Improve Crisis Core Thread

jazzflower92

Pro Adventurer
AKA
The Girl With A Strong Opinion
I know a lot of you have a lot of problems story wise with Crisis Core.It mainly comes from a certain character that resembles Gackt.What do you think would have made the game better than its current version.And who should have been the antagonist instead.
 

The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
What Tets said. Also, establish a greater ideological burden for Zack where he struggles with whether suppprting Shin-Ra is the right thing before they turn on him. Have his mentor defect due to a crisis of conscience rather than just some stupid shit like "Oh noes! I have wings! My origins dictate the value of my life! I can't choose who I want to be and follow a good path anyway!"

In fact, keep his mentor out of the Jenova soup altogether. Let Genesis remain in such if you must (the G Reports from Dirge had already established him as a predecessor to Sephiroth), but don't further dilute Sephiroth's novelty with a character whose narrative value never needed to be -- and shouldn't have been -- related to Jenova in the first place.
 
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Unlucky

WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN
I still don't have a solid alternate story formed in my head but here are some suggestions:

-more focus on Angeal and his relationship with Zack. Could also be that Angeal is not a part of a secret experiment and is a normal SOLDIER instead.

-less repetitive missions. Seriously, I got no fun playing those at all. Think of all the space that could have been used elsewhere.

-more focus on the Cloud and Zack friendship, dammit. CC's attitude about the whole thing to me is like "Mehh just put a scene or two about them, the audience knows they're BFFs anyway. Neeeext." NO.

-make Sephiroth the poised, arrogant and intimidating general that he was, and not a monotonous bore.

-more Wutai war, where Shinra's atrocities are shown. Also some AVALANCHE.

-fix the Midgar slums. They seriously suck. And what the hell is going on about that background music? Sounds like something you'd hear in a phone commercial.

-Genesis? Who is that? :desumonster:
 

ForceStealer

Double Growth
Because of Dirge, Genesis is kinda required to exist, but he doesn't have to run the show. Maybe he peaced out before the game even started but his departure has left lingering effects.

Besides that, Wutai War. That's what everyone assumed the game was going to be about anyway. Sabotage Wutai warships while getting backup from the Junon cannon. More stuff like the game's opening mission. Show Sephiroth commanding - if not leading troops into battle. He doesn't have to give rousing speeches or anything, he just has to f shit up. I really like his intro in CC, honestly, where he killinates Ifrit, more of that.

The boss fights with summons were cool! Can you think of a society that worships a certain summoned beast as a god? SOLDIERs aren't the only ones with Materia, you know.

Unlucky said:
less repetitive missions. Seriously, I got no fun playing those at all. Think of all the space that could have been used elsewhere.

Well, I think that's just it, they DIDN'T take up a lot of space. It was only like 5 maps. The solution to that problem is just to not have it on a handheld. (OR, just release it on two UMDs which every publishers was scared out of their wits to do for some reason. Did they really cost that much more than CDs? Cuz they'd spread shit across CDs just cause they felt like it on the PS1.)
 
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Zee

wangxian married
AKA
Zee
how about we treat the female characters like fucking characters instead of love interest props

aeris has always been our window to the mystical side of this world. so fuckin' SHOW IT. give us a better scope of what it means to be a cetra. how it affected her. how it affected her mom! she's an adopted child with friggin superpowers there is so much to do with her. hey maybe they could have even addressed the fact that her first love worked for the same company that killed her mother and harassed her and that relationship should have felt more complicated?

could we have seen tifa dealing with the anger of her mother's death through her martial arts training? maybe shown a young tifa as sort of a protector of the town since all the young men left to be soldiers, like a precursor to her role in avalanche?

also, fuck genesis. fuck that shit straight to hell.
 
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Obsidian Fire

Ahk Morn!
AKA
The Engineer
^^It should be mentioned that part of Aerith's story-line in TOG was accepting that she was a Cetra... so if anything, she should be portrayed as wanting to be normal in CC.
 
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Zee

wangxian married
AKA
Zee
^^It should be mentioned that part of Aerith's story-line in TOG was accepting that she was a Cetra... so if anything, she should be portrayed as wanting to be normal in CC.

wait what does that have to do with what i wrote

whether or not she wants to be normal is irrelevant to what i want from her character. the fact is she still heard her mother's voice, she still used her weird ass powers to grow plants, she still had the government chasing after her, and it's implied that her relationship with her mother was strained because of all this. expand on it. show us the stuff we weren't able to see in the OG. we should be getting more depth out of her appearance, not less.
 

Unlucky

WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN
Oh I forgot to add:

-get rid of the epitome of fucktardedness that is Ayaka's song playing over Zack's death scene.
 

jazzflower92

Pro Adventurer
AKA
The Girl With A Strong Opinion
Also give Aerith some of her spunkiness back.Yeah,she can be sweet but she is very much a tease and a firecracker who strikes at the opporunity.Not to mention she can be stubborn in a lot of situations.

I think Sephiroth should keep his CC portrayal which is a sugar and ice personality and a dry sense of humour.I do think that it actually fits that Good Sephiroth would actually be a boring person who really has a hard time relating to other people.

Of course like in the other thread,I believe Lazard should have been the main villain instead of Genesis.Angeal and Genesis should have been normal SOLDIERS with no connection to Project Jenova that defected with Lazard.
 

jazzflower92

Pro Adventurer
AKA
The Girl With A Strong Opinion
Give Gast some posthumous focus in the game because it seems like he is usually out of focus in the Compilation.I want to know why he earned such great respect from Sephiroth.In Crisis Core some NPC characters in the Shinra lab keep mentioning Gast as a better scientist than Hojo.
 

Kuja9001

Ooooh Salty!
AKA
roxas9001, Krat0s9001, DarkSlayerZero
Delete Genesis

Keep Angeal BUT he's a normal guy, no honor crap.

Zack's only blade is the buster sword just say he made it because he needed a better sword or something.

Delete Genesis
 

Jarlix

Pro Adventurer
Platinum games to develop it, make it a crazy sword action game at 60fps in battles and let us fully explore Midgar outside of it. Better story. No Gackt.
 

Rydeen

In-KWEH-dible
Redo the characterization entirely. The game introduced a bunch of new potentially interesting characters and killed them off before even meagerly establishing them. SE did a terrible job with characterization, with Zack being the only exception, and Genesis being the most notorious example. The sympathetic depiction didn't match up with his actions; he slaughtered the people who cared about him for no reason and obsessively quoted a book that had nothing to do with anything; I'm not gonna feel sorry for the guy when I slice him up. Lazard even lampshaded the nonsensical Loveless quotations in the end, and Zack, like the viewer, was completely confused by the actions of the other characters. "I'M A MONSTER. Let's go fuck shit up and whine about honor." Where's the thought provoking moral conflict, aside from the notion that human experimentation is bad and that fame distances people from others? A lot of the issues could have been resolved if Crisis Core had been an actual 40 hour game instead of a weak string of events and a morass of generic missions - then again, Before Crisis had only 20 hours of gameplay as well and didn't have these crippling characterization issues. I was also disappointed to see the gritty slum riddled with class struggle watered down to the extent that it was - let's see a bit more of that sadness, violence, and suffering that fueled Lazard's pathos. Didn't like Cissnei's character interpretation either, but that is probably more of a personal preference/textboxes don't fully capture intended mannerisms/personality.

On a more positive note, in terms of the bromance, I enjoyed the first interaction between Zack and Cloud and the nice immersive use of game lore "If a reactor's there and it ain't Midgar, must be nothin' else out there," and how the tinkering of gameplay mechanics was used to the advantage of the storytelling during the last scenes. I thought the concept of legacies and living on through others was a great start, but fell short because it had no backbone in this story. And I do think the mass insanity of the 1st Classes put a bit of context to Sephiroth's rampage. But aside from Zack and Seph, nothing to see here really. Overall I enjoyed Crisis Core for what it was worth, but it felt like a game that wrongly assumed we would relate to the characters and came out as nonsensical and melodramatic instead.
 
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jazzflower92

Pro Adventurer
AKA
The Girl With A Strong Opinion
Lazard being the villain would have delved deeper into the class struggles of the slums and what caused him to plot revenge against his father.Lazard should have been the main antagonist because he would have made a more interesting plot.He would have also made a complex villain as well who is not doing it for himself but for all the people he has felt been wronged by the Shinra corperation.This would have actually been a better insight into putting Zack into doubt about the company as well.
 

Tennyo

Higher Further Faster
Put this game on a console instead of a handheld. It needed to be longer with more time to explore characters and to allow the events to unfold.

Fight Angeal, fall into church, meet pretty girl, decide to take her on a date when you should be reporting back to headquarters, yeeeeaaaaahhhhh seems legit.
 

The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
Yeah, Ryvius's and jazz's two posts alone offer a much more interesting story -- and a more fitting take on FFVII's setting -- than what the guys in charge actually did with the opportunity to tell a story about Zack and a pre-Meteor SOLDIER organization.

The game definitely does a shit job of selling us on the reason for anything Lazard did. Unless you read his e-mail newsletter, you wouldn't even know what he had a bug up his rump about, and even then, the slums as portrayed in this game are too fucking happy to even give much understanding to his actions. Seriously, the slums from the original game make this shit look like Costa Del Sol.
 

jazzflower92

Pro Adventurer
AKA
The Girl With A Strong Opinion
The only way we could improve Hollander is that he is not apart of Project Jenova and maybe could a scientist who defected with Lazard for his own reasons against Shinra.Maybe he would be tired of the direction the science department was heading under Hojo.
 

The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
Hollander is salvageable, sure. I'm not sure he would even be necessary without Project G, but the idea of a scientist envious and resentful of Hojo isn't on its own a bad thing -- and is, in fact, rather ironic given Hojo's own inferiority complex with regard to Gast.
 

jazzflower92

Pro Adventurer
AKA
The Girl With A Strong Opinion
Hollander is salvageable, sure. I'm not sure he would even be necessary without Project G, but the idea of a scientist envious and resentful of Hojo isn't on its own a bad thing -- and is, in fact, rather ironic given Hojo's own inferiority complex with regard to Gast.

I mean I have a feeling a lot of people would resent Hojo for many reasons especially if he had a hand in their suffering.Maybe Hollander had someone close to him be experimented by Hojo and he has been secretly waiting to take his revenge on him then finds an opportunity to strike back by teaming up with Lazard.
 

Unlucky

WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN
What if Genesis was just a normal SOLDIER during the time of CC? He's not a First Class, moreso friends with Sefiros. Perhaps he could be an ambitious and skilled Second Class, but his arrogance, bitterness and impatience hindered his superiors from promoting and trusting him. His passion and potential aren't unrecognized though. However he's a very insecure fellow who thinks he isn't good enough for some reason, may be a death of a friend in the Wutai war or some shit (any reason that makes sense and not "I wanna be a her0!!1")

There would be some other main conflict in the game. The point is that Genesis would be reduced to a side character that may or may not have to do with the new main antagonist. No more army of copies, Project G, and crapping over Sefiros' 'uniqueness'.

In the end, Genesis teams up with the sour grape Hollander who had been long waiting for a chance to surpass Hojo. He experiments on him. But being the second-rate scientist that Hollander was, he ultimately fucks up Genesis' mako-infused cells, rendering him powerful but extremely unstable. In a surge of power he transforms into Genesis Avatar. Zack defeats him as in the original CC but unbeknownst to him, he was still alive but weakened from the transformation. He hides and rests til he finds his strength again-- leading to the events at the end of DoC.

I don't know enough DoC canon (so sorry if I overlooked a lot of things :P ) but I know that his cells were used to create the Tsviets (?). But plot-wise does that bit matter so much? I suppose it could well be said that Shinra just created a different SOLDIER type for those.
 
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