SPOILERS Hard Mode Discussion

Jack Gilmour

Rookie Adventurer
AKA
AH88, ahall89, ahall88
I made it to the second Abzu fight, basically the end of chapter 14 I think, on hard mode and I'm done. Just not enjoyable at all. I have next to no MP heading into the fight and it just makes it too much of a slog.
I'll probably just go back and grab the dressed to the nines trophy and then just shelf the game for a few years.(Hopefully it's only a few years before part 2, right?)
No idea why I even attempted this, I always avoid hard difficulties in games, but I really wanted to try for the platinum since this is FFVII. Oh well.
 

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
I think if you can make it past Hell House in Hard Mode, you basically can do anything.

That fight is the ultimate fucking test and barrier of being able to manage the storyline fights on Hard Mode difficulty.

If you can survive that, you have what it takes. I purposefully specified "storyline fights" because the optional bosses are a whole different level.

Took me 5 tries, but I did it. You have to be real creative with materia and MP management. I already fucked up and used too much MP leading up to the fight because for some fucking reason I forgot it was a thing in this chapter :monster:

A combination of Bad Breath (I purposefully skipped ahead, did the Monsters of Legend fight just to get that Enemy Skill to help me through this playthrough), Aerith with her Arcane Sceptor for reduced MP consumption, saving Bahamut's summon for the last phase of the fight, and just extremely safe playing, allowed me to win.

Bahamut is such a good fucking summon, it cannot be overstated. Also, Prayer is such an important skill to use. Oh, and Steadfast Block mastered. You need that so much to survive certain attacks.

Hard Mode isn't for everyone, that's for sure. The lack of MP restoration and item use is a serious handicap to overcome. Hell House was the most difficult and least fun fight in this mode, by a wide margin. It was fucking nasty.
 

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
Double post because it's simply that important.

So I was at the start of chapter 11 when I told myself "fuck it," took my own advice, fast forwarded to Chapter 17 and decided to go after the Top Secrets optional combat trial.

At the beginning, Shiva was the most annoying fucking boss of them all. It took me 4 or 5 tries to finally come up with a load out and strategy to best deal with her. Her Whiteout attack is a fucking pain in the ass, however I gave a Mastered Cleansing materia to Barret so he could cast Resist on Cloud and Aerith so they wouldn't fall asleep. He was immune to sleep thanks to his accessory. With that, we just focused on damaging and winning. Then, I made it all the way up to Bahamut, got greedy with damage which pushed him into summoning Ifrit BEFORE he even fired off his first Mega Flare, and subsequently died an ignominious death.

I didn't rage though. I knew exactly what I did wrong, and while annoyed I understood I fucked up and paced the battle all wrong.

So I tweaked my equipment strategy, remembered not to push Bahamut to half his life before he fired his Mega Flare, and then tried again.

Shiva was annoying but I made it through her after a slog.

Fat Chocobo is actually pretty easy, so long as you deal with the fucking toys the adorable asshole moogles summons :monster: If you see a Tonberry, STOP WHAT YOU'RE DOING AND KILL IT IMMEDIATELY. Even if you're on the cusp of staggering the Fat Chocobo, all focus needs to be on killing any Tonberry dolls summoned because... They have the same attacks and capabilities to instantly kill as their genuine kind. Anytime a Tonberry so much as set foot on the arena, Cloud immediately Braver'd it, or Barret fired off Maximum Fury. Each of those attacks are enough to one-shot them. Focusing on the other kind of toys are important too, but they're not nearly as deadly as Tonberry dolls. The Fat Chocobo itself is predictable and easy.

Leviathan honestly felt like a breather. Even though it's a long, drawn out fight due to it's ability to soar above the arena and come at you from all sides, it really wasn't as bothersome as the first 2. Slow and steady wins the fight. Keep up Manaward, heal up when appropriate, and when it starts to soar, use thunder magic and Barret's long-range attacks to hit it.

Honestly, I feel like the true challenge of this run is Bahamut. Bahamut plays no fucking games in the Remake. He's filled with hatred and rage. As I said earlier, you do not want to force Bahamut's hand and make him call his homeboy Ifrit before he fires Megaflare, because then Ifrit will proceed to pick off any of your party members in critical who were able to survive the Megaflare. Bahamut also inflicts slow and silence with his Flare Breath. So keep Aerith away from Bahamut whenever possible.

@Lex gave some really pro advice on how to deal with Bahamut, and I have to give my thanks to him because it allowed me to not get wrecked a second time :monster: You definitely want to focus on damage and not stagger. Cloud should just Infinity End and go for pure damage and Limit Break Bahamut as soon as possible. Just focus all damage on him. Ironically, that'll succeed in building his stagger more than trying to Focus Thrust or anything. Just make like Ignis in FFXV and Overwhelm his ass. I actually killed Bahamut first before taking out Ifrit, which is the opposite of what most strategies say to do. But that's because I had a specific trick that ended up saving my ass in the next fight too.

So the Pride and Joy Prototype, a prototype version of the Proud Clad of FFVII, opens the fucking match with Pulse Cannon. Aerith should be on your team for this, and she should have a mastered First Strike materia equipped. As soon as the match starts, immediately hit X, give Aerith the command to Manawall, guard and save yourself from taking full damage from a move that could instantly put you in critical. I didn't even know it was gonna do that, but I saw the attack announcement and I guess Ultra Instinct kicked in and I acted.

A trick that really helped this fight was an unintentional preparation I made for the Bahamut fight. I gave Cloud both my elemental materia. I gave Cloud's weapon elemental-thunder materia to take advantage of the PaJ's weakness to Lightning, but I also had Cloud equipped with elemental-fire materia on his armor to absorb Ifrit's fire attacks, because I planned for Ifrit to be a challenge and wanted Cloud to make quick work of him while not have to worry about taking damage from him.

I had no fucking clue PaJ would fucking spam Knee-Fire at whoever got in it's face to attack it. So Cloud was fucking face-rolling that machine because Knee-fire was healing him, and he was dealing weakness damage to the fucking thing. The only time that I had issue was when it got pissed and grabbed Cloud and fired its laser into his face.

Thank the Butterfinger gods for that Superstar Belt I got as DLC since it kept Cloud alive and he was subsequently healed by the Knee-Fire attacks that came afterwards :wacky:

Cloud proceeded to summon Bahamut, limit break, and a fun time was had by all. The thing is tough but not nearly as challenging as Bahamut and Ifrit.

And now I have the Gotterdammerung to play with for the last 8 chapters of the game :monster:

I want to say that the Remake was able to create the most challenging, strategic, and enjoyable optional boss fight gauntlet I have played in a long time. This really felt like the attempts of trying to defeat Ruby and Emerald Weapon back in the OG. The need for strategy, power, and careful timing (with a teeny bit of luck) was a wonderful call back to the challenging superbosses of before. This was fucking awesome.

Cloud had a close to maxed out Hard Edge. This weapon gives the strongest power along with powering up a lot of his moves like his Limit Breaks, his attack commands, his limb crushing attacks, and everything else. It also extends the duration of positive buffs. I've loved this sword all through my playthrough and it's never disappointed. His armor was the Cog Bangle, and accessory was the Superstar Belt. On the weapon was 2/3 starred Elemental -> Mastered Lightning, Mastered Cure materia, Mastered Steadfast Block, Mastered Chakra, and a 3-star HP Up materia. On the armor was Mastered Elemental -> Mastered Fire, and a 1 star Revive materia.

Aerith was equipped with a near maxed Arcane Scepter. I chose this weapon because it gave her the most MP, gave her the ability Reprieve, and was overall a strong stat option. Her armor was the Chain Bangle. Materia for her weapon was Magnify-> Barrier, mastered Auto-cure-> mastered Cure, mastered First Strike, and mastered Steadfast Block. On her armor was a 2-star Warding materia -> mastered Binding materia, 4-star HP Up, and Mastered Revive materia. Aerith's accessory was the Enchanted Ring. I absconded from Revival Earrings because they're a single-use resource accessory in a 5 battle gauntlet where shit could go wrong anytime. Ideally, I would love to have them for Bahamut, but seeing as how all sorts of shit could go wrong on the way and they could be broken early, you could in essence have no accessory up to the 4th and 5th gauntlet. Instead, I focused on giving Aerith an accessory that maximized the length of her buffs. Manawall is incredibly important in these battles. The Arcane Sceptor also extends positive buffs by 10%. Combined with the Enchanted Ring, Aerith didn't have to recast Manawall as often.

Barret is where I got creative :monster: I used the Big Bertha weapon because it allowed Barret to have the best attack while also giving him a ton of HP, defensive options and essentially allowed him to play as a tank. He could weather a lot of damage. It Reprieve is once again an important skill to have, along with critical HP regen, defense up on block, and a plethora of other abilities that essentially focus on him staying alive. On his weapon, I gave him mastered Cure, mastered Prayer, mastered Steadfast Block, a 3-star HP up, mastered Cleansing, and.. Enemy Skill. Enemy Skill was only used for the Shiva fight. Bad Breath puts in work. Shiva is actually susceptible to Poison and Silence. Poison helps counter her self-healing she does with her AoE ice attacks, and the Silence keeps her from fucking spamming Blizzaga. Barret was also equipped with a Cog Bangle, and it was slotted with a 2-star Warding materia -> Time materia, and a 1 star Revive materia. Haste is a great buff to have for tough fights and everyone has to have the means of reviving teammates, its vital. His accessory was the Headband because I was fucking tired of my team being put to sleep by Whiteout :monster:

This was by no means a full, end-game, maxxed out team. It was sorta the minimal necessary to get to the optional boss and be able to hang with it. A lot of how I won came to just careful, patient playing, staying observant of the enemy, knowing when to guard, and keeping buffs up. Manawall, Steadfast Block, and proper healing will carry you a long way. So will Reprieve.

I hope anyone else daring to try Hard Mode will find this info helpful. It's tough as balls but fucking worth it. The developers really made some magic with these optional fights. I'm excited for what's to come, because they know what's up.
 

LegendarySaiyan

AKA: SalihGuclu
I am at Chapter 18 now and fighting against the Whispers, came all the way to fighting Bahamut, and died. Now I have to start all over!! Like how about a checkpoint, I fought through how many, 4 or 5 battles with the Whispers... Used up half of my MP on healing (half of them were wasted).

You know what I hate. When I cast a Healing Spell on me, but the game decides to change from fighting to a scene where the Boss does some stuff before we go back to fighting, but in the process I lose my ATB without getting healed. Also another thing I hate is that, whenever it looks like it is safe to cast a Healing Spell or use the Pray Skill, one of the three whispers attack you canceling my command and losing ATB..

If it not were for these stuff happening, I would beat the hell out of them.. :haunter:

EDIT:
Yeeeeah, that's karma for you Bahamut, killing me with his Mega Flare in the first round. Well guess what! I spared Cloud's Limit Break the Ascension and when the battle begun against Whisper Bahamut, I used it. Then I summoned my Bahamut and used its Skill a few times and then he did a Mega Flare on him killing him!

I just love this game <3
 
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Cannon_Fodder

Pro Adventurer
Almost got Hell House on my second try, but in the time between my summoner (Cloud) fainting and Bahamut using Megaflare before leaving, the cutter managed to silence my full-health Aerith. So I had no choice but to run around dodging chairs until the status ran out, and I got house-stomped. Oh well, at least I feel like I'm close.
 

Odysseus

Ninja Potato
AKA
Ody
Okay I give up. Though my level may be maxed, my stats aren't high enough. Should I skip to chapter 10 and come back?
 

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
Okay I give up. Though my level may be maxed, my stats aren't high enough. Should I skip to chapter 10 and come back?

What's your materia and equipment? I recommend using the Hard Edge for power, and don't be afraid to use the Angelic Earrings for auto-life. Especially for Aerith. She should have a weapon with the Reprieve ability, AND Angelic Earrings. She needs the protection.

You can earn SP by jumping around and doing later stuff. But for Hell House you basically need to have Aerith with all elemental materia, Prayer mastered, auto-cure and mastered cure, mastered Revive, and then Steadfast Block mastered.

Cloud having Elemental mastered or at least to the level it nullifies the paired materia's damage is a good. I chose thunder as the element to absorb because the Hell House has the tendency to electrify itself and try to tackle or charge at you.

You should also have the Bahamut summon. And save summoning Bahamut for the final part of the fight.

You gotta be slow and steady. And always block. Don't take raw attack hits. Steadfast Block is the MVP of Hard Mode.

First Strike materia is important too to have mastered. That way when Hell House vomits Tonberries you can Triple Slash them out the way.

I personally like using Enemy Skill materia too since Bad Breath can poison and sleep the Hell House too if you need a breather and wanna let Regen give you some extra HP for a break.
 

Odysseus

Ninja Potato
AKA
Ody
The strategy is be stupidly aggressive.

Phase 1:
hit the house until cloud has 1 atb
build aerith to 1 atb and use blizzaga
kill tonberrys with triple slash
use blizaga again
use blizard
Hell house is staggered
use infinities end

Phase 2:
use punisher mode to quickly pressure hell house before it starts using god mode
use infinities end to build stagger bar
use aerith's multi hit beam move i don't remember the name to build stagger
poison it at some point
around now is when god mode starts
use punisher to attempt to pressure hell house again, deal with tonberrys if need be
Stagger again, beat it up until phase 3 stars

Phase 3:
Bait Hell Bound with Cloud since he can take the hit at full health, summon Leviathan with Aerith
Aeith Dies anyway because fuck me, but Hell House's shield is down so Leviathan does 9999 damage
Revive Aerith
Pray to god you get lucky with the elements the Hell House uses so you can kill it with its weaknesses before it kills you
Kill it fast enough that the sweepers don't spawn
Win.

And thaaaaat's the stupid strategy.
 
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Odysseus

Ninja Potato
AKA
Ody
The sweepers keep getting me. I'm saving Leviathan (no bahamut :( ) until they come out, but I think I sould just summon it when phase 3 starts. I keep dying before it uses its big attack.
 

Cannon_Fodder

Pro Adventurer
I like your strategy! If your summoner dies first, then Leviathan will do Tidal Wave before peacing out. Hopefully that will kill both mechs and then you can revive your summoner before attacking again.
 

Odysseus

Ninja Potato
AKA
Ody
VICTORY!

I punished so hard in the third phase that the sweepers never even came out lol.

EDIT:
My exact set up:
Cloud LVL 50:
Hard Edge, Supreme Bracer, Mako Crystal (B U T T E R F I N G E R B O N U S) two star mp up, max healing, max fire, one star revive, max wind, 4 star prayer, 3 star mp up, 4 star hp up, 4 star mp up, Shiva.

Aerith LVL 50:

Arcane Scepter, Rune Armlet, Mythical Amulet, max lightning, 1 star mp up, max poison, 3 star magic up, 3 star hp up, max Ice, max healing(linked to magnify), max auto cure, Leviathan.

Was this a masochistic set up to use or am I just bad?
 
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