Why was Jenova kept in the Nibelheim reactor?

[jazzflower92]

Was there ever explanation why they just left Jenova there and didn't bring it to the Shinra's headquarters until Sephiroth burned the place down? Or did Hojo intentionally kept Jenova there so it can be useful later on for his own purposes.

 

[Ite]

Headcanon: Shinra HQ was subject to far more scrutiny and regulations 30 years ago. Since the rise of SOLDIER, and the subsequent crushing of Wutai and global mako takeover, Shinra has become untouchable. Five years ago, they probably considered the Nibelheim incident as something like:

"People will really look into this massacre and razing.
People will find all our kooky shit in this reactor.
Okay, rebuild the town and hire actors to live in it.
People will notice Sephiroth is gone. Announce his death. Don't mention the crazy thing.
Move the kooky shit to the Shinra Mansion if we can. Books, survivors, etc.
Bring Jenova to Midgar, we own the government now so we can conduct our kooky shit over there without any batted eyelids."

 

[jazzflower92]

Headcanon: Shinra HQ was subject to far more scrutiny and regulations 30 years ago. Since the rise of SOLDIER, and the subsequent crushing of Wutai and global mako takeover, Shinra has become untouchable. Five years ago, they probably considered the Nibelheim incident as something like:

"People will really look into this massacre and razing.
People will find all our kooky shit in this reactor.
Okay, rebuild the town and hire actors to live in it.
People will notice Sephiroth is gone. Announce his death. Don't mention the crazy thing.
Move the kooky shit to the Shinra Mansion if we can. Books, survivors, etc.
Bring Jenova to Midgar, we own the government now so we can conduct our kooky shit over there without any batted eyelids."

That actually makes a lot of sense. Because if people found out that Nibelheim was the result of their meddling then the citizens would question Shinra more and more.

 

[Obsidian Fire]

Well, 30 years ago, Neibelheim looks like it was the main center for scientific research for the S Project, which needs a constant supply of Jenova cells. So they would probably need Jenova close by for that. And we all know that mako does weird things to cells... I'm thinking Hojo probably piped in Jenova-cell laced mako in from the mako reactor, and then when Neibelheim was abandoned shortly after Sephrioth's birth, Hojo didn't have a good reason to study Jenova anymore, so he just left her where she was. After all, he would know where Jenova was, and you'd have to be pretty crazy/desperate to go up into the Nibel mountains looking for her.

 

[jazzflower92]

Well, 30 years ago, Neibelheim looks like it was the main center for scientific research for the S Project, which needs a constant supply of Jenova cells. So they would probably need Jenova close by for that. And we all know that mako does weird things to cells... I'm thinking Hojo probably piped in Jenova-cell laced mako in from the mako reactor, and then when Neibelheim was abandoned shortly after Sephrioth's birth, Hojo didn't have a good reason to study Jenova anymore, so he just left her where she was. After all, he would know where Jenova was, and you'd have to be pretty crazy/desperate to go up into the Nibel mountains looking for her.

It could also be why they built that metal thing for her so to throw people off who accidentally bump into her.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

Where did they originally find Jenova?

I'm thinking it was in the Northern Crater... but if it was in the Northern Crater, that means they not only knew the Crater was there but had been inside it, in which case Shinra would have known all along about the rich supply of mako inside it... But that would make nonsense of the whole Neo-Midgar/Promised Land storyline, plus Rufus seemed extremely surprised to see all that crystalised mako down in the cave.

So maybe she's in the Nibelheim reactor because that's where they found her, when they were digging its foundations?

 

[jazzflower92]

Where did they originally find Jenova?

I'm thinking it was in the Northern Crater... but if it was in the Northern Crater, that means they not only knew the Crater was there but had been inside it, in which case Shinra would have known all along about the rich supply of mako inside it... But that would make nonsense of the whole Neo-Midgar/Promised Land storyline, plus Rufus seemed extremely surprised to see all that crystalised mako down in the cave.

So maybe she's in the Nibelheim reactor because that's where they found her, when they were digging its foundations?

So, you think she was originally found in Nibelheim but the official canon stuff said she was found frozen at the Northern Crater. Also remember it was actually Gast who found her and not Shinra. Shinra just became interested in Gast's research because they thought Jenova was an ancient that would lead them to finding the Promise Land.

 

[LicoriceAllsorts]

IIRC, Gast was working for Shinra when he found her. But I am happy to be corrected.

Although it's interesting.... in the scene when Rufus and all the executives come to the Crater, Rufus, Scarlet and Heidegger are all clearly astounded by what they see, but Hojo doesn't seem all that surprised. Has the science department been covering up the existence of this so-called Promised Land? (Is that canon and did I just fail to realise it?) That would be quite a big cover-up for the science department to maintain all on its own. Maybe that's why Hojo had to shoot Gast?

 

[jazzflower92]

IIRC, Gast was working for Shinra when he found her. But I am happy to be corrected.

Although it's interesting.... in the scene when Rufus and all the executives come to the Crater, Rufus, Scarlet and Heidegger are all clearly astounded by what they see, but Hojo doesn't seem all that surprised. Has the science department been covering up the existence of this so-called Promised Land? (Is that canon and did I just fail to realise it?) That would be quite a big cover-up for the science department to maintain all on its own. Maybe that's why Hojo had to shoot Gast?

Yeah, you are stumbling onto something because I think that is exactly what Hojo would do. He never really has been a big follower of Shinra's grand schemes and seems to have an agenda of his own. It would be in his nature to mislead things so his true ambitions can be met.

 

[Roger]

Gonna assume that the Crater looked very different before Sephiroth resurfaced there from the Lifestream and started gathering strength.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

They had to have known that giant ass Crater was there. The whole educated world should know that as basical geographical knowledge. Unless the age of discovery in FFVII was literally just decades ago, that giant ass crater almost had to have been known as a geographical feature in the realms of history.

The context of the Crater being Mako rich being a recent discovery I can understand (seeing as Mako energy only became relevant to civilization at large only some time ago), but the concept of 'Hey look, check out this massive crater in the middle of the continent! Oh man nobody's noticed that before!' is hard to buy, even considering that the northern continent is snowy and icy.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Gonna assume that the Crater looked very different before Sephiroth resurfaced there from the Lifestream and started gathering strength.

Probably not. The planet had been funneling spirit energy there for 2,000 years to fix the big hole, and the Weapons are said to have been encased in materia for just as long.

 

[Ite]

I assumed they found her in the North. (head canon: Icicle Inn is the town built around the excavation which is why 1: Gast has a lab there and 2: It has as uncreative name as Rocket)

 

[Obsidian Fire]

What makes the "nobody knew what was in the Northern Crater" plot-hole even weirder is that it's a plot-hole from the OG. The plot-hole wasn't caused by the Compilation so you'd think we'd have caught it earlier.

That said, the shear amount of information the Science Department (particularly Hojo) has not informed Shin-Ra about is not small. I mean, I don't even know if Shin-Ra even found out that Jenova wasn't a Cetra until the OG. And yeah, if I remember right, cannon just says Gast found Jenova up north in a layer of rock. So however far north that was, they weren't to the point yet where the ice was so thick they couldn't dig through it. So Jenova probably wasn't in the Great Glacier...

 

[jazzflower92]

What makes the "nobody knew what was in the Northern Crater" plot-hole even weirder is that it's a plot-hole from the OG. The plot-hole wasn't caused by the Compilation so you'd think we'd have caught it earlier.

That said, the shear amount of information the Science Department (particularly Hojo) has not informed Shin-Ra about is not small. I mean, I don't even know if Shin-Ra even found out that Jenova wasn't a Cetra until the OG. And yeah, if I remember right, cannon just says Gast found Jenova up north in a layer of rock. So however far north that was, they weren't to the point yet where the ice was so thick they couldn't dig through it. So Jenova probably wasn't in the Great Glacier...

It also makes one wonder how Hojo managed to keep all that information hushed up for so long.

 

[Obsidian Fire]

It's a time where there's been a surge in scientific development, so it would make sense to me anyway if the application of the scientific development overshadowed the actual science of what was being developed. Also for non-scientifc people, a lot of scientific terms sound similar, or are hard to wrap your head around. So their understanding of stuff isn't very good.

Ultimately though, Shin-Ra is a company that cares about the results. So so long as they can get the results they want how ever often they want, the information that was the basis for the results in the first place isn't that important. So if some information about where something was found, or where something is stored, or if something could cause mutations goes missing, no one is going to miss it if it doesn't have something to do with producing whatever result you want.

It's also wroth considering that nobody misses information if they didn't know it existed in the first place, or if they don't have a reason to go looking for it. IE, Sephiroth has no reason to think that Jenova was not just a case of his mom dieing in childbirth, so he has no reason to go looking up her records. So he wouldn't even know if the records looked "off" or were missing in the first place.

 

[jazzflower92]

So, basically Hojo has gotten away with a ton of misinformation because Shinra cares more about the results than asking about the process. That seems pretty in character for President Shinra if one thinks about it.

 

[Ite]

One word: Mako.

 

[Knuxson]

What makes the "nobody knew what was in the Northern Crater" plot-hole even weirder is that it's a plot-hole from the OG. The plot-hole wasn't caused by the Compilation so you'd think we'd have caught it earlier.

That said, the shear amount of information the Science Department (particularly Hojo) has not informed Shin-Ra about is not small. I mean, I don't even know if Shin-Ra even found out that Jenova wasn't a Cetra until the OG. And yeah, if I remember right, cannon just says Gast found Jenova up north in a layer of rock. So however far north that was, they weren't to the point yet where the ice was so thick they couldn't dig through it. So Jenova probably wasn't in the Great Glacier...

I always thought it was weird that no one knew about the northern crater or had ever actually been up there. The closest one to knowing about it from the OG is the mountain climber living at the bottom. The way he talks about it, it sounds like no one in living memory has been able to get up the cliff to discover the crater. Of course, once Cloud and Co. get the Highwind, they can easily fly right over it (and Rufus and Co. fly right over it and even land and get inside). So, Shinra obviously had the technology to discover it.

However, IMO the most likely explanation is that Shinra simply didn't discover it until the events of the OG. Shinra has explored/settled/taken over most of the world by the OG, but they may have seen the frozen wasteland north of Icicle Inn and didn't see much reason to explore it further. It is a harsh place and likely does not contain many resources to take (not knowing about the massive amounts of mako at the crater). They might have been able to build a mako reactor (is there one in Icicle Inn - they have electricity, right?) but there was probably no indication that there was a larger supply there than in other places. Also, the technology (such as the Highwind) to discover it has not existed for very long. I need to look at the timeline again, but the current technologies have only been around for a few decades, right?

As far as where Jenova was discovered, it likely was in the north but that doesn't mean it was at the crater. It could have been anywhere on the northern continent. I doubt Jenova just hung out at the crater after she landed. It sounds like she ventured forth and was moving around quite a bit before her imprisonment. I agree with what was said previously: it makes sense that she was discovered near Icicle Inn, especially since Gast (the one who discovered her) has a place there. Not sure how all his stuff survived intact in that house for 20 years until Cloud gets there though. I also agree that Jenova was kept at Nibelheim because that was where the Jenova project took place and they just kept her there after the project was over.

 

[jazzflower92]

I wonder if any of the Ultimanias talk about this.

It would surely give us a clearer picture where she was found. I also have a feeling that Shinra never really understood the magnitude of how dangerous Jenova was. I think if they were smarter they defiantly would have kept an eye on Hojo meddling with her. Seeing it was his actions that almost got the world destroyed.

 

[Clement Rage]

Considering what the monsters are like in the North Cave I can definitely see why not many people bothered going there. It would take a major military expedition for anyone to hold on to whatever they found, and as far as anyone knows there's nothing to find to begin with. Explorers might try, but I doubt they have a high survival rate.

I reckon Jen was kept out of the Shinra building because A)Sephiroth might recognise the name, and B) Shinra building gets invaded quite a lot by various terrorist groups.

 

[jazzflower92]

Considering what the monsters are like in the North Cave I can definitely see why not many people bothered going there. It would take a major military expedition for anyone to hold on to whatever they found, and as far as anyone knows there's nothing to find to begin with. Explorers might try, but I doubt they have a high survival rate.

I reckon Jen was kept out of the Shinra building because A)Sephiroth might recognise the name, and B) Shinra building gets invaded quite a lot by various terrorist groups.

I know that Shinra was bad in using Jenova in their plans but imagine if a terrorist group managed to get their hands on her. And you have a point about needing to hide Jenova from Sephiroth because then he would have a lot of questions that need to be answered and this would have led to him defecting from the organization.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Checking Crisis Core's Missions, Shin-Ra definitely knew about the crater area already:

We unearthed a second subterranean den near the northern cave.
We cannot determine whether it was naturally formed, or made by human hands.
Shinra sent a science team, which never came back. This is where you come in.

So ... yeah. Makes no sense.

 

[Roger]

I know that Shinra was bad in using Jenova in their plans but imagine if a terrorist group managed to get their hands on her. And you have a point about needing to hide Jenova from Sephiroth because then he would have a lot of questions that need to be answered and this would have led to him defecting from the organization.

I really don't think any old terrorist group would be able to make use of a braindead alien. Fuhito with his scientific background is the odd one out. Most terrorists would probably have Barret's "this whole thing is stupid, let's move on." reaction.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Funny to think, if more folks thought like Barret the world would have been spared so much goddamn trouble