Bleach (Manga Spoilers Not Tagged) [WSJ]

AKA
The Engineer
The thing for me is that Bleach never really had a "win state" until Azien came up, at which point the "win state" became beating Azien which was never was really followed though with. This gives the series no clear end goal to feel "finished" when that goal is reached.

Naruto's "win state" is blatantly stated in the first oh, twenty pages of the manga; Naruto wants to be Hokage. The only questions is why he wants that and how he's going to accomplish it as at the beginning of the series nobody thinks he can do it. These questions form the driving force of the manga and bring a satisfying end to it when it turns out that Naruto really does become Hokage and for all the right reasons. The thing is that's what the main character has been wanting since Ch. 1.

With Bleach, I never got the idea that taking over his dad's clinic was something even on Ichigo's mind throughout the entire series (if anything, he attitude is the opposite). It literally feels like it came up out of nowhere.

In fact, that's how a lot of stuff is the last arc feels like, deaths come out of nowhere, characters dissapear to nowhere (when was the last we saw Isshin?), relationships come out of nowhere... etc. It's like Kubo is using the "10 years later" thing to gloss over all that.

I don't know, I just feel like Kubo has just done what he's wanted to with the series over the years without regard for the characterizations he's given his characters and nothing makes or breaks a story like good/bad characterization does. So when an author is sloppy with it, it feels like the whole series is sloppy which is kinda how I feel about Bleach as a whole.
 

The Mad King

Harbinger of Darkness
AKA
Lord Noctis, Caius Ballad, Midnight Rider of War, Quilge Opie
Like just about everyone I was pretty disappointed in the way Bleach ended. Like, I don't think the ending is bad because of the things that happened. I think the things that happened were fine. The ending is bad because of all the things that aren't in it. Who is the soul king now? What happened to Urahara, Yoruichi, Grimmjow, Nel, and Hallibel?

Also, while, I actually kinda did enjoy the final battle, it did seem rather short for the final battle of a fifteen year manga. I'm also not sure how Yhwach failed to foresee Uryuu's arrow piercing him. Maybe still silver represents a blind spot in the Almighty? Seems plausible, but who knows? Kubo, I suppose, but he didn't put the answer in the manga, so there you go.

Rushed messy ending aside, I find that I still like this blood war arc as a whole. It had an incredibly strong start, and didn't really start developing issues until around the Mask fight imo. It did have a number of issues pop up from that point, but I don't think it ever got bad, and there was plenty of cool stuff in there as well, including some good fights, cool character designs, and even some occasional, if underutilized character developement . I probably still prefer the arrancar arc overall, and the Soul Society arc remains the best arc from a storytelling standpoint, but I still like this arc. I'd call it a 6.5 out of ten. I'd bump that up to a 7 if the ending were a bit more fleshed out.

I guess the future of Bleach is a bit shaky now. We've got word of a live action movie which pretty much nobody wanted, and no news of the return of the anime, which most fans would have greatly preferred over the live action movie. Some might think the anime won't return at all, which seems reasonable given the rushed ending the manga received. I'm in the camp that think Shonen Jump made Kubo finish earlier than he originally planned, and if thats true it seems unlikely that they'd green light a new anime series.

However, I think there is a chance for the anime to return, and its thanks to the live action movie, funnily enough. I see one of two possible ways for this to happen.

1. The anime is brought back in order to generate hype for the new movie.

2. If the movie does well upon release it would show that Bleach can still bring in money, and thus a new anime might get made.

I'd prefer the first option, but option 2 seems more likely. Hopefully if the anime ever does return we can get a more fleshed out ending there.

Either way, for the time being at least, its time to say goodbye to Bleach. Its been a hell of a ride, and I'm sad to see it done. I'll be back for the live action movie, though my expectations are low, and if the anime ever comes back I'll be all over it, but until then, sayonara Bleach.
 

lithiumkatana17

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Lith
I didn't even notice this post until now.

I did go on over to the Beach forum I used to frequent a few hours before I saw this; evidently Bleach is getting 'remixed' i.e., they're re-releasing the series over a period of time with new covers and such.

It got a few people freaked out, thinking that Kubo was somehow leaving SJ and going to fix the botched ending of his series, but given that they've done the same 'remix' thing with Naruto, it's doubtful that will happen.
 

lithiumkatana17

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Lith
I think I'm going to reread the manga/watch the anime again. I was feeling very nostalgic for the series this morning at work, listening to clips on my phone before we opened. I want to go back and remember what made Bleach so good in the first place, and why I fell in love with it.
 

Airling

Ninja-Fairy-Jedi-Princess
I think I'm going to reread the manga/watch the anime again
I keep saying this too, and then Darth lightly rolls his eyes and laughs, because I just barely finished it all. But I can't help it. I'm trying dudes, really trying, to get into Naruto, but I just can't. It doesn't fill the Bleach shaped hole in my heart.
 
AKA
The Engineer
I wouldn't put down Naruto until at least the Wave Arc as that's when one of the most important themes in the entire manga is brought up. The further you can get past that, the better it gets. The only arc that is kinda a slog to get through is the Tournament Arc and even then, there's so much character development/introduction and worldbuilding that the rest of the manga runs on in that arc that it's worth paying attention to. And then Akatsuki gets introduced and the manga never really slows down again
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
I wouldn't put down Naruto until at least the Wave Arc as that's when one of the most important themes in the entire manga is brought up. The further you can get past that, the better it gets. The only arc that is kinda a slog to get through is the Tournament Arc and even then, there's so much character development/introduction and worldbuilding that the rest of the manga runs on in that arc that it's worth paying attention to. And then Akatsuki gets introduced and the manga never really slows down again
I actually watched the Naturo anime through the Chunin exams, and then used that to catapult myself into binge-reading the manga just before the Search for Sasuke arc (and then kept reading it weekly for a decade), and I think it really helped to get to know the characters and have internal voices for them, etc.

I basically jumped from anime to manga with Bleach and Naruto at close to the same time, and watched both of them until they hit filler arcs. Lots of nostalgia for those times.


Also: Is the Bleach Hell movie any good? I saw that it was on Netflix, and remember that Hell was one of the earliest concepts that I was SUPER intrigued by in Bleach that never really got dug into too deeply in the manga.





X :neo:
 

Lulcielid

Media Thinker
AKA
Lucis Caelum
I'd say its good enough, 7/10 for me.

Positives:

Best animation out of the four movies.
Best fights
Probably the best movie villan (that said the bar was never that high)
Hell is a pretty interesting place.

Negative:

Now this negative is a big YMMV but I personally felt it was very lackluster in the emotional department.
 

Flare

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Flare
I watched it a couple years ago iirc and, from my memory, I thought it was enjoyable to watch. The best part is how it sheds light on Hell, which is never really delved into in the manga and anime. So if you want more lore then you'll probably enjoy it. :D
 

Lulcielid

Media Thinker
AKA
Lucis Caelum
If you ask me I would rank the movies like this:

Memories of Nobody: It might have the less visually impressive animation of them all and the weakest villand too but it singlehandly has the most powerful gutpunching emotional story of all the BLEACH movies as well the best movie only character of them all (Senna). It holds the feat of being the only BLEACH movie that made me cry by the end credits (Fade to Black came close). 8.8/10

Diamond Dust Rebellion: Less favourite of them all, mostly because I'm not a big fan of Toushiro (I like him just enough as a character). I personally liked the twin Hyorinmarou idea. The second weaket villan in the movie series. 6.5/10

Fade to Black: My second favourite bleach movie, mainly because it has Rukia as a central character. This movie has second best villans (Again the bar was never high). The bond between Rukia and Ichigo and what them meeting meant in the grand scheme of things is what makes the movie good. I have very mix feelings with the parasite hollow thing. 8/10

Already covered Hell Verse. 7/10
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
Watched Hell Verse last night and enjoyed it.

Also, as a result I watched the first 5 episodes of Bleach & the first episode of Naruto and she's absolutely in love with them. My life is a wonderful wave of nostalgia and happiness.





X :neo:
 

Lulcielid

Media Thinker
AKA
Lucis Caelum
As many of you may or may not be aware of, post manga ending (as the time of this writing) two novels have been released, these being: WE DO knot ALWAYS LOVE YOU and Can't Fear Your Own World


The former is already fully translated and the later is yet to be finished but there're already a bunch of chapters translated.

And for the the lazy, here is (an incomplete) TL;DR of Can't Fear Your Own World (which provides conclusion and answer to many questions left unanswered) :

 

lithiumkatana17

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Lith
Figures. They're not written by Kubo, so no rush or urge to translate them for an American audience. Although I was displeased by the way the series ended, I wouldn't mind reading these.
 
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