Final Fantasy XII

[Tennyo]

Did I make any such statement? Or even anything remotely close to that? No. lol

 

[Makoeyes987]

If you're insinuating that I'm merely projecting my disturbed, perverted fantasies in regards to your statement...

You are gravely mistaken ma'am. I have no idea what you're talking about

 

[DrakeClawfang]

I just heard some horrific blasphemy on the FF Wiki - a user who considered XII the worst game in the series.

Like....how? In a series with games like FF Adventure, Mystic Quest, and VIII, how do you consider XII the worst in the series? I get how some people just don't like some games, you'll like or dislike some FFs more than others. But to consider XII the worst FF...wtf? It's like saying the Dark Knight is the worst Batman movie. SENSE MAKE NOT IT DOES!

 

[Tennyo]

What is it about XII that the person doesn't like?

I mean I can get why some people might not like it but some of the things I've seen people say make no sense. Such as how a lot of people seem to think that XII was a rush job and had no effort put into it. Um...no. I tell them it took five flipping years to make, and also had a lot of issues along the way. Then they just go off in a huff, most likely to make the same exact complaint to someone else. :/

 

[DrakeClawfang]

He basically hates everything. Quote: "Bad dialogue. Plot holes. Bad gameplay. Bad story. Bad characters."

I just don't understand it. FF12 certainly was flawed, yeah, but it was still an awesome game. IMO, the only real flaw in XII was that Vayne wasn't a satisfying villain. Kefka, Golbez and Kuja have ruined me when it comes to what I expect from villains. 12's battle system had its weak points too*, but for their first real attempt with a Real-time system, it came out pretty good.

*See - uneven spell lag, potentially confusing Gambits, Espers are useless in favor of Quickenings.

EDIT - This is funny now, I removed his messages from my page because really, when someone thinks FF12 is the worst in the series they don't have anything to say that I care to listen to. And now he's bitching and complaining to another user on his talk page about it.

I took another look at his page - seems all he's played is VII, VIII, X, CC, Dirge, and Tactics. He thinks the best "Cid" is Cid Highwind, Sephiroth and Genesis are the best villains, and FF7 is the best game in every category except graphics. Basically, he's one of *those* fans. No wonder he thinks XII sucks, his views on the series are horribly skewed.

 

[Tetsujin]

Like....how? In a series with games like FF Adventure, Mystic Quest, and VIII, how do you consider XII the worst in the series?

Mystic Quest/FF Adventure was awesome D=<
(talking about the Seiken Densetsu one, not FF Mystic Quest aka Mystic Quest Legend in Europe).

 

[DrakeClawfang]

I admit I've not played Adventure, but I've not heard much good about it. I hear it plays like Zelda, though since it spawned its own series I guess it must be alright.

 

[Tetsujin]

It's one of the best GameBoy games available actually. Got good reviews, has awesome story and music etc.

 

[Max Payne]

FFXII didn't have a real time battle system.

 

[Super Mario]

Where were you when that whole drama about being able to look up Selphie's skirt in Kingdom Hearts went down?

And perversion is no fault of anyone's sanity

Elaborate more on this pls?


Also, Battle system's awesome. Though can be irritating sometimes.

 

[Masamune]

He basically hates everything. Quote: "Bad dialogue. Plot holes. Bad gameplay. Bad story. Bad characters."

Hot dawg. You can't argue with that sort of reasoning.

I just don't understand it. FF12 certainly was flawed, yeah, but it was still an awesome game. IMO, the only real flaw in XII was that Vayne wasn't a satisfying villain.

I'd say that's because Vayne isn't an operatic villain. He works in the background, plotting his next machination. He's a true Machiavellian, and not many FF villains can boast of victory in defeat.

*See - uneven spell lag, potentially confusing Gambits, Espers are useless in favor of Quickenings.

Espers are a tactical option and less of a 'cheap shot', which I why a lot of people think they're useless.

 

[Strangelove]

He basically hates everything. Quote: "Bad dialogue. Plot holes. Bad gameplay. Bad story. Bad characters."

Would have been a more convincing argument if he had cited some examples and backed himself up instead of just using something subjective like 'bad'

He could have just said "I didn't like" and left it at that. Or said nothing at all

 

[DrakeClawfang]

Well, he cited a few examples, none of them really enlightening.

The characters stepped on each others' dialogue like an old Spider-Man cartoon, they hardly emoted at all, the English was fancy, but it sounded SO unnatural, the license system was ridiculous, the story didn't make a whole lot of sense (I find the summary "a revolution over a revolution over something that was working just fine" to be very apropo"), the characters were all ridiculously underdeveloped, the battle system was so ill-conceived that they actually moved BACKWARDS for XIII, & if we get into its status as a "distant prequal," it becomes even more problematic: It cleared up NOTHING about the Espers/Scions/Lucavi, Moogles were nothing like what they were depicted in FFT, all these half-assed races came out of nowhere, & in clearing up the Lucavi's origins slightly, it introduced something even MORE poorly explained: the Occuria.
Where did they come from? Why does the Mist always form humanoid shapes? Why are they so interested in controlling the lives of other species? Why are they such dicks (throwing innocent bystanders in the same punishments as the Lucavi)? What is the POINT in the Scions, anyway, since they don't seem to have any REAL other-worldly powers?
And why didn't they take the hint when everything from Yiazmat to the Magick Urns challenged their powers?

 

[Tetsujin]

the battle system was so ill-conceived that they actually moved BACKWARDS for XIII

What.

 

[Max Payne]

 

[DrakeClawfang]

I don't know, most of what he said was salvageable. Since I removed his messages he's gotten quite pissy on his talk page, tossing out curses and backhand insults. The most I ever did was call him a fool.

Speaking on what he said, I just have a generic question. I realize this is the internet, and im rdy for a few lol-worthy slangs, imo its inevitable and if u cant handle it then stfu. But really, are proper grammar and spelling so easily cast aside? Sometimes on the internet, it just gets so bad I really can't understand what people are trying to say.

 

[Max Payne]

I don't know, most of what he said was salvageable. Since I removed his messages he's gotten quite pissy on his talk page, tossing out curses and backhand insults. The most I ever did was call him a fool.

Speaking on what he said, I just have a generic question. I realize this is the internet, and im rdy for a few lol-worthy slangs, imo its inevitable and if u cant handle it then stfu. But really, are proper grammar and spelling so easily cast aside? Sometimes on the internet, it just gets so bad I really can't understand what people are trying to say.

All I can say regarding that is BAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWW.

And no, there's never any excuse for writing like you don't know shit about grammar.

 

[Arianna]

And no, there's never any excuse for writing like you don't know shit about grammar.

Yeah, it's ridiculous how some people are when they type on the internet; still, I could see some reasons why poor spelling and/or grammar could be used. Over all, if it's something that's meant to be taken very seriously or something one actually has time to formulate - not a forum post like this, at least, not so much - the excuses go out the window.

Well, he cited a few examples, none of them really enlightening.

Now wait a second... Final Fantasy XII is supposed to be a prequel - and a distant beginning at that?! Of what and/or who?! I do recall hearing that Final Fantasy Tactics' land is also named Ivalice, but... Can someone spill the beans here? Thanks!

 

[Super Mario]

It's part of the Ivalice Alliance, stories taking place in Ivalice, basically FFXII, Tactics and some more Tactics belong to this series called the Ivalice Alliance. I'm not sure if XI is there but FFXII, Tactics, Revenant Wings and Tactics II is part of it.

 

[DrakeClawfang]

No, XI is not set in Ivalice, it's in Vana'diel or something like that.

I don't understand how anyone could expect XII to solve the mysteries of Ivalice. I've not played the Tactics games, but as I've understood it, each of them is a game in of itself, all set in Ivalice but not directly connected. So why should XII have to be the game to explain plot holes in a bunch of other games? I don't expect VIII to explain things from VII

 

[Super Mario]

Lol wut? someone expected a closure or something from an FF series? Who is this moron???

 

[Cat Rage Room]

FF12 wasn't bad. It wasn't STELLAR in all aspects, either. It was in some, but the battle system...ugh.

Let me elaborate. I don't mind not having ATB. In fact, I loved the direction they took regarding that. The Gambit system wasn't bad either. It's just that I abhor systems where the characters more or less can, or have the easily available opportunity to end up all the same, and with the License Board and the minuscule difference in stats from character to character, FF12 had it in spades. I dislike systems where any character can do anything and you can switch roles at the drop of a hat.

My favorite system is a mix of character customization and uniqueness, such as FFV, FFIV, FFT, or FF9, where in some of those cases, you CAN make all of the characters the same or switch roles, but not without having to put in the time and effort (or suffer tactical consequences). Character growth and customization is more organic and meticulous, rather than YOU WERE JUST A HEALER BUT NOW YOU'RE FIRING THUNDAGA SPELLS PEW PEW

That's my biggest beef with FF12.

 

[Hinata Hyuga]

But even though they give you the ability to change them easily, you can very easily have them avoid doing things.

I haven't played a lot of 12 yet. So I can't say I worked with every skill and stuff.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

But even though they give you the ability to change them easily, you can very easily have them avoid doing things.

Why should the player have to purposefully limit themselves like that? Granted, the design decision was theirs to make, but it is what it is. Artificially changing your play style to make up for what you didn't like about the game doesn't change the game itself.

That's like a game where the main character has God Mode, but the player handicaps himself to make the game harder by shutting off the game every five minutes if he doesn't beat the level.

 

[DrakeClawfang]

It's just that I abhor systems where the characters more or less can, or have the easily available opportunity to end up all the same, and with the License Board and the minuscule difference in stats from character to character, FF12 had it in spades. I dislike systems where any character can do anything and you can switch roles at the drop of a hat.

True, but in such situations, you can do a sort of "forced Job Class" thing.

Also, XII International solves that, by creating twelve different License Boards based on Job Classes, and each character chooses one and only one to use for the entire game. It honestly sounds like a cool system, but as with all their "Final Mix" games, it will likely never see an English release.