Final Fantasy is a Train Wreck

[clowd]

This thread was a mistake, apologies to everyone

 

[ForceStealer]

The character designs in FFXIII proper were perfectly fine and simplistic. In fact, all the worst ones were the ones not designed by Nomura (the NORA members). It's as the FNC wears on that the outfits get more and more outlandish.

 

[Lord Noctis]

First things first, I doubt you'll find many people who disagree that Final Fantasy has gone downhill, even amongst those of us who enjoy some of the newer entries.

Secondly, those of us who enjoy some of the newer stuff do not do so because we are simple Japanese obssesed fanboys. We might simply have different tastes or prefferences than you do, and there is nothing wrong with that.

 

[Strangelove]

cool story bro

i got up to the part where you basically called everyone who likes something you don't names

 

[Cthulhu]

I guess some of us have mostly quit on being cynical and negative bastards about everything post-PS1 era and accept the games for what they are, .

(I didn't like the pop music and don't like the outfit, but the rest wasn't terrible)

 

[Geostigma]

lol@ the costumes argument.

For once SE puts the main female lead in clothing that actually seems like it can protect her and isnt there to show off her baps and its still being chastised.

Considering what shes going to be getting into Lightnings get up in that pic makes a ton of sense. Leather on the torso so its atleast somewhat durable, metal plating/chainmail everywhere else. A God damn shield to keep her safe ect.

And agnis costume is the smarter design? Does not compute, that chicks going to get her long ass robes stuck in a revolving door (like dollar bill in Watchmen) and get her ass killed lol.
I dont see how Agnis character design is any better, it just looks lazy and boring.

 

[Lex]

cool story bro

i got up to the part where you basically called everyone who likes something you don't names

Yeah that.

You make some good points but it just loses its credibility when you start essentially calling everyone who likes the game stupid. Maybe try making a post without the bitter aggression and people can actually start to respond to you seriously.

 

[Splintered]

Or maybe they like things shiny and loud and could give a rats ass about substance?

Oh man yeah, I like XIII so I obviously only like shallow things and am a weabo, come save me videogame messiah-kun from my horrible opinions.

In fact, all the worst ones were the ones not designed by Nomura (the NORA members).

I actually really like Nao Ikeda wackiness aside, she had some solid designs mixed in with the crazy. I think she would have done a lot better than the XIII-2 designers (one of which is credited with some of the characters in IX which makes sense to me because IX is the only game that rivals my strong dislike of the costumes in XIII-2, and the other was the art director for VII, VIII, and X which imo.... should have just staid the art director)

 

[Dashell]

cool story bro

i got up to the part where you basically called everyone who likes something you don't names

HAHA that's exactly when I stopped reading... and I never even played anything after FFX-2

 

[Strangelove]

i am still trying to work out how anyone in ffxiii has hair that is any more outrageous that ffvii

where the main character has a spike of hair that is literally as long as his face

multiple characters with strange praying mantis hair

not to mention the talking dog creature and a robot cat who rides a giant moogle on your main team

not forgetting the old guy who floats on a magical ball or something, and the oddly high number of burly men walking around in speedos

compared to this ffxiii is positively mundane in its designs


these kind of complaints pretty much follow every ff game that comes out. square has lost its way and everything is terrible. every time.

 

[looneymoon]

I liked VII, VIII, never played IX, liked X, liked XII. All these games were by no means perfect...

That's because you never played IX.

Also Gangnam Style is a great song.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

You make some good points but it just loses its credibility when you start essentially calling everyone who likes the game stupid.

Pretty much this right here, clowd.

You make a couple of valid points, and even a cogent, funny simile or two, but the opening insults -- and constant derision toward Japanese culture and those who like anime -- borders on xenophobia. You make a strong case in my opinion for the absurdity of Lightning's newest design, but VII's aesthetics were based on anime sensibilities, like 99% of JRPGs. You're raking one game's designs over the coals while praising the other's, when both drew from the same inspirational wellspring.

For that matter, XIII's character designs are really in the same vein of VII in terms of simple-but-memorable. I mean, look at Sazh. What is garish about that design?

Yeah, XIII-2 started getting outlandish with Lightning and Serah, but, really, Noel and Caius have rather subdued designs. It's just their swords that are on crack, and more Noel's than Caius's anyway. The main strike against Caius's Ragnarok is that the Soulcalibur series already did that sword -- and did it better -- freakin' years ago.

I'll agree with you that the surrealism of XIII's setting was a lot more disorienting than VII's, however, and that it has progressed to the point that it's like living under a red sky. One of VII's great strengths is certainly how familiar its settings feel even while they should be alien.

There's a lot more I could comment on, but I will let this list of bullet points stand for why your rant crossed over the border into the same absurd territory you feel FF has ventured into:

-I loved VII, VIII and X
-Think IX is amazing with its development and direction of plot/characters, even while I still can't overlook how much I dislike the art design
-Think XIII's character development is among the best in the series, even though the plot itself was frequently shoddy in its presentation and opportunities for players to feel immersed in it
-Absolutely hated XIII-2's story and aesthetics, though Noel is a really likeable character
-Kind of expecting to hate Lightning Returns' story and aesthetics as well; already hate Lightning's new design
-Love (good) anime
-Love "Gagnam Style"

Judge me.

 

[Lex]

I didn't even read the bit about Gangnam Style before. Could you possibly explain how liking that can equate to XIII? I ask because South Korea and Japan are not the same country.

In all seriousness, I understand why you hate XIII. I understand why a lot of people here and elsewhere hate XIII. We grew up with/learned to expect a completely different game from the name "Final Fantasy". I think when they were making XIII they thought they could get away with removing key elements like random little side quests, super hidden secret stuff, towns because it's nice to look at and had a story.

And it DOES have some of the best character development in the series, as Tres said. It also has redeeming qualities, such as that battle system when it opens up a bit. For me, Fang makes it. XIII-2 was missing that part, but made up for it in other areas.

I think what we also need to take into account is how fresh our eyes and ears are. Some people were disappointed with XII for messing with the formula too much, some people were the same with XIII. I am one of these people. I'm constantly asked by newcomers to the series why it has a bad name, and its not a difficult thing to quantify - we all got used to something and they changed the rules on us.

Sorry for the tl;dr, that's just my take on things. I personally love XIII and its sequel (though I like the sequel less than the original), but it took me a while. I'd also like to point out that it has one of the deepest and most developed overarching Mythos's of any FF game, though whether or not you find it interesting is subjective. Anyway, oppan gangnam style.

 

[Pixel]

FF7 probably would have had more OTT character design if they were able to represent them with PS1 graphics. The designs got more complicated in VIII, because they wanted to push the graphics. Graphics capabilities have always effected the development, whether its budget, development time or system capabilities. Agni is designed purely to show off graphics capability, light playing on the clothing, realistic hair style.

I like the story in all of the games, but all the games have flaws. SE themselves are conflicted about what final fantasy fan expect from them, so they try new thing. Some work, some dont. I would hate to see them just stick to a formula.

 

[Fangu]

lol@ the costumes argument.

For once SE puts the main female lead in clothing that actually seems like it can protect her and isnt there to show off her baps and its still being chastised.

This. Not very many games has a clear female lead. Then one appears and what do people do? Argue over how she is dressed.

 

[Flintlock]

This. Not very many games has a clear female lead. Then one appears and what do people do? Argue over how she is dressed.

To be fair, loads of people took the piss out of Tidus for the way he dressed too. Vaan and Squall also got the treatment, to a lesser degree. I don't think it is a female-only issue by any means.

Also, I disagree that the LR costume doesn't "show off her baps".

 

[TotoroTori]

Reading that rant was a trainwreck

 

[JBedford]

I think XIII is awful too. Way too linear, and I dislike most parts of the battle system bar the idea of Paradigms and switching in battle. I also can't stand the characters and how much they spend their entire time whining. At least that's what it seemed like to me.

I much prefer XIII-2, which has a laughable story, but heavily improves on the battle system. Or at least the game is so much easier that I notice how bad it is less (they definitely did make improvements). Although since it still has the Stagger system which the entire battle-system is based around, I still find it difficult to call the battle system "good". For me the characters are much more tolerable, I don't get the hate Serah gets when she seems level-headed most of the time. I also like the Monster-catching system a lot.

But I don't understand the rant in the first post of this topic. For me XIII has three key flaws: Linear gameplay, battle system (which I personally don't like but accept others might like), and (for me) the characters when they talk. I think these would be acceptable reasons to not like the game. But all the arguments in the main post seems to focus on design. Really? You spend the post saying how people must only like it for trivial reasons such as boxart and trailers, then you go on and spend the entire time criticising the design as the reason to not like it?

 

[Geostigma]

To be fair, loads of people took the piss out of Tidus for the way he dressed too. Vaan and Squall also got the treatment, to a lesser degree. I don't think it is a female-only issue by any means.

Also, I disagree that the LR costume doesn't "show off her baps".

Fine. Her Baps Skin lol.

 

[Edley]

The biggest problem with Final Fantasy is that I'm not 14 anymore.

 

[Fangu]

To be fair, loads of people took the piss out of Tidus for the way he dressed too. Vaan and Squall also got the treatment, to a lesser degree. I don't think it is a female-only issue by any means.

This only makes the matter worse imo. The title has "fantasy" in it, for heaven's sake! Go play games where you steal cars instead then.

This is turning into the LR:XIII thread now, so I'll gtfo. Or, the "Lightnings outfit is shit" thread, as it now has been known to be. One page of good discussion and here comes another asshat to complain about the fucking clothes, while the old asshats thank them. Meaning people revisit the thread not for discussion, but to look for fellow clothing-haters.

So now I'm back on topic: Srsly if this is all the newer Final Fantasy is to you, something that ruins your day, then why don't you just leave it alone? Because your spitefullness is ruining it for some of us. The result is - people who actually like this crap flees to a corner of the Internet we can enjoy stuff in peace, but yet you still follow us to bitch and whine. When is trashing ff gonna get old, because I'm seriously looking forward to that day.

Or, well, I guess it's better you take it out on ff than on your neighbours car.

Edit: Why does the world insist on making me look like an idiot these days? So the OP was a joke. Fine. Anyway I just snapped. I didn't mean to call Tres et co asshats. Even though some of the posts in the LR thread annoys me to hell and makes me swear I am never going back to that thread, I am not entitled to dictate what people should write. But in all honesty, your behavior does ruin that thread for me - now that might just be my fault for being over sensitive. But it might not be a coincidence that people in that thread who are excited for the game started popping into #tls instead of posting in the actual thread.

Edit 2: Oh rite, got my period today. Knew there was something.
Anyway the LR:XIII thread is about LR:XIII the video game and is not Fangu's Lightning Shrine. I'll try to remember that.

 

[clowd]

My apologies to everyone for creating this thread. There was no way any sort of productive conversation was going to come from this, so therefore it was really nothing more then a troll thread. I deleted the first post, and again, sorry.

 

[Geostigma]

>Posts a long thread he meant for discussion.
>Sees everyone disagrees.
>OhyougaizIwastrolling

 

[skyrise]

One is entitled to bitch forever about why they don't like Final Fantasy, or the latest installments and blah blah, but when you get to a point where you might pinpoint Lightning's outfit as a ~legitimate flaw~, then you're doing it wrong son.
Dump videogames and go and play one of those crappy fashion outfit games on those numerous tacky ads that pop up everywhere.

 

[looneymoon]

eeeeehhh i think design complaints are legitimate.

i like final fantasy and all but some of the character designs are just embarrassingly bad.

some people will just care more about that than others and that's okay.