So what's your opinion on the new characters?

[VivaLaValenwind]

I have to say that i really hated Shelke becoming a main character. Same goes for Denzel, if they weren't in the original story then they shouldn't become main characters (In my opinion anyway.) As for the other people like the Tsviets i did like the character designs, especially Nero, but I think Vice proved to be a pretty boring main bad guy since we know almost nothing about him other than the fact that he wanted to get Omega :/ Also I think that they should've elaborated more on Grimiore cause he was just there...and then died. Whoopee...

 

[Ravynne Nevyrmore]

Grimoire did nothing in regards to the experiments that created Nero. The scientists of Deepground were responsible; they just used Grimoire's theories and research and took his words literally. "Life being born of Terra corrupt."

If that is true, then they do a pretty horrible job of portraying that, what with showing Grimoire in the front of all the scientists that did the experiments.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Well they do that to emphasize that it was his research that inspired the DG scientists to create Nero. If you listen and read what they say, and remember how old Grimoire is, its pretty apparent there's no way he could've been around when Nero was born.

 

[Ravynne Nevyrmore]

What they said was pretty confusing, but I do see how you're saying it now.

Well that's kind of a bummer that will force me to rethink the history of my fanfic, lol. e.e

 

[Cat Rage Room]

They should have really elaborated on the world politics at the time of Grimoire's research.

 

[HylianMogget]

It's been a while since I played DoC, so I've forgotten most of the specifics of the plot and whatnot, but I do remember quite liking Shalua (but not her wacky design/outfit. Oh, Nomura ). The Tsviets were cliched but I think they still worked well enough as antagonists; Nero was really the only one that was genuinely a little bit interesting, though. I was able to tolerate Shelk for, like, the first half of the game, but then she became a plot device.

Hell, even Weiss had nothing particularly special about him. Of course, it didn't help that we barely ever interact with him in the game. When we do, it's freakin' Hojo.

I agree; I wish they just let him be the main bad guy rather than bringing Hojo back.

 

[Ravynne Nevyrmore]

O thought that introducing the whole concept of data fragments was dumb, tbh. I mean, I love what it allowed in terms of "interaction" between Vincent and Lucrecia, but come on... They didn't have the technology for cell phones but they could create holorecordings and turn their consciousnesses into readable computer data?

 

[Nocturne]

I must be one of the few who actually liked Dirge a good bit and thought the characters were interesting. I thought they pulled off the characters pretty well (though I dont like Shelke either, nor do I think they gave enough background on Deep Ground).

But I think we will get alot more info in the next game in the compilation. Weiss is still probably alive, Genesis will be a main player and probably give some insight on DG, and it will probably tie up the compilation in general. Lets just hope it's a RPG.

 

[Makoeyes987]

[quote author=Ravynne link=topic=397.msg15908#msg15908 date=1234161472]
They didn't have the technology for cell phones but they could create holorecordings and turn their consciousnesses into readable computer data?
[/quote]

That recording technology was thanks to materia. And really, the whole network concept really sounds a lot like FFX's sphere technology except artificially created and digitized.

 

[ForceStealer]

And Gaia's technology has never been really consistent. The feel of it was always a little futuristic and yet they hadn't been to space yet. FF always throws swords and guns together so I won't use that as an example, but they've got energy cannons and supercomputers while still without any discernible system of roads/highways connecting the cities of the world.

The world seems to have progressed kinda strangely. But the presence of magic always seems to have an interesting effect on the advancement of technology.

 

[Ravynne Nevyrmore]

That recording technology was thanks to materia. And really, the whole network concept really sounds a lot like FFX's sphere technology except artificially created and digitized.

How advanced it was isn't really my beef. It's that they have those things and lack so starkly in other technological areas.

I must be one of the few who actually liked Dirge a good bit and thought the characters were interesting. I thought they pulled off the characters pretty well (though I dont like Shelke either, nor do I think they gave enough background on Deep Ground).

I did like Dirge overall, though you would most likely be correct in saying we're part of a few. But it certainly wasn't the new characters that I liked it for.

 

[Tetsujin]

[quote author=Ravynne link=topic=397.msg16602#msg16602 date=1234290756]

That recording technology was thanks to materia. And really, the whole network concept really sounds a lot like FFX's sphere technology except artificially created and digitized.

How advanced it was isn't really my beef. It's that they have those things and lack so starkly in other technological areas.[/quote]

What areas? Last time I checked, ShinRa had highly advanced tech at their disposal.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

[quote author=Tetsujin link=topic=397.msg16605#msg16605 date=1234291694]
[quote author=Ravynne link=topic=397.msg16602#msg16602 date=1234290756]

That recording technology was thanks to materia. And really, the whole network concept really sounds a lot like FFX's sphere technology except artificially created and digitized.

How advanced it was isn't really my beef. It's that they have those things and lack so starkly in other technological areas.[/quote]

What areas? Last time I checked, ShinRa had highly advanced tech at their disposal.
[/quote]

I guess she means in terms of the rest of the world. It's kind of weird to only have two (or three if you count Wutai) major cities on the planet considering everything else that's going on.

 

[Tetsujin]

[quote author=The Notorious M.O.G. link=topic=397.msg16620#msg16620 date=1234294002]
[quote author=Tetsujin link=topic=397.msg16605#msg16605 date=1234291694]
[quote author=Ravynne link=topic=397.msg16602#msg16602 date=1234290756]

That recording technology was thanks to materia. And really, the whole network concept really sounds a lot like FFX's sphere technology except artificially created and digitized.

How advanced it was isn't really my beef. It's that they have those things and lack so starkly in other technological areas.[/quote]

What areas? Last time I checked, ShinRa had highly advanced tech at their disposal.
[/quote]

I guess she means in terms of the rest of the world. It's kind of weird to only have two (or three if you count Wutai) major cities on the planet considering everything else that's going on.
[/quote]

Whaaaat.

We're talking about ShinRa's technology here and she said it's weird they have advanced stuff but in other areas...they don't. I wanted to know what other technological areas she meant which hasn't got anything to do with cities.

Also, doesn't pretty much EVERY FF display only 2-3 major cities?

 

[Cat Rage Room]

Whaaaat.

We're talking about ShinRa's technology here and she said it's weird they have advanced stuff but in other areas...they don't. I wanted to know what other technological areas she meant which hasn't got anything to do with cities.

Also, doesn't pretty much EVERY FF display only 2-3 major cities?

Well EXCUSE ME, Princess! I was mistaken, sheesh. No need for the attitude.

And no, not necessarily every FF implies two or three major cities. FFVI had quite a bit of major cities (more major cities than towns), FFVIII had quite a few, FFIX had a decent amount, FFXII had a lot, and so on.

In FF7, it just seems like Junon, Midgar are HEAVILY MODERNIZED AND LARGE, but the rest just seem to the exact opposite, small dirt farmers. I suppose Wutai is an exception in a way.

 

[Ravynne Nevyrmore]

In FF7, it just seems like Junon, Midgar are HEAVILY MODERNIZED AND LARGE, but the rest just seem to the exact opposite, small dirt farmers. I suppose Wutai is an exception in a way.

No, that doesn't even bother me, since it wouldn't be beyond ShinRa to hoard those technologies to themselves. In order to be able to steal technology, you have to have someone who understands it, and those small dirt farming towns probably wouldn't have met that criteria, especially since the only schools and universities we've heard of were in Midgar.

How advanced it was isn't really my beef. It's that they have those things and lack so starkly in other technological areas.

What areas? Last time I checked, ShinRa had highly advanced tech at their disposal.

Roads, cars, cell phones, e-mail(?). Bear in mind that if we're talking about Lucrecia's ability to record her thoughts onto a hologram and break her consciousness down into storeable, readable data, then we're also talking about ShinRa's technology 25-30 years before FF7. The holorecording, okay, I can buy that as the Ancient's "technology" since it involved materia, but being able to turn her thoughts into data at a time when cell phones weren't even used by the Turks and the world's first Mako reactor was just approved for use seems like a bit of an incongruency to me.

Which brings us to another point— When Sephiroth reads Gast's journals, the entry about the Jenova Project being approved and the first Mako reactor being approved are together. So how the hell did they have that much technology during the Jenova Project? Were they already running computers on coal or did they just manage to come up with the idea of a computer and develop some in a few months?

Or, did they not actually mean the first Mako Reactor—just the "first" in Nibelheim?

 

[Tetsujin]

Uhm, where did it say that the Turks didn't use cell phones back then? o.o
Did I miss something? Was that in BC?

 

[Cthulhu]

I doubt they'd be able to develop all the technology they did in 30 years~ish, and I'm sure they had electricity before that.

 

[Makoeyes987]

I'm not seeing much of an incongruency either.

In FFVII, they talk about how the world had other means of technology, but with the advent of mako, they slowly moved away from it, and in a sense, "forgot" it. They had electricity and power beyond coal *before* mako, but that was years ago. And it was abandoned.

If you look in the basement and flashbacks of DC, there are clearly computers back then. You see Lucrecia banging her hands on it while she tries to figure out a way to save Vincent who was shot.

So yeah, they had the technology. And I don't know what you mean by the Turks back then didn't have cell phones. I don't know where that's stated.

 

[Max Payne]

Wasn't the PHS basically a cell phone?

 

[Makoeyes987]

Yes, the PHS was a cell phone.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

I'm not seeing much of an incongruency either.

In FFVII, they talk about how the world had other means of technology, but with the advent of mako, they slowly moved away from it, and in a sense, "forgot" it. They had electricity and power beyond coal *before* mako, but that was years ago. And it was abandoned.

If you look in the basement and flashbacks of DC, there are clearly computers back then. You see Lucrecia banging her hands on it while she tries to figure out a way to save Vincent who was shot.

So yeah, they had the technology. And I don't know what you mean by the Turks back then didn't have cell phones. I don't know where that's stated.

It's not really an incongruency perse, more like an inconsistency and lack of information that causes it. Like I said, technology dispersed between world locations seems to be very uneven, and we don't know anything about the social-economic status of Gaia besides for 'Shinra made it'.

It's not really a huge fault, but SE hasn't really done the greatest job in establishing a cultural and historical background for Gaia.

especially since the only schools and universities we've heard of were in Midgar.

Oh come on, I'm sure there were schools and universities elsewhere.

 

[Strangelove]

PHS is a type of cellphone.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_Handy-phone_System

Although I think FFVII PHS = Party Hensei (organization) System.

 

[Ravynne Nevyrmore]

And I don't know what you mean by the Turks back then didn't have cell phones. I don't know where that's stated.

Vincent is rather baffled by the cell phone that he only reluctantly purchases after AC because everyone else in the world already has one.

As for where it's stated, see "Trivia 1" on Vincent's page in the Compilation Ultimania.

In the world of FFVII, mobile phones are spreading, but because he is from a generation more than 20 years ago, Vincent doesn’t carry one. In Advent Children, Marlene is so astonished by this, Vincent then resolves to buy a phone. A year later, Reeve and Shelke frequently communicate with Vincent for various reasons, now that he carries a cell phone.

Mobile phones are "spreading," which implies that they were not previously as widespread as they are becoming as of FF7/AC. Furthermore, it says Vincent doesn't carry one "because he is from a generation more than 20 years ago," which implies that they didn't use cell phones then. At the very least, he, a Turk, did not.

http://thelifestream.net/final-fantasy-vii/931/vincent-valentine-character-profile-p68-71/#more-931

 

[Makoeyes987]

Well maybe cell phones back in Vincent's day weren't nearly as high tech, popular, or conventional as they are in the current era of FFVII. It doesn't say they never existed.

It's like how in the late 90's and current 2000's everyone has a cell phone, but back in the eighties and early nineties, they were not nearly as popular or prevalent. They existed, but everyone and their mother didn't have them.

I think its more of a statement on their popularity, not that they never existed.