KH2 was a greenlit game that they planned for and designed to exist for a continuing franchise.
No it wasn't, not when KH1 first released. Nomura wasn't sure more games would get approved after KH1, he made that concept trailer anyway. While we're on that line of thinking though, Nomura has also claimed the idea for what remake became was something he thought up while working on Crisis Core,
sooo....
Dirge's secret movie was primarily a stinger for the next already in development game, Crisis Core.
I already proved this was not actually the case.
There was no overarching intent to make some new game post-DC because they wasn't a grand intention to do so. Even in the Perfect Guide interview for Dirge of Cerberus, a sequel for DC was seen as an "if." Not a "when."
No plans doesn't equal no interest. Concepts are thrown around behind the scenes that we never hear about. Remake wasn't approved until like 2013 or 2014, but we know they were thinking of it long before. You have no idea how games are made, clearly.
So assuming it has this greater overarching meaning is false. It was never intended as such because DC never even had a guaranteed sequel set in it's future.
Again, KH1's secret ending was made before a sequel was approved or conceptualized. It was a concept trailer. I assume "G" was included as a conceptual idea. Those things have potential to become projects, or not.
For 16 years that concept movie had zero thought or intention directed to it. So trying to build up this great meaning for it when even the writers never said as much is like wishing on a cheese burger. You can do it, but it makes no sense.
I showed this is not the case. They were still thinking about it as late as 2008 at the very least, after CC came out.
I'm providing as much as you, dude!
You fuck right off. I showed proof every time you asked, you've given me jack shit. Moving on.
You're making an extraordinary claim of importance for this 16 year old secret movie with no tangible evidence
I provided plenty?
and I'm pointing out how it fits just fine where it is and is completely in line with the statements from the CC Ultimania.
I showed other stuff from the CCU that shows it was both not made to tease CC, nor were they not interested in following up with Genesis. Quite the contrary.
Wow, that is
so meaningful and important. What an incredible insight and expansion we saw. What year was that again? God, that was so important we didn't hear jack from that for how long again??
Yeah, it totally was such a
grand prologue we saw it lead to what again? It was so long ago, I can't even remember...
I'd like to remind you that no new entries in FF7 were released between 2007 and 2020, and Remake was approved in 2013ish and teased in 2015. We have literally not seen the next piece of FF7 since Crisis Core until now, so who the fuck cares if it's been 16 years? Blame Square for being a bunch of slow pokes.
There are LOTS of forgotten and unused ideas in Final Fantasy, you really think every concept ends up actualized? Especially when they're nearly 2 decades old? This is FFVII Remake and we're following Cloud Strife's story in 0007. You think they're somehow fixated on stuff from an interview a decade ago?
They sure do remember that one cellphone game barely anyone played. Before... something. Can't recall.
They sure remembered Dirge enough to include Weiss and Nero, and, again, REFERENCED GENESIS' LINE FROM DIRGE'S ENDING IN WEISS' BIO.
Because I'm not making the claim of some grand importance for the tertiary antagonist here. He got awoken by Omega, a threat that was a danger to the Planet. If it happened late, so what?
You have no idea how stories are written, do you? Your claim is brain dead, that's clearly not what's going on in that scene.
You're riding on a point that's been literally forgotten for so long people didn't give two-shits about it until someone ironically meme'd Genesis so hard, that it turned unironic when Hojo mentioned having some G-Type SOLDIERs try to create a baby with Aerith.
Yeah, they ALREADY referenced Genesis in Remake. I can't believe I didn't mention that already. yeah, he's sooooooo unimportant they included a throwaway line just to reference him. Sure. "It's just a meme bro".
That one mention of "G-Type" SOLDIERs is the closest, most tangible reference to Genesis we've gotten in the Remake and it's been like a grain silo fire ever since.
YOU'RE INSISTING THEY FORGOT AND DISMISSING WHEN THEY REMEMBERED. What is your DEAL, man?
People fucking losing their minds over speculating when Genesis will return because they just are so fixated on a character that was designed with a J-Rock star's likeness. Like, it makes no sense. If he weren't carrying Gackt's likeness and didn't get shat on so badly by fandom, no one would give a shit, and this would be a non-issue. He'd be seen as another tertiary antagonist within the Compilation. But because of those two special factors, he's amassed an inordinate amount of attention.
I'm starting to think you're the insecure one with how vehemently you're against it. You get ridiculously condescending whenever you're presented with ideas that threaten your ideas of what FF7 should be, like you wrote the damned thing. And everyone else are fucking idiots for thnking any other way.
He is 100% sealed. That's how it's described. "Sealed."
PROOF PLZ??
I asked about this because I wasn't sure, and all the canon info we have about Genesis after he was taken into Deepground was that Weiss asked him to help over throw the restrictors, and Genesis told him "no" and left to sleep in a cave. AFAIK this business of him being "sealed" is something you invented. I could be wrong, but I need more than your word on this one. I've got a whole group of people working on translating all of these guides and interviews and they had no idea what you're talking about.
How did Shinra make a magic water barrier? Where are the guards? Why is he in a cave and not a facility?
Why would Shinra capture Genesis and then just leave him to fuck-off and fly away whenever he wanted to?? Yeah, Genesis let Shinra seal him away. And Shinra didn't even bother to try and run Genesis ragged in Deepground because he was deemed a threat that was so dangerous the expunged all his records.
AFAICT He just vanished and Shinra had no idea where he went. Everything else is your cool fanfic. prove me wrong.
In fact, here's something claiming Genesis sealed HIMSELF away:
and
YOU PUBLISHED THIS ARTICLE lmao.
Here's our newer version for good measure
So as far as I can tell, Genesis can leave whenever he wants and go wherever he wants and you're wrong. Anyway,
How does this support your point...?
You keep claiming it was made to promote crisis core. This implies the exact opposite, and that Gensis was made to be in Crisis Core specifically to tie it and Dirge together more closely. This both emphasizes the care the devs have made into making all FF7 titles cohesive as well as shows Genesis is not just intended to be a Crisis Core character as you keep insisting, and that he has significance beyond that. Supports my point quite a bit I'd say.
If he can just show up wherever he wants, why did Shinra use Nero and Weiss to pick him up for capture? What was the point of the very scene you referenced in those interviews? You're like completely eschewing context and continuity just to justify a premise with no purpose or established cause.
I just proved you're whole premise of him being held captive is wrong, so I'm not sure I'm the one ignoring canon.
Well, he's in Sephiroth ballpark, so sending two of their strongest to go get him was probably a good idea. As said, this scene was planned from Crisis Core's conception to better tie it to Dirge, not the other way around.
This is what I'm talking about. If the threat Sephiroth posed to the Planet was so great that it would require him to act, and he was... Able to somehow break free while Shinra was literally still standing and presumably monitoring/containing him as they intended...
The second half of your premise here has been demonstrated to be false.
Why would the Planet need to do it in the friggin' future when it could just do it in the present and WAKE HIS ASS UP?
Getting Weiss involved would probably be the biggest reason beyond just connecting the Dirge scene to Remake. He was there too. Otherwise, yeah, it'd be easier to just have him wake up without the time travel stuff.
...Why would any situation regarding Sephiroth require any additional input from anyone other than Cloud and the others? This is their damn story and they are the main characters.
Because we have a big scary Sephiroth from the future and Cloud and co have failed no less than twice to put the bad man down for good? He keeps coming back, stronger than before. The Planet would probably like some extra spice.
Okay but whatever, fine. The situation has "changed."
Yes
ou can use Genesis in his established setting and location without doing some weird convoluted time travel plot.
He can leave whenever but probably
He's literally right there in Midgar. And can be seen in Midgar.
Or he could leave his self-imposed imprisonment and fly somewhere else. You are weirdly hung up on this point.
He wouldn't help the party, nor is he some appointed guardian of the planet.
He and them share a goal and you keep ignoring how the planet healed his degradation and gave him the opportunity to play hero. Whether he appointed himself with that role or not doesn't matter, the planet let him do it. He never even wanted to be evil, he was kind of forced into it by Shinra. He's certainly no good guy but he's not Sephiroth levels of megalomania.
This is what unironic trolling on this subject has done.
Man fuck off you self important boy you.
The planet cured his degeneration out of pity and judged him unworthy during CC. But he feels, personally, that he should protect the planet out of obligation and a desire to be the hero of LOVELESS.
Wow you really pissed off the fuckin team of people helping me find sources for my claims with this one lol
Evidently whatever translation you're using sucks ass.
Yours, with wrong parts bolded:
New one with correct parts bolded:
From the translator:
biggest deviations... if you want them listed out...
[Minerva's] intention was not necessarily to revive Genesis.
vs
Minerva's intentions are not the reason why Genesis survived.
conflates what Minverva actually planned to do initially when it's really that Minerva herself doesn't have to do with why Genesis survived
Genesis wanted to regain his pride as a SOLDIER, deciding that it could not be found simply in the duty of the SOLDIER, he came to the idea that ‘I am not afraid of degradation or death’.
vs
Genesis has reached a point where he is "not afraid of degradation and death" because he is determined to regain his SOLDIER Honor and fulfill his role of a SOLDIER
flipping around cause and effect, and more over
deciding that it could not be found simply in the duty of the SOLDIER,
vs
he is determined to regain his SOLDIER Honor and fulfill his role of a SOLDIER
JP says Genesis wanted to regain his SOLDIER Honor and that is what saves him, not that his duty could not be found in doing his role as a SOLDIER. So TLSs is saying that he decided he was going to transcend death while JP is saying that he abandoned the idea of transcending death to regain his SOLDIER Honor... and that is what ironically gets him what he wanted the whole time he's not afraid of dying because he now has a bigger goal than that.
‘Genesis still has much left to learn’.”
vs
something remains for Genesis to accomplish
This one confused the heck out of me. There is nothing in the JP that says anything about Genesis needing to learn anything, I don't know where that comes from. It's instead the idea of Genesis still having a goal or mission or just... stuff in general left he has to finish doing. So yeah, that one is really weird and makes Genesis out to be... more boneheaded than he actually is. One is "you've not leaned what you should yet" while the other is "you want to do this role and you've not finished doing it yet" When... Genesis is just finally getting a chance to even do the the role he really wants to do in the first place. So yeah, super weird this one. No idea how TLS got that out of it.
Thus, [because of that decision] Genesis was able to achieve his goal of ‘surmounting death.’
vs
In this way, Genesis "overcame death" with the intention of carrying out its [the Lifestream's] mission.
The exact goal/mission is not mentioned here, however "Genesis" is the subject of "overcoming death". JP is about why Genesis wanted to "overcome death" rather than what goal he was looking for. Genesis' goal by the end was not "to overcome death", it was "to regain his SOLDIER honor". Overcoming death wound up being something the Lifestream let him have so he could actually do that.
So, it seems your whole idea of Genesis "not being worthy" is predicated on a bad translation, as the whole bit about him needing to learn a lesson is not in the Japanese. Also note the insistence Genesis' job is not done.
That's not Genesis being bestowed as "protector of the planet" by the Planet himself. He gave himself that designation.
By healing him and letting him live up to his SOLDIER honor, the planet is allowing him to fill that role. Obviously it doesn't speak, but there's a reason why he chose that path. He's not as self-righteous as you make him out to be.
And Genesis doesn't have Jenova cells either. He carries Jenova's abilities within his own genetic factors. But he is not an actual Jenova cell recipient or carrier like Sephiroth.
He recieved Gillian's cell's, which would've been infused with Jenova's as part of Project G. After being deemed a failure, he went on to enlist in SOLDIER normally, which involves getting bathed in Mako and injected with Jenova cells. I guess I can't prove that but until canon says otherwise there's no reason to think so.
Nonsense. For one, Genesis's was a one-sided rival for Sephiroth. Genesis only knew Zack. And he is a self-proclaimed actor for the planet.
Last point has been made moot, even if he proclaimed it himself the planet let him do it and encouraged it. Genesis did meet Cloud a few times, specifically while Zack was on the run. Mako poisoned or not he'd recognize him. I don't see why it being one-sided matters, he still doesn't like Sephiroth so that's just a bonus for him.
Roche declares himself the greatest motorcycle SOLDIER. Does that make it true?
If Roche's motorcycle cured his space AIDs so he could keep on being the best biker, I'd say there's reason to believe so.
It's 1 AM, fuck this lol.
