SPOILERS FFVII:R Chapter 10 Spoiler Discussion
- Thread starter Lex
- Start date
Misterbadguy
Phantom Lord
- AKA
- METEODRIVE
The combat got pretty challenging for me in this chapter at a few points - Aps was formidable enough, but the jump attack the Sahagins use screwed me over quite a bit. Got a bit easier after realising that Amplify really does just work exactly like All did and pairs with party magic, so I had Aerith casting Barrier on everyone.
Kinda uneventful chapter but lots of nice character chatter. Very curious about some of the moments with Aerith too, like her line about the future not being set in stone.
Kinda uneventful chapter but lots of nice character chatter. Very curious about some of the moments with Aerith too, like her line about the future not being set in stone.
Last edited:
Tetsujin
he/they
- AKA
- Tets
Oh I just remembered.
Before the Abzu fight, both Aerith and Tifa are on the floor unconscious. The way they are positioned in equal distance from you and each other...I see what you're up to, Square Enix.
It's an LTD CHOICE MOMENT™
This was a sneaky one. I noticed it and pondered for a while who I'm gonna wake up first.
I wonder if this has any consequence or whether it counts towards an affection point system. I don't think there is much that can come out of it in this part but if they do have some sort of save game carryover in the next part, it might matter.
(I ended up tossing a coin, Tifa won btw)
Before the Abzu fight, both Aerith and Tifa are on the floor unconscious. The way they are positioned in equal distance from you and each other...I see what you're up to, Square Enix.
It's an LTD CHOICE MOMENT™
This was a sneaky one. I noticed it and pondered for a while who I'm gonna wake up first.
I wonder if this has any consequence or whether it counts towards an affection point system. I don't think there is much that can come out of it in this part but if they do have some sort of save game carryover in the next part, it might matter.
(I ended up tossing a coin, Tifa won btw)
Elisa Maza
Whomst
If you wake up Tifa first, she asks Cloud if there's something more between him and Aerith. If you wake up Aerith first, she just says that you need to leave.
LTD lives.
LTD lives.
pollenainne
Pro Adventurer
It does.
You get a scene with either Tifa or Aerith on the flower garden depending on affection points I think. I still am not sure about everything that counts towards it, or the wrong or right choices that gives a corresponding point. I woke up Tifa first btw simply because I wanted to know what she would say and I didn't think it mattered at the time (yeah I like Aerith more) but I got Aerith at the flower garden. I was trying to gain affection for both (again I didn't really think it mattered at this point). I am really curious about it now...
Last edited:
pollenainne
Pro Adventurer
lol. If you are wondering about the consequences of an LTD choice then of course it will be a spoiler. But maybe someone will click it. lol!
Alex Strife
Ex-SOLDIER
In all fairness, he was wondering, rather than asking others. 
cold_spirit
he/him
- AKA
- Alex T
I'm keeping a log of my thoughts after each chapter. Here's Chapter 10!
- I'm glad the decision of who to help up first upon landing in the sewers was kept. In the original Aerith was closer, but now they're dead even
- Interesting that Abzu lives. Wonder when we'll see it again? In the coliseum or a future part?
- Tifa asks Aerith "What aren't you telling me?" I'm guessing Aerith is burdened from already receiving a vision of Sector 7's destruction via the Guardians. This, along with her unsurprised reaction to Cloud's earlier comment that Sephiroth is alive, has me mighty curious
- It was fun to see how Tifa and Aerith play off each other, such as teasing Cloud or the pump minigame. They're less like rivals and more like budding friends. Since these two probably won't have much downtime together, it's important their dynamic is established wherever possible
- Also that pump minigame is ridiculous
Last edited:
Erotic Materia
[CONFUSED SCREAMING]
Ok, I was really excited to use the binding materia, and I've noticed that "sleep" is effectively useless. Even if you do send an enemy to beddy-bye, your other members keep attacking it, waking it up almost immediately.
Like, come on guys. What the eff.
Like, come on guys. What the eff.
Shademp
420
- Used Sleep on Abzu and it was super-effective. None of the characters woke up Abzu with an attack so I was able to just wait and let the ATB build while Abzu was snoozing. This is quite in contrast to battles against normal enemies where, like Erotic Materia mentioned, your party members keep waking up the enemy unless you actively switch to interrupt your characters. Would definitely like an "keep AI passive" setting or some such, or make player character AI the same in normal battles the way it seems to be in boss battles.
- I hope that these Wutai-style gates, found both here and in the Sector 5 slums scrapyard are part of optional content later on. Or maybe one of the gates is mandatory and the other one isn't?
- Months ago when I first saw the Abzu battle, I got vibes similar to when the Fellowship fights the cave troll in the first Lord of the Rings. This uneasy empathy for the creature. In the case of Abzu I think it's because some of its animations appear more playful than aggressive and because the heightened realism makes you feel that you are killing an intelligent creature. Similarly there is added discomfort with killing the Sahagins (more than I already felt with them) since the Enemy Intel now specifies that the Sahagins have their own language. But Abzu is far cuter than the Sahagins, so...
I figured that the developers might be intentionally trying to channel this empathic energy and so I speculated that, perhaps, in FFVIIR Abzu would not die. Turns out I was right. At least for now. I also feel better from the fight since I never destroyed either of Abzu's horns, so he/she/it got to leave pretty gosh darn intact all things considered. But who knows. Maybe they'll change it this time and have Don Corneo kill Abzu out of frustration.
- First started the chapter by talking to Aerith, then restarted and spoke to Tifa instead. Observed that, apart from the already mentioned difference that Tifa has a ton of dialogue while waking up Aerith is dull in comparison, the camera angles when Abzu appears also change depending on which one of the girls you approached.
- "It's an antique - older than the mako reactors even. It'll be a miracle if it still works." I appreciate this lore nugget about infrastructure present from before the reactors were built.
- The atmosphere when you entered the darkly lit patch of the sewers was amazing. The music, the limited lighting and the overall creep-factor of the place was perfect. You were expecting a jump-scare at any moment...and it never happened. I love it when you are expecting a jump-scare and it never happens.
- On the same topic, I greatly enjoy how this sewer level looked. But you have to turn your brain off when it comes to the level design. Are you telling me that Cloud, who has already demonstrated amazing SOLDIER-style jump capabilities, can't just carry the ladies under his arms and jump over this gap? Yes, plenty of levels would be shortened massively if the game remembered how well Cloud can actually jump. Would not be surprised if Tifa was capable of making the aforementioned jump too.
Back in Ch9, when Aerith dropped ladders for Cloud in the broken expressway, I kept telling myself "Look, the game KNOWS the ladders aren't for Cloud. He could easily just jump across. It's just a nice, pointless gesture Aerith performs after she was helped across the obstacle." But here in Ch10 I can't find excuses that satisfy.
I expect more examples to pop up where the level design only works if you ignore that Cloud can jump good.
- The level to which players are spoiled may differ depending on which loading zone messages they get to read. This and other factors make it so difficult to decide what counts as a spoiler and what doesn't. Like this loading zone message about Shiva that I got in Ch10.
- It's embarrassing just how long it took me to understand the minigame with Aerith and Tifa. Still, it's appreciated that the chapter took the time to show these two ladies connecting not only in dialogue but also in gameplay.
- That moment when Tifa asked Aerith what she's not telling them/her makes me wonder if this will be a source of tension across the games. They're really laying it on thick here that Aerith has had visions of the future (but doesn't want to accept them). This part, more so than the plain level design (mechanics-wise, not graphics-wise), makes me uneasy.
- I hope that these Wutai-style gates, found both here and in the Sector 5 slums scrapyard are part of optional content later on. Or maybe one of the gates is mandatory and the other one isn't?
- Months ago when I first saw the Abzu battle, I got vibes similar to when the Fellowship fights the cave troll in the first Lord of the Rings. This uneasy empathy for the creature. In the case of Abzu I think it's because some of its animations appear more playful than aggressive and because the heightened realism makes you feel that you are killing an intelligent creature. Similarly there is added discomfort with killing the Sahagins (more than I already felt with them) since the Enemy Intel now specifies that the Sahagins have their own language. But Abzu is far cuter than the Sahagins, so...
I figured that the developers might be intentionally trying to channel this empathic energy and so I speculated that, perhaps, in FFVIIR Abzu would not die. Turns out I was right. At least for now. I also feel better from the fight since I never destroyed either of Abzu's horns, so he/she/it got to leave pretty gosh darn intact all things considered. But who knows. Maybe they'll change it this time and have Don Corneo kill Abzu out of frustration.
- First started the chapter by talking to Aerith, then restarted and spoke to Tifa instead. Observed that, apart from the already mentioned difference that Tifa has a ton of dialogue while waking up Aerith is dull in comparison, the camera angles when Abzu appears also change depending on which one of the girls you approached.
- "It's an antique - older than the mako reactors even. It'll be a miracle if it still works." I appreciate this lore nugget about infrastructure present from before the reactors were built.
- The atmosphere when you entered the darkly lit patch of the sewers was amazing. The music, the limited lighting and the overall creep-factor of the place was perfect. You were expecting a jump-scare at any moment...and it never happened. I love it when you are expecting a jump-scare and it never happens.
- On the same topic, I greatly enjoy how this sewer level looked. But you have to turn your brain off when it comes to the level design. Are you telling me that Cloud, who has already demonstrated amazing SOLDIER-style jump capabilities, can't just carry the ladies under his arms and jump over this gap? Yes, plenty of levels would be shortened massively if the game remembered how well Cloud can actually jump. Would not be surprised if Tifa was capable of making the aforementioned jump too.
Back in Ch9, when Aerith dropped ladders for Cloud in the broken expressway, I kept telling myself "Look, the game KNOWS the ladders aren't for Cloud. He could easily just jump across. It's just a nice, pointless gesture Aerith performs after she was helped across the obstacle." But here in Ch10 I can't find excuses that satisfy.
I expect more examples to pop up where the level design only works if you ignore that Cloud can jump good.
- The level to which players are spoiled may differ depending on which loading zone messages they get to read. This and other factors make it so difficult to decide what counts as a spoiler and what doesn't. Like this loading zone message about Shiva that I got in Ch10.
In the Enemy Intel description, it only says that she "healed the planet's wounds with ice" but in this loading zone info dump it specifies that she saved the planet from "certain destruction". There's a slight but interesting difference between those two descriptions.
- It's embarrassing just how long it took me to understand the minigame with Aerith and Tifa. Still, it's appreciated that the chapter took the time to show these two ladies connecting not only in dialogue but also in gameplay.
- That moment when Tifa asked Aerith what she's not telling them/her makes me wonder if this will be a source of tension across the games. They're really laying it on thick here that Aerith has had visions of the future (but doesn't want to accept them). This part, more so than the plain level design (mechanics-wise, not graphics-wise), makes me uneasy.
ForceStealer
Double Growth
omg FrogAerith has a bow
Seconded, I liked how really the only thing I could see of Cloud was the materia on his sword.
Seems like it. Also I was figuring they had something to do with Corneo
Seconded, I liked how really the only thing I could see of Cloud was the materia on his sword.
Seems like it. Also I was figuring they had something to do with Corneo
Last edited:
Rydeen
In-KWEH-dible
The AI is mad stupid. Gotta love how ranged characters just love to walk right up to the enemy the moment you leave them to their devices.
Fangu
Great Old One
Abzu was pretty fun.
I liked the sewers, I thought they were well done and I got to grind/ get Abilities from different weapons for Tifa and Aerith. I wish enemies respawned more often on that part of the map that has several round spaces and ends in a dead end, would have been a really nice place to get some grinding done.
The Tifa/Aerith mini game was lol. Took me several tries to get it right.
I spoke to Tifa first
Overall I think this was a short and sweet chapter with good pacing.
I liked the sewers, I thought they were well done and I got to grind/ get Abilities from different weapons for Tifa and Aerith. I wish enemies respawned more often on that part of the map that has several round spaces and ends in a dead end, would have been a really nice place to get some grinding done.
The Tifa/Aerith mini game was lol. Took me several tries to get it right.
I spoke to Tifa first
Overall I think this was a short and sweet chapter with good pacing.
Mayo Master
Pro Adventurer
Ok, chapter 10 impressions! Although I could pretty much summarize them by 'Yeah, what Shademp, said".
- I had the same reaction as Tets when seeing both ladies lying on the floor "Damn you and your LTD Choice Moments, Square!". Choosing is hard, so I woke Tifa first.
- Really enjoyed the fight vs Abzu. Like Odysseus said, odd to start the chapter with the boss fight and finish the chapter with much less tension.
- The brick walls aren't green, big change from the original game
. Man, the sewers were the first scenes I had finished rendering with Blender 3d (with the water animation and everything), so much nostalgia.
- As Shademp pointed out, you really have to turn your brain off regarding the the level design. That was the major let-down of this chapter for me. Cloud could have made all the jumps on one leg while carrying a girl under each arm. Come on.
- I really appreciated the tidbits of lore such as those Shademp had outlined.
- My spouse, my friend and I all got vibes from FFXII's Garamsythe Waterway.
- I really enjoy the growing friendship between Aerith and Tifa. And as they were making plans to go together for some shopping topside and thinking of Cloud as their pack-chocobo, when Cloud asked 'what were you saying about me?' my spouse replied 'Nothing!' perfectly in-sync with Tifa, it was hilarious.
Also... personally, I'm not convinced that Aerith's visions are about the future. Do I want to know if that's the case? Maybe not
Overall I feel that was a low-key chapter. It's a shame the level-design felt so archaic and lazy.
- I had the same reaction as Tets when seeing both ladies lying on the floor "Damn you and your LTD Choice Moments, Square!". Choosing is hard, so I woke Tifa first.
- Really enjoyed the fight vs Abzu. Like Odysseus said, odd to start the chapter with the boss fight and finish the chapter with much less tension.
- The brick walls aren't green, big change from the original game
. Man, the sewers were the first scenes I had finished rendering with Blender 3d (with the water animation and everything), so much nostalgia.- As Shademp pointed out, you really have to turn your brain off regarding the the level design. That was the major let-down of this chapter for me. Cloud could have made all the jumps on one leg while carrying a girl under each arm. Come on.
- I really appreciated the tidbits of lore such as those Shademp had outlined.
- My spouse, my friend and I all got vibes from FFXII's Garamsythe Waterway.
- I really enjoy the growing friendship between Aerith and Tifa. And as they were making plans to go together for some shopping topside and thinking of Cloud as their pack-chocobo, when Cloud asked 'what were you saying about me?' my spouse replied 'Nothing!' perfectly in-sync with Tifa, it was hilarious.
Also... personally, I'm not convinced that Aerith's visions are about the future. Do I want to know if that's the case? Maybe not
Overall I feel that was a low-key chapter. It's a shame the level-design felt so archaic and lazy.
ForceStealer
Double Growth
I liked how the second screen you go to in the sewers was the match for the first screen in the OG
Philco
Pro Adventurer
I think Ch. 9 annoyed me more in this regard. Especially with the tedious hand cranes. I actually missed the first green materia there not realising that, instead of simply having Cloud vault up or drop down 4ft from the area above, the game wanted me to ever so slowly and tediously drop Aerith off to pick it up for me.
Apparently a lot of my frustrations with the game so far are partly due to me having really bad "gamer's intuition" though. For example, I didn't realise when first playing the demo that you can slide down ladders. I didn't notice for ages that my stronger spells had been unlocked and I need only press right in the menu to access them. Battles in general are fine, until they're not, and then I feel like I'm missing a trick but have no idea what it could be. Or maybe I'm just not paying enough attention I dunno.
Anyway. This chapter was fine. There were froggies <3
Shademp
420
I think a primary reason that I enjoyed the Chapter 9 hand cranes is because they fulfilled my 22-year-old dream to interact with the machines in the road to Wall Market.
It always felt like such a tease in the original game that you could neither use the robot-hand as a point to jump from nor could you control the crane or even walk up along the crane arm. So by combining the crane machine and the robot hand in FFVIIR they channeled the dreams that have stuck with me for so long. My eyes were a bit rose-tinted in other words. The same immersion-breaking logic does apply here in FFVIIR though as it does with the level design in Ch10: Cloud could easily make so many of these jumps with the lady/ladies under his arm(s).
What the Ch9 hand cranes has going for them though is that they show a gradual increase in complexity.
They definitely should have made the hand cranes faster to move around. When I figured out that I was to stack objects in the final challenge it still took me so long to perform the motions that the game revealed the puzzle's solution to me three times.
Controlling the sewage water in Chapter 10 is comparatively a disappointment since there is no gradual increase in complexity. I was convinced that there would be some sort of interlocking puzzle where I had to calculate carefully which bay I emptied or filled with sewage water and that only the right combination would reveal the best treasure or allow me to proceed. None of that though. Just follow the corridor and pull the levers and you're good to go.
Admittedly there is the risk that an interlocking puzzle would have ended up contrived and tedious. But if Ch10 had gone that route it could have learned some lessons from the Ch9 hand cranes.
It always felt like such a tease in the original game that you could neither use the robot-hand as a point to jump from nor could you control the crane or even walk up along the crane arm. So by combining the crane machine and the robot hand in FFVIIR they channeled the dreams that have stuck with me for so long. My eyes were a bit rose-tinted in other words. The same immersion-breaking logic does apply here in FFVIIR though as it does with the level design in Ch10: Cloud could easily make so many of these jumps with the lady/ladies under his arm(s).
What the Ch9 hand cranes has going for them though is that they show a gradual increase in complexity.
Stage 1: Control one hand crane.
Stage 2: Control two hand cranes.
Stage 3: Control two hand cranes and stack objects.
They definitely should have made the hand cranes faster to move around. When I figured out that I was to stack objects in the final challenge it still took me so long to perform the motions that the game revealed the puzzle's solution to me three times.
Controlling the sewage water in Chapter 10 is comparatively a disappointment since there is no gradual increase in complexity. I was convinced that there would be some sort of interlocking puzzle where I had to calculate carefully which bay I emptied or filled with sewage water and that only the right combination would reveal the best treasure or allow me to proceed. None of that though. Just follow the corridor and pull the levers and you're good to go.
Admittedly there is the risk that an interlocking puzzle would have ended up contrived and tedious. But if Ch10 had gone that route it could have learned some lessons from the Ch9 hand cranes.
Last edited:
ForceStealer
Double Growth
Yeah I've seen a few people complain about those crane segments...I thought they were fun.
Philco
Pro Adventurer
Yep I loved it when I came across the first hand crane. Including just the one as a callback to the original would've been enough for me.
I was half expecting the waterways to develop like that as well. But yes if that had been the case, chances are I would also end up moaning about those requiring too much back and forth.
Damned if they do, damned if they don't.
I was half expecting the waterways to develop like that as well. But yes if that had been the case, chances are I would also end up moaning about those requiring too much back and forth.
Damned if they do, damned if they don't.
lithiumkatana17
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Lith
They're fun the FIRST you do them.
They're NOT fun for the subsequent 3-4 times afterward when you're trophy hunting and you realize you cannot skip them no matter how much you rage.
