Final Fantasy XVI

[Lex]

I know some people find it bland

Underwhelming and bland

This meme has been everywhere today so I couldn't resist using it

 

[Makoeyes987]

Underwhelming and bland.
Square-Enix seems to be suffering from shaky camera syndrome. Who's directing this, Michael Bay? As nauseating as watching Kingsglaive. Oh, and superfast Kingdom Hearts gameplay again -- yay (not). I can't see what's happening.
Character design...well, it looks like every other game, doesn't it. You can already see the (USA) box art now - Scarface, eyes down, holding a sword, looking moody.
Hey, Square, here's an really coll original idea to ramp up FFXVI marketing prior to release in 2037 - promise 23 bits of DLC (including Cloud's buster sword and Yuna's summoner dress), a CGI movie, an anime series and 12 phone games.
I was really hyped about Versus XIII/XV from the day it was announced. Then they said it would be a road trip with the Backstreet Boys and I was disappointed. Then I watched Kingsglaive. I still haven't bought XV. Hopefully XVI at least marks the death of XV.

Voice acting is eneventful - some awkward whispering and overacted lines in there - but I seem to be in the minority that think FFX had the best, most natural voice acting of the series. For most of the the trailer I had no idea which of the copy-paste characters are talking. Joshua's got a really deep voice sometimes!

Overall though, I really hope this prequel focuses more on the relationship between the Children of the Forest and the White Walkers, and I hope Bran the Builder is a playable character, and can summon a dire wolf.

This edgelord came into the thread like

 

[Cat on Mars]

View attachment 7712

This meme has been everywhere today so I couldn't resist using it

I said the exact opposite but okay. I'm done living anyway.

 

[Slipstreamer]

Like how some special, wonderful people - truly a boon to our society - pronounce FFX "Final Fantasy Ex", I hope to popularise terming this game "Final Fantasy SVEE"

 

[Odysseus]

^Now this I can get behind

 

[Strangelove]

since differences between the english and japanese has been brought up, and i did one for ff7r, i went to compare the scripts for this too. the english one i started myself until half way through i noticed there were subtitles on youtube, which is good because that's official and in my transcribing i wrote 'dolmex' because i didn't know the spelling lol. the japanese one i based on a transcript i found online but there was a stream of the showcase with japanese subtitles so i used those to bring it in line with the official text (although there was a part not in the japanese subs but in the japanese audio)

俺たちの任務は《ドミナント》の暗殺 (Our mission is the assassination of the Dominant.)
標的を間違えるなよ (Do not get the wrong target.)
You all know the target. Shiva's Dominant. And only the Dominant.

the japanese line makes it more explicit that their task is to murder the dominant.

女だろ　戦場で間違えるかよ (It's a woman, you think we'll mistake her on the battlefield?)
How do we know the girl will even be among them?

the japanese line seems to take for granted that she will be there, and doesn't really have the doubt of the english line

これがある限り　俺たちに拒否権は無い (As long as we have this [face tattoo], we have no right to refuse.)
疑問を持つな (Do not harbour doubts.)
Our kind do not question orders, we follow them.

the second line seems to be missing from the english trailer, or it got rolled into a single line. is 'our kind' clear that it means the tattoo? (the visuals do focus on them)

おい　ありゃあ！？ (Hey, what's that!?)
Sergeant, they've summoned their Eikon.

this is either a different line, or vastly different.

くそッ　早々に召喚獣を出してきたか！ (Damn it, have they brought out their Eikon this quickly!)
Eikon? That thing's a bloody mountain!

same as above. the japanese term for 'eikon' is the same as most games in japanese.

マザークリスタルをめぐって　また戦が始まる (Another war will start over the Mothercrystal.)
Our foe will not relinquish their Mothercrystal easily. This will be a bitter fight.

idk if war in this setting are always about taking crystals (a la ff type-0's). but the japanese line indicates previous conflicts (which is mentioned in a later line in english as well.

また部屋を抜け出して　いけない子ね (Slipping out of your room again, naughty child.)
さあ　ジョシュア (Come, Joshua.)
陛下をお迎えに上がりましょう (Let us go meet His Majesty.)
You should not be out of doors. We have discussed this. Come, Joshua. Your father will be expecting us.

this woman just sounds evil in japanese, i don't trust her.

ジョシュアのナイトだからな　あいつを守ってやらなきゃ (I am Joshua's Knight, after all. I must protect him.)
I am Joshua's Shield. I'm sworn to protect him.

some differences in terminology

援軍を出せぬだと！？話が違う！それでは何の為の同盟だ！ (You won't send reinforcements!? That's not the agreement! Then what is the purpose of our alliance!)
What do you mean, you refuse? Did you not pledge your sword to our cause!?

the japanese subtitles on the showcase stream didn't include the middle line (that's not the agreement!), but it is in japanese audio

いったい何を焦っておいでか (What on earth are you fretting for?)
先の大陸戦争の折も　貴国は見事に奴らを防いだではありませんか (During the previous continental war, did you not successfully repel them?)
What does it matter? It was the Dhalmeks who drove back the Crusaders in the Battle of the Twin Realms, was it not?

this japanese line doesn't have so many terms

人はクリスタルの加護なしに生きて行けぬ (Man cannot live without the protection of the crystal.)
Without the blessing of the Mothercrystal, we cannot defend our realm from the spread of the Blight.

the japanese line uses 'crystal' instead of 'mothercrystal' and doesn't mention a 'blight'

竜騎士を送り込んでくるとは (So they're sending in the dragoons.)
ザンベルクの奴らめ 戦を始めたいのか (Zanberk dogs. Do they want to start a war?)
So, they sent in the dragoons. Imperial vipers. Do they really mean to invade us?

in a reversal, this time the japanese line introduces a new name for something, the empire is apparently called 'zanberk' (or something)

大公の息子だ！ (It's the Archduke's son!)
It's the Archduke's son.

the original transcription i found said "hyden/haiden's (?) son" but i couldn't make out the dialogue clearly, but the showcase stream subs said archduke. i initially thought the 'son' was the protagonist, but after the line before to joshua saying 'his majesty' i guess joshua is the archduke's son? (do you call archdukes 'majesty'?)

フェニックス！ (Phoenix!)
The Phoenix!

ジョシュア！やめろ！ (Joshua! Stop!)
Joshua, stop this!

フェニックスのほかに　なぜ火の召喚獣が！ (Why is there an Eikon of Fire other than Phoenix!)
A second Eikon of Fire!? But... that's impossible!

phrased differently but not very different

これはクリスタルの加護を断ち切るための物語 (This is a story to end the protection of the crystals.)
The legacy of the crystals has shaped our history for long enough.

the japanese line sounds like it isn't dialogue? or it might be dialogue, idk

やめろ・・・やめてくれ・・・弟なんだ！ (Stop... Stop this... That's my [younger] brother!)
Please, Joshua! Wake up!

this was mentioned before

俺は　必ず奴を殺す (I swear I will kill [him?])
I'll kill you if it's the last thing I do.

the japanese line isn't talking to the someone he's going to kill? unless the english line is talking to himself

 

[Cat on Mars]

the original transcription i found said "hyden/haiden's (?) son" but i couldn't make out the dialogue clearly, but the showcase stream subs said archduke. i initially thought the 'son' was the protagonist, but after the line before to joshua saying 'his majesty' i guess joshua is the archduke's son? (do you call archdukes 'majesty'?)

No, that's incorrect. The proper etiquette is the following:

Addressing an Archduke or Archduchess: His/Her Grace. Upon meeting give a deep bow accompanied with "Your Grace" every meet. This is usually held by royal family members; More commonly cousins or in rare cases bastard siblings. This court is held in a Kingdom setting.

It's just a mistake. The confusion may stem from the fact that Archdukes' sons and daughters are called "princes" and "princesses", respectively.

 

[Strangelove]

okay. i thought i might have confused or mistyped 陛下 and it was a different title maybe, but i checked and it is 陛下 which is only used for monarchs and emperors

disregard all that joshua stuff i said, i suck

 

[Ite]

Archdukes are monarchs (literally prime-leader) the term describes a petty king, below an international authority like the Holy Roman Emperor, but as independent as you can be within a network of states. Again, gettin’ some Ivalice vibes.

“I’ll kill you if it’s the last thing I do” definitely seems to set up a Noctis vs. Joshua main plot, but the more I look at it, the more Joshua seems to be someone to protect/save, not destroy.

Joshua is the Ifrit dominant, and ONLY the dominant Ifrit. As far as I can tell, Phoenix is wrecking shit during the Empire’s assassination of the Archduke which inspires Ifrit to manifest/Joshua to go berserk and Eva Unit 01 his own countrymen. This could be the climax of Noctis’s flashback, and then we flash forward to him joining Gafgarion the Order of Very Fine Face Tattooed Men.

Super cringe that the Japanese line says “A woman on the battlefield? LOL.” Jesus fucking Christ.

 

[Theozilla]

Super cringe that the Japanese line says “A woman on the battlefield? LOL.” Jesus fucking Christ.

Unless I am misinterpreting Hito’s translation, isn’t the line more about how it would be difficult to mix up/make a mistake on identifying the target because she’s woman (and thus easy to spot), I didn’t get the implication that the dialogue line is questioning/deriding the notion of a woman being on the battlefield in the first place?

 

[Prism]

View attachment 7712

This meme has been everywhere today so I couldn't resist using it

I mean, even I thought it looked less imaginative than I expect from Final Fantasy, but with each subsequent watch I found more to like.

That quoted post is a bit off the handle...

 

[Strangelove]

Unless I am misinterpreting Hito’s translation, isn’t the line more about how it would be difficult to mix up/make a mistake on identifying the target because she’s woman (and thus easy to spot), I didn’t get the implication that the dialogue line is questioning/deriding the notion of a woman being on the battlefield in the first place?

this is my reading of the line, that she will be easily identifiable as a target since it’s a woman in response to the line about not mixing up targets. but that does imply that women aren’t generally part of wars in this setting. which is a bit patriarchal, kinda cringe, not sure this is it chief

 

[Wol]

Given the points criticised and praised regularly in FF trailers, I would say FFXVI falls on substance over style category.

Its showing to be a potential solid entry in story gravitas, voice acting, battle system (which for a reveal looks polished already), there isn't long flashy CGs or target render fog over-promising things. This is a good sign.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Agreed.

 

[Glaurung]

Super cringe that the Japanese line says “A woman on the battlefield? LOL.” Jesus fucking Christ.

Repeat after me: "The words and thoughts of a character don't always reflect what the author believes, and most of the time, if said author is good, it will be the opposite."

It's fine and I'm quite happy to live in a society where I can do with my life as a woman whatever I please, but when creating a fictional setting you are allowed to go wild. In fact, it's part of a cultural enrichment to present, in a safe sandbox such as fiction, what happens when you have a sexist society, or one who plunges into eugenics, or (as I discovered when writing Caligo), what can go through the mind of a xenophobe. That way you can learn what you've gotten so far from your surroundings, and know what would happen if we went backwards.

Just because our society has advanced a lot in terms of social equality doesn't mean that fictional settings have to do that too (especially those based on a time when you would have been garroted for suggesting anything concerning civil rights). You can do whatever.

 

[Wol]

Repeat after me: "The words and thoughts of a character don't always reflect what the author believes, and most of the time, if said author is good, it will be the opposite."

It's fine and I'm quite happy to live in a society where I can do with my life as a woman whatever I please, but when creating a fictional setting you are allowed to go wild. In fact, it's part of a cultural enrichment to present, in a safe sandbox such as fiction, what happens when you have a sexist society, or one who plunges into eugenics, or (as I discovered when writing Caligo), what can go through the mind of a xenophobe. That way you can learn what you've gotten so far from your surroundings, and know what would happen if we went backwards.

Just because our society has advanced a lot in terms of social equality doesn't mean that fictional settings have to do that too (especially those based on a time when you would have been garroted for suggesting anything concerning civil rights). You can do whatever.

Indeed, just because characters kill other human beings in a story doesn't mean the author endorses murdering, and the same counts for any other erroneous or questionable act.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Thanks, Glaurung. I wanted to say something similar but couldn't find the words. One doesn't have to look far nowadays to find plenty of representations of women soldiers and women on the battlefield, both in fiction and in reality. If works of fiction sometimes harken back to a previous age, I'm fine with that. e

(The thing I really hate is when history is re-written to align the past with modern beliefs and sensibilities, make it more palatable. I really hate that.)

 

[Ite]

Glaurung that might ring more true to me if the story isn’t about dudes having dude feuds with other dudes. I don’t trust that the patriarchy on display there is going to be used in a sophisticated or productive way, the same way I don’t believe that the white male’s status as the lead is setting us up for a subversion. It’s going to be normalized, so normalized that mentions of it don’t even bear translating. That’s not exactly the Handmaid’s Tale commentary you’re making it out to be.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Given the story writers at the head of this project and the reputation of Final Fantasy in general, I think it deserves at minimal, a pause to see it's actual story details and full cast before indicting it as a stale male-centric perpetuation of masculine power fantasy and conflict.

It's okay to be critical, but see what it actually is first.

 

[Fade]

Repeat after me: "The words and thoughts of a character don't always reflect what the author believes, and most of the time, if said author is good, it will be the opposite."

This is starting to become a fucking endemic issue in fiction discourse lately, to the point that creating anything has become something of a thankless job. And I'm as lefty as they come, so I'm not ranting about SJWs ruining everything, here. I think the word "milquetoast" has popped up in this thread already, and it's exactly the word to describe what would happen to all fiction if we keep crucifying artists for adding dramatic tension to their story based on norms that differ from ours.

Given that this trailer was a few chopped up minutes from a game that could number its playtime north of a hundred hours, let's maybe hold our chocobos on making grandiose assumptions about whether it tells a socially responsible story for now.

 

[Prism]

Super cringe that the Japanese line says “A woman on the battlefield? LOL.” Jesus fucking Christ.

Theoretically it’s possible for specific characters to be written as sexist or other character flaws without the game itself endorsing it. Guess we’d need more context.

 

[Lex]

While I understand the perspective provided by everyone in response to Ite, I at least agree with Ite that the line is a sign to take caution. I'm certainly not ready to write it off, but XV's handling of its female characters was so shockingly poor that I don't have a lot of trust in Square in that regard any longer. And before anybody starts - it's nothing to do with the fact that there were only four dudes as mains. All that said, this is YoshiP, and in YoshiP we absolutely trust until proven otherwise.

 

[ForceStealer]

I don't know what it says about the game itself, but I think it's pretty obvious why they translated the line differently in English, and my thought upon reading it was "Oh, Japan."

but XV's handling of its female characters was so shockingly poor that I don't have a lot of trust in Square in that regard any longer.

I mean VIIR and Shadowbringers have both come out more recently than XV.

 

[Makoeyes987]

XV was an entirely different team with an entirely different storytelling ethos. Tabata isn't even at Square anymore, and Luminous Studios is doing God knows what. As a series entirely, I don't see why XV would somehow erase or weigh more heavily than the entire history of the series overall, when XV was clearly the outlier.

And anyways the team responsible for Shadowbringers should be who you're looking at for precedent, and there's zero reason to affix XV's development choices for its characters to XVI. The last thing I've ever heard was XIV being a sausagefest with zero strong and compelling women characters.

 

[leowhy77]

In the trailer I believe some gameplay sequence are shown but I don’t seem to find anything related to showing the HP/MP bars or whatever in those screens... is it some how being hidden?
My next curious questions would be is this game all action driven? No atb?