Question about Genesis and Tifa

[demonwolf]

I'm shaky on Crisis Core knowledge so, um...have these two ever met? Does she even know he existed at one point? I know there's a ship for them so I wonder.

 

[ChipNoir]

I only remember reading that Genesis copies attack Tifa and Cloud at the reactor, but I'm shaky on those details.

 

[fancy]

I know there's a ship for them so I wonder.

That's 'cause my girl Tifa is a Launcher of a Thousand Ships

 

[demonwolf]

Hmm, I'm a little lost as to where that fits in the timeline. Do you mean the Nibelheim reactor? Do Cloud and Tifa meet at another reactor?...Wait...

 

[demonwolf]

I know there's a ship for them so I wonder.

That's 'cause my girl Tifa is Launcher of a Thousand Ships

I agree. I mean she's really shippable (that a word?). Still I'm that traditional shipper who requires minimum contact in the orignal work to go "Oh yeah I can see that."

 

[Tashasaurous]

Hmm, I'm a little lost as to where that fits in the timeline. Do you mean the Nibelheim reactor? Do Cloud and Tifa meet at another reactor?...Wait...

Tifa's been completely unaware that Cloud was there up until the events of FFVII. But no, they only met again at the Nibelheim Mako Reactor, but only Cloud(and Zack and Sephiroth) was aware at the time.

But I don't think Tifa has fully met Genesis. A brief look, probably, but I doubt she even knew about him at all. She doesn't even know his name.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Yeah, Cloud would know who he is, and has been in the same room with him, but Tifa may have only ever seen some of his copies.

 

[demonwolf]

Thanks everyone, I really needed to know that.

Another question, how is Genesis still alive at the end of DoC? I read the wiki but am still unclear on how he survived in CC as well as what he did during DoC. Call me dumb.

Also I don't know where I read it but was Genesis saved by Minerva? Was that canon or fanon?

...It appals me that I intend to write him into my story with how little I know about him.

 

[Tashasaurous]

Thanks everyone, I really needed to know that.

Another question, how is Genesis still alive at the end of DoC? I read the wiki but am still unclear on how he survived in CC as well as what he did during DoC. Call me dumb.

Also I don't know where I read it but was Genesis saved by Minerva? Was that canon or fanon?

...It appals me that I intend to write him into my story with how little I know about him.

Spoiler

Given the reports found by Vincent/the Player in DoC and Weiss and Nero making a cameo appearence in the near ending of Crisis Core, he was offered to join Deepground but declined, and instead chose to sleep for the next 3/4 years.

My question is what Genesis intends to do with Weiss's dead body, but Square Enix won't answer that.

 

[demonwolf]

.......Maybe Weiss isn't dead the way Sephiroth will never be? And then Genesis can offer him to join Genesis on whatever endeavour he seeks to accomplish by sleeping that whole time.

I'm more concerned about where he goes after disappearing with Weiss's body. Back to sleep? Where has he been sleeping? How did he know to wake up? When did he wake up? What is his motivation at this point? What was his motivation for going to sleep in the first place? Oh my god should I just make an OC and ignore his existence?

 

[Tashasaurous]

.......Maybe Weiss isn't dead the way Sephiroth will never be? And then Genesis can offer him to join Genesis on whatever endeavour he seeks to accomplish by sleeping that whole time.

I'm more concerned about where he goes after disappearing with Weiss's body. Back to sleep? Where has he been sleeping? How did he know to wake up? When did he wake up? What is his motivation at this point? What was his motivation for going to sleep in the first place? Oh my god should I just make an OC and ignore his existence?

Apparently so far in the Crisis Core Ultimita or whatever the magazine's called, the only thing we know is that Genesis woke up to protect the planet. He's been sleeping underneath Midgar.

Plus, with Jenova cells and such inside him, it allowed him with inhuman abilities similiar to Sephiroth.

I think him going to sleep is kinda similiar to what Vincent went through for 30 years.

There's a Final Fantasy VII fanfic called "The Planet's Enemy" set after Dirge of Cerberus if you want to have a read to that.

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/5454968/1/The-Planet-s-Enemy

I'm also an authoress on the Fanfiction.Net website and working on a series of crossovers and had something completely different with Genesis if you're interested, if you kinda like this sort of thing.

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/11233158/1/Sailor-Moon-Truth-of-Nightmares

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/11639961/1/Kingdom-Hearts-Crisis-Core

If these two are not appealing, then "The Planet's Enemy" is the next best thing.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

How is Genesis still alive? He sought the Goddess and she gave him the gift he wanted - the gift of healing. They say an apple a day keeps the doctor away. What an irony that should have been living underneath Banora all that time!

But seriously, if I were writing a fic about that I would assume that she, whatever she is, doesn't have a fixed form or exist in a fixed place. His faith drew her to where he was. She appeared to him in the form he'd imagined for her. She healed him because she didn't know what a major asshole he was.

Before he fought Zack and she appeared, Genesis was degrading, and after she intervened, he was healed, so yes, I think we can assume she, or the Planet, intervened to heal him, which is just really weird when you think about it. He's full of alien DNA.

 

[demonwolf]

Thanks Tashasaurous, that cleared up a lot for me. Especially since word of god said Genesis wants to protect the world. I think I'm heading in the right direction.

I was reading the first few chapters of your fic and it seemed to be very elaborate. You were clear enough with your narration but since I don't know the other fandoms that you were crossing FF7 with very well (or much at all), I still had trouble following the story. I don't think I'll be continuing them, but regardless, thank you for writing the story. You've clearly put a lot of effort into the story, and that's something I can definitely respect in an author.

 

[demonwolf]

Before he fought Zack and she appeared, Genesis was degrading, and after she intervened, he was healed, so yes, I think we can assume she, or the Planet, intervened to heal him, which is just really weird when you think about it. He's full of alien DNA.

Yes this is a really big problem for me right now. I need to play with it somehow to make my storyline work.

But thanks for clarifying that it's at least marginally canon that Minerva had something to do with Genesis surviving. I was afraid I dreamt up that piece of info somehow. I feel like I've been having more and more trouble recalling where I've seen an info.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

I'm not sure what the canon is regarding the geostigma cure - whether Aerith's rain cleanses the infected of Jenova's taint, and whether that taint is due to them actually having been infected with her DNA or something else, something intangible, her essence or malevolence or whatever. But I suppose it is not beyond the bounds of possibility that Minerva, being the embodiment of the Planet, simply expunged all the Jenova DNA from Genesis' body, or did something else that rendered it inactive or harmless, thus restoring him to wholeness. But if this were the case, then he'd be useless to the Deepground Project. Maybe Shinra recovered him, realised he was useless, and dumped him somewhere deep under Midgar, where he either went to sleep or continued to sleep.

The OG starts only a few weeks after Genesis is cured in Banora and recovered by Shinra - possibly even only a week later or a few days, depending on how long it takes Zack to get to Midgar and how much time elapses between his death and the first bombing raid. So it seems as if Shinra wouldn't have had a huge amount of time to examine their recovered asset before the President was killed and Hojo fled and everything started falling into chaos.

That's just my two cents. The thing about fanfic is you can do whatever you like with it.

 

[demonwolf]

You are awesome Licorice-san. You just saved me prolly a few hours of research on the game's timeline.

But apparently in DoC Deepground could differentiate people who had had Geostigma from people who had not, so wouldn't that mean Aerith's rain cured an intangible something, while something tangible is still left behind to set the patients apart from others?

On the other note, Genesis obviously had some kind of monstrous power still at the end of DoC. So maybe Deepground had allowed him to sleep as a temporary measure instead of risking aggravating him. They never got to using him, cuz, as you said, they didn't have much time before it all went to the dogs.

I used to tell myself and my friends that we can do whatever we want with fanfics, too. Though recently I've developed this stubbornness in regards to trying to see how much of the OG I can respect while still writing what I want to write.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Same. I only really like fics that are canon-compliant (except for when canon contradicts itself. Sometimes you have to pick a side).

Like I said, it does seem as if Minerva's intervention cured Genesis. I can't remember whether or not he was in a coma from then on, or whether he briefly came to consciousness once Zack carried him to the surface. In any case, it seems as if you have a lot of decisions to make

- just how did Minerva cure Genesis?
- did he continue to harbour Jenova DNA in him after the cure?
- did Shinra get a chance to experiment on him and his DNA or did events move too fast?
- how did he end up in Deepground and why didn't Weiss and the others tear him apart?
- what powers does he still retain?

To the best of my knowledge, canon offers no answers to any of these questions so you're free to make it up.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

We know he got to Deepground. Weiss and Nero showed up right after Zack left Banora, and took him with them.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Yes, but presumably at that point they were under the command of Shinra. They must have been dispatched by Shinra to do this job and took him back to whoever it was at Shinra who wanted him (Hojo?) so they whatever it was they planned to do with him could be done. My question meant - how, after having been recovered by Shinra, did he end up in the bowels of some deep dark cave miles below Midgar? (and not in a specimen tank or a drawer in the morgue?).

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

I never found it mysterious myself. They were sent to recover him, and did so (and took him to the only place possibly secure enough to hold him: Deepground). They asked him to join their insurrection, and he declined. Then he left (who, other than the Tsviets could have even stood a chance at stopping him?), and hibernated until the planet called on him.

Unless they were able to implant a control chip before he woke up from Zack's beating, there would have been nothing Shin-Ra could do to stop him from leaving. The Tsviets could be ordered to fight him, sure, but they could also make a half-hearted attempt of it.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

I see what you mean, but it does beg the question of what his "cure" involved. If the Jenova DNA in his body was removed, what, if anything, would happen to the powers it bestowed? if it was not removed, then what did his cure consist of - especially since Minerva is supposed to be the embodiment of the Planet and the planet recognises and is hostile to Jenova as a threat. Was his cure similar in nature to the Geostigma cure brought about by Aerith's rain? How strong is he after he is cured?

Yes, it's perfectly possible they took him to Deepground. When did the Deepground insurrection start? I really know nothing about it. At the time of rescuing him, the Deepground operatives, whoever they were (is it Weiss and Nero?) were presumably doing the bidding of their Shinra masters, so they must have taken Genesis back to whoever gave them the order to go pick him up.

Although, how did Shinra even know where Genesis was?

It's all so stupid.

 

[Roger]

I never found it mysterious myself. They were sent to recover him, and did so (and took him to the only place possibly secure enough to hold him: Deepground). They asked him to join their insurrection, and he declined. Then he left (who, other than the Tsviets could have even stood a chance at stopping him?), and hibernated until the planet called on him.

Unless they were able to implant a control chip before he woke up from Zack's beating, there would have been nothing Shin-Ra could do to stop him from leaving. The Tsviets could be ordered to fight him, sure, but they could also make a half-hearted attempt of it.

The Retrictors were a fighting unit equal or better then the Tsviets sans Weiss.

 

[demonwolf]

- just how did Minerva cure Genesis?
- did he continue to harbour Jenova DNA in him after the cure?
- did Shinra get a chance to experiment on him and his DNA or did events move too fast?
- how did he end up in Deepground and why didn't Weiss and the others tear him apart?
- what powers does he still retain?

This. I'm so bloody thankful that I started this thread. You've just cleared a lot of my uncertainty about whether I would be violating canon or no.

how, after having been recovered by Shinra, did he end up in the bowels of some deep dark cave miles below Midgar? (and not in a specimen tank or a drawer in the morgue?).

This is my biggest problem with Genesis's involvement, or lack thereof, during Deepground. This whole time I was under the impression he was confined somewhere in Deepground after refusing to join them (and I still don't remember where I learnt that he'd refused to join Deepground before this thread). But if he'd been completely free and allegedly wanting to protect the Planet, why did he just stand by and watch...idk both AC and DoC happen without doing anything. Some protector.

Unless they were able to implant a control chip before he woke up from Zack's beating, there would have been nothing Shin-Ra could do to stop him from leaving.

Well, evidently they didn't implant anything in him but....why didn't they? Maybe because they didn't have enough time before he woke up? I just answered my own question. Still, it sounds more like a plot convenience. After Nibelheim incident, I'd imagine ShinRa would be cautious with Genesis.

I Was his cure similar in nature to the Geostigma cure brought about by Aerith's rain? How strong is he after he is cured?

I think really strong, especially since the word of god said he wants to protect the world. Knowing SE, he's prolly not a crippled messiah-wanabe.

Although, how did Shinra even know where Genesis was?

It's all so stupid.

I chalk it up to their awesome network of spies. Though those hypothetical spies lived up to this notion extremely poorly in the OG, all things considered.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

I see what you mean, but it does beg the question of what his "cure" involved. If the Jenova DNA in his body was removed, what, if anything, would happen to the powers it bestowed? if it was not removed, then what did his cure consist of - especially since Minerva is supposed to be the embodiment of the Planet and the planet recognises and is hostile to Jenova as a threat. Was his cure similar in nature to the Geostigma cure brought about by Aerith's rain? How strong is he after he is cured?

Those are good questions. I wouldn't know where to begin speculating.

Yes, it's perfectly possible they took him to Deepground. When did the Deepground insurrection start? I really know nothing about it. At the time of rescuing him, the Deepground operatives, whoever they were (is it Weiss and Nero?) were presumably doing the bidding of their Shinra masters, so they must have taken Genesis back to whoever gave them the order to go pick him up.

They didn't necessarily have to take him to whoever gave the order -- only to where that person ordered them to take him.

In whatever case, they definitely took him to Deepground, per these sources:

https://thelifestream.net/crisis-core-ultimania-timeline/
https://thelifestream.net/lifestream-projects/translations/340/crisis-core-ultimania-scenario-qa/ (sections 6 and 7)

There, he refuses to join the insurrection (it was underway at the same time as the original game; the Tsviets managed to overthrow the Restrictors just in time to end up trapped under Midgar because of Meteor), then puts himself to sleep in that cave seen at the very end of DoC.

The Retrictors were a fighting unit equal or better then the Tsviets sans Weiss.

They may or may not risk fighting a powerful opponent (in particular, one they can't turn off with a switch) when they have the Tsviets available to force into battle in their stead. I wouldn't expect them to engage him directly.

 

[Roger]

They may or may not risk fighting a powerful opponent (in particular, one they can't turn off with a switch) when they have the Tsviets available to force into battle in their stead. I wouldn't expect them to engage him directly.

The Restrictors are physically there in Deepground though, I find it odd that Genesis was able to arrive unconcious, get woken up, and just be on his way without any pursuit with them on the job.