Gamespot Coverage

[JechtShotMK9]

I'm fine with Midgar, but I really hope they change up the ending a bit. The c escape is fine, but I really don't want the final boss to be....the Motor Ball.

 

[FFShinra]

Depends on whether Motor Ball is the same. If they contextualize it with the story better (like say, it's being driven by one of the Turks or something), it could work.

I also think its more likely now that we won't have a regular fight with it, but instead fight it during the chase proper.

 

[Vyzzuvazzadth]

Jenova fight at the end of the highway. Calling it now!

(only halfway joking)

 

[FFShinra]

Jenova DRIVING the Motor Ball.

 

[Ite]

Totally fine and hoping the final boss is motor ball

 

[Lex]

I thought they would have a plan as to what Part 2 would be.

This is an entirely reasonable thing to think IMO, I've found it strange that a lot of people are rushing to defend Square after saying they don't know how many parts there are.

I said all along I didn't want part 1 to be Midgar only but after seeing it in action at E3 I very quickly made my peace with it, because it looks excellent. However they said they were mapping out the number of parts in 2015 (in various interviews) so for them to suddenly say "we don't know ourselves" has me more than a little bit worried. I'd like to believe the new FFVII project is going to consistently produce titles of a good calibre for the next 10 years or so until it reaches its inevitable conclusion - until then I remain incredibly worried they'll either never finish it, or the sequels won't match the first title because they don't know how to do get the characters from one location to another in the world.

 

[Kai Schulen]

I wonder if they're having trouble deciding which part begins and which part ends. Part 2's easy to figure out - start with Kalm, end with Aerith's death, (assuming this is the case) but everything in between Aerith's death and the final battle at the Northern Crater would be difficult to figure out where to split. I can easily imagine the Northern Crater being the final part.


....that, or SE is trolling us because it's going to be 3 parts and they don't want comparisons to the Lightning Saga.

Edit: Speaking of the Lightning Saga, do compare the reveal of XIII at E3'06, to XIII's release in 2009, with XIII-2's release in 2011 and and LR's release in 2013. So, I'm pretty optimistic that we won't have too much of a long wait for the next part.

 

[FFShinra]

If they detail out the other beats of the story as much as they do Midgar, Kalm to City of Ancients is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too long. I honestly do think they could end it earlier, maybe at Temple of the Ancients (at the maximum) or, as I personally prefer, the minimum of Kalm to Cargo Ship.

 

[Eerie]

Eh, I got the impression that at first, Midgard was just like in FFVII and the first part was supposed to be cut off later on, but as they chose to expand on various storylines there, they realised that they had enough content for one release. Hence the fact that they don't really know how many parts there are going to be: because as they progress in t he story, they might want to add so much stuff here and there that instead of X parts as they first planned, there will be X+Y parts. Think of it like ASOIAF that GRRM had planned to be THREE books at first (lol), and look at how much it has expanded since then.

 

[OdaDaimyO]

Eh, I got the impression that at first, Midgard was just like in FFVII and the first part was supposed to be cut off later on, but as they chose to expand on various storylines there, they realised that they had enough content for one release. Hence the fact that they don't really know how many parts there are going to be: because as they progress in t he story, they might want to add so much stuff here and there that instead of X parts as they first planned, there will be X+Y parts. Think of it like ASOIAF that GRRM had planned to be THREE books at first (lol), and look at how much it has expanded since then.

THIS^
It's not like in movies, where you have an already finished script at hand. Video game development is very complex, and sometimes you only know at the end of the process, that things worked out or not. The "script" is always evolving, a "living thing", you could say.

Where did I say I thought they were/should be working on Part 2? I thought they would have a plan as to what Part 2 would be.

my mistake...

The fact that Part 2 is just being planned is the far more....concerning/facepalmy/Classic SE part.

you actually marked it as, that they're only at the "starting phase", of the planning... I simply read it wrong as, they should already be finished by it. I apologise for my sloppy reading comprehension.

And I want to apologise for my outraged post in general, sorry guys!

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Eh, I got the impression that at first, Midgard was just like in FFVII and the first part was supposed to be cut off later on, but as they chose to expand on various storylines there, they realised that they had enough content for one release. Hence the fact that they don't really know how many parts there are going to be: because as they progress in t he story, they might want to add so much stuff here and there that instead of X parts as they first planned, there will be X+Y parts. Think of it like ASOIAF that GRRM had planned to be THREE books at first (lol), and look at how much it has expanded since then.

I think that's precisely part of our concern. lol

Not just because ASOIAF hasn't been completed (and very well may not be), but frankly because it just doesn't convey good product management to have been unable to plot this out at some point in five years while working from a highly detailed blueprint they had already possessed for 15 to 20 years (i.e. the original FFVII).

Expansion isn't always inherently beneficial, and part of managing effectively is recognizing when good enough is good enough -- before it becomes bloat. I can't speak for everyone who has concerns, but I know that mine stem in large part from the well-known development disarray that has been characteristic at Square Enix for well over a decade now.

FFXIII's production was notoriously troubled by squandered use of its resources and an ununified vision for development, resulting in -- among other things -- cut content. There's whatever the fuck FFXIV initially was and what happened to it. And then there's XV/Versus XIII, whose issues were so severe it was nearly canceled altogether and are likely going to be the subject of documentaries on development mishap in the years to come -- and whose last several planned DLC did end up canceled six months after they were announced in development.

Sure, any production can run into problems, but when you've been running into problems for about 15 years, it stops being a thing that happens to you and becomes a thing you do. It's simply now a trait of Square Enix.

Particularly given the incidents of cut or canceled content, and that we're dealing with a project director who is prone to artistic self-indulgence and meandering interest, I don't know how to look at the remake's current progress as anything but a sign that its production is already in trouble.

 

[OdaDaimyO]

unable to plot this out at some point in five years while working from a highly detailed blueprint they had already possessed for 15 to 20 years (i.e. the original FFVII).

When I look at the new trailers, the propotions for the Remake in comparison with the OG are gigantic. In that case, the original story is nothing more, than doodles on a napkin.

 

[Eerie]

Oh that I understand, but I also get that if you are adding stuff on the fly, you may not be able to say with certainty how many parts you'll be doing. To be honest, I think that Y is just "1", they are not sure if they can manage 3 or if they'll need 4 games. As for SE cancelling, I really don't know. I think it's now or never, before the people involved in FFVII become too old

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

When I look at the new trailers, the propotions for the Remake in comparison with the OG are gigantic. In that case, the original story is nothing more, than doodles on a napkin.

I think that's an overly reductive assessment, but that's not really the relevant point at hand for me anyway.

The doodles you speak of still offer a detailed sense of the game's internal proportions. Even allowing for the likelihood of multiple segments inspiring a desire to embellish (it would be silly not to plan for this possibility), those segments' relation to one another in terms of proportion should remain straightforward enough to estimate.

 

[Ite]

Padding Midgar, I totally understand. But there's SO MUCH content after Midgar that it could easily fill another 2 games with very little extra on top. Each of the following "plot points" is 1-2 hours in the OG and could easily be 4-8 hours in the remake by merit of the updated fields/battles and a bit more of that modern polish.

Spoiler: Part 2 Proposition

-Kalm Flashback
-Kalm Town, Overworld, Chocobos
-Mythril Mines, Junon, Boat
-Costa Del Sol, Overworld, Mount Corel
-North Corel, Gold Saucer
-Overworld, Gongaga, Overworld
-Cosmo Canyon, Nibelheim
-Mount Nibel, Rocket Town
-Wutai Sidequest, Pagoda Sidequest
-Weapon Seller, Gold Saucer Date, Overworld
-Temple of the Ancients
-Overworld, Sleeping Forest, Forgotten City
-Icicle Inn, Great Glacier
-Gaia's Cliff, Northern Crater

Spoiler: Part 3 Proposition

-Junon and Sapphire Weapon
-Sidequests
-Finding Cloud, Huge Materia Missions 1 and 2
-Return to Mideel, Cloud's Mind
-Huge Materia Missions 3 and 4
-Space Launch, Cosmo Canyon, Forgotten City
-Diamond Weapon, Return to Midgar
-Final Dungeon
-Boss Gauntlet and Finale

So a rough estimate here, we're looking at Part 2 being 50-100 hours and Part 3 being 35-75 hours, and that's without adding anything new!

 

[Makoeyes987]

On one hand I totally get The Twilight Mexican's concerns because yes... It makes absolutely zero sense to have no fucking clue as to how to proceed forward with the flagship project that's been in development for 5+ years. Poor planning seems to be an issue.

On the other hand, I can't help but feel strangely... Amused at the perceived sincerity they've displayed in going this hard and fast for part 1. They really did their best in ensuring the first impression of the Remake Saga (at this point, this is what this is... A saga given how long this will be) was a good one. First impressions are so important and Square focused so hard on nailing it, they've literally planned nothing else past it.

It's... Endearing in it's honest naivety. It almost makes me forget it was the same honest desire to do everything that made XIII lose out on some of its content and crippled XV/Versus.

I want to believe S-E learned something from the mistakes of Versus XIII. I mean, they would have had to, right? Part 1 being this massive is incredible, and if they can make it feel like a full game with a lot to occupy me, I can accept and enjoy part 1 being just 2 hours of the original game.

It just all depends on what we get. I have high hopes for the game and I'm optimistic. Because there's no way a company like Square could repeat the debacle that nearly undid XV.

Because if they did it'd ruin them. Reputation-wise, at the very least. There's too much riding on this investment in VII's remake to allow them to fuck up like with Versus, they still haven't lived that one down.

I guess we'll see. Forget the Compilation of FFVII. The new Compilation, is Final Fantasy VII itself.

 

[Kain424]

This is actually a very exciting mindset, to be honest. The legend of Final Fantasy was BUILT on high stakes. It's supposedly the story behind the name. I WANT them to go all in. I want this to be a make or break situation for Square-Enix. If they can't do this, they might as well hang it up. So, good. Bring it on.

 

[FFShinra]

Thinking about it that way, it makes me wonder. How do they do the openings for each portion. Several on the site have said we should start in media res in the Nibelheim flashback and I like that idea but....how do you do the actual opening sequence within that flashback?

 

[Odysseus]

If they were to start already in the flashback, I could see it going like this: First off, no immediate indication that the scene is a flashback, it would be a surprise. It's night time and raining, you can see the silhouette of trees on the dimly-lit sky, no music, the only sound is a vehicle driving in mud. Close up shot of the truck, and you hear Cloud talking. Its not clear immediately who he's speaking to, but he's talking about a new mission and how he received some new materia, keep it vague enough to not immediately tip the audience off that this is the past if they don't already know. Inside the truck, you only see Cloud. He keeps talking, and the vague shape of a long blade or maybe silver hair slowly drifts into frame. Cloud finishes talking by saying something like "What about you?" or "What do you think?" and then the camera turns and we just see Sephiroth coolly sitting on a crate across from Cloud, then boom, title card. "Final Fantasy VII REMAKE part 2: How Sephiroth got his groove back."

 

[Kain424]

It could also start with Cloud & (what a) crew in the back of a similar truck. Hitchhiking as fugitives, and intercutting with Cloud riding along with Zack and Sephiroth before launching into the flashback. There are plenty of artistic variations they could do for the second part's opening.

Of course, my own preference would be for it to simply open on the group, already on the open map. Kind of like Final Fantasy XV, but EVEN MORE LIKE the original Final Fantasy, with Kalm in the distance up ahead. Then you could wander wherever, if you so choose, getting into battles right out of the gate or simply walking out into the yonder toward the Chocobo Ranch. I highly doubt this will be the case, but I would welcome it.

 

[pxp]

It could also start with Cloud & (what a) crew in the back of a similar truck. Hitchhiking as fugitives, and intercutting with Cloud riding along with Zack and Sephiroth before launching into the flashback. There are plenty of artistic variations they could do for the second part's opening.

Of course, my own preference would be for it to simply open on the group, already on the open map. Kind of like Final Fantasy XV, but EVEN MORE LIKE the original Final Fantasy, with Kalm in the distance up ahead. Then you could wander wherever, if you so choose, getting into battles right out of the gate or simply walking out into the yonder toward the Chocobo Ranch. I highly doubt this will be the case, but I would welcome it.

You want to introduce Zack this early???

 

[Kain424]

You want to introduce Zack this early???

Well, no. I just mean, that is the scene... the truck scene.

...but now that you bring it up, they could hide a detail in a frame flicker or something that could hint at Zack being there.

Although all of this kind of makes me feel bad for new players. There isn't a place on the entire internet where they could go and not have every mystery and plot turn spoiled for them.

 

[FFShinra]

The reason I ask the question is because, since each game is separate in their own right (as of now), each game would have to be treated to the same SE epic opening cinematic magic. The Midgar Opening is one of the most famous in all of gaming, but they can't reuse that once they actually leave the city.

If that helps anyone in their answers.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Trust me.

There are a lot of people who don't know FFVII at all. They're only vaguely aware of the spiky-haired blond dude with the giant sword, and the silver-haired villain in black with a giant katana. Even Aerith and her ultimate demise is outside their knowledge.

Because they are silo'd from any talk of Final Fantasy.

Or, their only exposure to Final Fantasy was Kingdom Hearts. Thanks to Kingdom Hearts' growth, a lot of players have gotten into Kingdom Hearts through the Disney end. Not the Square-Enid/Final Fantasy and.

So there's plenty of fertile ground for brand new, unspoiled fans to grow. They just to not spoil themselves.

 

[Ryuman]

Trust me.

There are a lot of people who don't know FFVII at all. They're only vaguely aware of the spiky-haired blond dude with the giant sword, and the silver-haired villain in black with a giant katana. Even Aerith and her ultimate demise is outside their knowledge.

Because they are silo'd from any talk of Final Fantasy.

Or, their only exposure to Final Fantasy was Kingdom Hearts. Thanks to Kingdom Hearts' growth, a lot of players have gotten into Kingdom Hearts through the Disney end. Not the Square-Enid/Final Fantasy and.

So there's plenty of fertile ground for brand new, unspoiled fans to grow. They just to not spoil themselves.

I remember buying FFVII because I really liked Cloud and Sephiroth in Kingdom Hearts My mom was definitely confused as to why I got a PS1 game lol
There are definitely plenty of people out there.