Jenova and Ancients

[guisado]

When you know exactly what Jenova is not a Ancient?

And when Lucrecia was injected cells jenova already knew it was an alien and not a Ancient?

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

You first find the suggestion that Jenova was not an Ancient at Cosmo Canyon. It's optional dialogue, but one of the elders mentions Gast having come through at one point muttering that he had made a mistake and Jenova was no Ancient.

The second suggestion, also optional, is in the Shinra Mansion's basement prior to the Reunion. Sephiroth will refer to Jenova as the Calamity from the Skies, prompting Cloud to ask if he means she wasn't an Ancient.

Finalky, Gast's tapes at Icicle Inn (again, optional) have Ifalna confirming that Jenova was not one of the Cetra.

Also, no, at the time Lucrecia was injected, no one had figured out yet they were playing with an alien.

 

[Knuxson]

Yep, it is as Tres said. Also, the whole point of the Jenova project was to inject Lucrecia with Jenova's cells to try to recreate an ancient. So they obviously still thought Jenova was an ancient at that time.

 

[guisado]

and i see now Last Order and i see 1 error i think:


in the final we can look all the turks appears in Before Crisis but in this moment in the game the most turks except Rude Tseng and Reno are desert?



And when Zack dead and Cloud go Midgar and tifa help Cloud? How much time elapses?

thanks!

 

[S and G]

Official timelines state that Zack's death took place in the third quarter of the year and the opening mission of FFVII happened in December. This means that there were at least three months between these events. Beyond that, it is open to interpretation as to how long it took Cloud to meet Tifa.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Official timelines (e.g. Cloud and Zack's 10th Anniversary Ultimania profiles) put Zack's death in September, though I'm not sure if it was clear whether it was toward the end or beginning of the month. But, yeah, it's unclear where in the space of time following that Cloud met Tifa. It had to be before December 9th, however, as that's when the game began.

As for Last Order, that's not canon anyway, so I wouldn't worry about it too much, guisado. It actually has a pretty huge continuity error, though, in that it gives the impression the whole series of events from Cloud and Zack's escape out of Nibelheim to Zack's death outside Midgar happened in the space of one night.

Tseng's opening narration says that they had escaped three hours earlier and the story carries us to the next morning just before Zack dies. Their escape actually happened in December of 0006, and Zack didn't die until September of 0007.

Another big error there is that Last Order places Tseng in a helicopter going to intercept Zack and Cloud while Crisis Core has him in his office at the time of Zack's death.

So, yeah, just ignore Last Order as far as continuity goes. Enjoy it for what it is (I still like to watch it sometimes), but don't take it too seriously.

 

[Knuxson]

Interesting. The game makes it seem like Cloud has not been with Tifa and Barrett very long before the first mission at the start of the game. It makes me wonder if he was stumbling around Midgar for a couple of months before Tifa found him.

 

[Obsidian Fire]

^^That's a pretty likely scenario as he had been in a 4-year long coma up to that point.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

With his enhancements, who knows how long he could have survived on his own, even all fudged up like that.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

I now have hilarious visions of a derpy, mentally unbalanced Cloud dragging the Buster Sword all over the countryside outside of Midgar, getting into crazy shenanigans and chasing down random monsters to eat. All set to Yakety Sax, of course.

 

[Knuxson]

I have also always wondered why Tifa didn't recognize the buster sword and sort of figure out that Cloud must of been linked to Nibelheim/Zack somehow. I mean, she saw Zack using it in Nibelheim and it is a pretty distinct sword to forget about it. Maybe she figured it was just a typical SOLDIER sword that any SOLDIER might have. Of course, it wasn't given as much significance as it has until Crisis Core, so maybe in the OG it WAS a typical type of SOLDIER sword.

 

[Ite]

In the OG, only Sephiroth's sword is noted as recognizable, and considering all the random badass swords lying around, maybe people are just used to SOLDIERs having big honking blades. Tifa (and Aeris for that matter) might have noticed a similarity, but not being sword wielders themselves, and five years having passed, they probably didn't make the connection.

It would be like passing an appraisal check in D&D.

Edit: Also, Tifa may have known, but not said anything. She keeps her yam shut about Cloud because part of her is worried that it is *her* memory that's wrong. And Aeris was pretty tight-lipped about the whole ex-boyfriend thing in general.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

People who are unfamiliar with military hardware tend to have the entire concept totally fly over their heads. Tifa most likely, especially in the span of five years, saw no significance of the thing.

Even in real life, the Buster Sword is iconic to us because we know and love the mythology, and many of us are familiar with fantasy enough to make a distinction. However to those who don't have that foreknowledge, its just a sword. I were to show say, my girlfriend the Buster Sword and show her again five years later, bet she wouldn't remember it.

 

[Ite]

If I were to show say, my girlfriend the Buster Sword and show her again five years later, bet she wouldn't remember it.

Then you're doing it wrong OH SNAP

 

[S and G]

In the OG, only Sephiroth's sword is noted as recognizable, and considering all the random badass swords lying around, maybe people are just used to SOLDIERs having big honking blades. Tifa (and Aeris for that matter) might have noticed a similarity, but not being sword wielders themselves, and five years having passed, they probably didn't make the connection.

It would be like passing an appraisal check in D&D.

Edit: Also, Tifa may have known, but not said anything. She keeps her yam shut about Cloud because part of her is worried that it is *her* memory that's wrong. And Aeris was pretty tight-lipped about the whole ex-boyfriend thing in general.

Totally agree. It is perfectly plausible that Tifa assumed the Buster Sword was standard issue, kept tight-lipped about recognising it, or something else entirely.

Why Aerith said nothing about the sword, however....

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

If I were to show say, my girlfriend the Buster Sword and show her again five years later, bet she wouldn't remember it.

Then you're doing it wrong OH SNAP

This is funniest TLS moment of the year right here. I literally laughed out loud for about three minutes at work just now.

Thankfully, I work in a factory and it's full of noise.