SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[Eerie]

Maybe you have a better curated For You page

Actually I don't have a "For You" tab thanks to an addon I have lol. My Twitter experience is my TL and lists. I don't even have trends lol.

Even Max Dood sort of had a jab at it in one of his streams, which frankly quite surprised me.

Which is normal considering that side attacked him pretty relentlessly. But it's the account that I followed that counter-attacked with a thankyouMax trend to cheer him up. I know cause I gave them the idea Since they're big they had enough connexions to start it. So as I said not everything is black.

And BTW the UTH trend was started because JP CAs whined they would have Aerith in Tifa's place, saying her lines etc. if the HW scene happened. Lol.

 

[Yoru]

And BTW the UTH trend was started because JP CAs whined they would have Aerith in Tifa's place, saying her lines etc. if the HW scene happened. Lol.

Reminds me of their last "work" where the water tower scene and promise is now a Clerith moment lmao.

 

[Purple]

It's not just "free taunt" to LTD. More like "I already had a bad time, leave me out of it"

Maybe that’s all it was. I just was taken aback a bit if I’m being honest lol. I don’t really care much for his opinions, but he is the biggest FF7 fan, platform wise, so these things tend to stand out more. Ykwim

It was his stream where he was reading the Ultimania translations. He said something along the lines of all the dates are nothing but fanservice. I’d link it but it’s not important at the end of the day.

 

[Yoru]

Maybe that’s all it was. I just was taken aback a bit if I’m being honest lol. I don’t really care much for his opinions, but he is the biggest FF7 fan, platform wise, so these things tend to stand out more. Ykwim

It was his stream where he was reading the Ultimania translations. He said something along the lines of all the dates are nothing but fanservice. I’d link it but it’s not important at the end of the day.

I know yes. What I'm trying to say is that he's not here to try and start a trend or anything. It was just a response to the attacks he's received.

Unlike Reddit, as you pointed out, where it's more of a fashion statement. The slightest opinion is dragged down if it comes too close to the romance in FF7.

 

[Purple]

Unlike Reddit, as you pointed out, where it's more of a fashion statement. The slightest opinion is dragged down if it comes too close to the romance in FF7

The mods over at Reddit there are really something. They immediately lock a thread at the mere mention of romance. They’d sometimes lock a Tifa thread too once Aerith gets brought up in the comments. A total mess of a place.

It’s quite sad that this is the state of the fandom tbh. We can only hope Part 3 doesn’t leave too many things to “interpretation”

 

[Eerie]

There were a lot of CAs in Reddit, maybe it's turned so shitty with Rebirth that they decided to go nuclear. But well they won't be able to avoid it in p3 because it will be even more romance-heavy for CT and ZA.

 

[Yoru]

What will always make me laugh with all these Takes is that for years I've been told that Tifa was useless and that her absence wouldn't make any difference to the story. And now the Cult Clerith insists on inserting Aerith in all these supposedly useless moments. Ironic.

 

[Purple]

I was under the impression that their ship's popularity has waned a long, long time ago, particularly in Japan.

The notorious CAs in the West have all blocked me long ago but I'm sure they're still out and about in internet spaces.

 

[Ryeleigh]

I also noticed that shippers tend to get more hate these days. Specially on Reddit. It certainly wasn’t the case in 2020 as far as I can recall. Even Max Dood sort of had a jab at it in one of his streams, which frankly quite surprised me.

This isn't really specific to FF7 fandom but at a certain point shipping in general took a definite turn for the worse. Loud extremes forgot the fandom law of "ship and let ship", started conflating shipping with activism and puritan moralism, and started harassing creators and other fans for canon/fandom validation.* Then there's of course the fact that shipping generally looks at every relationship in media through either a sexual or romantic lens, which some people find annoying (especially if coupled with the previous behaviours).

So generally speaking, if all you see is the abovementioned behaviour, it's not surprising for people to grow tired of it.

*Edit: forgot to mention that people also started conflating fiction with real life.

 

[Eerie]

Yep, to put a little hindsight, pixiv yesterday announced that it was blocking R18 content to all the US and UK, that's just how bad it got. They got too many complaints from these users I guess, but it does show a certain way of thinking in shipping that is uh... please just don't. There's also the problem of having minors hanging in adult places really and thinking the adults should bend to them... no you're there because you lied about your age, not because you have the right to be there!

 

[Ryeleigh]

Yep, to put a little hindsight, pixiv yesterday announced that it was blocking R18 content to all the US and UK, that's just how bad it got. They got too many complaints from these users I guess, but it does show a certain way of thinking in shipping that is uh... please just don't. There's also the problem of having minors hanging in adult places really and thinking the adults should bend to them... no you're there because you lied about your age, not because you have the right to be there!

Yeah, that's definitely another thing that more people should re-learn: don't like, don't read. I mean, I can get if something you've read upset you (generic you, lol). I've read plenty of terrible stuff out of sheer curiosity, but instead of going on a moral crusade to have it eradicated, I just closed off the tab and went to read something I like to scrub it from my mind, lol.

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

Aaaa.... I love One Piece, been reading it since 1999 haha. (I dont follow anime, but the manga)
Tell me if he suggested OTP and BROTP that is same as me XD.
I ship Sanji/Nami and my BROTP is Luffy/Sanji. I just love Sanji lol.

He said Sanji/Zoro as BROTP I would like though I also said I could ship them romantically too based on my other ship dynamics and he thinks Nami/Luffy would be a ship I like but he isn't into it because he doesn't feel like Luffy feels that way about anyone. I would also ship timeskip: Luffy/Koby
As for Sanji ships he mentioned Pudding likes him or something. But I'm an outsider so I don't know much. I asked about different characters in general but the consensus is probably Sanji is more shippable of the crew because he is interested in romance.

I now how have to think about it more lol I didn't think of Nami/Sanji but it sounds nice.

I've posted this in previous pages before Rebirth was released out, lemme copy and paste again.
===========================

I asked my friend about it, she has Bachelor Degree in Japanese Literature.

Her:


Me:


Her:


Me:


Her:


Me:


Her:


======

Though, Aerith's motivation to pursue Cloud is romantic, because she saw Zack in him. But, it applies differently to Cloud whose personality need to grow first even as a friend (see how he's warmed up with AVALANCHE and Aerith is the same process), and it turns out even after two weeks, he just viewed her as friend. I guess this situation is confusing or difficult to Aerith while with Zack, it's clear a romantic love from the first meet. Nah, my friend said the koibito in the novel is platonic because is her thought, that she keeps her feelings only for herself. But then in Rebirth, she confesses it. So I guess, it's not platonic again? I dont think what Nojima write here is contradictive. So, she treasure both feelings.

Thank you.
Yeah I was getting very confused because the issue is people mostly on Twitter were saying how her different like "suki" meant she no longer feels romantically for Cloud. Or isn't sure she does. And that's why I said it's a contradiction because by confessing any feelings the feelings she kept to herself it would now be romantic. And yeah that's the difference one is koi and one is ren'ai both are romantic but in different ways.

However what I saw being said about it gave the impression it meant oh Aerith realized she doesn't feel romantic feelings for Cloud. At all. It's not romantic. It's the love of a friend. Which gave me the thought oh so she doesn't even know if she likes him romantically? Then what's the point if she doesn't even know that? That would also contradict LS White where she straight up says she does see him as a friend but also romantically.

But yeah basically she is saying she wonders what kind of like it is. Is this a crush? Is this something more? She isn't sure the extent of it And overall it feels less sure than straight up saying it's koi or it's ren'ai. And NOW koibito de aru makes perfect sense. Thank you.

Yeah my main point being they set this up so even Aerith is probably not going to be thinking of romance further in part 3.

 

[Sacky]

He said Sanji/Zoro as BROTP I would like though I also said I could ship them romantically too based on my other ship dynamics and he thinks Nami/Luffy would be a ship I like but he isn't into it because he doesn't feel like Luffy feels that way about anyone. I would also ship timeskip: Luffy/Koby
As for Sanji ships he mentioned Pudding likes him or something. But I'm an outsider so I don't know much. I asked about different characters in general but the consensus is probably Sanji is more shippable of the crew because he is interested in romance.

I now how have to think about it more lol I didn't think of Nami/Sanji but it sounds nice.


Thank you.
Yeah I was getting very confused because the issue is people mostly on Twitter were saying how her different like "suki" meant she no longer feels romantically for Cloud. Or isn't sure she does. And that's why I said it's a contradiction because by confessing any feelings the feelings she kept to herself it would now be romantic. And yeah that's the difference one is koi and one is ren'ai both are romantic but in different ways.

However what I saw being said about it gave the impression it meant oh Aerith realized she doesn't feel romantic feelings for Cloud. At all. It's not romantic. It's the love of a friend. Which gave me the thought oh so she doesn't even know if she likes him romantically? Then what's the point if she doesn't even know that? That would also contradict LS White where she straight up says she does see him as a friend but also romantically.

But yeah basically she is saying she wonders what kind of like it is. Is this a crush? Is this something more? She isn't sure the extent of it And overall it feels less sure than straight up saying it's koi or it's ren'ai. And NOW koibito de aru makes perfect sense. Thank you.

Yeah my main point being they set this up so even Aerith is probably not going to be thinking of romance further in part 3.

so what do square want us to take away from that scene then?

 

[Eerie]

To be clear, Aerith's "confession" in the church is extremely vague; in fact we don't know if:

• she realises that she doesn't like him that way, or what kind of feelings she has
• she confesses plain and simple although she just said "I know where we stand" which is a pretty big indicator that Cloud does not feel that way towards her anyway

... which are literally two opposite views where both fit (honestly I had hoped for a little explanation there from the Ultimania but.. yeah).

If you compare this to Tifa's feelings described in ToTP, I think there is a clear distinction between the two girls and their feelings: Tifa is absolutely certain that her feelings are romantic for Cloud and even more what they entail (ie being together, spending time together alone, romantic feelings in general depending on the JP and translations). In comparison, I'd say that Aerith's words are way more vague, they don't have that confidence "yeah I love you"... which I think is a big turn off? So I felt this was most probably done to setup ZA in p3. Because I feel her words reflect her mind, there's this vagueness because she was so sure of loving him but suddenly she's unable to voice those feelings clearly.

 

[Yoru]

so what do square want us to take away from that scene then?

Until we know what these other worlds really are, I'm not sure we can come to any conclusions. Because if we stick to the theory of the Cosmo Canyon NPC, for example, this Aerith may not even be real, but simply a projection of her desires and dreams. So her statement could very well just be her subconscious speaking for her, hence the fact that nothing is really concrete and very vague. All that to say, maybe we shouldn't take it at face value. Aerith's feelings are all over the place, and this may simply be a transcription of those doubts.

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

so what do square want us to take away from that scene then?

That she likes him romantically but it's different from her love from Zack. Because for Cloud she feels koi but with Zack it's re'nai. So basically she isn't sure how deep her feelings go. Basically as I said the entire purpose of this is to use CA's scene to set up Zerith. Which is great for Zerith.
But a bit messed up to me because basically this was supposed to be a farewell scene for CA. It didn't even have to mention her romantic feelings, it could have just been a tearful goodbye and it would have been fine. But it feels like it's used as a tool for set up more than a fulfilling character moment.
Which I still don't think is a payoff because she could have kept this to herself and it would be no difference. Cloud doesn't seem to get what she is talking about anyway and comments on her strange behavior.

But yeah it's very clearly a contrast of her feelings between Cloud and Zack. Koi vs. Re'nai.

Still not a fan of why they couldn't just straight up say that. But it's fine.

Well yeah that was my point all along, no conviction and wishy washy. It doesn't do this usually forthright character any favors. But it still doesn't make any sense literally at all for her to confess but not be sure if she even likes him at ALL romantically here. That would definitely be a contradiction especially with everything set up before to go you know what I was wrong at her farewell scene is very unsatisfying. So because of koi vs renai I'm going with she does like him romantically she is not sure though if goes beyond crush. And she is contrasting that with the renai for Zack. But maybe subconsciously.

 

[Sacky]

Until we know what these other worlds really are, I'm not sure we can come to any conclusions. Because if we stick to the theory of the Cosmo Canyon NPC, for example, this Aerith may not even be real, but simply a projection of her desires and dreams. So her statement could very well just be her subconscious speaking for her, hence the fact that nothing is really concrete and very vague. All that to say, maybe we shouldn't take it at face value. Aerith's feelings are all over the place, and this may simply be a transcription of those doubts.

Problem is that we won't know for 3 plus years It's strange to make this expectation and cruel to clerith fans honestly leaving this ambiguous kinda. I still see it as her being confused but there's still wiggle room and a unexplained difference in dialogue

 

[Yoru]

Problem is that we won't know for 3 plus years It's strange to make this expectation and cruel to clerith fans honestly leaving this ambiguous kinda. I still see it as her being confused but there's still wiggle room and a unexplained difference in dialogue

Well I still think it doesn't matter that much to be honest. I'm not a Clerith sure idk what I'm talking about.

But if the dude only answers to all that is "yeah let's go out again, we're friends" and "huh ? You're so weird" after you said you like him... well.. all have been said. I just have the feeling people get a little too hung up when the discussion is clear. The intensity of Aerith's feelings matters little in this case.

 

[nars305]

Literally it's been alluded to already in Remake in the Tifa's resolution scene. "Words aren't the only way..." is one of SE's favourite quotes, they use it on their gif website lmao. Literally the sex scene will happen because of the hug in Remake. Narratively, it's one thing that puzzled me after Remake in the sense that I didn't think we'd get a CT kiss in p2, however if you begin your p1 with a hug, then amp this with a sex scene in p3, then your p2 has to have a kiss. Most CTs (like probably 99%) thought we'd get a near kiss in p2 (which... we also did yeah). And I really do think it's very possible (99% certain) that we're getting a kiss in the LS scene too in the main scenario so it would make sense to amp it up. SE has only been really aknowledging only the HA HW so I think we're definitely going to get that, in a non optional setting this time around.

I would just be shocked, just the same as I was shocked there was a kiss. I totally understand people believing it will happen.

I think for me it’s trying to understand how they do it out in the open lmao. Maybe the moment will be called IN the Highwind instead.

I’m keeping my expectations low with every thing. At least I’m trying to.

 

[Hellenic]

They won't do that, they were too lazy to make a model that was able to raise its shirt to show a scar XD

I don't necessarily think it was lazyness couse we did get separate models for their flashback selves. I think it's more so that we as players can't confirm if she does in fact have the scar or not, just like how Cloud is being gaslight into thinking it's not there. It's something specifically made for new players i feel, so they can question if Tifa is indeed real or not.

 

[Yoru]

Cloud may be a little dense, but we've seen that when he wants to, he can. When he wants the moment to be romantic, he understands it perfectly.

I may be reading a bit too deep, but for me, the church moment is when Aerith understands that he's not going to reciprocate her feelings. This is where the "Now I know where we stand" comes into place. The date is a bit of a flop compared to Zack's, and he doesn't worry about it like he sometimes can with Tifa. Because he never thougth of this date as something romantic to begin with.

So that's what I think the developers were trying to show. And I think that's why I don't see this moment as something where they didn't dare to go all the way. Or that they left hanging. It's Clerith's end in Re-Trilogy. She has romantic feelings for Cloud but it won't go anywhere because Cloud loves someone else.

 

[LunarTarotGirl]

Problem is that we won't know for 3 plus years It's strange to make this expectation and cruel to clerith fans honestly leaving this ambiguous kinda. I still see it as her being confused but there's still wiggle room and a unexplained difference in dialogue

Exactly my point here. And I don't think it's ambiguous on Cloud's part. But now after years of drumming Aerith loves Cloud, Aerith sees him as koibito, Aerith is fortright they want to suddenly say you know what? You want me to accept she actually isn't sure if it's even a crush? You want to be ambiguous about Aerith's feelings too??

That is such a slap in the face. It's just really disrespectful to Clerith fans but also I'm an Aerith fan first. I wouldn't mind taking out any scenes with CA or calling them just friends. But it's seriously like what in the heck are they doing with this character.

And yeah all these moments are great if it favors your ship. Definitely. But for her character it's just so weird. Especially when this is her farewell scene. Why is her whole arc about this man again to the point it even matters at her final moments?

This man who will be making out with his childhood friend in PT3. They made him the focus of that scene. He is not even listening. He changes the subject. Her resolution warning herself not to fall in love and here she isn't sure. But the point is to set up her relationship with another man and make it clear this one doesn't want her.

Wonderful.

Does anyone else understand how disrespectful this whole handling of this narrative is to Aerith the character if this is their intention?

Because I'm wondering if I'm the only one seeing it.

 

[Yoru]

Exactly my point here. And I don't think it's ambiguous on Cloud's part. But now after years of drumming Aerith loves Cloud, Aerith sees him as koibito, Aerith is fortright they want to suddenly say you know what? You want me to accept she actually isn't sure if it's even a crush? You want to be ambiguous about Aerith's feelings too??

That is such a slap in the face. It's just really disrespectful to Clerith fans but also I'm an Aerith fan first. I wouldn't mind taking out any scenes with CA or calling them just friends. But it's seriously like what in the heck are they doing with this character.

Perhaps you should step into Aerith's shoes for a moment. The girl confesses knowing full well he won't reciprocate. And "that Aerith" knows 100% that she's going to die. I can't blame her for backing off a bit. It's really painful to be rejected. She just wants to enjoy one last moment with him. Like she said on the Water Tower. She doesn't want to "spoil the mood" for selfish reasons. So yes, she says what's on her mind. But she won't go any further because she doesn't have time for that. All she cares about is enjoying the moment.

"Cloud, I love you for what you are. But now shut up, hold me for a moment and thank you for everything."

I really think you're inserting too much of yourselves (Aerith's fans) here. This is her last moment and she's chosen to do it this way. Because she can't really do it any other way. You can't ask for more. It's rude in a way.

 

[Sacky]

Cloud may be a little dense, but we've seen that when he wants to, he can. When he wants the moment to be romantic, he understands it perfectly.

I may be reading a bit too deep, but for me, the church moment is when Aerith understands that he's not going to reciprocate her feelings. This is where the "Now I know where we stand" comes into place. The date is a bit of a flop compared to Zack's, and he doesn't worry about it like he sometimes can with Tifa. Because he never thougth of this date as something romantic to begin with.

So that's what I think the developers were trying to show. And I think that's why I don't see this moment as something where they didn't dare to go all the way. Or that they left hanging. It's Clerith's end in Re-Trilogy. She has romantic feelings for Cloud but it won't go anywhere because Cloud loves someone else.

Exactly my point here. And I don't think it's ambiguous on Cloud's part. But now after years of drumming Aerith loves Cloud, Aerith sees him as koibito, Aerith is fortright they want to suddenly say you know what? You want me to accept she actually isn't sure if it's even a crush? You want to be ambiguous about Aerith's feelings too??

That is such a slap in the face. It's just really disrespectful to Clerith fans but also I'm an Aerith fan first. I wouldn't mind taking out any scenes with CA or calling them just friends. But it's seriously like what in the heck are they doing with this character.

And yeah all these moments are great if it favors your ship. Definitely. But for her character it's just so weird. Especially when this is her farewell scene. Why is her whole arc about this man again to the point it even matters at her final moments?

This man who will be making out with his childhood friend in PT3. They made him the focus of that scene. He is not even listening.

Does anyone understand how disrespectful it is to Aerith the character?

I just wonder why they even tried going with Aerith having feelings now. I get its because of the OG game but maybe we didn't need to keep everything from OG. I felt like they didn't need to take away all of Aerith's future memories and maybe her plot could have been her trying to live normally while also, with her future knowledge, trying to learn more about the cetra? Giving the players more lore about the cetra as we learn it with Aerith. Maybe even if they really wanted showing us more conversations she had with Zack to Tifa that we never got to see in Crisis Core. I just think there's a lot more interesting stuff you could have done with the character?

 

[Sacky]

Perhaps you should step into Aerith's shoes for a moment. The girl confesses knowing full well he won't reciprocate. And "that Aerith" knows 100% that she's going to die. I can't blame her for backing off a bit. It's really painful to be rejected. She just wants to enjoy one last moment with him. Like she said on the Water Tower. She doesn't want to "spoil the mood" for selfish reasons. So yes, she says what's on her mind. But she won't go any further because she doesn't have time for that. All she cares about is enjoying the moment.

"Cloud, I love you for what you are. But now shut up, hold me for a moment and thank you for everything."

I really think you're inserting too much of yourselves (Aerith's fans) here. This is her last moment and she's chosen to do it this way. Because she can't really do it any other way. You can't ask for more. It's rude in a way.

I don't think they are talking about Aerith wanting to do more in the confession. I think they are confused on what Aeriths storyline was actually about having a dream date and once again making her arc around Cloud. Who in Rebirth has shown he isn't interested in a romantic relationship with her but cherishes her. Unfortunately, Aerith who isn't even the same Aerith as the one we were playing with so who knows what people are meant to feel about that? only learns this at the end of the game and didn't give her much to do in the plot until Temple, for some reason? The real issue was that Resolution scene saying don't fall in love with me. That line just comes off as weird and not the same story because for what Rebirth showed me there is no moment where Aerith should think this?