Bow wow wow ~ My Final Remake Theory

[cold_spirit]

Just throwing it out there, I've continued to update this theory over the last year. There's even a change log at the end of my first post. Most updates are for clarity, such as better terminology, diagrams, and examples, but today I made a minor "content" change.

I updated this line:

The planet activates the Whispers to intervenue and restrain the mysterious Sephiroth.

to just:

The Whispers intervene and restrain the mysterious Sephiroth.

Previously, I thought of the Whispers as a form of Weapon the planet could deploy to enact its idea of "fate". However, that doesn't fit with what we're presented in Chapter 18. Aerith describes the Whispers as "Those born into this world. Who lived and who died. Who returned." and that they're "howling in pain" because of Sephiroth. They certainly don’t sound like they're part of the natural order of things.

Reviewing the game script, these lines from Sephiroth stick out to me:

"All born are bound to her. Should this world be unmade, so too shall her children."

"Our world will become a part of it… one day. But I… will not end. Nor will I have you end."

Sephiroth is working to avoid some ultimate "end" that will come to himself and Cloud. I think the Whispers are a result of his actions. Perhaps Sephiroth's will is somehow tearing the lifestream apart. This torn spirit energy then becomes a "Whisper", a spectre hellbent on ensuring "destiny" is followed (i.e., Sephiroth is defeated), allowing them to merge back into the lifestream.

But Sephiroth has other plans. If he were to convert the entire planet's lifestream into Whispers, beings that exist outside of the cycle of life and death, then there wouldn't be a planet left to unmake. This would be disastrous to what we understand as "life", but that doesn't concern Sephiroth. He's obsessed with longevity and individualism, the exact opposite of being at peace with death and letting your life energy become someone else’s (returning to the planet).

"Their words… they don't reach him. All these moments and memories, precious and fleeting… they're like rain rolling off his back… And when they're gone, he won't cry… or shout… or anything."

Give my first post a look if you haven't in a while! I believe this diagram in particular will age well.

 

[waw]

Thanks for sharing updates on this. I haven't been around in a while but I tend to go back to your construction when I see folks discussing this. One of the things that keeps nagging at me is the KISS rule (Keep It Simple, Stupid) and how convoluted/understandable this will be to people who jump on to Remake only.

I would imagine a company is worried about relying on events of a 20 some year old game. It's sorta like the ending of DoC with Weiss and Genesis... Many fans have speculated that it means something and expected a continuing story, some sort of final chapter with those two heavily involved. But picking up that thread from a fairly obscure spin off 20 some years later is just... would they really do that?

And so as I look at what's going on with these time travel/multiverse/multi-timelined stories and I can't help but wonder if it can even work. Like, it gets so complicated, how would the average fan not on a forum follow it? They can't rely on people picking up on Ultimania to get the story. And so do they have time and room to really explain all this?

I wonder if the ending of Advent Children, "I will never be a memory" scene, will be something we flashover to, with Aerith or someone explaining that there are many Planets with the story playing out as Sephiroth keeps changing things so he can win and pretty much leave it there only for the nuance and detail to come in Ultimania later. I'm not sure how to best deliver this story.

And honestly, I'm still at a loss with what you refer to as the Terrier Timeline. What will the narrative function of having Zack alive in that universe be? If he's in a separate universe, will he ever interact with the party? Have any function? What's the point of it? Ostensibly, Zack is going to be a big component of what comes next by dint of marketing and hints.

 

[cold_spirit]

And honestly, I'm still at a loss with what you refer to as the Terrier Timeline. What will the narrative function of having Zack alive in that universe be? If he's in a separate universe, will he ever interact with the party? Have any function? What's the point of it?

In short, I don't know!

I'm not in the writer's room, I don't sit in the director's chair. I could tell you what I would do, but that'd be jarring to hear. The version of FFVII that exists in my head is probably different from the version that exists in yours, and both are most definitely different from the version that belongs to the creators. So what works for me might not work for you. I can't assure you of anything.

What I can do is look at the evidence we have so far and give you my conclusion. Let's let the games do the talking. Lining it all up, I'd say the evidence is overwhelming for alternate realities / universes. I posted a breakdown in another thread and will copy/paste it here for good measure. In the spoiler tag below is why I don't think the past was changed.

Spoiler

1. Stamp's new design is spotlighted by the camera. If the past was altered, then showing Zack’s survival would've been enough to communicate that. Why present a new design for Stamp as well? Furthermore, the design is not shown to have been affected by the defeat of the Whispers. This suggests to me that Stamp is not an additional alteration, but rather a label of distinction (between Zack’s reality and the party's).

2. The story would have a very different starting point if Zack survived in the past. Consider all the character development that would be affected. Not just the interactions the party had with supporting characters, but also the supporting characters themselves, such as Jessie, Leslie, and Rufus. Consider Yuffie’s story and Sonon’s sacrifice. All of this would be warped. Altering the past is narratively destructive because it separates the player from the story told so far in Remake. (Tommy 86 on Discord made this point, I’m just hijacking it)

3. The Whispers intervene to prevent major deviations from the original game's plot. If Zack survived in an altered past, but events still led to the party meeting up and escaping Midgar, then why were the Whispers monitoring him at all? To have events play out similarly regardless of the Whispers' presence reduces their purpose and threat throughout the entire story.

4. Zack's survival scene in the ending is inserted between scenes of Shinra and the Sector 7 slums, both of which follow up on the story as it was told in Remake. It's not separated from the rest of the pack or given a visual effect to hint that it takes place in the past. Instead, it's presented straight and even features a new design for Stamp to boot. I'd argue that from this cinematic point of view, Zack's survival is shown to happen at the same time as everything else.

5. Let's try to place Zack's post-credit Intermission scene in a "the past was altered" scenario. Assume for a moment that Zack arrived at the church sometime after the Sector 7 platefall and the people there are survivors. How does one explain the fact that Zack wields the Buster Sword, just as Cloud did during that time? Assume for a moment that Zack arrived at the church sometime before the Sector 7 platefall and the people there are mourning something involving Aerith. If something bad happened to her, wouldn't that reflect on our Aerith outside of Kalm? The scenario is inconsistent in both cases.

And so as I look at what's going on with these time travel/multiverse/multi-timelined stories and I can't help but wonder if it can even work. Like, it gets so complicated, how would the average fan not on a forum follow it? They can't rely on people picking up on Ultimania to get the story. And so do they have time and room to really explain all this?

Having the project be approachable to newcomers has already sailed away with Remake's ending, no matter how much the creators insist otherwise. Chapter 18 simply cannot land as intended without knowledge of the original game. So I don't see this as a new issue moving forward. These games have and will continue to leave new fans in the rearview mirror. As for poorly explained or rushed ideas, as well as the reliance on Ultimanias, that's simply been NKN's storytelling style since VIII. As much as I don't like it, it comes with the territory now.

I'll try to end on a positive note. I don't think NKN are senseless. Memory remains a core pillar. In Remake, memories of the original story are pushing the characters forward. In that sense the characters are like us, re-experiencing events with a certain nostalgia. Remake is a meditation on FFVII, more so than any straightforward remake could ever hope to be.

Nomura, Kitase, and Nojima are driven by excitement and creativity, both of which are very good aspects to have when making any FF game. Reinvention is the heart of the series. I have no doubt that the Remake Project will continue to be divisive. It's not content with adorning your shelf, it wants to rock the boat, to be the center of conversation. By reinventing itself I know, its heart is full.