Maiden of the Planet

Makoeyes987 · May 18, 2010

Wow, that's such bullshit.

So let me get this straight. Aerith clearly basing her questioning, fascination, and desire to get to know Cloud, based on her previous feelings for Zack, and her seeing Zack in Cloud, means that she is over Zack, and clearly wasn't that into him? Really?

Even though, in your so called canon novella, the thoughts she had of what she liked about Cloud somehow magically made Zack poof out of the green ether?

Because in Quexinos-lands, spontaneously talking about your ex twelve hours into meeting a new guy you're supposed to have romantic feelings for is totally normal and indicative of being ready to move on from the past relationship. And she never got to know the real Cloud. Not before getting brutally murdered on her knees, at least.

You keep hanging at the pink place, and you're gonna get dyed their color too. Christ.

And Lifestream White and Black were BOTH all about the Cloud, which is because both of their plans and decisions were focused around Cloud. No fucking shit. All Aerith is thinking about is Cloud because Sephiroth is thinking about Cloud and to ruin his life.

Dashell · May 18, 2010

So let me get this straight. Aerith clearly basing her questioning, fascination, and desire to get to know Cloud, based on her previous feelings for Zack, and her seeing Zack in Cloud, means that she is over Zack, and clearly wasn't that into him? Really?

Since when it is NOT normal to fall for a guy who's like the last guy you dated? You usually go for a certain type. That IS normal believe it or not.

Even though, in your so called canon novella, the thoughts she had of what she liked about Cloud somehow magically made Zack poof out of the green ether?

See above.

Because in Quexinos-lands, spontaneously talking about your ex twelve hours into meeting a new guy you're supposed to have romantic feelings for is totally normal and indicative of being ready to move on from the past relationship.

Idk, I guess I never thought discussion about exes was all that abnormal. This is the first place I've heard that can only mean you're OBSESSED!

You keep hanging at the pink place, and you're gonna get dyed their color too. Christ.

STOP
DOING
THIS!

I have always felt this way. My interrelation with CxA has no bearing on my feelings about Maiden or how Aerith felt about Cloud whatsoever.

okay? :awesome:

Max Caulfield · May 18, 2010

One of the things that disappointed me so much about Maiden was the lack of Aerith and Zack interaction. The writer had such an opportunity to address their relationship, but instead, practically ignored Zack.

Dashell · May 18, 2010

It's not like Zack hasn't gotten his time to shine in the Compilation

Makoeyes987 · May 18, 2010

Quexinos said:
Since when it is NOT normal to fall for a guy who's like the last guy you dated? You usually go for a certain type. That IS normal believe it or not.

Zack isn't a "type." He is an individual. Cloud mimicking Zack isn't Cloud being a generic type of man or personality. That's Cloud BEING ZACK FAIR.

Idk, I guess I never thought discussion about exes was all that abnormal. This is the first place I've heard that can only mean you're OBSESSED!

It's only abnormal when people like you don't want to accept the written fact that Aerith was not over her previous love of Zack and based her original interest in Cloud because Cloud WAS ZACK. She never knew the real Cloud in life. If you start quoting that twisted up translation from the FFVII UO, I swear to Christ.

STOP
DOING
THIS!

I have always felt this way. My interrelation with CxA has no bearing on my feelings about Maiden or how Aerith felt about Cloud whatsoever.

okay?

Whatever you say chief. Good that you're admitting to being wrong from jump street then.

null · May 18, 2010

Winter said:
I love how everyone calls Aerith OOC in Maiden then eats up her shitty character in Crisis Core.

I FUCKING HATE CRISIS CORE and Aerith hasn't been anywhere near in-character since Kingdom fucking Hearts, and I don't know why you all pretend to care either way. Just admit that you're asspained she isn't eating Zack's dick in the afterlife.

The compilation as a whole sucks ass, and I am rather fond of Maiden just because for once Square Enix threw me a bone. Maiden isn't BREATHTAKINGLY AMAZING by any means, but I am far more interested in it than 80% of the retconning, shitty, forced-new-character-filled Compilation.

God forbid anyone try to fill in the plotholes the size of Texas that SE seems to leave all over the place.

Sorry for the rage, it's just... you all piss and moan about how much Maiden sucks and invalidates FFVII, when the Compilation is just as bad if not worse. Like the fucking Nero/Weiss storyline was SO MUCH BETTER than giving us some insight into the Lifestream and the Cetra.

OFF TOPIC:

You realize this is exactly what the C/A shippers that you hate so much say? I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just pointing out that you can't get mad at me for thinking C/T secks under the Highwind is retarded when that about sums up how I feel about the matter.

You're right, this site is getting a reputation for being completely uncritical of the Compilation. We really ought to check our unbridled enthusiasm for all things not Maiden.

Max Caulfield · May 18, 2010

Quexinos said:
It's not like Zack hasn't gotten his time to shine in the Compilation

I know.

Aerith kind of just treats him like a stranger, though. Like, there were no lingering feelings towards him, no "I missed him so much after he disappeared", nothing. Just kind of, "Yeah, I liked Cloud more than I liked Zack."

Dashell · May 18, 2010

It's only abnormal when people like you don't want to accept the written fact that Aerith was not over her previous love of Zack and based her original interest in Cloud because Cloud WAS ZACK. She never knew the real Cloud in life. If you start quoting that twisted up translation from the FFVII UO, I swear to Christ.

IT WAS A DIM CRUSH :awesome:

Makoeyes987 · May 18, 2010

Quexinos said:
IT WAS A DIM CRUSH

Fairheartstrife · May 18, 2010

Quexinos said:
By the way some people talk about how obsessed she was, I totally expect this of her. Speaking of:

And? She recognizes the signs of SOLDIER, lots of people do. This doesn't prove she's obsessed with Zack.

No, she noticed his EYES specifically--immediately after he deja-vu'd through the ceiling of the church. She knows the signs of SOLDIER, yes, but she comments on them, why? Oh, yes, because she was REMINDED of ZACK. This isn't a passing comment, Quex, and you playing it off as such is making me seriously doubt your comprehension skills...

lulz, okay. put yourself in Aerith's shoes. What if you had a husband who died in a war? Then you meet a new guy from the Army, wouldn't you ALSO ask what rank he is or whatever?

Wait, wait...DIM CRUSH Zack is her dead husband in this analogy? MAke up your fucking mind. Either he meant a SIGNIFICANT amount to her and therefore she is attracted to that personality, or he was a first crush and Cloud's huge sword catches her eye--oh, wait, THAT'S ZACK'S TOO. **eyeroll**

I've been really super-duper-in-love-would-dunno-if-I-can-make-it-without-this-person before. And let me tell you, any time one of my friends does something that reminds me of her, I say so. or if I find out they're from the same fandom as she was, I ask if they know her. Does this mean I'm obsessed?

A little, yeah.

She's admitting she saw Zack in him. Unhealthy would be if she didn't admit it and continued to deny it.

UNHEALTHY is stalking a guy across sectors and demanding to accompany him SOLELY based on the fact that he reminds you of your EX. NO, that is NOT normal/healthy no matter how you spin her recognizing this little insanity later.

If you ask me, it's extremely healthy that she realizes this before it went too far.

Define too far? Before she interfered in the guy's life? Mission? potential relationship? Before she strong armed a date? Before she meets the Ex's parents and plays dumb? HOW FAR is TOO FAR for you? Aerith was NOT right in the head and her emotional--huge emotional fucked-upness--is probably her saving grace as a mary sue character, so I'd be embracing it and not making Materia Jesus a rock of Psychological stabilty when CLEARLY she wasn't.. EVEN BEFORE CC. Fuck.

She ALSO said she wanted to get to know Cloud for Cloud.

AFTER she realized that she was chasing Zack's cock via emulation.

She ALSO still loved Cloud after she got to know the real him. She also says Cloud is her beloved and there's not a hint of Zack in CoLW. For someone who was obsessed, you'd think she'd have thought about him at least ONCE in the novel. But she did not. It was all about teh Cloud.

Stop fucking trolling. You know better.

After CC sure, but not before then.

Uh-huh...so you DID play a different version of the game.

How's the weather in your world?

Max Caulfield · May 18, 2010

Quexinos said:
IT WAS A DIM CRUSH

I had a crush on a guy when I was younger, but nothing came out of it. And you know what? After a little while, I barely thought about him anymore. There weren't any lasting feelings for him.

On the other hand, I really, really, reallly like this other guy a couple years ago. I moved away from him, and never saw him again. I still think about him sometimes and have feelings for him.

You don't write to a guy for four years after he disappears, if it's a "dim" crush.

Strangelove · May 18, 2010

I had a crush on a guy when I was younger.

It broke my heart and left me the bitter shell of a person I am today.

Dashell · May 18, 2010

No, she noticed his EYES specifically--immediately after he deja-vu'd through the ceiling of the church.

Yeah thanks to CC aka Retcon City. It used to be that she met him while selling flowers.

She knows the signs of SOLDIER, yes, but she comments on them, why? Oh, yes, because she was REMINDED of ZACK. This isn't a passing comment, Quex, and you playing it off as such is making me seriously doubt your comprehension skills...

oh rly, cause several other people say it to Cloud in the game. It's a passing comment to everyone else but Aerith, okay then.

Wait, wait...DIM CRUSH Zack is her dead husband in this analogy? MAke up your fucking mind. Either he meant a SIGNIFICANT amount to her and therefore she is attracted to that personality, or he was a first crush and Cloud's huge sword catches her eye--oh, wait, THAT'S ZACK'S TOO. **eyeroll**

I'm not by any means saying that Aerith didn't love Zack at all. That's obvious that she did. I'm saying that by any means. He DID mean a lot to her but I never got that in the game she was obsessed with Zack. The only time I felt this was when CC came out and again, retconed everything.

UNHEALTHY is stalking a guy across sectors and demanding to accompany him SOLELY based on the fact that he reminds you of your EX. NO, that is NOT normal/healthy no matter how you spin her recognizing this little insanity later.

Maybe I'm remembering wrong but I hardly remember her doing exactly that. IIRC Cloud didn't want her to come along because it was dangerous. But maybe I'll play that part again.

Define too far? Before she interfered in the guy's life?

Uhm, no again, he jumped in front of HER to save her AND escorted her home.

potential relationship?

lol

Before she strong armed a date?

Come on, you don't let the Cleriths get away with this forced promise crap, don't you start.

Before she meets the Ex's parents and plays dumb?

... wha? I remember her running out and crying. How is that playing dumb?

erith was NOT right in the head and her emotional--huge emotional fucked-upness--is probably her saving grace as a mary sue character, so I'd be embracing it and not making Materia Jesus a rock of Psychological stabilty when CLEARLY she wasn't.. EVEN BEFORE CC. Fuck.

BECAUSE I TOTALLY SAID THAT AERITH WAS A ROCK OF PSYCHOLOGICAL STABILITY! OMG

Look it's obvious she cares for Zack a great deal. I won't deny that, I'm just saying she seems to love Cloud more. And at the time FFVII came along, at the very least she was GETTING over Zack.

AFTER she realized that she was chasing Zack's cock via emulation.

lol

Stop fucking trolling. You know better.

Moi? Troll? When have I ever?

Uh-huh...so you DID play a different version of the game.

How's the weather in your world?

Not as hot as I'd like it to be. I can still wear pants and only be a little hot.

also lol at everyone thinking I was being serious about dim crush... I don't even know what quote Mako was talking about XD

Fairheartstrife · May 18, 2010

Quexinos said:
Yeah thanks to CC aka Retcon City. It used to be that she met him while selling flowers.

AGAIN--she met CLOUD the EXACT same WAY, so...null and void on that attempt at deflection.

oh rly, cause several other people say it to Cloud in the game. It's a passing comment to everyone else but Aerith, okay then.

You're a fan of analogies, so, let's assume my steady was a musician, played guitar--disappeared. I meet sexy guy holding a guitar a few years later. Attracted? Yes. Comment on "so you play?" yes. Same significance as random guy: "Dude, you play guitar?" NO. Context, it is your friend. :awesome:

I'm not by any means saying that Aerith didn't love Zack at all. That's obvious that she did. I'm saying that by any means. He DID mean a lot to her but I never got that in the game she was obsessed with Zack.

First, this isn't about whether Aerith loved Zack. It is about Maiden being an ass-rape of character, and her interaction with Zack being one of the non-lube moments. You are the one that asserted her in-game character persona showed no indications (in the original) of being hung up on Zack, and I provided (as well as others) examples that prove, yes, she was. And yes, it showed, and NO compilation didn't fuck that up--it was ALWAYS there.

The only time I felt this was when CC came out and again, retconed everything.

Where in CC does it show her obsessed? The letters? 89 in 4 years, so twice a months she jotted a note and gave it to the Turks--who probably assured her that Zack would get it... Yeah... ok, that's a bit much, but given the nature of his career, her isolation, and the fact that Zack was her only real friend/love, I'd say a person would hold onto that. Rather tightly. But hey, if you're more comfortable with her being all: "Zack who?" SOLDIER slut that wants the first big sword she spies, then by all means, have her your way.

Maybe I'm remembering wrong but I hardly remember her doing exactly that. IIRC Cloud didn't want her to come along because it was dangerous. But maybe I'll play that part again.

Not just about the sector 6 stalking. She asks a man she knows for 1/2 a second to be her bodyguard. She refuses to budge and makes him fight, and THEN decides to run up the rafters, and THEN takes him to her house, and when he tries to leave, she shunpos her ass to the sector six entrance and stops him. Cloud has the option of mentioning Tifa as a girlfriend--and Aerith will STILL do these things... yes, she inserts herself.

Uhm, no again, he jumped in front of HER to save her AND escorted her home.

WHAT?

here, refresh your memory:

Aerith
"Don't fight here! You'll ruin the flowers!"

(Cloud and Aerith run to the back of the church.)

Aerith
"The exit is back there."

....

Cloud
"I know... Looks like they aren't
going to let us go."

Aerith
"What should we do?"

Cloud
"Well we can't let them catch us,
can we? Then, there's only one thing left."

(He jumps across the gap and motions for Aerith to follow.)

Cloud
"Aerith! This way!"

(She shakes her head.)

Cloud
"All right. I'll hold them off."

Aerith
"Right. Make sure they don't get through!"

WHEN does he leap in front of her? She MAKES him fight, because she won't climb the fucking rafters that she then climbs 2 minutes later... **sigh**

Come on, you don't let the Cleriths get away with this forced promise crap, don't you start.

First off, I never said the promise wasn't strong armed. It meant a lot to Cloud though, and he kept it in his heart. the DATE is not the same. You can not change WHO he makes the promise to.

And she PHYSICALLY shoves him out the door. That is strong arming.

... wha? I remember her running out and crying. How is that playing dumb?

They ask her if she's the girlfriend and she plays dumb. And then, she gets all weepy and wants CLOUD to be jealous. Girl has ISSUES.

BECAUSE I TOTALLY SAID THAT AERITH WAS A ROCK OF PSYCHOLOGICAL STABILITY! OMG

You implied she was rather rational and steady and secure in her feelings/thoughts/love interest, so yeah, by implication, you sure as shit did.

Look it's obvious she cares for Zack a great deal. I won't deny that, I'm just saying she seems to love Cloud more. And at the time FFVII came along, at the very least she was GETTING over Zack.

This isn't about who she loves MORE, (although you are completely WRONG) but it is about how MAIDEN is not a good or even accurate representation of Aerith. Her interaction with ZACK is one example of that.

Moi? Troll? When have I ever?

Right now.

Celes Chere · May 18, 2010

Yeah, you know I think the creators created an ENTIRE story and showed Zack and Aerith deeply in love for no reason. Wearing pink, a ribbon, even selling flowers - they tied it all to Zack OBVIOUSLY because they're just really, really great pals. Yes... because Aerith loved Cloud more, they decided to make CC to show us that Zack would always be by her side as a really good friend. Derp, that makes sense!

I mean it's so brotherly how Zack goes back to Midgar just to see her again. And it's so Motherly how Aerith walks out of the church with Zack in ACC. It's so clear.

I guess they just felt like making Crisis Core to waste time, and for it to mean absolutely nothing. Especially since it debunks the fuck out of anything 'Clerith' in Maiden. Hrrm.

Edit: Also, Zack's character is pointless. They show him interacting and being close to Aerith because... they just feel like it. It's not like they're in love or anything.

Dashell · May 18, 2010

AGAIN--she met CLOUD the EXACT same WAY, so...null and void on that attempt at deflection.

My point was that it was a retcon, that's all.

You're a fan of analogies

Wha?

so, let's assume my steady was a musician, played guitar--disappeared. I meet sexy guy holding a guitar a few years later. Attracted? Yes. Comment on "so you play?" yes. Same significance as random guy: "Dude, you play guitar?" NO. Context, it is your friend

I'm not following this. Are you saying that Cloud is the random guy? Because I think he's the first example with the mako eyes and the SOLDIER Uniform.

First, this isn't about whether Aerith loved Zack. It is about Maiden being an ass-rape of character, and her interaction with Zack being one of the non-lube moments. You are the one that asserted her in-game character persona showed no indications (in the original) of being hung up on Zack, and I provided (as well as others) examples that prove, yes, she was. And yes, it showed, and NO compilation didn't fuck that up--it was ALWAYS there.

You know what's funny about Maiden, is this Benny guy apparently saw the same thing I did. That Aerith loved Cloud more than Zack. And for at least a brief period of time, people thought this was canon. It wasn't until later in the Compilation when they wrote all this stuff about Zack giving her the ribbon and her wearing pink for him and blah blah. So yes, that did get retconed.

Where in CC does it show her obsessed? The letters? 89 in 4 years, so twice a months she jotted a note and gave it to the Turks--who probably assured her that Zack would get it... Yeah... ok, that's a bit much, but given the nature of his career, her isolation, and the fact that Zack was her only real friend/love, I'd say a person would hold onto that. Rather tightly. But hey, if you're more comfortable with her being all: "Zack who?" SOLDIER slut that wants the first big sword she spies, then by all means, have her your way.

I'm sorry but 89 letters IS a bit much. I mean holy shit, WHO DOES THAT? What do you even write about? I'd have been fine with like 20 letters or something, but 89? Holy shit.

And I love how it can only be "SHE WAS OBSESSED" or "SHE FORGETS ALL ABOUT HIM!" Love how I can't be in the middle.

Not just about the sector 6 stalking. She asks a man she knows for 1/2 a second to be her bodyguard. She refuses to budge and makes him fight, and THEN decides to run up the rafters, and THEN takes him to her house, and when he tries to leave, she shunpos her ass to the sector six entrance and stops him. Cloud has the option of mentioning Tifa as a girlfriend--and Aerith will STILL do these things... yes, she inserts herself.

..
shunpos?

WHAT?

WHEN does he leap in front of her? She MAKES him fight, because she won't climb the fucking rafters that she then climbs 2 minutes later... **sigh**

When Reno first enters the scene Cloud tries to intercept him before he gets to Aerith.

Aerith: Blah blah be my bodyguard for a date
*Cloud looks at Reno... and walks toward him to tell him to GTFO*

Okay it's not LEAPING in front of her but he was ready to protect her.

First off, I never said the promise wasn't strong armed. It meant a lot to Cloud though, and he kept it in his heart. the DATE is not the same. You can not change WHO he makes the promise to.

And she PHYSICALLY shoves him out the door. That is strong arming.

Well of course the promise meant a lot to Cloud. That's obvious.

As for the other thing you said, I'm going to use your logic:
What should he have done? Punched her in the face and said no?

They ask her if she's the girlfriend and she plays dumb. And then, she gets all weepy and wants CLOUD to be jealous. Girl has ISSUES.

really? I do not remember the playing of the dumb. I'll have to see that again.

You implied she was rather rational and steady and secure in her feelings/thoughts/love interest, so yeah, by implication, you sure as shit did.

There's a different between someone being rational and being a ROCK of stability.

This isn't about who she loves MORE, (although you are completely WRONG) but it is about how MAIDEN is not a good or even accurate representation of Aerith. Her interaction with ZACK is one example of that.

Shit is that what this is about? I Couldn't even remember

Celes said:
stuff

And I'm ignoring all of this because you clearly aren't talking to me because I never said anything like this.

Right now.

No I'm not trolling now.

Zee · May 18, 2010

My god what is this thread

Admittedly I only scanned past page 2 buuut my two cents: Maiden isn't a bad read. Some of the awkward writing like the infamous "cracked egg heart" doesn't bug me that much because in translating some stuff just doesn't transition well. I wish I could recall the line off the top of my head, but in reading the FF13 Light Novel there was a line (or two) like that as well.

Aeris isn't horrible out of character in Maiden, either. Not if you followed her character development. She's still the same stubborn, lonely, yet forgiving girl we saw in FF7, and I liked that each of the interactions we get to see all these aspects of her personality. If the biggest issue (which, it seems to be for many people) is how she is portrayed with Zack, well, sorry to say, that's really your problem! She's friendly, teasing, but still focused on Cloud and saving the planet at hand. Besides, she hasn't seen Zack in years -- she's grown up without him. Awkwardness would ensue, especially with all that's happened since he's been gone. I don't get why people would assume they'd derail. They're both uh dead. DEAL WITH IT LOL

Oh, and a note about Crisis Core: AERIS' CHARACTERIZATION SUCKED BALLS and I will explain to you why. It's not because of "character development". It's called, actually, inconsistent character writing. And I'm an expert on this because I sat through three and a half seasons of Heroes, so I know what the fuck I'm talking about, okay?

Aeris is seven years old and a talkative, stubborn child who has enough balls to tell the men in black to piss off. She's 22 and running around trolling Cloud, flipping verbal middle fingers to people she doesn't like, running around wherever she pleases. But. Somehow. At 17 she is a fucking retard who falls over Zack like a brainless schoolgirl.

"Oh! Whatever shall I do...is that what you want me to say!"
"I'm not a Cetra, I'm not! -spits raspberries, runs upstairs-"

....

"Oh Zack, I feel so safe with you."

What the fuck. I always thought Zack and Aeris' relationship was special was that, knowing Aeris, she didn't take any guy's crap and Zack, used to having girls want him, would be intrigued by her. But nothing that makes Aeris so compelling, that would make her compelling to Zack, is present in her character in Crisis Core. She's an airhead that giggles and is practically living up to the Mary Sue stereotype she was ripping a new one in FF7.

why the fuck did this post get so long

Fairheartstrife · May 18, 2010

Quexinos said:
My point was that it was a retcon, that's all.

Wha?

I'm not following this. Are you saying that Cloud is the random guy? Because I think he's the first example with the mako eyes and the SOLDIER Uniform.

**facepalm** Seriously? It's a REALLY simple analogy... And no, random guy is RANDOM guy; as in OTHER people noticed Cloud's eyes, but their interest in them wouldn't be the same as an ex... you know what, forget it. If I have to spoon feed you the context, then it's a lost cause.

You know what's funny about Maiden, is this Benny guy apparently saw the same thing I did. That Aerith loved Cloud more than Zack. And for at least a brief period of time, people thought this was canon. It wasn't until later in the Compilation when they wrote all this stuff about Zack giving her the ribbon and her wearing pink for him and blah blah. So yes, that did get retconed.

And your version of her makes her a fucking shallow whore. Not kidding. I HATE this Aerith because she's as deep as spit and less clean. Keep her, if you want. She loved a guy she knew for 2 weeks--and actually only realized she did NOT know him close to her death--MORE than the GENUINE fucking relationship she had... Ok. Look,self inserting mary sue shit aside, that is a completely bogus portrayal of ANY character.

I'm sorry but 89 letters IS a bit much. I mean holy shit, WHO DOES THAT? What do you even write about? I'd have been fine with like 20 letters or something, but 89? Holy shit.

I'm sorry but LOVE is a bit much. I mean holy shit, WHO DOE STHAT? She knew the guy for 2 weeks and he wasn't even himself! I'd be fine with like a mild crush, or something, but True Love? Holy shit. :awesome:

And I love how it can only be "SHE WAS OBSESSED" or "SHE FORGETS ALL ABOUT HIM!" Love how I can't be in the middle.

Please point out where I said this. Or STFU.

..
shunpos?

Bleach reference.

When Reno first enters the scene Cloud tries to intercept him before he gets to Aerith.

Aerith: Blah blah be my bodyguard for a date
*Cloud looks at Reno... and walks toward him to tell him to GTFO*

Okay it's not LEAPING in front of her but he was ready to protect her.

WHAT SHOULD HE HAVE DONE? HE JUST AGREED TO PROTECT HER. I NEVER SAID HE NEVER AGREED TO BE HER BODY GUARD, WHERE THE FUCK ARE YOU GETTING THAT? HE NEVER AGREED TO THE DATE! Am I clear on this? Cloud protecting her is NOT relevant. HE did NOT do it out of LOVE, where as she used the EXACT SAME FUCKING LINE THAT ZACK USED ON HER. You have NO IDEA if Nojima had always had that scenario. He had a much bigger picture of Zack than was put into the game...but again, beside the point.

Well of course the promise meant a lot to Cloud. That's obvious.

Well, duh.

As for the other thing you said, I'm going to use your logic:
What should he have done? Punched her in the face and said no?

You aren't even in the ballpark of my logic, here. It is not up to Cloud to refuse, the fact is HE didn't initiate the date, she STRONG-ARMED him. His acceptance does nothing to change that. WTF are you on tonight?

really? I do not remember the playing of the dumb. I'll have to see that again.

Please do.

There's a different between someone being rational and being a ROCK of stability.

There's a difference between attraction and soul-bonding love.

Shit is that what this is about? I Couldn't even remember

obviously.

No I'm not trolling now.

then I am sad for you.

Max Caulfield · May 18, 2010

Okay, concerning the characterization differences between CC and Maiden:

Isn't it possible that Aerith changed between CC and FFVII? Maybe in the beginning she was a young, blushing schoolgirl who grew up after the man she loved left her and never came back. Also, in CC, Zack and Aerith's relationship seemed to progress pretty slowly, so when Cloud fell through the roof of her church, maybe she saw it as a second chance and wanted to grab him while she still could.

But, this is a lot of assumption and interpretation on my part, so I might be (and probably am) completely wrong.

Zee · May 18, 2010

Chi said:
Okay, concerning the characterization differences between CC and Maiden:

Isn't it possible that Aerith changed between CC and FFVII? Maybe in the beginning she was a young, blushing schoolgirl who grew up after the man she loved left her and never came back. Also, in CC, Zack and Aerith's relationship seemed to progress pretty slowly, so when Cloud fell through the roof of her church, maybe she saw it as a second chance and wanted to grab him while she still could.

But, this is a lot of assumption and interpretation on my part, so I might be (and probably am) completely wrong.

imo it doesn't make sense with what we've been told about her. She's a streetwise girl who knows how people perceive her and takes advantage of them because she's poor and desperate. I got none of that from her in CC.

Fairheartstrife · May 18, 2010

Zee said:
imo it doesn't make sense with what we've been told about her. She's a streetwise girl who knows how people perceive her and takes advantage of them because she's poor and desperate. I got none of that from her in CC.

I'm not really arguing that CC was a great portrayal of her character (although it is canon) so much as Maiden wasn't any more accurate, IMO. The Zack thing irks, but the whole story was really a smeared glimpse at the character. First, Maiden's existence wipes out the impact of Aerith's death.

She was no longer gone, but, oh, just over here, hanging out with the dead and the desolate... lah lah...

It trivialized an epic moment in the game.

It's just not well done, IMO.

Max Caulfield · May 18, 2010

Zee said:
imo it doesn't make sense with what we've been told about her. She's a streetwise girl who knows how people perceive her and takes advantage of them because she's poor and desperate. I got none of that from her in CC.

Alright, I agree that she was a little bit too sweet and giggly to be Aerith. But, I also think that we didn't get to see enough of her in different circumstances to really see what she was like.

Also, I think that Zack might have rubbed off on her and made her change. In FFVII, she flirts like Zack flirted in CC (as in saying she'll take Cloud a date in payment for him being her bodyguard).

But, I do agree that in CC, she is a bit too sweet and docile.

Dashell · May 18, 2010

**facepalm** Seriously? It's a REALLY simple analogy... And no, random guy is RANDOM guy; as in OTHER people noticed Cloud's eyes, but their interest in them wouldn't be the same as an ex... you know what, forget it. If I have to spoon feed you the context, then it's a lost cause.

OOH I thought you meant you were talking to random guy and asking him if he played guitar after you talked to the sexy guy. Anywho, I mean really, if you have a BF and you break up, and then you find another BF who does or has something that your old BF did, don't you say "Oh you do that too?" or something? I mean Jesus Christ I CAN'T be the only one.

And your version of her makes her a fucking shallow whore. Not kidding. I HATE this Aerith because she's as deep as spit and less clean. Keep her, if you want. She loved a guy she knew for 2 weeks--and actually only realized she did NOT know him close to her death--MORE than the GENUINE fucking relationship she had... Ok. Look,self inserting mary sue shit aside, that is a completely bogus portrayal of ANY character.

She hadn't seen Zack in years. It hardly makes her shallow to fall for someone else. Is she honestly supposed to just cling to Zack forever even though it's been years? Really now...

I'm sorry but LOVE is a bit much. I mean holy shit, WHO DOE STHAT? She knew the guy for 2 weeks and he wasn't even himself! I'd be fine with like a mild crush, or something, but True Love? Holy shit.

I see what you did there.

Please point out where I said this. Or STFU.

It's everyone.

I don't see why when I say she loves Cloud it's all "NU SHE LUVED ZACK ONLY ZACK AND ZACK ZACK ZACK ZACK ZACK ZACK ZACK ZACK!!!"

Why the hell can't she love both?

WHAT SHOULD HE HAVE DONE? HE JUST AGREED TO PROTECT HER. I NEVER SAID HE NEVER AGREED TO BE HER BODY GUARD, WHERE THE FUCK ARE YOU GETTING THAT? HE NEVER AGREED TO THE DATE!

By being her bodyguard he accepted her one date offer so no u.
And EVERYONE Has to push Cloud out the door to get him to go on the date. He's Cloud, he's awkward, he doesn't know WTF he's doing.

Am I clear on this? Cloud protecting her is NOT relevant HE did NOT do it out of LOVE, where as she used the EXACT SAME FUCKING LINE THAT ZACK USED ON HER. You have NO IDEA if Nojima had always had that scenario. He had a much bigger picture of Zack than was put into the game...but again, beside the point.

If Nojima was planning it, he had an odd way of showing it publishing things that said that Aerith met Zack while selling flowers and so on. Plus it's an odd way to show that Aerith got the ribbon for Zack when early screens showed her wearing it while meeting Zack. Nojima sure has an odd way of showing these things.

As for the bodyguard thing, he even says it at one point, "I'm your bodyguard, right?" This obviously was somewhat important to him or he'd never bring it up again .

You aren't even in the ballpark of my logic, here. It is not up to Cloud to refuse, the fact is HE didn't initiate the date, she STRONG-ARMED him. His acceptance does nothing to change that. WTF are you on tonight?

First off I was using the "What was he supposed to do?" excuse. Second...

Tifa was the one who said, "Cloud words aren't the only way you can tell someone how you're feeling." Thus she initiated the what not that happened that night. It's not up to Cloud to refuse, he didn't initiate it. He's acceptance does nothing.

then I am sad for you.

I didn't say i wasn't having fun :awesome:

Zee · May 18, 2010

First, Maiden's existence wipes out the impact of Aerith's death.

She was no longer gone, but, oh, just over here, hanging out with the dead and the desolate... lah lah...

It trivialized an epic moment in the game.

I agree the concept of losing someone is somewhat dampened by her further inclusion in the compilation, but this was actually an aspect we knew about beforehand. It was established in game that the Cetra would hold on to their "selves" longer than normal humans, and I know even prior to the compilation people already assumed she had a hand in the Lifestream event.

Dashell · May 18, 2010

It is not up to Cloud to refuse, the fact is HE didn't initiate the date, she STRONG-ARMED him. His acceptance does nothing to change that. WTF are you on tonight?

Case of Lifestream white... just saying

Also we see her in the end so lol what?

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