Tetsuya Nomura contributed more to FFVII than Hironobu Sakaguchi but people are not ready to admit it.

Wanderer

Pro Adventurer
Sakaguchi's contributions:
-The First draft of the story was about a detective named Joe who goes around investigating terrorists who blow up reactors around New York City
-The Materia System

Nomura's contributions:
-Designed all the characters
- Wrote the backstories of many characters
-Contributed to many key events
-Was the one who suggested that Aerith be killed
-Limit Breaks
 

null

Mr. Thou
AKA
null
Yeah, FFVII was where Sakaguchi began to seriously delegate. I don't think that's controversial.

But this was their next flagship product and he was extremely involved, just not in the weeds. Like like spearheading the move to Playstation because the N64 wasn't meeting their engineering requirements - earth shattering impact on the game AND the company, just not something that credits like "producer" or "original story by" really do justice. He also had to recruit CG talent that could develop the cutscenes, which was a challenge because back then CG was for movies, not video games.

My impression is that he had a role very similar to Kitase and Nomura's role in ReTrilogy, where Hamaguchi is leading the work on the ground while the old guard facilitates, consults and approves.

Great read: Final Fantasy 7: An oral history

Good read (original source is gone - TLS probably has scans somewhere in the attic): Final Fantasy VII – 1997 Developer Interviews

Shinra Archaeology plug: Special FFVII Talk Vol. 1

Probably lots more, we have Final Fantasy PhDs around here somewhere
 

Wanderer

Pro Adventurer
Yeah, FFVII was where Sakaguchi began to seriously delegate. I don't think that's controversial.

But this was their next flagship product and he was extremely involved, just not in the weeds. Like like spearheading the move to Playstation because the N64 wasn't meeting their engineering requirements - earth shattering impact on the game AND the company, just not something that credits like "producer" or "original story by" really do justice. He also had to recruit CG talent that could develop the cutscenes, which was a challenge because back then CG was for movies, not video games.

My impression is that he had a role very similar to Kitase and Nomura's role in ReTrilogy, where Hamaguchi is leading the work on the ground while the old guard facilitates, consults and approves.

Great read: Final Fantasy 7: An oral history

Good read (original source is gone - TLS probably has scans somewhere in the attic): Final Fantasy VII – 1997 Developer Interviews

Shinra Archaeology plug: Special FFVII Talk Vol. 1

Probably lots more, we have Final Fantasy PhDs around here somewhere
Nomura is a lot more directly involved in developing the Remake trilogy. He directed the first game and is the creative director for Rebirth. Not only that, he is writing the general plot for the third part, according to Kitase. Also, we know from Uematsu that Sakaguchi was on vacation while VII was being developed, but it was not the first time he was away from the series. FFVI is where his involvement in the series was not as deep as in previous entries.
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
I think that the thread title is fundamentally an impossible comparison, because Sakaguchi & Nomura had different roles, which means that the volume of what they're doing and how externally apparent the result of their work is are going to be... very different. What makes it FEEL like they're subject to comparison is that those two roles are very closely intertwined – but that's exactly why you can't try to enumerate out contributions in a meaningful way to weigh them against one another.

Sakaguchi really laid the core foundation of concepts that they were working off of that was largely immutable and kept everything anchored towards a specific direction, but how exactly the specifics & nuances of that narrative evolved were heavily shaped by Nomura. This was largely thanks to how Nomura took on a lot of responsibilities near the end of Final Fantasy VI's development – and that's where the initial concepts of things like Sephiroth & other themes grew out of that bear as much resemblance to how those are depicted in the final game as the Joe NYC draft of Sakaguchi's did. All of those ideas heavily intertwined & shaped one another as they shifted throughout development, as the content revealed in the Early Material Files shows – and that's very much what one would expect, but ESPECIALLY because of how their careers were moving.

Sakaguchi started out as a game designer in 1984 who moved into being a director in 1987, and then a producer in 1993. Nomura started out doing battle, graphic, monster, & character design in 1992, and then moved into being a director & lead designer in 2002. The trajectories of their career paths are perfectly complimentary to one another, and this means that their working relationship in 1997 is one where you'd expect Sakaguchi to be helping to intentionally mentor Nomura around getting an understanding of what it takes to do those other things that Sakaguchi had a decade of established experience with, and which fundamentally allowed Nomura to go on and do all the things he did.

This is why it's also worth noting that a lot of the core themes that Sakaguchi established and guided as the producer in Final Fantasy VII that didn't get used in the form of his first draft with Joe in NYC were almost all just split over into Parasite Eve, where he was ALSO the Producer & Nomura was once again the main artist working with him to those same ends – both in the collaboration of their professional development as well as in the shape of the design elements of how the game itself is knit together. When you take that perspective on Sakaguchi's first draft and direct responsibilities for Final Fantasy VII, as well as looking at his collaborative professional relationship with Nomura as a teammate who he can delegate specifics to with a high degree of confidence in knowing that it will align with his end goals, and also see Parasite Eve as the other half of where their collective thoughts around depicting those themes went, it makes it much easier to see how they worked as a team.

Sakaguchi doesn't NEED to be diving into some of those things as deeply when he understands how Nomura understands the components of the vision he has, and can focus on the myriad of other parts for leading the production. With the release of the final product, it's easier to see how Nomura's involvement with art puts him very close into the core of the design process that interfaces with the writing and translating all of those elements into a single cohesive vision – and this is why Sakaguchi's contributions are always heavily emphasized, specifically because they're a bit less visible. None of that would exist without him forming that core foundation and holding those things together for that work Nomura did to get done. Simply put – without Sakaguchi, Nomura doesn't really get to have that level of influence over so much.

The nature of those two roles means that the lines between the responsibilities Nomura & Sakaguchi held have a LOT of overlap, where the balance of who leads & who follows is based very heavily on trust and pre-existing alignment on their shared vision & what's the best way to achieve that. This is pretty par for the course in software development where a Product Manager & Design Lead have VERY different responsibilities on paper... but in reality there is a colossal amount of direct overlap that comes about as a result of those two collaborating together and mutually working to reinforce & influence one-another's visions into a cohesive whole that will become what the product that end users eventually get to see. It's not a contest over who contributes the most to that end product – it's about both of them shaping that into a collectively shared vision as various parts of production need, and ending up with a variable amount of recognizable fingerprints on the end product really just by the happenstance of how things go during the production & development.

(Most of my IRL job these days has me spend a large amount of time very closely embedded with Product & Design Leads in software development, and helping them guide things from business proposals, into napkin-sketch level wireframe concepts, into test prototypes, and then though the whole pipeline going into actual development & release. So, the working relationship between Sakaguchi & Nomura in Final Fantasy VII is one that I've probably formed the most appreciation for over the years in just how inextricably interconnected their work is to each other even when it comes from what seem like very different directions. It also helps. that this particular niche of their work and the core design language of some of my favourite stories is also THE main thing that I spent a majority of my time digging into & analyzing as a fan even before it happened to intersect other areas of my life).



X :neo:
 

Odysseus

Ninja Potato
AKA
Ody
From all the research we've done for various Shinra Archaeology projects, I'm inclined to believe he had very little to do with making the game itself past the very early stages, you're right.

Some corrections though, his early plot idea wasn't about a detective named Joe. Hot Blooded Detective Joe was an antagonist investigating the protagonist, who was unnamed. The protagonist also had a partner called "Needle Nicholas." He was also responsible for the idea of Mako, which may or may not have also been in this draft I don't remember.

I think he mostly just kept tabs on development while working on his own things. I think around the time of FFVII's development was when Square was setting up their Hawaii studio to make a certain ill-fated film in, and he was helping with that.
 

Wanderer

Pro Adventurer
From all the research we've done for various Shinra Archaeology projects, I'm inclined to believe he had very little to do with making the game itself past the very early stages, you're right.

Some corrections though, his early plot idea wasn't about a detective named Joe. Hot Blooded Detective Joe was an antagonist investigating the protagonist, who was unnamed. The protagonist also had a partner called "Needle Nicholas." He was also responsible for the idea of Mako, which may or may not have also been in this draft I don't remember.

I think he mostly just kept tabs on development while working on his own things. I think around the time of FFVII's development was when Square was setting up their Hawaii studio to make a certain ill-fated film in, and he was helping with that.
Yes, I forgot to mention that he was impressed with the FMVs of VII and wanted to take Square in a direction like Disney, encompassing different forms of entertainment media. I think that could somewhat explain his direction with FF9.
 

Eerie

Fire and Blood
Not only that, he is writing the general plot for the third part, according to Kitase.
I must correct this, this is not true at all. It's Nojima who wrote the whole script for the main story, Hamaguchi's team doing all the side quests (that still must be approved by Nojima). Kitase put Nomura in charge of a new ending and only that, and I bet he must have discussed it with Nojima too, because Nojima is basically the one who has the upper hand on the characterisation etc. This is why fans wonder what this new ending could be, all we know is Kitase likes it. So maybe a time skip where everyone can be happy lol.
 

Ite

Save your valediction (she/her)
AKA
Ite
Yoshinori Kitase was the director. That’s the beginning and end of the discussion from an official standpoint, anything else is honestly wasteful gossip.

That said :monster:

I know that the script for Final Fantasy IX was penned by Sakaguchi alone. The parts of VII that remind me of IX are great. I know that the flair and bombast of VIII is accredited to Kitase, and the parts of VII that remind me of VIII are great.

There are also parts of VII that remind me of KH. Those parts are not so great. That’s where I stand.
 

Wanderer

Pro Adventurer
Yoshinori Kitase was the director. That’s the beginning and end of the discussion from an official standpoint, anything else is honestly wasteful gossip.

That said :monster:

I know that the script for Final Fantasy IX was penned by Sakaguchi alone. The parts of VII that remind me of IX are great. I know that the flair and bombast of VIII is accredited to Kitase, and the parts of VII that remind me of VIII are great.

There are also parts of VII that remind me of KH. Those parts are not so great. That’s where I stand.
It is cause Nojima was a writer on FFVII, VIII, and almost all KH games.
 

Odysseus

Ninja Potato
AKA
Ody
Yoshinori Kitase was the director. That’s the beginning and end of the discussion from an official standpoint, anything else is honestly wasteful gossip.

That said :monster:

I know that the script for Final Fantasy IX was penned by Sakaguchi alone. The parts of VII that remind me of IX are great. I know that the flair and bombast of VIII is accredited to Kitase, and the parts of VII that remind me of VIII are great.

There are also parts of VII that remind me of KH. Those parts are not so great. That’s where I stand.
Not to sound like I dislike Sakaguchi or anything but like I said, all evidence says he had next to nothing to do with the final product we got for FFVII beyond those few concepts he introduced in the early stages and probably approving of things for afar later on. I don't think any bit of the final scenario was written by him. I always felt like people gave him way too much credit with VII just because they view the post-Guchi era so negatively.
 
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Wanderer

Pro Adventurer
Not to sound like I dislike Sakaguchi or anything but like I said, all evidence says he had next to nothing with the final product we got for FFVII beyond those few concepts he introduced in the early stages and probably approving of things for afar later on. I don't think any bit of the final scenario was written by him. I always felt like people gave him way too much credit with VII just because they view the post-Guchi era so negatively.
People just need to accept that the golden era of FF was something that had something limited to do with Sakaguchi himself, other than IX Even for VI, you could argue he was not there all the way, as he was busy with other responsibilities, He himself has said that the games got much better after Kitase got on board and that he brought a certain quality to the games. He also recognised the potential in Nomura, asking him to write the scenario of FFVII and entrusting him with an ambitious crossover like Kingdom Hearts. Sakaguchi, since V started to train his protégés so that they would take over for him, and they did just that.
 

Elkazor

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Cinder Wing
Sakaguchi was still the one who guided the story to be tethered to the central theme of life, death and loss, according to his own words in interviews.

In all of his famous interviews about the game, he openly talks about what he wanted Aerith's loss to convey to the player, how he wanted the theme of life to be sprinkled throughout, etc.

That's still a pretty significant role within the game even if he's not doing much of the main design and writing work, and I've never known of any of the other team members ever challenging or correcting what he says in those interviews.

I completely agree that too many people overstate his role, but saying that all he contributed to FFVII was an early scrapped plot concept and the Mako and Materia system seems like understating his role. If that was true, there would've been a lot more pushback against what Sakaguchi said in those initial famous interviews from way back when.

Here's my understanding of how it worked (as best as I can gather from the info on its development):

-Sakaguchi goes through multiple ideas and scrapped plot ideas, lands on a theme of loss, life, and death based on his life experiences.
- The team come up with their own ideas for how to convey the theme according to Sakaguchi's direction, leading to the various character ideas, scenarios, and backstories.
 

Odysseus

Ninja Potato
AKA
Ody
I also feel like the theme of loss is overstated, at least in relation to him. Not that he was totally uninvolved in the decision to kill Aerith, but the actual idea to do so seems to have originated somewhere between Kitase and Nomura:
1745793037357.png
(TIMELINE OF BLAME for Aerith's death made by Jean from Shinra Archaeology)

Even Sakaguchi was like "was it really that big of a deal " lol. Granted, it seems the idea to kill SOMEONE existed from the beginning, so maybe that was from him.
 

Theozilla

Kaiju Member
I also feel like the theme of loss is overstated, at least in relation to him. Not that he was totally uninvolved in the decision to kill Aerith, but the actual idea to do so seems to have originated somewhere between Kitase and Nomura:
View attachment 17585
(TIMELINE OF BLAME for Aerith's death made by Jean from Shinra Archaeology)

Even Sakaguchi was like "was it really that big of a deal " lol. Granted, it seems the idea to kill SOMEONE existed from the beginning, so maybe that was from him.
Interesting, so Nojima got brought onto the project early enough that the decision to kill off Aerith was still being finalized (since he said he was part of the discussions)?
 

Elkazor

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Cinder Wing
I'm curious about the context of that Sakaguchi quote. The final game makes it clear that Aerith's death is meant to be felt deeply and to be impactful. We don't know for sure at what point in the dev process they were at when that conversation happened. And that's the other thing about this whole conversation.

FFVII is one of the most Frankenstein games of Frankenstein games. It went through countless iterations through development. How much each person contributed at different points in the process is very hard for any of us to gauge given all the conflicting accounts of people remembering different points of dev process.
 

Theozilla

Kaiju Member
I'm curious about the context of that Sakaguchi quote. The final game makes it clear that Aerith's death is meant to be felt deeply and to be impactful. We don't know for sure at what point in the dev process they were at when that conversation happened. And that's the other thing about this whole conversation.

FFVII is one of the most Frankenstein games of Frankenstein games. It went through countless iterations through development. How much each person contributed at different points in the process is very hard for any of us to gauge given all the conflicting accounts of people remembering different points of dev process.
Well it happened early enough that when they decided to kill off “Aerith” (or rather the proto-Tifaerith character) that’s what caused the Tifaerith character to be split into the Aerith and Tifa we know today. That also seems to be when Aerith and Sephiroth were changed from being half-siblings to being ex-lovers.
 

Odysseus

Ninja Potato
AKA
Ody
Interesting, so Nojima got brought onto the project early enough that the decision to kill off Aerith was still being finalized (since he said he was part of the discussions)?
That does feel a bit off to me but I guess so. FFVII was developed over the course of a single year so shit was just being thrown at the wall constantly.

I'm curious about the context of that Sakaguchi quote. The final game makes it clear that Aerith's death is meant to be felt deeply and to be impactful. We don't know for sure at what point in the dev process they were at when that conversation happened. And that's the other thing about this whole conversation.

FFVII is one of the most Frankenstein games of Frankenstein games. It went through countless iterations through development. How much each person contributed at different points in the process is very hard for any of us to gauge given all the conflicting accounts of people remembering different points of dev process.

Masato Kato has this great quote that I think sums it up. This is from an interview found here on composer Yasunori Mitsuda's website:
The way that SQUARE creates their events is that they first discuss the story thoroughly with the entire project team, and then let each of the individual scenario writers freely (I say freely here, but of course, if it's not up to our standards; it's rejected) fill in the little details on the sub-events; so the people credited for writing the scenarios aren't necessarily the people who write the stories.

They don't do it like that anymore, but back then that's how it was. With FFVII thankfully each game map has a credit for the event planner who handled it, so that gives us some idea of who wrote what, but then you never know when they're creating scenes based on someone else's script either.

There's also another quote I half remember and don't recall the source of where one of the devs says that back then major plot decisions could come about from casual conversation at the water cooler lol.

Well it happened early enough that when they decided to kill off “Aerith” (or rather the proto-Tifaerith character) that’s what caused the Tifaerith character to be split into the Aerith and Tifa we know today. That also seems to be when Aerith and Sephiroth were changed from being half-siblings to being ex-lovers.
Okay here's something Turq and I were talking about in DMs not too long ago. Nomura's phrasing in that quote is a bit odd, and Turq realized that the reason he says "bring in Tifa" is because he's referring to the "Tifa" design Aerith used to have. Meaning, when they decided to kill Aerith, she already had her redesign and name change. So when they wanted to add in a second female protagonist, they went back and recycled that scrapped design and name to make the Tifa we know now.

Aerith exists in her near-final form from really early on, in images from game magazines from as far back as March 1996:

1745833505901.png

So "Tifa" Aerith probably didn't last very long at all.

This is speculation on my part, but I think what probably happened is that at some early stage they decided to redesign Sephiroth. For reference, he looked like Vincent at that stage:
1745833797812.png
Who looks enough like Tifa at least in these sketches that you could believe they're related. I think they wanted to make him more menacing looking, which led to this intermediary design for him:

1745833929423.png

Since they're siblings, Aerith was probably then redesigned to match, leading to the design we're familiar with. They both have those antenna bangs, after all. I think the name "Aerith" came about in-part so her name and Sephiroth's would have a bit more in common, too (the "~su" sound).

Also, for some added fun:

There's no evidence that the "siblings" phase of their relation and "ex-lovers" phase were seperate. both come from this, where no distinction is made lol:

1745834344567.png
(Also they weren't lovers, she just had one-sided feelings for him)
 
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FFVIIFunFacts

Lv. 1 Adventurer
AKA
Facts
Sakaguchi's contributions:
-The First draft of the story was about a detective named Joe who goes around investigating terrorists who blow up reactors around New York City
-The Materia System

Nomura's contributions:
-Designed all the characters
- Wrote the backstories of many characters
-Contributed to many key events
-Was the one who suggested that Aerith be killed
-Limit Breaks
Yeah, other than the theme of life, you don't really hear much about Sakaguchi's involvement when it comes to VII. Interesting to think about.
 

Eerie

Fire and Blood
Even Sakaguchi was like "was it really that big of a deal " lol. Granted, it seems the idea to kill SOMEONE existed from the beginning, so maybe that was from him.
I am not surprised at all by this off-hand comment. I write an OC story with a friend and hearing us talking it's exactly like that "oh yeah this character should die there" "like that (throws in explanation)" "yeah and we could insert this too". It feels exactly the same way of thinking.
I'm curious about the context of that Sakaguchi quote. The final game makes it clear that Aerith's death is meant to be felt deeply and to be impactful. We don't know for sure at what point in the dev process they were at when that conversation happened. And that's the other thing about this whole conversation.
Writers are always a step back from their stories and characters, they're going to be clinical about what's the story and what happens. They are professionals after all, and this shows it. The theme may be important to Sakaguchi, as well as how it is conveyed, but in the back when they were talking about it? Yeah, they're not fans, they're creators.
Okay here's something Turq and I were talking about in DMs not too long ago. Nomura's phrasing in that quote is a bit odd, and Turq realized that the reason he says "bring in Tifa" is because he's referring to the "Tifa" design Aerith used to have. Meaning, when they decided to kill Aerith, she already had her redesign and name change. So when they wanted to add in a second female protagonist, they went back and recycled that scrapped design and name to make the Tifa we know now.
I realised that immediately when I read this quote the first time, I thought it was obvious actually that he was referring to this design. Interestingly enough, Aerith was also supposed to have Tifa's character and not her own forward character that they created after bringing back Tifa.
 

Theozilla

Kaiju Member
That does feel a bit off to me but I guess so. FFVII was developed over the course of a single year so shit was just being thrown at the wall constantly.
Perhaps the parts about Aerith's death Nojima was most present for related to discussions and decisions of how, when, and where in the game Aerith's death would take (hence why there is remnant data and dialogue for Aerith existing past the Forgotten Capital up until the meteor summon at the northern cavity right?).

Okay here's something Turq and I were talking about in DMs not too long ago. Nomura's phrasing in that quote is a bit odd, and Turq realized that the reason he says "bring in Tifa" is because he's referring to the "Tifa" design Aerith used to have. Meaning, when they decided to kill Aerith, she already had her redesign and name change. So when they wanted to add in a second female protagonist, they went back and recycled that scrapped design and name to make the Tifa we know now.

Aerith exists in her near-final form from really early on, in images from game magazines from as far back as March 1996:

View attachment 17587

So "Tifa" Aerith probably didn't last very long at all.

This is speculation on my part, but I think what probably happened is that at some early stage they decided to redesign Sephiroth. For reference, he looked like Vincent at that stage:
View attachment 17588
Who looks enough like Tifa at least in these sketches that you could believe they're related. I think they wanted to make him more menacing looking, which led to this intermediary design for him:

View attachment 17589

Since they're siblings, Aerith was probably then redesigned to match, leading to the design we're familiar with. They both have those antenna bangs, after all. I think the name "Aerith" came about in-part so her name and Sephiroth's would have a bit more in common, too (the "~su" sound).

Also, for some added fun:

There's no evidence that the "siblings" phase of their relation and "ex-lovers" phase were seperate. both come from this, where no distinction is made lol:

View attachment 17590
(Also they weren't lovers, she just had one-sided feelings for him)

Oh wow that's fascinating, and a helpful clarification. Aerith getting her redesign and name change well before the decision to kill her off does make a lot more sense (since as you mentioned Aerith's final design and name also existed pretty early on). The early "Tifaerith" stage of Aerith's character development process existing for a very short amount of time does give better fitting context with how the devs consistently refer to Cloud, Barret, and Aerith as being the first three protagonist characters conceived of for FFVII.

And wow again, I never realized the siblings and unrequited love aspects existed simultaneously (though the sibling aspect does seem like it was still conceived of first before the unrequited love element was considered).
 

Odysseus

Ninja Potato
AKA
Ody
I realised that immediately when I read this quote the first time, I thought it was obvious actually that he was referring to this design. Interestingly enough, Aerith was also supposed to have Tifa's character and not her own forward character that they created after bringing back Tifa.
Somehow I just didn't think about it, and neither did he lol. It's too bad we don't have her full body art from that phase of development, just Cloud and Barret's.

1745879585579.png

Barret1.png
That they're labeled Character I and Character III tells me the Tifa!Aerith one must also exist as Charcter II, but we don't have it. Vincent!Sephiroth might also be somewhere as Character IV. I'd be curious to know just how similar the design was to final Tifa.

Perhaps the parts about Aerith's death Nojima was most present for related to discussions and decisions of how, when, and where in the game Aerith's death would take (hence why there is remnant data and dialogue for Aerith existing past the Forgotten Capital up until the meteor summon at the northern cavity right?).
One extremely conspicuous thing we noticed while making SAC is that after Icicle Lodge, there's not a single mention of Aerith in the game until some optional dialogue with Red on the Highwind bridge as Cid after finding Cloud, and then not again in a main story scene until you talk to Bugenhagen as Cloud. It's in a way that doesn't feel like it was just because they wanted that sense of loss to linger or whatever, but more like they hadn't decided exactly when she'd die and didn't have the characters talk about her as a result lol. There is also the stuff with the post-snowboard dialogue and also the Fort Condor Magnus Materia event where she has text after her death, which could also be a result of it being uncertain.
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
One extremely conspicuous thing we noticed while making SAC is that after Icicle Lodge, there's not a single mention of Aerith in the game until some optional dialogue with Red on the Highwind bridge as Cid after finding Cloud, and then not again in a main story scene until you talk to Bugenhagen as Cloud. It's in a way that doesn't feel like it was just because they wanted that sense of loss to linger or whatever, but more like they hadn't decided exactly when she'd die and didn't have the characters talk about her as a result lol. There is also the stuff with the post-snowboard dialogue and also the Fort Condor Magnus Materia event where she has text after her death, which could also be a result of it being uncertain.

It's always interesting when little facets of design process end up exposing themselves like this. Especially with RPGs where there are some locations that can be reached in any order, and some that are linear, it's always interesting to find things where the specific sequence of location events (which feel critical to the story we're familiar with) have details that show that they weren't set in stone nearly as early as it might seem, and have space for elements that would be impossible for when they appear.

I also feel like the theme of loss is overstated, at least in relation to him. Not that he was totally uninvolved in the decision to kill Aerith, but the actual idea to do so seems to have originated somewhere between Kitase and Nomura:

I think that an over-focus on "agency of the decision to have Aerith die" is actually missing the forest for the trees insofar as what that theme is in the context of Sakaguchi's contribution in this case.

I've detailed a fair bit about Sakaguchi's experience with death shaping the story & being overtly reflected in Remake/Rebirth in another thread which hits on a lot of his lasting contributions that I don't want to just repeat here. One important thing is that this theme all started back in Final Fantasy III. One of the bigger things is that even if he's not making the specific decisions about various story details, it's still his personal philosophical attempts to grapple with that kind of loss from personal experience that created the core of the story about the Lifestream itself.

Following along that line, one of the things that I think is worth mentioning is that non-material contributions are harder to gauge, but still just as important of a REAL contribution to what the end product is. Sakaguchi's own life experiences are also worth noting, being that he's older ('62) than Nojima ('64), Kitase ('66), & Nomura ('70), and as he's using that as a foundation from which a lot of the world & story's more specific inspiration & iteration can still take place outside of his direct influence, when it comes to the roles of the writer, director, & artist being able to contribute to shaping that.

I've always seen that contribution of his as being basically the North Star as the point of guidance around the core of what FFVII explores from an existential standpoint – and since those themes are heavily shaped by his own very unique philosophical outlook around those things from his experiences back then, it's hard to overstate how much he contributed to Final Fantasy VII. The variability & nuances that Nojima, Kitasae, & Nomura tackle all match to what one would expect from their various roles with Nojima as the writer, Kitase as the director, & Nomura as the artist. It's also worth noting that this builds off of the foundation that Sakaguchi established not JUST in FFVII, but with the general theme of death in earlier Final Fantasy titles, meaning that both Nomura & Kitase would already be familiar with some of that, and be able to easily iterate in directions that explored those things differently than they had done before.

Given that that's why FFVII is focused around the Lifestream, and it's both literally & metaphorically the lifeblood of the world in the story – everything that Final Fantasy VII is wouldn't exist how it does without it. As the Compilation has proved over the years – there's a lot of malleability with the various details in the game when it comes to how the characters look, and exactly what happened with them in various circumstances. However, I'd argue that the core themes of Sakaguchi's are still absolute & fundamental to how the narrative is shaped both in the original game, and in what came afterwards.

It's also worth looking at this in the general context of what we know about Sakaguchi's role in general at Square, and just how much of that was involved in other tasks. The section "Sakaguchi leaves Square and the company begins to change" really helps to emphasize a lot of what that looked like from a business operational perspective.
Kazuyuki Hashimoto (CG supervisor, Square Japan; Chief technical officer and senior vice president, Square USA)

Especially during the Final Fantasy 7 period, Sakaguchi-san made every big decision. That was why everybody moved quickly. It was so exciting. And after Sakaguchi-san left, no one wanted to take responsibility, so all the decision making needed lots of approvals, which took a long, long time. The company didn’t move very quickly. It suffered from “big company disease.”

Shinichiro Kajitani (Vice president, Square USA)
When Sakaguchi-san wanted to make a decision, it would just happen like that. But after he left, several people had to do it. … It became more of a committee-based thing, so it took a lot more time to get things done.

Hiroshi Kawai (Character programmer, Square Japan)
It’s one of those [things] where, when somebody like Sakaguchi-san, who had such authority in the company, kind of just disappears, there’s this vacuum that exists where nobody can really arbitrate between your devs and your artists and your game designers. And in that environment, most people — especially in Square — tended to avoid conflict and try to resolve things as best as possible. And unfortunately, the way each individual tried to resolve it wasn’t necessarily in the end user’s interests.

Tatsuya Yoshinari (Programmer, Square Japan)
Basically everything was different between Square and Microsoft. But if I had to choose the most significant difference, it was that we didn’t [initially] have anyone at Microsoft that was like Sakaguchi-san back at Square, that powerful leader who really kind of had that aura of leadership and drove everyone forward.


Motonori Sakakibara (Movie director, Square)
The company seemed like it was becoming [more about costs than creativity]. At the beginning of this interview, I mentioned that Square was very creative — the first priority was creativity, right? But I think after the movie project, they changed some of the direction of the company, especially after Sakaguchi left.

It's ironically the EXTREME strength of that collective unity and ability to be a strong guiding force that ended up being the exact same thing that undermined translating that same operational mindset into FF:TSW

Yoshihiro Maruyama (Executive vice president, Square U.S.)
I think [Final Fantasy 7’s success] changed [Sakaguchi’s] style in a slightly negative way. [Laughs] He thought he could do anything within the company. That’s why he started investing even more money in Final Fantasy the movie, which became one of the biggest flops. That made him a little out of control. The original budget of the film was like $40 million dollars, and it [ended up costing] close to $150 million. So when I actually did the calculation on how much it was going to cost based on the number of people Sakaguchi wanted to assign, I quickly figured out it couldn’t be finished for $40 million. But you know, they did it anyway. They kept investing more money.

Alex O. Smith (Localization specialist, Square U.S. and Japan (1998-2002) )
The movie … was an unmitigated disaster. … I talked to the lawyer, and I just remember at a party, but she was the lawyer from Hawaii who had handled their applications for doing the movie there. And there were so many tax benefits on the table, and they didn’t take a single one. Because they went in and they were like, “We’re bringing our team.” And they were like, “You hire 10 percent Hawaiian and you get this huge tax cut.” And I don’t think it was like Sakaguchi sitting there going, “No, we’re keeping it pure. It’s our team.” I don’t think there was any thought at all. I think it was like, that came in and the whole organization was so dysfunctional that when that kind of news hits the grind, it never gets to the person that needs to hear it.
And that’s the problem when you’ve got that kind of power structure. It’s like a family thing. And this is endemic in Japanese companies where it operates like a family instead of a business. And so, if something isn’t on the family’s radar, it just doesn’t happen. And there are so many missed opportunities there. So apparently, they could have saved so much money — millions of dollars — if they had taken advantage of these really easy [opportunities]. They just had to hire janitors locally, really, and they could have done it.

(I think it's also a not insignificant impact to the struggle that we still see around the Final Fantasy titles now, and especially with the modern "live-service" era of game monetization and things all attempting to offset this type of risk, even as the size & budgets of AAA games starts to get closer and closer to what happens with film production, but that's a bit of an aside that I just felt was worth highlighting).

Overally, that's why it's worth looking at what Sakaguchi's contributions to Final Fantasy VII were from a bit of a different perspective than just attempting to compare them against the explicit details like around who technically decided that Aerith was going to die. Especially in looking at things like how they're different from things like what Nomura contributed, it's really necessary to also just emphasize the big difference in the roles that they had, and what to expect qualifies as a "contribution" to try and gauge that.



X :neo:
 
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