Theozilla
Kaiju Member
Goddamnit no, I said FF V I I I ! FF8 not 7, there are three Roman Numeral ‘I”s not two!
Nier
- Thread starter Novus
- Start date
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
ForceStealer
Double Growth
Squ[A]ll is Dead 
Tetsujin
he/they
- AKA
- Tets
I honestly think this is giving the devs too much credit. I've seen this point made on the internet so much and it honestly bothers me.
I mean even assuming this really is the case, what's the commentary here? "Haha, this is boring and tedious, you're a sucker for doing this!" Uh, sorry for playing your game? I guess?
What is the point of making a "commentary" when it just drags down the gameplay and makes it unfun? When there is like hours of content that are best ignored? Making something intentionally bad maybe works for a small section to make a point, but littering the entire game with it? To what purpose?
I think the truth is that there was no commentary here. This was originally a game made by a cheap for hire dev studio that made mediocre games across the board and that's why it is the way it is. IMHO.
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
So far, I definitely find the sidequests of Automata more interesting and engaging.
I saw more creative subversion of expectations in Automata than in Replicant. Granted, Nier is still a boy so maybe it'll change but it certainly feels like a typical open world JRPG being played straight so far.
Now, I know that's not how the overall story turns out but that's how it's playing currently.
I saw more creative subversion of expectations in Automata than in Replicant. Granted, Nier is still a boy so maybe it'll change but it certainly feels like a typical open world JRPG being played straight so far.
Now, I know that's not how the overall story turns out but that's how it's playing currently.
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
Game definitely picked up as I got to Facade and obtained more Sealed Verses. Facade is my favorite town out of the locations in Nier thus far. It felt truly unique and it's Temple was interesting and entertaining with it's challenges.
The main quest of Nier is excellent. I cannot emphasis this enough. Loving the story so far and the characters. I tried not to fall for Kaine but here I am... Loving that foul-mouthed tsundere. Grimoire Weiss makes me laugh too much, and even Nier is endearing to me. Knowing what I know overall hasn't hurt my experience, and I'm grateful for that.
However, it's weakness are it's sidequests. They're not all bad. However, I would say half of them so far are uninspired rote JRPG fetch quests that don't even give the luxury or benefit of expanding on anything regarding the narrative, lore, setting or just... Anything. I'm forgiving when it comes to sidequests, I have a high tolerance for immersive side jobs. But... HOO BOY. A lot of this is just Nier being a naive sweetheart and doing repetitive busywork for the benefit of some lazy ass NPC.
Some of these quests are great, like the Lighthouse Lady quest or the the twins singing a duet quest. But for every great sidequest with a nice payoff and interesting story, you get 3 Fisherman's Gambits which just. Why were there five iterations of that fucking quest...?
It's very clear Nier is a product of its time when RPGs felt the necessity to not only be open world, but cram as much sidequest busy work as possible to ensure "value" was given through just things to do. I had an interesting debate here over the nature of filler in another RPG game, and I can honestly say that Nier definitely has sidequests that fall under the category of "filler." Delivering a fucking package across the world map that breaks if you get hit or dodge roll because someone asks you to and that's that is nothing more than a gameplay busywork challenge. The highlight of that quest was Grimoire Weiss complaining about us taking such a meaningless job when we had shit to do, LMAO!
Given what I know will be required to unlock everything and its true ending, this game didn't need this many sidequests. And it's apparent Yoko Taro and his development team learned from this game because Automata doesn't have nearly as many quests, let alone filler ones.
Despite this weakness I love this game a lot. It's pros definitely outweigh it's cons. I just will have to listen to podcasts or something else in the background as I do these stupid sidequests
The main quest of Nier is excellent. I cannot emphasis this enough. Loving the story so far and the characters. I tried not to fall for Kaine but here I am... Loving that foul-mouthed tsundere. Grimoire Weiss makes me laugh too much, and even Nier is endearing to me. Knowing what I know overall hasn't hurt my experience, and I'm grateful for that.
However, it's weakness are it's sidequests. They're not all bad. However, I would say half of them so far are uninspired rote JRPG fetch quests that don't even give the luxury or benefit of expanding on anything regarding the narrative, lore, setting or just... Anything. I'm forgiving when it comes to sidequests, I have a high tolerance for immersive side jobs. But... HOO BOY. A lot of this is just Nier being a naive sweetheart and doing repetitive busywork for the benefit of some lazy ass NPC.
Some of these quests are great, like the Lighthouse Lady quest or the the twins singing a duet quest. But for every great sidequest with a nice payoff and interesting story, you get 3 Fisherman's Gambits which just. Why were there five iterations of that fucking quest...?
It's very clear Nier is a product of its time when RPGs felt the necessity to not only be open world, but cram as much sidequest busy work as possible to ensure "value" was given through just things to do. I had an interesting debate here over the nature of filler in another RPG game, and I can honestly say that Nier definitely has sidequests that fall under the category of "filler." Delivering a fucking package across the world map that breaks if you get hit or dodge roll because someone asks you to and that's that is nothing more than a gameplay busywork challenge.
The highlight of that quest was Grimoire Weiss complaining about us taking such a meaningless job when we had shit to do, LMAO!Given what I know will be required to unlock everything and its true ending, this game didn't need this many sidequests. And it's apparent Yoko Taro and his development team learned from this game because Automata doesn't have nearly as many quests, let alone filler ones.
Despite this weakness I love this game a lot. It's pros definitely outweigh it's cons. I just will have to listen to podcasts or something else in the background as I do these stupid sidequests
Mayo Master
Pro Adventurer
I finally finished the game (ending E). I almost dropped the game after ending B, but I got some encouragement to push it to the finish line - I'm glad I did it and I am grateful for the encouragements. I agree with Lex's earlier comments, ending E is quite something.
Definitely not platinum-ing this one though, way too much grinding for my taste.
Definitely not platinum-ing this one though, way too much grinding for my taste.
Regarding the E playthrough: I got completely taken by surprised by the plot twist when waking from Kainé's dream. In particular, what got me is that when you start your E playthrough, there's a single small detail that conditioned my whole mindset: the presence of the mother's diary, which is unlocked after ending A.
At this particular point, the mother's diary is the single thing that bears a trace that you've completed the game before. And the other aspect is that you're also grossly under-leveled to take on the dungeons from the mother's diary. These elements got me to think "I'll have to try completing the mother's diary later, once I reach Act II of the game with "grown-up Nier" and my level is higher". I was fully expecting to have to go through the same motions as for reaching ending A, and anticipating to get a final plot-twist in the Shadowlord's castle (and bracing myself for so much grinding). The subversion was spectacular. If the presence of the mother's diary was intentionally set to make the player get into the same mindset as I did, this plot device was beautiful in its simplicity.
The other thing that I was contemplating: I personally haven't played the original PS3 Nier, still I found ending E really emotional. For those who had reached ending D in the original Nier, reaching ending E after a decade must have been something really mind-blowing. It must have been an incredible reward.
At this particular point, the mother's diary is the single thing that bears a trace that you've completed the game before. And the other aspect is that you're also grossly under-leveled to take on the dungeons from the mother's diary. These elements got me to think "I'll have to try completing the mother's diary later, once I reach Act II of the game with "grown-up Nier" and my level is higher". I was fully expecting to have to go through the same motions as for reaching ending A, and anticipating to get a final plot-twist in the Shadowlord's castle (and bracing myself for so much grinding). The subversion was spectacular. If the presence of the mother's diary was intentionally set to make the player get into the same mindset as I did, this plot device was beautiful in its simplicity.
The other thing that I was contemplating: I personally haven't played the original PS3 Nier, still I found ending E really emotional. For those who had reached ending D in the original Nier, reaching ending E after a decade must have been something really mind-blowing. It must have been an incredible reward.
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
oh you think there are only five
Are you fucking serious?? I swore I only saw 5 in my sidequests guide. If that old man makes me catch more damn fish for him post-timeskip
Yeah this game is definitely worth sticking through to the end. Don't know if I'm gonna platinum it either. And I did platinum Automata.
Drakengard 3 is another game that has amazing characters, an amazing story, is overall pretty fun but suffers from too much goddamn grinding and stupid busywork sidequests. It suffers for it more than Nier does and it's got the worst final boss fight I've ever seen in a modern game. Developers who designed that final boss should be punched in the stomach but that's another rant.
Tetsujin
he/they
- AKA
- Tets
Are you fucking serious?? I swore I only saw 5 in my sidequests guide. If that old man makes me catch more damn fish for him post-timeskip
Oh you know he will.
Good news: Platinuming does not require doing all sidequests!
Bad news: It does require getting 33 weapons to max level which requires lots of specific grinding for items with very low RNG drop rates.
In general the weapon upgrade system is odd as at least on Normal, you'll never really need anything beyond lvl.1 weapons. And you'll likely barely ever have enough raw materials to upgrade any weapon to lvl 2 to begin with, let alone all the way to 4!
Maybe I'm wrong but I do seem to recall I had a bunch of weapons upgraded in Automata just by playing the game normally? In Replicant, you'll have to grind SO much and there's no practical use for maxed out weapons unless you wanna have a go at Hard where everything is a damage sponge.
Drakengard 3 is another game that has amazing characters, an amazing story, is overall pretty fun but suffers from too much goddamn grinding and stupid busywork sidequests. It suffers for it more than Nier does and it's got the worst final boss fight I've ever seen in a modern game. Developers who designed that final boss should be punched in the stomach but that's another rant.
I've only watched a playthrough of the game on YouTube, so I didn't experience it firsthand, but it's always amusing to see posts about the final boss that are like "I have a PhD in music theory and let me explain why this is bullshit". The last bit is absolute trolling, I'd be so mad if I got to the end only to be hit by that nonsense.
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
Maybe I'm wrong but I do seem to recall I had a bunch of weapons upgraded in Automata just by playing the game normally? In Replicant, you'll have to grind SO much and there's no practical use for maxed out weapons unless you wanna have a go at Hard where everything is a damage sponge.
It's definitely easier to upgrade in Automata compared to Replicant. The developers learned their lesson after this game and improved dramatically in regards to game design. I'll try to upgrade my weapons but eh, we'll see.
LOL, It is utter bullshit and it arguably ruins the game from just a game-player perspective. It's not just ridiculously difficult to the point of obnoxious, it literally tries to cheat you. Nevermind the complexity of the rhythm timing that's beyond what should be expected of just average players of an action game, the entire structure of the fight itself is in clear sadistic opposition of the player succeeding. It comes from a terrible design perspective and ruins what would be a great, albeit grind heavy game.
That final boss fight is the worst I've seen in a modern game in terms of design, and I do not say that lightly. It's a brilliant and beautiful song, I love the aesthetics of the fight, and the idea is unique, but they ruined the execution and it really just needlessly fucks up everything.
Not even Drakengard 1's final boss was that hard and that final boss was stupidly difficult too, lol.
If Drakengard 3 gets remastered, they have to fix that final boss fight. If they don't, I wouldn't even buy it, lol
Obsidian Fire
Ahk Morn!
- AKA
- The Engineer
There are so many Fisherman's Gambit quests because that is how you unlock the fishing skill upgrades. Which can be useful if you *are* planning on getting a lot of weapon upgrades and need more ways to grind money.
I find the quests of Part 2 a lot more interesting than the quests of Part 1.
I find the quests of Part 2 a lot more interesting than the quests of Part 1.
Tetsujin
he/they
- AKA
- Tets
Just finished ending E, that was decent.
Did all the grinding for the weapon upgrade trophy on my C playthrough. That was probably the second-most grindiest game I tried to platinum.
Only got one trophy left now.
(fyi the grindiest was Re: Chain of Memories, and that was *with* RNG manipulation)
That giant flower at the end...for a second I feared there'd be a rhythm game o.o
Didn't expect them to get the protag back, that was actually almost a happy ending...for Yoko Taro. I mean, humanity is still doomed but you know. You take what you can get.
Didn't expect them to get the protag back, that was actually almost a happy ending...for Yoko Taro. I mean, humanity is still doomed but you know. You take what you can get.
Did all the grinding for the weapon upgrade trophy on my C playthrough. That was probably the second-most grindiest game I tried to platinum.
Only got one trophy left now.
(fyi the grindiest was Re: Chain of Memories, and that was *with* RNG manipulation)
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
Good God.
I don't think I've played a game where it's enjoyability spikes quite as hard as this one. It literally gets better the more into it you get. Nier is the Regigigas of JRPGs.
The fucking glow up of Nier. I'm really liking him, and the characterization he obtains is... It's tragic, badass and so very human. He's bitterly optimistic. He refuses to believe otherwise. He refuses to give up. And he intends to destroy as many Shades as possible along the way. It's a relentless love that will carve out it a miracle even if it damns him in the process.
And Emil and Kaine... I have a lot to say about them but I will say I see why they're so popular. This game really knows how to make you feel for their situation, even when you know it's coming. They don't give up, and find solace in being outcasts together. I love em.
Need to find the pieces of the key to the Shadowlord's Castle.
I really can't believe
I think it's a reflection of how people fixate so much on the differences of others, they miss the similarities... Often to tragic and horrific results.
I don't think I've played a game where it's enjoyability spikes quite as hard as this one. It literally gets better the more into it you get. Nier is the Regigigas of JRPGs.
The fucking glow up of Nier. I'm really liking him, and the characterization he obtains is... It's tragic, badass and so very human. He's bitterly optimistic. He refuses to believe otherwise. He refuses to give up. And he intends to destroy as many Shades as possible along the way. It's a relentless love that will carve out it a miracle even if it damns him in the process.
And Emil and Kaine... I have a lot to say about them but I will say I see why they're so popular. This game really knows how to make you feel for their situation, even when you know it's coming. They don't give up, and find solace in being outcasts together. I love em.
Need to find the pieces of the key to the Shadowlord's Castle.
I really can't believe
no one saw the resemblance between Nier and the Shadowlord. There are so many hints about what Shades really are but no one seems to notice.
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
Double post because I just finished the game, got Ending A, and read some of the short stories from Grimoire Nier because I had to know some stuff.
I must seriously be an emotional masochist to put myself through this, lol. Yelling that much at a story that's already determined isn't healthy.
What's hilarious about this game is I knew what I was getting into with this. Hell, I played Automata, so it's not like this all is a surprise. Yet...
Nier Replicant does a damn good job making you feel for these tragic, fucked up, and imperfect characters. Their tragic and foolish mistakes are frustrating yet... Sadly so familiar. So fucking human. It's amazing. And that ending... Just..that ending.
Gonna take a break for the sake of my emotional health and then go into Route B.
I must seriously be an emotional masochist to put myself through this, lol. Yelling that much at a story that's already determined isn't healthy.
What's hilarious about this game is I knew what I was getting into with this. Hell, I played Automata, so it's not like this all is a surprise. Yet...
I cannot believe how fucking hopelessly tragic this was. And it all could have been prevented.
It's infuriating yet tragically realistic. The tragedy of people trapped on the course of their own ambition, blinded by hatred, and deaf to the feelings and consideration of others.
People have said that Nier Replicant/Gestalt is more of a personal character driven story while Automata is more an exploration of themes, specifically the nature of existence and I feel like that's only half right. Because, Nier Replicant definitely explores very important themes albeit within a small cast of characters in a smaller scale story.
One is of course the nature and meaning of "humanity." Which was delved into further in Automata but Nier goes at it from a different angle.
And the important question Nier asks is, who are the real humans? This question is at the root of most of the conflicts and tragic consequences that spiral the entire human race into extinction. It's the dehumanization and disrespect of others that lies at the root of every tragedy that befalls the characters and the entire human race.
1.) You have governments of the world callously passing out copies of Grimoire Noir to people in order to hunt for the poor sap who will be made into a Gestalt that will function as the cornerstone of the entire Gestalt-ified human race. And it's not just "people," its poor, destitute, and family-less people within the margins of society. People who won't be missed. People who are desperate with no one who'd give a shit if they immediately relapsed and turned into Shades with no sense of self.
2.) You've got scientists and a weird private-publicly sponsored corporation called the Hamelin Organization cruelly experimenting on children to make them supersoldiers and magical superweapons.... And look, I get it. The human race was in a war for its very survival against interdimensional magical monsters who were turning people into salt-filled zombies and shit. Of course tough choices would have to be made, but you don't fucking lie and tell these children that they're being given a preventative for WCS when in reality it only slows down the infection and leaves them damned to either die or transform regardless. You don't get to experiment on kids, turn them into superweapon magical monsters and then act shocked when one goes berserk. And you don't trick some poor desperate adolescent into being the cornerstone of humanity by lying about what can happen with his sister while doing fuck-all to manage his expectations.
3.) You've got Devola and Popola just.... Not saying shit or managing Project Gestalt in any meaningful or proactive way. You know... I have to say, going into this game from Nier Automata, you would think Devola and Popola were innocent and wrongly maligned models of androids that were only trying to do their best with a shitty situation. No. Fuck that noise. Of course the Devola and Popola of Automata are not the same and didn't deserve the mistreatment they suffered, but there's a very real and valid reason to be wary of that model, I'm sorry Those spell-slinging psycho sisters fucked everything up. Why the fuck would they just show up at the Shadowlord Castle, not answer any of Nier's questions (bitch literally said, "I'm not going to answer that. You can figure it out") when he desperately asks what the fuck was going on, and just leaned into playing the villain? Bitch, you don't get to cry and lose your shit when one of you dies like a villain while playing the villain. And my god, how Popola lost it. That was wild and emotionally intense. I'm not gonna lie, I felt that pain, despair and rage in my chest. But at the same time... Either their AI was programmed and compiled improperly by the humans that built them, or they are shortsighted and selfish overseers. Why would they look down on Nier and all the Replicants like that? If Replicants were waking up and becoming aware, and Gestalts needed their Replicants to be human again, then guess what? You need to either explain that or put all the Replicants to sleep. But treating them like empty puppets and disrespecting their own agency isn't going to work.
4.) Shadowlord Nier just rage-quitting and stealing Yonah from the village and Replicant Nier. I get it. Waiting 1000 years is a long ass time. Not getting updates. Not seeing anything move. Worrying if the promise that was told to you would ever materialize. It's horrible and shitty situation that he was manipulated in. And this is also in part the fault of those androids and the fucked up human scientists 1000 years ago... But, how can you not have any sense of empathy, understanding or just... A feeling of desire to communicate to your other self, what the fuck is happening? The only reason I can discern is because he was, just like his Replicant version, focused entirely on the love for his sister and he saw his Replicant self as nothing but a shell.
5.) Replicant Nier definitely doesn't get a pass either because, while I love him, he fucked up too. Granted, no one really explained to him properly what was going on but after being told the whole history of the world, humanity, Project Gestalt, etc... This man didn't even pause. Not for a second. Didn't even question what the hell was going on around him. Granted, the emotional trauma and shock of everything probably made things hard but holy shit. You're fighting and killing yourself. This man deadass didn't even pause to think, "that's weird... he looks just like me..huh." And the reason was, because he was a Shade. It's so very clear that as the game progressed, Nier developed a visceral hatred of Shades to the point of mass murder. Shades that weren't even attacking, Shades that were trying to be peaceful, and Shades that even communicated and screamed, "Don't kill me! Don't kill them! That's my Mother! That's my Husband!" Their cries fell on deaf ears because Nier became the Shade Hunter. But that goes into another theme I'll go into shortly. Suffice to say, I've never seen someone so passionately and eagerly butcher themselves until this game
6.) The hatred and war between the Facade people and the wolves led by that Shade. Just... It's so fucked up and yet so perfectly human. Humanly tragic.
There are other examples but these I feel are the core 6 that just... Exemplify the tragedy. No one's communicating with each other. Why? Because they feel the other side is less. They aren't human. They aren't important. They're the real ones who matter. And just....
Another theme is hatred. Discrimination, hate.. The game goes out of its way to showcase how in Nier's adulthood he gained a growing hostility and bloodlust towards Shades. Regardless of the circumstance, he kills them indiscriminately. Yet... As you go through the game, fight and do sidequests... Little hints are dropped that show that Shades are not just mindless monsters. They're human. Their cries upon death, their behavior, their feelings, their understandable words when they are rarely able to speak. None of it matters to Nier. Why? Because he wants revenge for Yonah.
Likewise, Shades, Devola, Popola, Shadowlord Nier, and Grimoire Noir do not even deign to treat the Replicants as beings worthy of respect. They see them as expendable puppets. Shades try to exact revenge and you can see the hate and malice for Replicants in some of them. It's a cycle of hate.
Between that, Kaine's tragic childhood, and more it's clear that hatred and discrimination are an important theme explored in this game as well. It's no surprise that the main party are a band of misfits trying to make it in a [/ucked up world that's slowly dying around them.
It's infuriating yet tragically realistic. The tragedy of people trapped on the course of their own ambition, blinded by hatred, and deaf to the feelings and consideration of others.
People have said that Nier Replicant/Gestalt is more of a personal character driven story while Automata is more an exploration of themes, specifically the nature of existence and I feel like that's only half right. Because, Nier Replicant definitely explores very important themes albeit within a small cast of characters in a smaller scale story.
One is of course the nature and meaning of "humanity." Which was delved into further in Automata but Nier goes at it from a different angle.
And the important question Nier asks is, who are the real humans? This question is at the root of most of the conflicts and tragic consequences that spiral the entire human race into extinction. It's the dehumanization and disrespect of others that lies at the root of every tragedy that befalls the characters and the entire human race.
1.) You have governments of the world callously passing out copies of Grimoire Noir to people in order to hunt for the poor sap who will be made into a Gestalt that will function as the cornerstone of the entire Gestalt-ified human race. And it's not just "people," its poor, destitute, and family-less people within the margins of society. People who won't be missed. People who are desperate with no one who'd give a shit if they immediately relapsed and turned into Shades with no sense of self.
2.) You've got scientists and a weird private-publicly sponsored corporation called the Hamelin Organization cruelly experimenting on children to make them supersoldiers and magical superweapons.... And look, I get it. The human race was in a war for its very survival against interdimensional magical monsters who were turning people into salt-filled zombies and shit. Of course tough choices would have to be made, but you don't fucking lie and tell these children that they're being given a preventative for WCS when in reality it only slows down the infection and leaves them damned to either die or transform regardless. You don't get to experiment on kids, turn them into superweapon magical monsters and then act shocked when one goes berserk. And you don't trick some poor desperate adolescent into being the cornerstone of humanity by lying about what can happen with his sister while doing fuck-all to manage his expectations.
3.) You've got Devola and Popola just.... Not saying shit or managing Project Gestalt in any meaningful or proactive way. You know... I have to say, going into this game from Nier Automata, you would think Devola and Popola were innocent and wrongly maligned models of androids that were only trying to do their best with a shitty situation. No. Fuck that noise. Of course the Devola and Popola of Automata are not the same and didn't deserve the mistreatment they suffered, but there's a very real and valid reason to be wary of that model, I'm sorry
Those spell-slinging psycho sisters fucked everything up. Why the fuck would they just show up at the Shadowlord Castle, not answer any of Nier's questions (bitch literally said, "I'm not going to answer that. You can figure it out") when he desperately asks what the fuck was going on, and just leaned into playing the villain? Bitch, you don't get to cry and lose your shit when one of you dies like a villain while playing the villain. And my god, how Popola lost it. That was wild and emotionally intense. I'm not gonna lie, I felt that pain, despair and rage in my chest. But at the same time... Either their AI was programmed and compiled improperly by the humans that built them, or they are shortsighted and selfish overseers. Why would they look down on Nier and all the Replicants like that? If Replicants were waking up and becoming aware, and Gestalts needed their Replicants to be human again, then guess what? You need to either explain that or put all the Replicants to sleep. But treating them like empty puppets and disrespecting their own agency isn't going to work.4.) Shadowlord Nier just rage-quitting and stealing Yonah from the village and Replicant Nier. I get it. Waiting 1000 years is a long ass time. Not getting updates. Not seeing anything move. Worrying if the promise that was told to you would ever materialize. It's horrible and shitty situation that he was manipulated in. And this is also in part the fault of those androids and the fucked up human scientists 1000 years ago... But, how can you not have any sense of empathy, understanding or just... A feeling of desire to communicate to your other self, what the fuck is happening? The only reason I can discern is because he was, just like his Replicant version, focused entirely on the love for his sister and he saw his Replicant self as nothing but a shell.
5.) Replicant Nier definitely doesn't get a pass either because, while I love him, he fucked up too. Granted, no one really explained to him properly what was going on but after being told the whole history of the world, humanity, Project Gestalt, etc... This man didn't even pause. Not for a second. Didn't even question what the hell was going on around him. Granted, the emotional trauma and shock of everything probably made things hard but holy shit. You're fighting and killing yourself. This man deadass didn't even pause to think, "that's weird... he looks just like me..huh." And the reason was, because he was a Shade. It's so very clear that as the game progressed, Nier developed a visceral hatred of Shades to the point of mass murder. Shades that weren't even attacking, Shades that were trying to be peaceful, and Shades that even communicated and screamed, "Don't kill me! Don't kill them! That's my Mother! That's my Husband!" Their cries fell on deaf ears because Nier became the Shade Hunter. But that goes into another theme I'll go into shortly. Suffice to say, I've never seen someone so passionately and eagerly butcher themselves until this game
6.) The hatred and war between the Facade people and the wolves led by that Shade. Just... It's so fucked up and yet so perfectly human. Humanly tragic.
There are other examples but these I feel are the core 6 that just... Exemplify the tragedy. No one's communicating with each other. Why? Because they feel the other side is less. They aren't human. They aren't important. They're the real ones who matter. And just....
Another theme is hatred. Discrimination, hate.. The game goes out of its way to showcase how in Nier's adulthood he gained a growing hostility and bloodlust towards Shades. Regardless of the circumstance, he kills them indiscriminately. Yet... As you go through the game, fight and do sidequests... Little hints are dropped that show that Shades are not just mindless monsters. They're human. Their cries upon death, their behavior, their feelings, their understandable words when they are rarely able to speak. None of it matters to Nier. Why? Because he wants revenge for Yonah.
Likewise, Shades, Devola, Popola, Shadowlord Nier, and Grimoire Noir do not even deign to treat the Replicants as beings worthy of respect. They see them as expendable puppets. Shades try to exact revenge and you can see the hate and malice for Replicants in some of them. It's a cycle of hate.
Between that, Kaine's tragic childhood, and more it's clear that hatred and discrimination are an important theme explored in this game as well. It's no surprise that the main party are a band of misfits trying to make it in a [/ucked up world that's slowly dying around them.
Nier Replicant does a damn good job making you feel for these tragic, fucked up, and imperfect characters. Their tragic and foolish mistakes are frustrating yet... Sadly so familiar. So fucking human. It's amazing. And that ending... Just..that ending.
Gonna take a break for the sake of my emotional health and then go into Route B.
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
Oh don't get me wrong, I don't know what they're saying.
But I don't really have to, to infer what they're feeling. You can hear in their distorted crying/garbling that they're in pain. They feel. When Nier strikes them down and they flail on the ground, it's so fucked up. And the way Shades relentlessly attack Nier more and more as the story goes on, trying to trap him, chase him and just exact revenge clearly demonstrates a vengeful malice.
The guy straight up butchers a Shade peacefully chilling in Emil's library, ffs.
And the fact Shades drop items from the Old World and the smaller Shades drop coloring books, dictionaries and other things alluding to the fact they're children just really drives the point home of what they are. Nier is inadvertently slaughtering people.
Also, don't forget in the Eerie where Shades apparently merged with some Replicants there and were screaming for Nier to stop killing them. Shades apparently can speak when they inhabit bodies.
The guy straight up butchers a Shade peacefully chilling in Emil's library, ffs.
And the fact Shades drop items from the Old World and the smaller Shades drop coloring books, dictionaries and other things alluding to the fact they're children just really drives the point home of what they are. Nier is inadvertently slaughtering people.
Also, don't forget in the Eerie where Shades apparently merged with some Replicants there and were screaming for Nier to stop killing them. Shades apparently can speak when they inhabit bodies.
Mayo Master
Pro Adventurer
Double post because I just finished the game, got Ending A, and read some of the short stories from Grimoire Nier because I had to know some stuff.
I must seriously be an emotional masochist to put myself through this, lol. Yelling that much at a story that's already determined isn't healthy.
[...]
Gonna take a break for the sake of my emotional health and then go into Route B.
If that's how you feel after ending A, going through ending B will magnify that. Enjoy!
cold_spirit
he/him
- AKA
- Alex T
I've said it before but Nier Replicant/Gestalt is the kind of game that grows in your heart and mind as time passes.
I played through all the endings of the original Nier back in 2017. Felt the emotions, it was good. Played through all the endings in Nier Replicant recently. Literally bawling by the time I reached the final boss in Ending A.
I played through all the endings of the original Nier back in 2017. Felt the emotions, it was good. Played through all the endings in Nier Replicant recently. Literally bawling by the time I reached the final boss in Ending A.
They're putting out a Kazuma Koda Nier artbook:
I've got the first Automata World Guide, but, while it's nice for what it is, it's not really a proper artbook, so I'd been hoping for a book that's more solely art-focused.
I've got the first Automata World Guide, but, while it's nice for what it is, it's not really a proper artbook, so I'd been hoping for a book that's more solely art-focused.
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
Whelp.
That's another artbook buy.
I'm running out of bookshelf space!
That's another artbook buy.
I'm running out of bookshelf space!
cold_spirit
he/him
- AKA
- Alex T
That reminds me, Grimoire Nier will receive a revised edition to compliment v1.22...
Really hope Square Enix Books translates this for us. The timeline of events from Drakengard to Nier and the Project Gestalt research documents included in this are enlightening from a lore perspective.
Really hope Square Enix Books translates this for us. The timeline of events from Drakengard to Nier and the Project Gestalt research documents included in this are enlightening from a lore perspective.
Makoeyes987
Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
- AKA
- Smooth Criminal
Goddamnit, that's TWO books now!!!
Shit! LMAO, this isn't cool, they can't keep doing this!!
Shit! LMAO, this isn't cool, they can't keep doing this!!