To be frank, you're being more self righteous than he is by an order of magnitude, you're attempting to ignore his point that the majority of incest tends to be abusive in nature, then try and throw a reverse fucking smokescreen by implying with your 'So a gay guy never raped anybody Stereotypes are fun!!!' that he's missing a giant point.
I ignored nothing. He mad e astatement, I asked for proof. His response was to link me to article on child abuse...which does nothing prove his point that a majority of incest is child abuse.
It's irrelevant anyway because I'm condoning consensual sex between adults. His bringing child molestation into this doesn't have anything to do with my argument. In fact if incest laws were repealed, anyone who molested a child, family or not, would be subject to the law and punishment.
So I don't even see how Mako has a point.
Let me just say that completely irrelevant of your viewpoint, what you're doing is INHERENTLY in violation of this goddamn subforum's rules and civil discourse and debate in general.
Keep it up, buddy, I dare you. We'll see where it goes.
Okie dokie.
No, it's because the vast majority of incest cases involve coercion, and there's simply no way for the law to determine the small minority of the cases which don't involve coercion, so it's safer for individual human rights to outlaw all of them on principle.
Again with the unfounded stereotypes. Your point also holds no weight whatsoever as the law would also punish them for sex with a minor. So why is incest illegal? Outdated morals based on culture and religion.
I cap Osama bin Laden right now. Millions are happy.
That's just one example of how murder is a good thing. There's countless more.
Because it violates the inherent right of each individual human being to his or her own life. How is making the prohibition against the intentional taking of another human being's life for anything other than self-defence anything but a universal standard at all beneficial for society?
Osama, Hitler, Stalin, you're saying nobody would openly jump at the chance to shoot any of these people even if said people were handcuffed and helpless?
That which causes unnecessary suffering is wrong. That which alleviates unnecessary suffering is desirable. Seems pretty self-explanatory to me.
Many good things can come out of causing tragedy. Nazi policies alleviated the general suffering of Germany and made it one of the strongest nations in the world and history. At the cost of causing suffering. Of course I guess that makes it necessary and not unecessary as you said.
Tell me, how would you have the law enforce grey areas? Would you rely on the testimony of family members, who could have their own motivations to lie? What about the testimony of the people involved, who could have been scared or manipulated into saying things against their own individual interest? How would you make certain individuals' rights were not being violated?
Well, first, even if incest remained illegal, all those possibilities would still exist so I don't see how it's a counter-argument to my belief in how incest should be legal.
But on your actual point, you can't help someone if they refuse to be helped. If a family member was victimized and lied to us about it and refused to cooperate, it be impossible to do anything for them. In the case of adults anyway.
When it comes to minors, I believe it's within in the law to remove children from unsafe homes. If the child shows signs of abuse, I personally don't have a problem with the law taking them away from the parent.
So how would I protect individual rights? By removing the unecessary laws against incest and just keeping everything else about the same. As I've said, two consenting adults, let them do whatever they want.
David Irving is a Holocaust denier. Therefore, describing him as "more intelligent and knowledgeable" than anyone on this forum is utterly absurd. If he is in fact more knowledgeable than anyone here, then he is also being utterly dishonest about most of his knowledge.
As I've said, different people have different beliefs. The fact someone believes one dumb thing doesn't somehow make him dumb. His books are very good reads in fact.
I definitely wouldn't say me or anyone here was smarter than Goebbels because he was a true genius. Yet he believed Jews were below us. That one belief doesn't make him less of a genius, though.
He's one of the smartest political minds of the 20th Century IMO.
It is difficult to be certain since cases are rarely reported, but Nemeroff and Craighead (2001) report that around ten to fifteen percent of the population are estimated to have been victims of childhood sexual abuse; other reports conclude similar numbers. By contrast, Wolf and Durham (2004) report that incest between adults is rarely reported.
Welll as you said, it's difficult nigh impossible to get real numbers. Those cases of child abuse are obviously reported because there are usually signs noted by objective observers looking out for the child. With adultsm people aren't quite as attentive and I doubt the two consenting adults report the fact they're doing something illegal.
And one courey reply
So you've cried at family members' funerals, big deal. Empathy for strangers is what is required for a functional human being. Having no sympathy for people you've met doesn't make you "more of a man." If anything, it makes you less of one, since it strongly implies that your morality isn't developed enough to apply universal principles of right and wrong.
I already replied to this basically. Neither you ro i nor anyone is "developed" enough to apply universal concepts of right and wrong.
