[TERRA BATTLE] The future of Sakaguchi / Mistwalker

So, as the title suggests - a topic for discussing the future (and the past) of Sakaguchi's work and of his company Mistwalker.

EDIT : But has also now evolved into a thread focused on Terra Battle.
The game features team-play and PvP (PvP is unlocked once you clear chapter 7), and me and Twilight are playing. It's entirely free with no strings attached, so give it a go.
http://www.terra-battle.com/en/#

What prompted this, is that Sakaguchi has just gotten into live-streaming his stuff on Youtube (has been doing it for a while on the Japanese streaming site niconico) - which to be fair, is usually just him being drunk with friends, showing videos and art stuff while talking about Terra Battle (a pretty awesome mobile game you ought to try out, if you haven't already).

In his latest stream he talked about wanting to start a new game-development studio, did a shameless plug about looking for staff, and then threw about, probably in jest, the name "Dawnwalker".
(I made a logo just for fun, posted it on twitter and got a response from the father of FF himself - "ooooooh". So, senpai noticed me! You can see it here :
https://twitter.com/auuo/status/744235424797777920 )

Now, given the promise that once Terra Battle reached a certain download number, they'd begin working on a console title based off of that world, it seems likely that we're now looking at a new Sakaguchi title on the horizon.

So what's people's thoughts and feelings on this? Any particular things you want, or hope for? What's your though on previous Mistwalker titles?

(And also importantly, get on Terra Battle)

Um, first off, Sakaguchi retweeting you is pretty freaking amazing, so hats off.

I haven't played Terra Battle but I actually heard really good things about it. It's like a... tactics puzzle game or something? I've got a real problem with tactics so I've avoided it. So I have no idea if it warrants a console spin off, but any more console games from Mistwalker would be welcome.

I've only played Blue Dragon and Lost Odyssey. I couldn't get into Blue Dragon for the life of me, I tried. And it couldn't be the child-like atmosphere because I have no problems with those. I just really didn't like Blue Dragon.

I loved Lost Odyssey, though. I even suffered through the insanely designed secret dungeon that's how much I liked it. It's a great story and a great world, and some of the written stories in it actually made me tear up. The battlesystem was pretty okay, although I wasn't fond of the wall system. I don't know why Lost Odyssey's battle system worked for me while Blue Dragon's didn't since, iirc, they were pretty similar but oh well.

Here's hoping for remastered multiplatform versions of the Mistwalker games.
I always wanted to play LO and Blue Dragon but never got the chance :<

@Splintered :

Terra Battle is pretty unique - it combines tactics with finger dexterity and time pressure.

You play on a grid, and you have character units and you can only move one per round with limited time once you pick the unit, but you can push your other units around using the one unit you picked.
The idea is get one unit on each side of an enemy unit and they'll perform an attack. If you have other units aligned with the attacking units, you'll get team attack bonuses.

It's really simple, and really complex at the same time. The game also does a really good job of showing you the ropes and easing you into the game-play, so it's really accessible.
Best of all, it's completely free, and does not have any pesky adds, nor does it try to convince you to spend cash either, like pretty much all other free mobile games out there.
It really is, IMO, probably the best puzzle/strategy RPG on mobile period - and a really good testimony to what sort of designer and person Sakaguchi is.

So, people here have nothing to lose by at least trying it out. It's got stellar art, and a soundtrack by Nobuo Uematsu to boot.

As for other Mistwalker games -
I'm really all about The Last Story, which is arguably my favorite game of Sakaguchi.
He had the entire characters converse naturally while you play without halting or obstructing game-play pretty much down to a T before anyone else, and that combined with the amount of dialogue in the game really fleshes out the characters in a way that I've never really felt other RPGs do.

The problem with the older properties of Mistwalker, is that they're bogged down with licensing issues due to things like platform exclusivity deals etc.
Sakaguchi, while great at making games, was never much a man for the world of business to my mind, which is why he never seems to have much foresight when it comes to how business models, market forces and publishers etc. can truly freeze a game or a franchise.

I have to say that I really do love the art-style, and the lore from Terra Battle, so I think that there's plenty of room for an awesome new single-player RPG franchise from that pool of ideas and concepts.
Hopefully, he'll do something new and fresh.

Ohhh I loved The Last Story. Excellent game really, I kind of fell in love with the characters, and the story was very good (imo). Battle system was easy to use.
The only complaint I might have with the game was that I wish there was more to it in certain areas, not in story-terms but just in exploration/locations and some side content. The coliseum had only two different battles in it (iirc) and you could only ever really explore the same city, although it was definitely a good size and I enjoyed seeing the people in it change over time. I only wish there was more to it because I loved the game so much, but to be honest the game as-is is already a blast to play, so the above isn't really anything bad about the game, just what I would've liked more of.
Again, because I enjoyed the game so much, part of me wishes there was more to the story, but at the same time not every game had to be a 100+ hour epic adventure to be good. I'm happy with what I got in the game.

I'd love to see Sakaguchi make another game in a similar vein as this one (maybe even related to this game's setting/plot) but I doubt that'd happen. I look forward to anything else he makes, regardless. Does the Terra Battle have any story to it, or is it just a puzzle/strategy game?

It has a story, but it's a very bare bones affair - a couple of lines of story-telling/dialogue between each encounter.
It's essentially just this flimsy thing to create context for the battles.
The main point of the game is the game-play.

But as I said - if you have a half-way recent phone, just try it. It's free after all.
You probably won't regret it.

Wasn't a fan of Last Story. Pretty bland game and story and runs like shit too.
Even Uematsu's soundtrack was weak. No clue what happened there.

Tetsujin said:

Wasn't a fan of Last Story. Pretty bland game and story and runs like shit too.
Even Uematsu's soundtrack was weak. No clue what happened there.

Click to expand...

No accounting for taste I guess. I'm unsure what you mean by it running like shit though - never had any issues about the way it runs.

It has framerate issues up the wazoo during battles.

Never had any framerate issues during battles playing the game. Judging by game-play videos of those who played the English version, which I cannot judge since I played the Japanese one, I have to say they seemed stable as well.
Maybe your Wii has a issue with the fan or something?

The framerate issues are well documented and mentioned in many reviews. Whether you chose to overlook them doesn't matter, they are there.

Tetsujin said:

The framerate issues are well documented and mentioned in many reviews. Whether you chose to overlook them doesn't matter, they are there.

Click to expand...

A modicum of research shows that people's experience with the frame rate issues is widely inconsistent.

I might as well cite the numerous reviews calling the game brilliant in pretty much all regards as proof of you overlooking the quality of the story, the soundtrack etc.

Get off your sour grapes. If you have nothing of value to contribute, why bother posting here?

Just downloaded "Terra Battle" and I couldn't stop playing until I'd finished the first three chapters. Holy shit, is it ever addicting.

hian said:

Tetsujin said:

The framerate issues are well documented and mentioned in many reviews. Whether you chose to overlook them doesn't matter, they are there.

Click to expand...

A modicum of research shows that people's experience with the frame rate issues is widely inconsistent.

I might as well cite the numerous reviews calling the game brilliant in pretty much all regards as proof of you overlooking the quality of the story, the soundtrack etc.

Get off your sour grapes. If you have nothing of value to contribute, why bother posting here?

Click to expand...

I'll be real here I could very well be remembering incorrectly and I haven't double checked if this is even true.

How ever IIRC both Xbox and 360 had SKU's with different hardware in them some models were even considered decent upgrades as far as performance goes.

It could be likely that the people experiencing these framerate issues may have been playing on an earlier/vanilla release of an Xbox resulting in inconsistent documentation of the issue.

Reaper said:

hian said:

Tetsujin said:

The framerate issues are well documented and mentioned in many reviews. Whether you chose to overlook them doesn't matter, they are there.

Click to expand...

A modicum of research shows that people's experience with the frame rate issues is widely inconsistent.

I might as well cite the numerous reviews calling the game brilliant in pretty much all regards as proof of you overlooking the quality of the story, the soundtrack etc.

Get off your sour grapes. If you have nothing of value to contribute, why bother posting here?

Click to expand...

I'll be real here I could very well be remembering incorrectly and I haven't double checked if this is even true.

How ever IIRC both Xbox and 360 had SKU's with different hardware in them some models were even considered decent upgrades as far as performance goes.

It could be likely that the people experiencing these framerate issues may have been playing on an earlier/vanilla release of an Xbox resulting in inconsistent documentation of the issue.

Click to expand...

What? I thought the Last Story was Nintendo only?

Anyway, different strokes. I find myself liking a lot of "mediocre" JRPGS but somehow passing over games like Eternal Sonata, for no particular reason other than it just doesn't do anything to hook me. So if someone doesn't like X game, then it's fine. It's nothing to take personal.

Splintered said:

Reaper said:

hian said:

A modicum of research shows that people's experience with the frame rate issues is widely inconsistent.

I might as well cite the numerous reviews calling the game brilliant in pretty much all regards as proof of you overlooking the quality of the story, the soundtrack etc.

Get off your sour grapes. If you have nothing of value to contribute, why bother posting here?

Click to expand...

I'll be real here I could very well be remembering incorrectly and I haven't double checked if this is even true.

How ever IIRC both Xbox and 360 had SKU's with different hardware in them some models were even considered decent upgrades as far as performance goes.

It could be likely that the people experiencing these framerate issues may have been playing on an earlier/vanilla release of an Xbox resulting in inconsistent documentation of the issue.

Click to expand...

What? I thought the Last Story was Nintendo only?

Anyway, different strokes. I find myself liking a lot of "mediocre" JRPGS but somehow passing over games like Eternal Sonata, for no particular reason other than it just doesn't do anything to hook me. So if someone doesn't like X game, then it's fine. It's nothing to take personal.

Click to expand...

Oh dip. I thought he only made those few games for Microsoft back in the day and just quietly went away. I had no idea one of these games was on another platform.

Sorry

Splintered said:

What? I thought the Last Story was Nintendo only?

Anyway, different strokes. I find myself liking a lot of "mediocre" JRPGS but somehow passing over games like Eternal Sonata, for no particular reason other than it just doesn't do anything to hook me. So if someone doesn't like X game, then it's fine. It's nothing to take personal.

Click to expand...

The Last Story was only ever released on Wii.

Also, I have no issue with someone not liking games.
What I "take issue with" (and I say that lightly, because I'm just having a conversation here) is when people confuse opinions (like/dislikes) with facts, or arguments meant to build a case - especially if its done by waltzing into a conversation and taking a dump on it.

Not liking The Last Story isn't a crime - however, if you're going to cite reviews to qualify your opinion, whilst ignoring the fact that the same reviews largely said the exact opposite of what you were saying on all other accounts of the game (like story and soundtrack, which was largely praised), then that's annoying to me.

This thread is here to discuss more than just The Last Story - so there's something to be said by coming in here and just leaving one paragraph to dump on that game, and then saying nothing else.

The Last Story might have had some frame-rate issues - I wouldn't know, because I personally never experienced them. I'm simply saying that if you're going to talk like it's a train-wreck of a game (rather than actually just saying you didn't like it, or it wasn't your cup of tea), then expect to be challenged on that.

The Twilight Mexican said:

Just downloaded "Terra Battle" and I couldn't stop playing until I'd finished the first three chapters. Holy shit, is it ever addicting.

Click to expand...

I'm on chapter 8 now I think. Things have slowed down a bit, because I always end up spending my time on the challenges, and in the metal zone.
I'm just looking forward to unlocking the PvP thing so I can't start playing others.

Do you have any nice characters so far? I really want some human characters, but I have really bad luck with the random draw thing, so I always end up with various lizards and beast-men...

What I "take issue with" (and I say that lightly, because I'm just having a conversation here) is when people confuse opinions (like/dislikes) with facts

Click to expand...

So do I, which is why it bothered me to be challenged on performance issues which are certainly not down to opinions which is why your saying that reviews praised things I don't like is kinda pointless - story, music etc are certainly down to opinion. The performance is not and that's what you chose to challenge me on for some reason.

And it's not the first time I've come across people who simply don't care about framerate and the likes. That's okay. There were people who saw "no issues" with the framerate in Zone of the Enders 2 HD when others complained about it despite the fact it literally ran at half the framerate and needed a massive overhaul via patch.

If people don't care about technical issues they tend to simply not see them, that's a thing - but it bugs me when they act like "I didn't see it therefore it didn't exist, must be just you".

Anyway, dropping this now.

I think the problem with Sakaguchi and characters at least, is that his characters run the spectrum of subtle and needing nuance to bland, depending on the story. They don't fall neatly into anime tropes which some other games tend to do, which is good. But sometimes he forgets to make them compelling?

I felt he did his best with Kaim, who was a very quiet characters and his evolution was underplayed in a good way.

But I haven't seen Last Story.

Oh dip. I thought he only made those few games for Microsoft back in the day and just quietly went away. I had no idea one of these games was on another platform.

Click to expand...

Oh, that makes sense, LO and BD were both Xbox exclusives, I suppose console exclusivity is really the better way of finding a budget. Still though, it's such an odd move because the JRPG fans, especially the ones that would flock to a name like Sakaguchi, aren't typically thought of as Xbox fans.

I wanted to play Last Story too, but I don't own a nintendo system. I'll probably just lp it or something.

Tetsujin said:

So do I, which is why it bothered me to be challenged on performance issues which are certainly not down to opinions which is why your saying that reviews praised things I don't like is kinda pointless - story, music etc are certainly down to opinion. The performance is not and that's what you chose to challenge me on for some reason.

Click to expand...

The problem isn't here is that
A.) You're assuming I don't care about frame-rate issues, which I do.
and B.) that it's somehow impossible for me not to have had them to any noticeable degree.

Performance has not come up across the board in reviews of The Last Story - in fact, the first reviews I found of the game upon googling it, made no mention of it.

When I specifically googled "The Last Story frame-rate issues", what I usually got was forum posts from disgruntled users - several of which qualified their position by mentioning that the issues mainly happened when they had many magic circles on screen at the same time, or did a full zoom on a magic circle during combat with large amount of enemies etc.

Furthermore, I have not "challenged" you on performance - I asked you a question, followed up by my own personal experience with the game, and the experience of others, which leads me to believe that apparently how well the game runs is varied.

Finally, it beggars belief that you consider reviewers views on performance, despite varying opinions on the matter (including no opinion) pertinent to this, while at the same time ignoring the same reviewers opinion on other aspects of the game which you're entirely dismissive of.

You try to qualify that by saying one is objective the other isn't - the point I'm trying to make is that, given the fact that people have completely different experiences of the performance, that is not a real distinction in this matter.

Your first post went as following -

Tetsujin said:

Wasn't a fan of Last Story. Pretty bland game and story and runs like shit too.
Even Uematsu's soundtrack was weak. No clue what happened there.

Click to expand...

"Runs like shit" is not an objective statement by any measure or definition of the word. It's a completely loaded statement.

The statement "bland game and story" is not a statement of opinion either - that's a factual claim.

A game cannot be bland in your opinion - it either is or isn't depending on your definition of "bland" and what other games you're comparing it to.

The problem here isn't that you made one factual claim that I am somehow ignoring - the problem here is that you fail to separate when you make factual claims, and when you're voicing an opinion. You also fail to recognize that the "factual claim" you're making is one that you don't get to presuppose to be right when people have vastly different experiences of the game, and when you make a subjective loaded statement to describe the state of the problem.

How many frames does a game have to drop, and how often, for it to be considered "shit" to your mind? 1 frame below 30? 20? 15?

I found accounts of people claiming frame-drops when they open the god damn menu - you'd think I, and most reviewers would notice that if it were a consistent thing for most players of the game.

This isn't a black and white issue, where you've objectively described a fact about the game - it's an issue of you having had one negative experience, then trying to claim that it's objective because reviewers among others took note of it, yet hold that this standard of objectivity somehow doesn't matter in relation to statements about story, game-play and sound.

Tetsujin said:

If people don't care about technical issues they tend to simply not see them, that's a thing - but it bugs me when they act like "I didn't see it therefore it didn't exist, must be just you".

Click to expand...

Another thing is angry nerds raging over performance issues and assuming the causes of them without actually knowing what that cause is.

If you gave me a penny for every angry pirate bay comment saying "This shit doesn't run/lags/blablabla" on perfectly functional games and software that I had no trouble installing and running, I'd be rich as fuck.

I'm suggesting - maybe some (certainly the worst of them which I never experienced) of those frame-drops might have been due to changes made to the game during localization, old/worn/broken Wii systems, and/or other things -

We'll never know.

What I do know though - is that your outright dismissal of another persons perspective is dismissive and belittling as fuck.

Maybe you should just recognize that this post :

Tetsujin said:

Wasn't a fan of Last Story. Pretty bland game and story and runs like shit too.
Even Uematsu's soundtrack was weak. No clue what happened there.

Click to expand...

is not constructive in any way shape or form, and that you fucked up when you made it.

Verbal warning time. This ridiculous argument stops now.

hian said:

The Twilight Mexican said:

Just downloaded "Terra Battle" and I couldn't stop playing until I'd finished the first three chapters. Holy shit, is it ever addicting.

Click to expand...

I'm on chapter 8 now I think. Things have slowed down a bit, because I always end up spending my time on the challenges, and in the metal zone.
I'm just looking forward to unlocking the PvP thing so I can't start playing others.

Do you have any nice characters so far? I really want some human characters, but I have really bad luck with the random draw thing, so I always end up with various lizards and beast-men...

Click to expand...

I'm in Chapter 7. My primary party consists of the Humans Bahl (LV 20 Dark Duelist, LV 22 Dark Warrior) and Amina (LV 21 Nurse), a Human Knight (LV 23), a Human Archer (LV 22), a Lizardfolk Knight (LV 23) and a Dracorin (LV 23).

They're a pretty fearsome team. I'm tearing through everything without too much trouble -- just the occasional annoyance when half the team is put to sleep or something.

I also have a Devil Bat, a Spinetrich, a White Sabretooth (all LV 21), a Beastfolk Healer (LV 20) and Ba'gunar (LV 20).

I am also looking forward to PvP.

Damn you progressing fast!

Bahl and Amina seems to be common starters - maybe even mandatory.

My party consists of Bahl (second form), Amina (third form), Kapori (lizard swordsman A class at first form), Sh'Berdan (lizard lancer B class at first form), Zerro (beastfolk dark mage, SS class first form), and Pahrl (stormfolk archer A class at first form)

So, as you can see, I only have two humans - although my party is pretty OP in terms of rank. I'm just trying to stock up on items so I can evolve all my primaries but it's proving to be quite the job given that many lizards use several of the same items.
Also gotten some good equips for them for added attack and defense bonuses.

I just noticed the game has co-op battles! Wanna give it a go some time?

EDIT : I have no idea how this stuff is supposed to work - do I play concurrently with someone else, or with a "ghost" A.I? How do I host games? Can I even host games?
lol, gonna let co-op wait for a while I guess, til I can read more up on it.

EDIT :
Okay, got a grasp of it - There are co-op missions, which you select, and then you can host private or public games, or do quick matches, so we can indeed play together, as long as we have the room information.
That's really welcome news.

I mean this game is really mobile gaming done right - it's got depth, strategy and skill demands, co-op play, and PvP, it's free and doesn't push the micro-transactions at all.
I think it really stands as testimony to the caliber of Sakaguchi as a developer, that he can change genre and style so, and still make something as solid as this.

It is a really impressive change of pace for him. It still evokes "Final Fantasy" left and right (e.g. some of those metal guys are obvious stand-ins for Cactaurs), but it's also very different.

Also, yeah, I'd totally love to co-op with you sometime.

Finished up Chapter 8. Probably going to take some time in Metal Zone 2 to get all my characters to LV 30. I have a Mantle Tortoise, a Mech Orbling and a Mechanic now too. Don't know that I'll ever need them, but I'll probably just level them as well.