Bhunivelze - Worst. Father. Ever.

[Ghost X]

@Mog: Abstract concepts (like morality) do not cease to exist because someone (eg: "the mighty") doesn't think it applies to them.

 

[Arianna]

@Mog: Abstract concepts (like morality) do not cease to exist because someone (eg: "the mighty") doesn't think it applies to them.

Agreed!

 

[Cat Rage Room]

So I've been drinking throughout this conversation and I'm literally too drunk to continue. I concede until I sober up. Please continue in my stead.

 

[Arianna]

If I remember anything about Zeus wasn't he a notorious rapist.In fact most of the Greek Pantheon were jerks who very petty and vain.

Zeus had his faults, as they all did. He was a notorious womanizer.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

I started drinking too, so, yeah, let's postpone this.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

I didn't even read all that and I wish I was drinking now

 

[Jiro]

How about a late contender? Let me introduce you to the worst father in the Final Fantasy series...

Cid Kramer adopts a bunch of kids, trains them as child soldiers, sends them into conflicts and sells them as mercenaries, all so that one day they can defeat their mother. What a fucking asshat. Not to mention how useless he is when push comes to shove, and that he abandons his children for his wife in the end anyway.

This is the type of person you do not let adopt even orphans. Giving him control of Garden was a massive mistake on the part of the Department of Child Safety, or whatever. Jesus H Christ.

 

[Arianna]

How about this: Final Fantasy is notorious for its line of horrible fathers.

Kind of makes me wonder about the fathers of some of these script writers...

Cid Kramer adopts a bunch of kids, trains them as child soldiers, sends them into conflicts and sells them as mercenaries, all so that one day they can defeat their mother. What a fucking asshat. Not to mention how useless he is when push comes to shove, and that he abandons his children for his wife in the end anyway.

This is the type of person you do not let adopt even orphans. Giving him control of Garden was a massive mistake on the part of the Department of Child Safety, or whatever. Jesus H Christ.

Is this from VIII? I haven't played that one ye.

Wait, you mentioned Garden, I know that's from VIII.

 

[Murdim]

How about a late contender? Let me introduce you to the worst father in the Final Fantasy series...

Cid Kramer adopts a bunch of kids, trains them as child soldiers, sends them into conflicts and sells them as mercenaries, all so that one day they can defeat their mother. What a fucking asshat. Not to mention how useless he is when push comes to shove, and that he abandons his children for his wife in the end anyway.

This is the type of person you do not let adopt even orphans. Giving him control of Garden was a massive mistake on the part of the Department of Child Safety, or whatever. Jesus H Christ.

You know, I think the Kramers could have been really interesting and a credit to the game's story... had they been treated in-game as the bunch of well-intentioned scheming bastards they actually are. Those people had to put their own emotions and humanity aside and horribly abuse their own adoptive children, in order to prevent an universe-ending cataclysm.

Morally grey "good guys", necessary evils and the need for atonement are all recurrent elements in the Final Fantasy games, yet the game never presents Cid as anything more than a bumbling Robin Williams lookalike. He should have been treated as a tragic monster, not as a straight mentor figure. Even Harry Potter did it with Dumbledore to an extent, and his sins weren't nearly as great as those of those of Cid and his spoileriffic wife.

 

[Kermitu Kleric Katie]

Now hold on, Final Fantasy has it's share of good fathers as well. Just look at Barret, who's not the best father in the world, but he tries his best. And then there's Sazh, who is perhaps the best father ever. And even Cloud, minus the brief period when he got Geostigma and left, has been a good dad to Marlene and Denzel. And there's also Dorgan, who had to raise Bartz by himself for a good portion of Bartz's childhood, and seems to have done a good job. And that's only the tip of the iceberg. I have plenty moar examples I could give you.

 

[Obsidian Fire]

Techinicly, Cid can only be blamed for Squall and Seifer. Zell, Irvine, Questis (sp?) and Selphie were all adopted by other people and went to Garden of their own volition... also, 16 is a very average age to be fighting in a manga/anime world; a lot of characters start even younger then that.

 

[Jiro]

Techinicly, Cid can only be blamed for Squall and Seifer. Zell, Irvine, Questis (sp?) and Selphie were all adopted by other people and went to Garden of their own volition... also, 16 is a very average age to be fighting in a manga/anime world; a lot of characters start even younger then that.

Cid's role as a surrogate father figure extends to all the students of Garden imo, which includes the "junior classmen" that are attacked during the Clash of the Gardens.

I know that technically he's not a parent but when fulfilling a similar role, I think he needs to be held accountable. He turns kids into soldiers, which is not something to be proud of, even if it is in service to the future of the planet.

Another iffy mention is Laguna; he rescues Ellone, but has nothing to do with Squall. Kind of a fuck up of a father in some respects, though he's certainly not malicious or deliberate about it.

 

[Ghost X]

Before Kony 2012, there was Cid 1999.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Another iffy mention is Laguna; he rescues Ellone, but has nothing to do with Squall. Kind of a fuck up of a father in some respects, though he's certainly not malicious or deliberate about it.

That one is more that Laguna got screwed. The people of Winhill didn't like him and sent the kids away when Raine died, so he may not have even known Squall existed until the present-day events of the game (he mentions that "Ellone told me everything").

 

[Jiro]

That one is more that Laguna got screwed. The people of Winhill didn't like him and sent the kids away when Raine died, so he may not have even known Squall existed until the present-day events of the game (he mentions that "Ellone told me everything").

Oh yeah, Laguna is not at fault for a lot of that, but it still stands to reason that Laguna let* Squall be in the orphanage, let Squall become a child soldier and then encouraged/forced him to get sucked into Time Compression to save the world. Tall order from a son you never bought a single birthday card for.


* Again, sometimes Laguna didn't really have a choice, but fuck it, we're criticising bad parenting here and it's gonna count.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Other than that last one, he didn't do any of that, though (again, may not have known the kid existed; almost definitely didn't know his name; certainly didn't know where to find him). And that last one was more Laguna honoring his son's wishes to save Rinoa.

Once Adel was dead, the world was saved. If Laguna wanted to be a bastard about it (a.k.a. do the practical thing), he would have had Rinoa taken into custody at that point, and she would have been back in stasis. Stopping Ulty didn't require allowing Time Compression, going to the future, killing the witch or most anything that happened on Disc 4.

They only did those things because it was the only way Rinoa was going to have a normal life.

So, tl;dr: Squall risked all existence for his woman, and Laguna backed him up.