Hopes for Remake & Rebirth (gameplay/combat)
- Thread starter X-SOLDIER
- Start date
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
Really? I think the Ni no Kuni world map looks beautiful. Also keep in mind the Type-0 stuff is just a HD port of a PSP game.
Anyways, the FFVII remake would likely have an even larger budget than Ni no Kuni had, so I think they could make a good not-to-scale world map even with a more realistic art style.
Also here's another example of a relatively recent video game that uses a not-to-scale world map. It was from a indie French RPG game from two years ago that never got off the ground that also takes heavy direct inspiration from PS1 era JRPGs (including pre-rendered environments and fixed-angles for cinematic effect).
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
Also, whether or not the game decides go with a not-to-scale world map or a multi-regional sectioned open world should they still have the world be torus/duocylinder shaped like traditional JRPG maps of the era were (I'm not sure if this would be as much an issue in the latter option)? Or should they actually try to make the world spherical in shape?
Links explaining what I mean by the in-game world being "torus/duocylinder" shaped:
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VideoGameGeography
http://imgur.com/a/fUD7n
Links explaining what I mean by the in-game world being "torus/duocylinder" shaped:
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VideoGameGeography
http://imgur.com/a/fUD7n
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
But the exact point of a not-to-scale world map is that stuff like trees and towns aren't supposed to look exactly 1:1 photorealistic (regardless of whether it is in HD or not). I think as long as a proper art/visual style is utilized properly for the world map (and only for the world map) it doesn't have to look "worse" than the non-world map areas.
clowd
Pro Adventurer
Well we have to look at why the turn based system was chosen for RPGs in the first place. Probably because thats the only way they figured you could control 3-4 people in fights and have a long list of magic and items to use?
As much as I do like FFXII's battle system, it still looks like a bunch of people LARPing. Games have become more cinematic, I think it only makes sense their battles become that way too.
For me an ideal battle system would feature RPG style commands, but the combat should be much more fluid and seamless. Characters just standing around and waiting to get hit or strike the enemy themselves should be something of the past. Issuing commands instead of real time action can stay, but it has to continue to improve and become more realistic, cinematic, and fluid.
I remember seeing Final Fantasy XIII footage for the first time and saying THAT is the RPG battle system I want. Unfotunatley the real game turned out to be nowhere near as cinematic and fluid. It was back to LARPing again.
:25 - :40 in this video is the battle system all RPGs should continually strive to obtain
As much as I do like FFXII's battle system, it still looks like a bunch of people LARPing. Games have become more cinematic, I think it only makes sense their battles become that way too.
For me an ideal battle system would feature RPG style commands, but the combat should be much more fluid and seamless. Characters just standing around and waiting to get hit or strike the enemy themselves should be something of the past. Issuing commands instead of real time action can stay, but it has to continue to improve and become more realistic, cinematic, and fluid.
I remember seeing Final Fantasy XIII footage for the first time and saying THAT is the RPG battle system I want. Unfotunatley the real game turned out to be nowhere near as cinematic and fluid. It was back to LARPing again.
:25 - :40 in this video is the battle system all RPGs should continually strive to obtain
Snap! I've brought up that video / combat system before. I REALLY wanted those mechanics and would love to play in an RPG with that. It could work really well for the Remake.
I am really really concerned about the apparent changes they're going to make to the battle system. A large portion of any RPG is the battles, whether random or boss. I hope the dev team remembers that this is a Final Fantasy VII remake and not oc, and that they don't stray too far from the original game...
clowd
Pro Adventurer
How about both?
Let players switch between a menu driven system and 100% real time action. Honestly it shouldnt be too hard to do.
I just think controlling Barret from 3rd person and manually aiming at enemies and lighting them up wtih the gatling gun is something too cool not to experience. And actually executing some sick combos with Tifa? I cant pass that up
Let players switch between a menu driven system and 100% real time action. Honestly it shouldnt be too hard to do.
I just think controlling Barret from 3rd person and manually aiming at enemies and lighting them up wtih the gatling gun is something too cool not to experience. And actually executing some sick combos with Tifa? I cant pass that up
Wolf_
Pro Adventurer
Has it not already been confirmed that a turn based battle system would not be suitable? I'm in too minds about this. The OG system I loved. It was in my opinion, by far the best battle system of the final fantasy franchise. That being said on the remake the massive menu would have to go and be replaced with something minimalistic and transparent. Now a live action "hack and slash" type game would give the gameplay a different feel and would be potentially limiting (only so many buttons and potentially every spell on one character) what I think they should go with is this...
Have the r1 and l1 buttons as combat options. Attack, magic, summon, command, item, etc. have your ox[]^ as customisable preferences, I.e one could be set for cure2 another for bolt3 another for ultima and one for barrier for example. When you hit l1 it would go to attack and you could have jump/slash/punch/ block etc as your chosen 4. Same with items. Take your favourite 4 and assign them to buttons. Then anything you want to use that isn't on your default 4 you use r2 and l2 to scroll through a list of the category that your on.
That might all sound complicated because I'm terrible at explaining things but in my head it's easy. Think lightning returns but your not changing clothes just fighting options and you aren't limited to 4 but your chosen 4 can be assigned for easy use. Best of both worlds.
Have the r1 and l1 buttons as combat options. Attack, magic, summon, command, item, etc. have your ox[]^ as customisable preferences, I.e one could be set for cure2 another for bolt3 another for ultima and one for barrier for example. When you hit l1 it would go to attack and you could have jump/slash/punch/ block etc as your chosen 4. Same with items. Take your favourite 4 and assign them to buttons. Then anything you want to use that isn't on your default 4 you use r2 and l2 to scroll through a list of the category that your on.
That might all sound complicated because I'm terrible at explaining things but in my head it's easy. Think lightning returns but your not changing clothes just fighting options and you aren't limited to 4 but your chosen 4 can be assigned for easy use. Best of both worlds.
- AKA
- Yop
I'd say it'd be pretty hard to do both / let the player decide; you're talking pretty much two separate codebases there, and possibly a rebalancing of stats and damage and whatnot, or difficulty. I haven't seen it in action either; at best I've seen a choice between first or third person (which already, IMO, has a significant effect on gameplay - all other things being left the same).
Turn-based (with polished animations / graphics / effects) will be fine. It's not like it won't be a hit if the battle system feels a bit archaic, would it?
.
Turn-based (with polished animations / graphics / effects) will be fine. It's not like it won't be a hit if the battle system feels a bit archaic, would it?
.
Wolf_
Pro Adventurer
Never understood people's love for 10 but hate for 13.. Both where linear but one main character was a badass where as the other was a dead/dream guy with the most cringe inducing laugh imaginable.
There was no timed thing in crisis core though. It wasn't full control hack and slash but you could attack as quick as you could mash the button.
There was no timed thing in crisis core though. It wasn't full control hack and slash but you could attack as quick as you could mash the button.
I have never been able to deal with that. It's utterly retarded.
I already mentioned somewhere that I want the fights against Sephiroth to be harder. An easy way to start would be to make Supernova actually have a chance of killing you rather than doing percentage damage.
Starling
Pro Adventurer
I have never been able to deal with that. It's utterly retarded.
I already mentioned somewhere that I want the fights against Sephiroth to be harder. An easy way to start would be to make Supernova actually have a chance of killing you rather than doing percentage damage.
I think there're enough instant death attacks, thank you. It's always rather frustrating to get killed by one. I personally find the ridiculousness of Supernova being over the top and yet not being able to actually kill you somewhat hilarious.
- AKA
- The Man, V
I wouldn't mind if the remake were harder than the original, but I doubt it's going to happen. Instant death attacks are pretty cheap though, especially if they're Yunalesca-style ones (I'm still mad at Square for making a fight that basically can't be won on the first attempt without a strategy guide unless a player habitually doesn't bother healing ailments like Zombie, and preceding it with an unskippable five-minute cutscene to boot).
I didn't say anything about instant death, just possible death. You know, like almost any other magical attack. Supernova could do heavy damage to your party but you'd still be able to survive it with high enough HP and possibly MBarrier.
- AKA
- Flare
I have never been able to deal with that. It's utterly retarded.
I already mentioned somewhere that I want the fights against Sephiroth to be harder. An easy way to start would be to make Supernova actually have a chance of killing you rather than doing percentage damage.
I thought it was hilarious too, seeing this huge solar-system destroying attack only wound your party members.
But I would love to see Sephiroth be harder to beat; I beat him the first try every time. I was talking about this with my cousin, and wondering about the last 'fight' with Sephiroth, actually, the one where you're just Cloud in the lifestream.
She made a point that, since it's not really a fight, it would be cool if it was more of a cg video scene of them doing that last fight. While that would be cool, I think it might be even better if they actually made that a proper fight, one where Cloud can still lose.
Starling
Pro Adventurer
Changing the last part of the fight would be missing the point. It's effortless because it's meant to show that Sephiroth no longer has any hold on Cloud, who now has the strength to effortlessly eliminate Sephiroth from his mind. Making it an actual fight would undermine that. As for making it a CG scene, that could work I guess, but you'd lose the inter-activeness of being able to go to the attack menu, click omnislash and watch as Cloud does his thing.
leadmyskeptic
Pro Adventurer
It may be one of those cheesy "fan explanation" things, but I always thought of the over-the-topness of Sephiroth's Supernova to reflect his ability to mindfuck, i.e., the universe is not actually exploding but having essentially become almost a god at this point, this is what he's forcing the characters to perceive it as, like a hallucination.
Anywhoozle, I don't mean to re-scratch an itch that was finally left alone, but is it pretty much confirmed that the majority of us here would want (or at least be fine with) a turn-based system?
Anywhoozle, I don't mean to re-scratch an itch that was finally left alone, but is it pretty much confirmed that the majority of us here would want (or at least be fine with) a turn-based system?
- AKA
- Flare
^I don't mind turn-based, but I don't mind more action-based either. I liked XII's combat system. I'll just go with the flow, and whatever the battle system is, I think I'll enjoy it. Never had a big problem with any of them so far.
Well, the idea that Cloud is now in a place that Sephiroth can't touch him is nice too.
They could always turn it into a bit more of a battle, but one impossible to lose, like the final battle in X.
Well, the idea that Cloud is now in a place that Sephiroth can't touch him is nice too.
They could always turn it into a bit more of a battle, but one impossible to lose, like the final battle in X.
clowd
Pro Adventurer
They just need to find a way to make the characters always look like they're always doing something instead of just standing around in a battle. That goes for enemies too. I was refreshing my memory of XII's battle system by watching clips of it on youtube and I was surprised to see one of the stronger optional bosses just standing there for the entire battle letting you attack him. He rarely if ever defended himself or moved. That breaks the immersion. I mean, I can live with it, but they can do soooo much better.