SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[GamerSkull]

Oh, this is absolute and complete bullshit. Japan is very big on kissing, both direct and "indirect" and it shows up in media for every age group, including small children.

Do you think people who think like this have piercing headaches when they see Cloti content and then afterwards they arrive at these bizarre conclusions?

Methinks Jenova is afoot.

 

[thetriplerhyme]

I’m 99% convinced she has died too, keeping 1% out for being wrong but I’d be shocked. They’ve said things about maintaining this plot point too many times for me to think otherwise.

ahh okay that's i can be same 99% percent 1% for possibility of error
- lmao I wanna say I'm the same with mainiting same story but yeaah sorry zack made me weak lmao
well~ you wanna see him back I mean I wanna see him alive ( buut yeah I'm sure he's dead too)

When people lie about one of the most documented mechanics in the game, they reveal their desperation and idiocy. That people are still lying about the AVs in the original game is just stupefying.

exactly~ dude its the same thing we have on OG you're just seeing it now in 4K with all of those non- verbal cues. Tifa doesnt have any rude choices just whats best for childhood friend LMAO you dont need to try soo much

I also heard delulu said they said they're getting more in part 3 ( lmao what were they expecting?)

 

[nars305]

ahh okay that's i can be same 99% percent 1% for possibility of error
- lmao I wanna say I'm the same with mainiting same story but yeaah sorry zack made me weak lmao
well~ you wanna see him back I mean I wanna see him alive ( buut yeah I'm sure he's dead too)

I don’t really know what to think for Part 3 but I just have this feeling that it’s not exactly going to go into Advent Children. It’s Aerith saying don’t blame yourself to Cloud and also the fact that Cloud was able to fight beside Zack. Also, Cloud fighting Sephiroth with Aerith after she died…

I don’t see how in the next game Cloud doesn’t get to say goodbye to Zack, and I guess Aerith…again. Especially seeing as Zack was taking care of Aerith and Cloud. I don’t see what’s the point of having him in a world with an Aerith and Cloud that just don’t wake up…

Unless the last world he got into wasn’t that same world their bodies were in. But that world had a white materia in it too.

It’s all too much to think about lmao.

 

[A-to-Z]

Slightly off topic but, I'm replaying the game on hard mode and have just finished the loveless play for the second time, and yet again, as I've stated before I'm not so good at this whole "interpreting" thing, and I can't really make heads or tails of what it's supposed to represent/foreshadow, if anything at all.

So I'm sorry if this is a tired topic or if no one cares, but I'd like to hear what ye think of it and or what it means. That way I might be able to piece something together, than

the Loveless play in Rebirth to me was a clear allusion for Zack and Aerith (take note that Cloud doesn’t smoothly deliver his lines; it’s more apparent that he’s just acting out a role compared to Tifa or Aerith). Also someone in twitter pointed out ZA’s (seemingly matching) Ever Crisis skins is a reference to Loveless. Aerith’s Prism dress having blue roses (Rosa) and a gold heart motif at the corset area (not to mention her headpiece is somewhat similar to the Rosa’s crown in Rebirth) while Zack’s Shinra Dress Uniform outfit also being blue and clearly designed for a hero/protagonist. Zack’s matching weapon for that outfit in EC is called “ceremonial sword” and guess who has a “ceremonial staff” in Rebirth? (Sorry to reach but the weapons also have similar visual motifs)

 

[Dashell]

There's a big explosion on twitter now because Kitase basically confirmed the story would follow the original and Aerith would still die... certain people aren't too happy about this.

Where does this "Defy fate" being the theme of the game come from? I didn't pay attention to the marketing for this game so I never heard that until after the game came out and when I heard someone say it in regards to rebirth, I thought it was about Sephiroth trying to defy fate. I Just feel like they repeatedly set themselves up to fall and then blame the devs and Clotis when it doesn't go their way. It's just insane how they've been doing this for 27 years and keep doing it over and over.

Also
Doesn't Aerith say "Don't fall in love with me." to Cloud in Remake? Kind of an odd thing to say if she's going to live lol

 

[GamerSkull]

There's a big explosion on twitter now because Kitase basically confirmed the story would follow the original and Aerith would still die... certain people aren't too happy about this.

Where does this "Defy fate" being the theme of the game come from? I didn't pay attention to the marketing for this game so I never heard that until after the game came out and when I heard someone say it in regards to rebirth, I thought it was about Sephiroth trying to defy fate. I Just feel like they repeatedly set themselves up to fall and then blame the devs and Clotis when it doesn't go their way. It's just insane how they've been doing this for 27 years and keep doing it over and over.

Also
Doesn't Aerith say "Don't fall in love with me." to Cloud in Remake? Kind of an odd thing to say if she's going to live lol

It’s in the marketing but it’s often verbalized by Sephiroth. It’s in the trailers and on the back cover but… I still don’t think it’s necessarily bad that fate wasn’t actually “defied” as it could be a red herring to catch us off guard. And tbh if you aren’t following marketing then only Sephiroth talks about defying fate constantly.

And Remake ends with “unknown journey will continue” so they probably assumed that specifically referred to Aerith’s fate.

Now personally I believe there’s been enough changes in these two games that “unknown journey” is still more or less accurate. So ultimately, my conspiracy theory is that people don’t actually want changes, they only championed the idea of changes because they wanted Aerith’s death to be changed.

Also, when a villain is the one constantly going “let’s defy fate”, I always get the feeling that it would be a bad thing.

Not to mention, even before Rebirth came out the devs constantly said it would be more or less the same story. So if people are truly following the marketing (and I get that not everyone is) they must have seen that.

 

[Yoru]

It’s in the marketing but it’s often verbalized by Sephiroth. It’s in the trailers and on the back cover but… I still don’t think it’s necessarily bad that fate wasn’t actually “defied” as it could be a red herring to catch us off guard. And tbh if you aren’t following marketing then only Sephiroth talks about defying fate constantly.

And Remake ends with “unknown journey will continue” so they probably assumed that specifically referred to Aerith’s fate.

Now personally I believe there’s been enough changes in these two games that “unknown journey” is still more or less accurate. So ultimately, my conspiracy theory is that people don’t actually want changes, they only championed the idea of changes because they wanted Aerith’s death to be changed.

Also, when a villain is the one constantly going “let’s defy fate”, I always get the feeling that it would be a bad thing.

Not to mention, even before Rebirth came out the devs constantly said it would be more or less the same story. So if people are truly following the marketing (and I get that not everyone is) they must have seen that.

"If something is written, it must be true !" I understand now why I see so many awful takes with the logic of these people...

Yeah the marketing focused on Fate from time to time... but maybe it's not a good thing to defy it... or maybe it's just impossible... maybe things happen in life and you have to live with it... as if the game was trying to teach us something about loss and life... definitely something we never saw in 1997... must be coincidence.

 

[thetriplerhyme]

It’s in the marketing but it’s often verbalized by Sephiroth. It’s in the trailers and on the back cover but… I still don’t think it’s necessarily bad that fate wasn’t actually “defied” as it could be a red herring to catch us off guard. And tbh if you aren’t following marketing then only Sephiroth talks about defying fate constantly.

And Remake ends with “unknown journey will continue” so they probably assumed that specifically referred to Aerith’s fate.

Now personally I believe there’s been enough changes in these two games that “unknown journey” is still more or less accurate. So ultimately, my conspiracy theory is that people don’t actually want changes, they only championed the idea of changes because they wanted Aerith’s death to be changed.

Sephiroth speaks a lot bout it because it basically him who wanted to defy fate by not dying ( he is supposed to be dead back in Nibelheim ) but if they focus on the story Wedge fate is able to defy a bit but eventually caught up to him. That should be a warning that death just comes and sometimes even fate cannot defy it~!

Devs has been saying this multiple times I dont see the surpised though ( I admit being swayed because of Zack but that's 50/50 % )

Marketing focus more on Aerith saying these things so people will be swayed that she can defy her own fate ( cuz people know she's going to die ) that's why they're not focus on her death instead their focus on people's desire " she can be saved" in order to give fans the same feeling of loss ~

Fans are not suprised she's going to die, soo that fact wont hurt anymore instead they focus on their desire to save her.. "aaahh she can defy her fate " only be to told otherwise and there! People will be heartbroken with her death again..

 

[Sacky]

Sephiroth speaks a lot bout it because it basically him who wanted to defy fate by not dying ( he is supposed to be dead back in Nibelheim ) but if they focus on the story Wedge fate is able to defy a bit but eventually caught up to him. That should be a warning that death just comes and sometimes even fate cannot defy it~!

Devs has been saying this multiple times I dont see the surpised though ( I admit being swayed because of Zack but that's 50/50 % )

Marketing focus more on Aerith saying these things so people will be swayed that she can defy her own fate ( cuz people know she's going to die ) that's why they're not focus on her death instead their focus on people's desire " she can be saved" in order to give fans the same feeling of loss ~

Fans are not suprised she's going to die, soo that fact wont hurt anymore instead they focus on their desire to save her.. "aaahh she can defy her fate " only be to told otherwise and there! People will be heartbroken with her death again..

I love how people keep saying Defy Destiny all this time and I'm just here thinking The Villain... the Villain is saying this people. The back of the box for Rebirth let us Defy Destiny together is what Sephiroth said XD. But maybe in part 3 they will defy destiny maybe part 3 the end is happier characters fates staying the same but the state of the world might be better or Sephiroth could be erased entirely. Its like 7 seconds to the end it was never about Aeriths fate, it was about the end of the world. Though AC is a happy ending anyway so maybe they just show more post AC stuff since a lot of people don't realise how happy that ending is somehow? But fate is also the will of the planet the lifestream. Sephiroth is trying to create eternity forcing the planet to keep existing and corrupting it rejecting Death which is ironic for some of the fanbase. While Aerith is all about the acceptance of Death and the flow of the planet. Yeah they were making Aeriths fate a red herring but there was clear hints that maybe messing with fate wasn't a great thing considering it's the villains goal, a villain who is a master manipulater, that keeps teasing them about fate.

 

[Sacky]

"If something is written, it must be true !" I understand now why I see so many awful takes with the logic of these people...

Yeah the marketing focused on Fate from time to time... but maybe it's not a good thing to defy it... or maybe it's just impossible... maybe things happen in life and you have to live with it... as if the game was trying to teach us something about loss and life... definitely something we never saw in 1997... must be coincidence.

You have this same argument right now with Zack saying "Cloud save her" which might just be cause Zack doesn't know she's died but people seem to think it's foreshadowing that we can save Aerith

 

[Stiggie]

You have this same argument right now with Zack saying "Cloud save her" which might just be cause Zack doesn't know she's died but people seem to think it's foreshadowing that we can save Aerith

It's a reasonable interpretation if you ignore the rest of the game. It IS weird to include that if saving her is off the table, feels unnecesairy

 

[GamerSkull]

To be fair, the devs have always maintained that the story would more or less follow the OG path so I’m not sure why everyone is surprised.

Zack saying “save her” could mean a lot of things, but not necessarily that Aerith will be alive in the end.

But to be honest, if Aerith is brought back then they’ll do the same for Zack. (I hope not, I think both of them should remain dead by the end of the series). You can still make that sorta happy by having them be together in the Lifestream.

So I don’t think CA fans will get what they want either way. Either Aerith and Zack will both be alive and together. Or they’ll be dead and together.

If everyone’s getting a “happy ending” then the devs aren’t gonna have Tifa be alone after all she goes through to help the Real Cloud come back. And Zack won’t be getting one if the woman he loves ends up in the arms of his best friend. And I doubt the devs will do that to him if “everyone gets a happy ending.”

This is, of course, assuming Kitase’s definition of happy ending is the same as everyone else.

This is the same guy that interpreted humanity to be gone in the epilogue (even though Nojima says otherwise) and still considers that to be a happy ending. Pretty sure it was him that said that.

 

[thetriplerhyme]

Zack saying “save her” could mean a lot of things, but not necessarily that Aerith will be alive in the end.

I agree saving her could mean different things ~ I dont think she's alive eitherway

But to be honest, if Aerith is brought back then they’ll do the same for Zack. (I hope not, I think both of them should remain dead by the end of the series). You can still make that sorta happy by having them be together in the Lifestream.

So I don’t think CA fans will get what they want either way. Either Aerith and Zack will both be alive and together. Or they’ll be dead and together.

- if that's the setup devs want Cloud should have regain his true self since Remake to settle his score with childhood friend whom he adore / crush /love since childhood ~ that's too much work and w/ story we have now C/A 'happy ending' is more likely less than none. ( I'm sure 100% as Aerith herself made the final word on that last date )

If everyone’s getting a “happy ending” then the devs aren’t gonna have Tifa be alone after all she goes through to help the Real Cloud come back. And Zack won’t be getting one if the woman he loves ends up in the arms of his best friend. And I doubt the devs will do that to him if “everyone gets a happy ending.”

they're holding on to that hope' of multiple timelines with Kitase saying we're following the OG script then most likely the MCU timeline they're expecting is another blur in line ~

The most nail on their' beliefs is when Nojima says he have to study "Buddhism’s Yogachara and Jung’s theory of the collective unconscious" they gave a hint that this is how the 'game world works and ending in part 3" - this is hard to comprehend personally if anyone can give me ideas and correct me let me know pleaase ~

As I understand via google this believes mean what your mind perceive will come true ~ sometimes the unconvious desires of your innerself makes it true - soo in this theory maybe those otherworlds are one inner self ( whether is Aerith or Zack ) desire to make it happened. { this is just me though }

I also saw another take " why following a boring almost 30 y/o game without changing anything just visual.. "

Whaat? i mean.. this is FINAL FANTASY VII we're here to enjoy original story of the game why are they here is they dont like the OG story ~ its kinda obvious where does this take comes from~

 

[GamerSkull]

I also saw another take " why following a boring almost 30 y/o game without changing anything just visual.. "

Whaat? i mean.. this is FINAL FANTASY VII we're here to enjoy original story of the game why are they here is they dont like the OG story ~ its kinda obvious where does this take comes from~

That’s just cope. It’s more than just a visual upgrade. It’s literally a different game with different gameplay mechanics. The scenes are also redone in full modern graphics vs polygons.

Other recent remakes that are closer to the original don’t get this crap. I think people don’t actually want changes, they just want Aerith to be alive. So they’re pretending to prefer changes simply so that can have this one specific change that they’ve been pining for.

Because other than Aerith’s fate which has been the same, I would say there are quite a few changes to the OG story already.

 

[Hellenic]

So I don’t think CA fans will get what they want either way. Either Aerith and Zack will both be alive and together. Or they’ll be dead and together.

If everyone’s getting a “happy ending” then the devs aren’t gonna have Tifa be alone after all she goes through to help the Real Cloud come back. And Zack won’t be getting one if the woman he loves ends up in the arms of his best friend. And I doubt the devs will do that to him if “everyone gets a happy ending.”

This is always so weird to me, like how do people not get the point of Tifa and Zack being there? Like it's just a hard fact that these 2 characters exist for a reason here and it's not to be sidelined so they can watch Cloud and Aerith make out.

Those 2 characters being in the roles they are make this whole thing abundantly clear, yet people somehow ignore it. I just don't get what they expect for these 2 characters otherwise.

 

[frosty]

I just don't get what they expect for these 2 characters otherwise.

I've seen

• Zack and Tifa can end up with each other because Tifa is too depressive for Cloud and Zack is too high energy for Aerith
• Tifa is a person better off alone because its a good story for her to learn to be strong and independent
• Tifa can have Cloud in one timeline and Aerith can have one in another

" why following a boring almost 30 y/o game without changing anything just visual.. "

Lol this is just cope at this point. Resident Evil /Capcom and Naughty Dog all laughing their way to the bank

 

[GamerSkull]

I've seen

• Zack and Tifa can end up with each other because Tifa is too depressive for Cloud and Zack is too high energy for Aerith
• Tifa is a person better off alone because its a good story for her to learn to be strong and independent
• Tifa can have Cloud in one timeline and Aerith can have one in another

Lol this is just cope at this point. Resident Evil /Capcom and Naughty Dog all laughing their way to the bank

Square isn’t gonna do the first one. Would be super random. Also Zack is too high energy for the high energy girl?

For the second one, could that not apply to Aerith as well. Why does she need Cloud?

For the third one… just lol.

 

[Hellenic]

I've seen

• Zack and Tifa can end up with each other because Tifa is too depressive for Cloud and Zack is too high energy for Aerith
• Tifa is a person better off alone because its a good story for her to learn to be strong and independent
• Tifa can have Cloud in one timeline and Aerith can have one in another

Yeah they like to pair them together just to get them both away from their respective ships, while Tifa basically doesn't care one bit about Zack in that way and they've barely even interacted all things considered. Doubt things would really change at this point either when one of them is already dead, so no real room to connect between Tifa and Zack anyway.

As if Tifa didn't have to be independent already when she was forced to slave it away in Midgar just to survive and get herself the bar. She's already been independent for years before Cloud even dropped back to her life, but hey i'll give this one to them for not having read Traces, couse they don't really care about the Aerith side of that book anyway.

I don't even know what to say to the third point honestly, just no.

 

[Ryushikaze]

If we're talking multiple timelines, why not just have Zack fall into the timeline where Aerith is still alive and Bob's your uncle?

 

[nars305]

If we're talking multiple timelines, why not just have Zack fall into the timeline where Aerith is still alive and Bob's your un

Because that makes too much sense.

If you want to understand the narrative, you have to think backwards. Apparently.

 

[Sacky]

I love how they think let's abandon all story and have a world where Cloud gets shipped with this character. Like you can only come to this conclusion if you only see this game as characters getting shipped. Also what other Cloud are they even talking about the comatose one? XD that's if these worlds are even living worlds and not just the lifestream memories and souls. But let's say it is a multiverse this Cloud wakes up finds out most people are either Dead or missing we still don't have an answer on that. To wake up he needs Tifa anyway to even form a persona. Then he would what get told that ok your staying in this world with this flower girl or do they want the Cloud we play as to live in another world with Aerith because he sure would abandon all bonds he made since only one person matters to him???

Square isn’t gonna do the first one. Would be super random. Also Zack is too high energy for the high energy girl?

For the second one, could that not apply to Aerith as well. Why does she need Cloud?

For the third one… just lol

 

[Yoru]

If we're talking multiple timelines, why not just have Zack fall into the timeline where Aerith is still alive and Bob's your uncle?

Good Try. But we all know here that's impossible.

The access to the timeline is way to high. Pretty simple to see what the dev are trying to do here. Must I remind you of the height of our characters ? Yes my dude, bingo. Zack is taller than Cloud. Pretty clear detail to understand he'll be the one to boost Cloud up through. Because Zack is the ultimate wingman. He already accepted defeat in Rebirth in case you didn't know. He's dumb anyway so who cares ?

What about Tifa ? I think we all know where she is. In jail. The Shinra police is sure coming after her for being the Nibelheim Bullies leader. Her character in inspired by Biff Tannen from Back to the Future. I have all the evidence but I can't show you now

 

[Ryushikaze]

Good Try. But we all know here that's impossible.

The access to the timeline is way to high. Pretty simple to see what the dev are trying to do here. Must I remind you of the height of our characters ? Yes my dude, bingo. Zack is taller than Cloud. Pretty clear detail to understand he'll be the one to boost Cloud up through. Because Zack is the ultimate wingman. He already accepted defeat in Rebirth in case you didn't know. He's dumb anyway so who cares ?

What about Tifa ? I think we all know where she is. In jail. The Shinra police is sure coming after her for being the Nibleheim Bullies leader. Her character in inspired by Biff Tanen from Back to the Future. I have all the evidence but I can't show you now

You need to get some casual character assassination of Cloud going in on there too to really complete the satire.

Switching back to serious talk for a second, one thing I think we need to keep in mind is that for Aerith, Cloud is the consolation prize. Like, as Marlene says, Aerith started liking Cloud because Zack wasn't there, because of Zack-like elements he presented. Rebirth has reiterated that Aerith still isn't over Zack and I think if she knew what he's done to try and get back to her she would gladly reunite with him in an instant.

 

[nars305]

What about Tifa ? I think we all know where she is. In jail. The Shinra police is sure coming after her for being the Nibleheim Bullies leader. Her character in inspired by Biff Tanen from Back to the Future. I have all the evidence but I can't show you now

Everything else you said is correct, except this part which I can’t agree with.

Tifa is actually going to be the one to die. She might actually already be. It’s evident in the promotional poster where Sephiroth’s sword is pointing at Tifa instead of Aerith.

 

[GamerSkull]

You’d know who’d be better for Cloud?

Cissnei.

Why? No clue. I just want him out of the way for Aerti.