The WEAPONS are here. And they're pissed. *SPOILERS*

[Cat Rage Room]

Simple enough topic, and hopefully it'll garner some discussion.

The most accepted reason why the WEAPONS didn't target Sephiroth when they went apeshit is because of the barrier around the Northern Crater. However, let's assume hypothetically that A. The barrier never went up, or B. Shinra blew it away immediately after.

Now let's also say that the WEAPONS are actively looking for Sephiroth, but its not an option to his plans to hide in the crater forever and EVENTUALLY he's going to have to come out and fight them, and he can't keep ducking back in the crater either, for the sake of the situation. Waiting for Meteor to hit and wipe them away is not an option for the sake of the hypothetical.

So, given Sephiroth's power in FF7, could Sephiroth take the WEAPONS? Individually? All at one time? What do you think? Keep in mind this includes Sapphire, Emerald, Ruby, Diamond, and Ultimate.

 

[Part the Yngve]

I'd say he'd be able to take them on individually, all at once would be an incredibly tough battle though.

 

[Max Payne]

I took it that the WEAPONS were also going to destroy humanity as well since they were meant to protect the planet.

My feelings have changed a bit since then.

 

[X-SOLDIER]

Are we talking about Sephiroth's level of ability pre or post regeneration in the Northern Crater?

You only see a few demonstrations of his power against other creatures - the Dragon in Nibelheim before he goes all crazy, that he takes down in a single blow. That shows that even based only on his sword fighting / SOLDIER training alone, he was one hell of a combatant. Afterwards, when you're chasing after him, you see that he's managed to impale a Midgar Zolem onto a huge tree (which at that part is a pretty tough opponent), so I think that his abilities even pre-transformation in the North Crater are quite impressive.

(On a slightly less lore-related note, I really think it would be interesting generate a battle between Sephiroth & the WEAPONS, and see the outcome. Where the WEAPONS can 1 hit kill your whole party, I wonder if they could stand up against an opponent with >9999 HP).


X

 

[Cat Rage Room]

No, I'm talking about Sephiroth post regeneration, the same Sephy you're after and eventually fight during the game.

As to comment on your statement, the Dragon and the Midgar Zolom are impressive foes indeed, but they seem to be flies on a wall compared to the WEAPONS.

 

[Splintered]

Individually it would be easy for him, imo. But all together, I'm not sure he would survive. That was probably one of the reason he put up the barrier in the first place. But I really have no good explanations on why that would be.

I took it that the WEAPONS were also going to destroy humanity as well since they were meant to protect the planet.

My feelings have changed a bit since then.

Actually so did I. Especially since the easiest way to protect the planet was to have everything that can return to the planet. I see no reason why a WEAPON would attack Mideel if it weren't the case.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

Something tells me Sephiroth vs. all the WEAPONS at once would equal smooshed Sephiroth.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Oh yeah, definitely. Sephiroth would probably beat the WEAPONs if he had to.

All at once though...well, that would be a very epic fight, but knowing Sephiroth, he'd probably win anyways. Hell, I'd think that would probably garner a Supernova and Heartless Angel for such a battle

I don't think he'd be overwhelmed taking on each WEAPON...that is to say...if Sephiroth finished his regeneration and "rebirth." Cause if he didn't then yeah, he'd probably be dead. He was vulnerable while he was in that cocoon of "Reverse/Bizarro Sephiroth."

 

[Andalegogo]

If the WEAPONs would've had access to Sephiroth they probably would've vaporized him. His "will" is powerful, but I doubt he would've had enough to distribute it against the various WEAPONs while he was busy halting Holy and hauling in Meteor.

His physical ability would've been ineffective if the WEAPONs were all attacking him at once. Their bodies appear to be made of dense mineral, so sword strikes, even from Sephiroth, wouldn't prove very useful. His speed is probably the only thing that would save him, but it means nothing if the WEAPONs, who each appear to have greater stamina, defense, and sheer power than Sephiroth would be able to outdo him in the long run. Seph's magic abilities aren't ever shown as being especially great, so I doubt they would be enough to grant him any advantages.

Sephiroth's abilities just aren't enough to take on a team of super-sized magical mechs who are hellbent on destroying their shared primary target.

If Sephiroth didn't have to worry about Holy and Meteor, I figure he could apply more of his telekinetic abilities against the WEAPONs. It would at least allow him to immobilize the threat long enough to get him some distance or score some free hits towards busting open their cores.

But...no I don' think Seph stands much of a chance by himself.

 

[Makoeyes987]

If the WEAPONs would've had access to Sephiroth they probably would've vaporized him. His "will" is powerful, but I doubt he would've had enough to distribute it against the various WEAPONs while he was busy halting Holy and hauling in Meteor.

His physical ability would've been ineffective if the WEAPONs were all attacking him at once. Their bodies appear to be made of dense mineral, so sword strikes, even from Sephiroth, wouldn't prove very useful. His speed is probably the only thing that would save him, but it means nothing if the WEAPONs, who each appear to have greater stamina, defense, and sheer power than Sephiroth would be able to outdo him in the long run. Seph's magic abilities aren't ever shown as being especially great, so I doubt they would be enough to grant him any advantages.

Sephiroth's abilities just aren't enough to take on a team of super-sized magical mechs who are hellbent on destroying their shared primary target.

If Sephiroth didn't have to worry about Holy and Meteor, I figure he could apply more of his telekinetic abilities against the WEAPONs. It would at least allow him to immobilize the threat long enough to get him some distance or score some free hits towards busting open their cores.

But...no I don' think Seph stands much of a chance by himself.

But Sephiroth has a slew of magic at his disposal in FFVII as Safer Sephiroth. He wouldn't necessarily have to use brute force. Which would be rather tough against them.

And I dunno, I'd say Supernova, Heartless Angel, and Ultima are pretty powerful spells to have at your disposal.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

I dunno man, the WEAPONS...it just seems like it would be too much. If Sephiroth could be beaten by a group of relatively mortal and normal dudes and chicks, why couldn't 5 planet busting superweapons made by the planet itself smash his face into jelly?

People forget that Sephiroth LOST to the party's combined strength. For all of his power, it has a limit. The WEAPONS combined would destroy him in comparison.

 

[Joker]

Er...the same WEAPONs that were destroyed by a group of relatively mortal and normal dudes and chicks?

 

[Cat Rage Room]

Yes, one at a time.

WTF

are you kidding me with that statement

 

[Andalegogo]

okay, Supernova appears to be a major energy attack, based on its appearances in the original Japanese version of FF7 and Dissidia. I'm not sure if Sephiroth can actually spam this spell enough to wear the WEAPONS down quickly enough to guarantee a victory. And I'm also not sure if this spell was actually available to him prior to him morphing into his Safer form.

I have no idea how Heartless Angel works outside of gameplay, but I imagine it basically breaks the opponent's will to fight. I can't see Haartless Angel breaking a WEAPONs will to fight, seeing as its supposed to be akin to a machine programmed to destroy a specified target. And again...I don't know if Seph could perform this trick before his Safer form.

Ultima and Shadow Flare seem like things he would have access to, since they're accessible through materia. But then, the WEAPONs also have access to the same spells.

If Seph truly did have access to Supernova prior to his Safer form, then he'd stand a better chance, but I don't think a victory would be guaranteed.

EDIT: oh wait, Seph DOES use Heartless Angel in CC, right?! Still, I have no idea how it works outside of gameplay, and question whether it would be of any use against the WEAPONs.

 

[Joker]

Point being that if a bunch of relatively normal people can do it, why wouldn't the very powerful ABNORMAL guy about to destroy the world be able to do it?

 

[Cat Rage Room]

Because I'm not just talking about a one on one fight? The hypothetical also allows for all of the WEAPONS to engage him at one time. If that happened with Cloud and co they wouldn't have lasted 30 seconds.

 

[Joker]

But in the hypothetical, you did ask about one on one. Is it safe to assume we can all agree that Sephiroth would waste them in one on one combat?

Against multiple WEAPONs at once, I dunno. He could probably handle the weaker ones (c'mon, Diamond and Ultima were pathetically weak - even a single member of the party is enough to take them out), but I lose certainty in the thought of Emerald and Ruby at the same time.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

One on one, I think Sephiroth is looking at good odds.

He could probably handle the weaker ones (c'mon, Diamond and Ultima were pathetically weak - even a single member of the party is enough to take them out)

Whoa whoa, let's not use gameplay as a measuring stick (too much) for this kind of thing. So it's great if you leveled up Cloud to 99 with Knights of the Round materia and let him at 'em, but storyline wise, Diamond wasn't even so much as bothered by the party's attack (he literally just went 'fuck it' and walked away mid battle), and the party has to chase Ultima around the world several times after several beatings to finally do him in.

 

[Dark and Divine]

Well, one on one, Sephiroth would be able to take them down with relative ease.

An Haikiri here, a magic spell there and Sephiroth takes the cake.

Sephiroth vs all of them, however, it's a completely different matter, and i'm not sure if Sephiroth would win.

If Supernova would function the same way that in Dissidia, maybe Sephiroth could engulf one or two Weapons in the blast of energy that Supernova produces and destroy them or at least cause enough damage to make them inoperative.

But there are three more Weapons, so it would be a very hard fight for Sephiroth.

In order to win, Sephiroth would have to rely more on speed and mobility than raw power.

Other than that, being the seasoning Soldier that he is, Sephiroth could come up with a strategy to take advantage of the WEAPON's weaknesses and handicaps, isolating them from their "brothers". Emerald and Saphire are limited to in-water combat, while Ruby and Diamond can't fly.

Sephiroth could attack them with magic from the air, while avoiding their attacks, until he was able to defeat them.

The only real threat in these conditions would be Ultima, wich would be the first one Sephiroth should deal with.

After that, taking adavantage of his flight ability and speed, Sephiroth could eventually surpass and defeat the other Weapons.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

I think Sephiroth would be crushed in an all out fight. If it was that easy, he wouldn't have been defeated by the party.

 

[Makoeyes987]

While I think the power of the WEAPONs are immense and would give Sephiroth a very dangerous challenge, they're not too bright either. I wouldn't be surprised if Sephiroth proved capable of outsmarting them or formulating a strategy to turn their powers and abilities against them.

I think the party beat Sephiroth because of their combined strength AND tactical intelligence as people. For all intents and purposes, the WEAPONs are just simple robots.

 

[Max Payne]

LOL Avalanche isn't relatively normal at all Omega. I don't know where you're getting that. They've beaten ridiculously powerful monsters on their own, fought off a trained military, and defeated a borderline god in his home turf.

They're freaks.

 

[Joker]

If Sephiroth could be beaten by a group of relatively mortal and normal dudes and chicks

From this post, obv

 

[Max Payne]

Ohrite.

Then I direct the question to the originator.

 

[Andalegogo]

I usually get a mess of flack for calling most of Avalanche "normal" people. I suppose a better term would be "unenhanced", but the fact that their journey turns them into some hardcore muthafathas kinda makes up for their lack of physical enhancements. Their experience with materia in battle should be enough to make them a match for lower ranks of SOLDIER, and as a team they could take on a band of 1st Classes.

But as powerful as Avalanche is, their combined forces failed to keep Diamond WEAPON interested in them long enough to even finish their battle. It didn't view them as a viable threat and turned away to Mako-sucking Midgar. And this isn't so far from the final battles of the game.

If a team of combatants managed to take down a hulking Sephiroth, but could not cause any injury to a single WEAPON...it's hard to imagine that Sephiroth would do well against a team of those WEAPONs.

But I'll agree that Sephiroth could probably outplay a single WEAPON. I'd even go so far's to entertain the thought of him outplaying a pair of them, but a team of five of those fuckers breaking it down? As I mentioned earlier, if Seph's Holy/Meteor dilemma played a role in his defeat, removing those handicaps in a fight against the WEAPONs might better his odds.