS novels which complement ACC, which is "at the heart of the Remake" as Nomura said. We don't know who dies, but the trio definitely will.

 

[albert graham]

Spoiler

In #FinalFantasy VII Remake Tifa and Aerith glam themselves up to infiltrate Don Corneo's mansion, and Cloud is left with no choice but to dress to impress… Each character has multiple outfits too!

Like how SE expanded the Remake for Tifa and Aerith to have multiple outfits as well. Think about the replay value it would give for the game.
Will have to reactivate my gamefaqs account to scroll through the alternate outfits unlock guide when the game is out.

 

[Jairus]

That's fine and all, but what I really hope for is, will Jessie have the chance to dress up/be in an outfit too other than her Avalanche gear (aside from her train disguise)? Obviously not for the Wall Market sequence, but maybe in a different part of the game, a side mission for her or something. It would just be nice for her to have the same fun and opportunity as the other girls and let us see her in a way we aren't used to. SE goes on and gives Aerith and Tifa multiple extra outfits, but there's nary a peep on whether Jessie will get even one. She's a girl, too, after all. And I'm sure she doesn't wear that armor all the time or go to bed in it. She's got to let her hair down (figuratively at least, if not literally) sometime.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Probably not.

 

[Jairus]

Well, you never know. Considering her past and what she used to do, a flashback showing that would certainly involve her looking differently than her Avalanche gear. And that's just one example. You don't have to be contrary, you know.

"Oh no, we can't possibly allow a significant secondary character to ever get some of the same perks and treatment as a main character. That would destroy gaming as we know it. The horror!"

Seriously, though, I don't see how it would hurt anything. But I don't want to derail the thread, either. So I won't go any further into it here.

 

[Makoeyes987]

The thing is, is FFVII-R is a tight, narrative driven story. It offers some leeway and down time to do mission type things aside from the plot, but this is a heavily narrative focused game. It's chapter based. You're at the mercy of the plot's progression so, unless the stakes and the story get heavily changed and slowed down, I don't see there being lots of opportunity for those type of events with Jessie to happen.

Like, if this were FFXV? What you're talking about could happen and wouldn't be a bad thing. But the thing is, is given the plot and stakes of the plot, there's like, very few parts I could imagine that being even feasible. The times you're gonna be with Jessie are the times you'll be doing shit to drive the plot forward and the stakes are gonna be high. This sadly won't be like FFXV where you'll get to move at your own pace, chill at camp fire, shoot the shit, and spar into the night while Tifa cooks a meal and Barret laughs while enjoying a drink.

It's not about hurting anything, there's just no time and the writers aren't gonna divert from the story that hard to include stuff that would just not fit the theme. It's not an open-world, play-at-your-pace FF like XV.

 

[Jairus]

I'll respond to this in the trio's thread so I don't take this one off course.

 

[LNK]

That's fine and all, but what I really hope for is, will Jessie have the chance to dress up/be in an outfit too other than her Avalanche gear (aside from her train disguise)? Obviously not for the Wall Market sequence, but maybe in a different part of the game, a side mission for her or something. It would just be nice for her to have the same fun and opportunity as the other girls and let us see her in a way we aren't used to. SE goes on and gives Aerith and Tifa multiple extra outfits, but there's nary a peep on whether Jessie will get even one. She's a girl, too, after all. And I'm sure she doesn't wear that armor all the time or go to bed in it. She's got to let her hair down (figuratively at least, if not literally) sometime.

Maybe she'll be wearing something different when Cloud comes to her parents house?

 

[Jairus]

That's sort of what I was saying:
https://thelifestream.net/forums/th...-roles-in-the-remake-thread.22294/post-843311

 

[Clement Rage]

This is almost the only game where I've ever cared about alternate costumes, I hope Tifa gets the option to wear her AC outfit, because that's one of the best costume designs in all of FF.