Omnislash7
Lv. 1 Adventurer
- AKA
- NonchalantXstev
THIS IS GONNA BE THE BEST GAME OF ALL TIME
Hopes for Remake & Rebirth (story/content)
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mandelbrot86
Lv. 25 Adventurer
I’m a fan of of the AI approach for Cait Sith. I think it would explain why Reeve doesn’t need to constantly control him and it makes his loss in the temple a little more real. Also it would help with why he stays. Maybe he’s controllable but the his real personality is not a bad guy.
Saven
Pro Adventurer
There will be some things from the Compilation used for the story in FFVIIR like Wutai to help develop the backstory for AVALANCHE.
jazzflower92
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- The Girl With A Strong Opinion
Hopefully not Genesis.
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
I really don’t understand the anxiety around Genesis anytime inclusion of the Compilation is mentioned. Regardless of one’s feelings on the character, the Compilation itself set it up so that Genesis isn’t supposed to appear directly during the main game timeline since he’s in self-imposed hibernation. At most there could be small references to him, like documents or news clippings regarding the history of SOLDIER.
Jairus
Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
I understand, but I think what some people want is for him to not ever have existed at all, even in hibernation, and this is a chance to remove him from FFVII's canon entirely. Sephiroth could have lost his mind without any help from Genesis, just as the original game showed us.
Sephira
That Silver-haired Lady
- AKA
- Sephiravania
↑ This. Perhaps Genesis is not much of a loved/liked character, but he's a part of the Compilation, like it or not -yep, as same as Cait Sith, dudes and dudettes! And yes, his presence -may or not may- be strictly necessary for the story development, but he's there and plays his role, and can be referred to in the Remake, not affecting the outcome at all. Will they even refer to Angeal? Could be, why not? He's a part of the Lore as well, and as Crisis Core is canon, references to them could be used.
But I do think than more than references to Genesis, they will refer to Zack, adding depth to the story by making him a little less absent and thus making Cloud's mindfrick more interesting. Will Sephiroth, maybe, give him hints of Zack's existence so he's even more confused? Could be.
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
Yeah, but even if the FFVII Remake doesn’t even indirectly reference Genesis, that doesn’t mean Genesis has been removed from the canon entirely, as the entire point of the way the Compilation used Genesis is that his absence in the OG is can be explained away easily. Even with the Nibelheim flashback Genesis not appearing can be explained as Cloud not “remembering” the entirety of the reactor scene, as Genesis only appeared after the entirety of the OG dialogue had been said.
Jairus
Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
That still doesn't address the issue of Sephiroth needing Genesis to go mad in the first place. The original game was written and made in such a way that Sephiroth needed no other catalyst than what we saw in the game. And keeping it simple like that can be more effective than inserting a new character just for the sake of doing so and circumventing the intention of the original.
youffie
Pro Adventurer
I think the problem is that Genesis and everything that concerned him was very jarring in a way that seemed to clash with the original without adding much of substance in return – case in point, the new version of the Nibelheim incident, which was at the very core of the original game and for that reason alone should not have been tampered with.
Of course, this is not limited to poor Genesis, and perhaps he’s not even the worst thing they came up with after the original game. It’s just that he was a very loud, very flashy representation of what rubbed many people the wrong way with the Compilation. So when people say they don’t want Genesis anywhere near the remake, I don't think it's even about the character per se at this point. I think they just hope that everything they rewrite or add will actually complement and enhance the original material, something the Compilation failed to do more often than not.
Personally, I don't care if the changes they implement have any relation with the Compilation or not. I just hope that the way they go about implementing them makes sense thematically and tonally.
Of course, this is not limited to poor Genesis, and perhaps he’s not even the worst thing they came up with after the original game. It’s just that he was a very loud, very flashy representation of what rubbed many people the wrong way with the Compilation. So when people say they don’t want Genesis anywhere near the remake, I don't think it's even about the character per se at this point. I think they just hope that everything they rewrite or add will actually complement and enhance the original material, something the Compilation failed to do more often than not.
Personally, I don't care if the changes they implement have any relation with the Compilation or not. I just hope that the way they go about implementing them makes sense thematically and tonally.
Mayo Master
Pro Adventurer
To summarize: Genesis was a bad case of shoehornitis.
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
Sure, Genesis may have been a case of shoehornitis (though I think his character is fine/neutral towards him). But that’s an issue with Crisis Core itself, also the showhornitis, regardless of its quality, was inherently designed in a way that it’s absence in the OG is self-justified.
I can sorta understand the reasoning that “Genesis” is just shorthand for people meaning “things from the Compilation I don’t like”, but I think it’s just strange to use a character that deliberately was written to justify its own absence in the OG narrative as symbolic of Compilation material that could be used in the Remake, as opposed to actual Compilation material that could actually be added to the Remake that does fit in with the current timeline, such as the additional towns and locals that CC/BC added. Or like the Remake twitter said more Wutai material.
I can sorta understand the reasoning that “Genesis” is just shorthand for people meaning “things from the Compilation I don’t like”, but I think it’s just strange to use a character that deliberately was written to justify its own absence in the OG narrative as symbolic of Compilation material that could be used in the Remake, as opposed to actual Compilation material that could actually be added to the Remake that does fit in with the current timeline, such as the additional towns and locals that CC/BC added. Or like the Remake twitter said more Wutai material.
LNK
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Nate
Your last couple statements is all I hope for as well
LNK
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Nate
I've said the same thing about Crisis Core. Even if they are only shown as minor references, I don't see why that would take away from the game
Jairus
Author of FFVII: Lifestream & FFVII: Reflections
I'm fine with them drawing on certain things from the Compilation to expand the lore and such, though I don't know how effective using anything from BC would be given its release was so limited, it never made it outside Japan, and only a minority of the overall fanbase seems to even know about it so any references would likely be missed by most people.
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
That’s the point of references/Easter eggs/homages though, they can be enjoyed as just extra content/information even if only a few people recognize their origin.
FFXIV does that all the time, like in Stormblood there’s is a sidequest chain with some Miqo’te characters that’s a direct homage to Red XIII’s character arc with his father. Now there are plenty of FFXIV players who haven’t played FFVII and plenty who have, but the former can still enjoy content regardless of their lack of context/knowledge.
FFXIV does that all the time, like in Stormblood there’s is a sidequest chain with some Miqo’te characters that’s a direct homage to Red XIII’s character arc with his father. Now there are plenty of FFXIV players who haven’t played FFVII and plenty who have, but the former can still enjoy content regardless of their lack of context/knowledge.
youffie
Pro Adventurer
Perhaps it’s not that he’s a symbol of Compilation material that is likely to be incorporated in the Remake, so much as that he’s a symbol of unnecessary retcons that cast shadows over pre-existing moments from the original game, and possibly over the Remake as well, even when he doesn’t “officially” appear in them.
That said, I honestly don’t care about him all that much and I’m not opposed to Easter eggs, even about things I didn’t enjoy. I’m more interested in how they could rework a few other things from the Compilation into the Remake, though. I do think the Compilation had some good ideas, they just weren’t written very coherently most of the time.
Speaking of Easter eggs, ever since the game was announced to be split in parts, I’ve been wondering about if and how they could include little nods to the rest of the gang. There’s probably not much of a chance they’ll actually appear, after seeing the amount of care and detail they seem to have put in the new designs and in nailing that first impression… But for most of them even a small reference could work?
I’m pretty sure Red will be in Part 1 in some capacity. I also think we’ll see more of Reeve, and possibly we’ll catch a glimpse of Cait Sith as well, since that was already the case in the OG anyway – maybe we could even meet him somehow, so that when Cloud meets him again him joining the group makes more sense. Cait Sith is a staple FF mascot by now, after all.
The other three are a bit trickier. Vincent is probably the easiest, it wouldn’t be that far fetched to skim through Hojo’s computer and find classified files about this former nameless Turk who was assigned to the Jenova project. Yuffie, I’m not sure… If they’re going to expand Wutai and throw in some more or less fabricated link with the AVALANCHE, maybe there could be some news about the daughter of Wutai’s leader having gone mysteriously missing around the time the bombings started. That could even add another layer to her reasoning for joining Cloud and the others. Or maybe we’ll just hear people talking about this idiot bandit in the wilderness just outside Midgar, I wouldn’t complain.
About Cid, I wouldn’t mind if we actually saw the guy? I mean, it’s not Final Fantasy without a Cid
Maybe he could be in Shinra HQ to try to make his case about the rocket for the last time before deciding he’s done with them (until the President dies and he tries again with Rufus I guess). I would love to see him wearing an ugly suit
That said, I honestly don’t care about him all that much and I’m not opposed to Easter eggs, even about things I didn’t enjoy. I’m more interested in how they could rework a few other things from the Compilation into the Remake, though. I do think the Compilation had some good ideas, they just weren’t written very coherently most of the time.
Speaking of Easter eggs, ever since the game was announced to be split in parts, I’ve been wondering about if and how they could include little nods to the rest of the gang. There’s probably not much of a chance they’ll actually appear, after seeing the amount of care and detail they seem to have put in the new designs and in nailing that first impression… But for most of them even a small reference could work?
I’m pretty sure Red will be in Part 1 in some capacity. I also think we’ll see more of Reeve, and possibly we’ll catch a glimpse of Cait Sith as well, since that was already the case in the OG anyway – maybe we could even meet him somehow, so that when Cloud meets him again him joining the group makes more sense. Cait Sith is a staple FF mascot by now, after all.
The other three are a bit trickier. Vincent is probably the easiest, it wouldn’t be that far fetched to skim through Hojo’s computer and find classified files about this former nameless Turk who was assigned to the Jenova project. Yuffie, I’m not sure… If they’re going to expand Wutai and throw in some more or less fabricated link with the AVALANCHE, maybe there could be some news about the daughter of Wutai’s leader having gone mysteriously missing around the time the bombings started. That could even add another layer to her reasoning for joining Cloud and the others. Or maybe we’ll just hear people talking about this idiot bandit in the wilderness just outside Midgar, I wouldn’t complain.
About Cid, I wouldn’t mind if we actually saw the guy? I mean, it’s not Final Fantasy without a Cid
Maybe he could be in Shinra HQ to try to make his case about the rocket for the last time before deciding he’s done with them (until the President dies and he tries again with Rufus I guess). I would love to see him wearing an ugly suit
jazzflower92
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- The Girl With A Strong Opinion
Perhaps it’s not that he’s a symbol of Compilation material that is likely to be incorporated in the Remake, so much as that he’s a symbol of unnecessary retcons that cast shadows over pre-existing moments from the original game, and possibly over the Remake as well, even when he doesn’t “officially” appear in them.
That said, I honestly don’t care about him all that much and I’m not opposed to Easter eggs, even about things I didn’t enjoy. I’m more interested in how they could rework a few other things from the Compilation into the Remake, though. I do think the Compilation had some good ideas, they just weren’t written very coherently most of the time.
Speaking of Easter eggs, ever since the game was announced to be split in parts, I’ve been wondering about if and how they could include little nods to the rest of the gang. There’s probably not much of a chance they’ll actually appear, after seeing the amount of care and detail they seem to have put in the new designs and in nailing that first impression… But for most of them even a small reference could work?
I’m pretty sure Red will be in Part 1 in some capacity. I also think we’ll see more of Reeve, and possibly we’ll catch a glimpse of Cait Sith as well, since that was already the case in the OG anyway – maybe we could even meet him somehow, so that when Cloud meets him again him joining the group makes more sense. Cait Sith is a staple FF mascot by now, after all.
The other three are a bit trickier. Vincent is probably the easiest, it wouldn’t be that far fetched to skim through Hojo’s computer and find classified files about this former nameless Turk who was assigned to the Jenova project. Yuffie, I’m not sure… If they’re going to expand Wutai and throw in some more or less fabricated link with the AVALANCHE, maybe there could be some news about the daughter of Wutai’s leader having gone mysteriously missing around the time the bombings started. That could even add another layer to her reasoning for joining Cloud and the others. Or maybe we’ll just hear people talking about this idiot bandit in the wilderness just outside Midgar, I wouldn’t complain.
About Cid, I wouldn’t mind if we actually saw the guy? I mean, it’s not Final Fantasy without a Cid
Maybe have it be mentioned that Reeve's is working on something.
Legend
Rookie Adventurer
So what are the chances we'll see Elena? Reno gets injured during the Sector 7 incident but I highly doubt that would be his last appearance in the game. But then he can always reappear without Elena ever showing up.
In the original, Rude only appears once during the entire Midgar portion but we already know he has an extended role in the remake. We'll probably see more of Tseng, too.
What do you guys think?
In the original, Rude only appears once during the entire Midgar portion but we already know he has an extended role in the remake. We'll probably see more of Tseng, too.
What do you guys think?
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
I'd be really surprised if we didn't see Reeve being more fully developed. It'll be interesting to see whether they present him as a your typical good guy, or more morally ambiguous.
Saven
Pro Adventurer
I really hope this is the case. I thought Reeve was an interesting character and it will be cool to see his perspective of things at the top level (pun intended).
Personally, I hope the relationship between he and Barret are explored even further. The interactions with them can be funny and serious when needed. I can't wait for the scene in the last part of the Remake where Reeve/Cait Sith finally confronts Barret on his recklessness on blowing up the reactors and how many lives have been lost or affected for the worse. It's one of my Top 5 scenes in the original game and based on what we have seen in the trailers and Barret's bio on SE's website, I think they are going to explore that subject even further. When everyone realizes that they destroyed the building + lives after the first bombing, Barret blows it off and has a "suck it up" attitude and that bio revealed that he was too much for other AVALANCHE cells because of his extreme methods. This subject will eventually be brought back up again at the end of the game but by then, we should see Barret's fall and redemption (seeing what Sector 7's destruction has done to his friends and family and being forgiven by the group) and how Reeve needs to learn to forgive as well and that he really isn't all that perfect either. Reeve will then do his part to get everyone out of Midgar for his redemption arc as a Shinra exec.
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