Shinra's Experiments With Non-SOLDIER Combatants in the Remake
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ForceStealer
Double Growth
Mainly because of us 
(By which I mean, TLS, not me)
(By which I mean, TLS, not me)
leadmyskeptic
Pro Adventurer
Mainly because of us
(By which I mean, TLS, not me)
Oh yeah, this is DEFINITELY true (both poring over the Wiki, as well as the ever-detailed breakdowns of Ultimania information)! And I have to thank ya'll for all the work you've put it in adding to the wiki, as well as the translations of the Ultimania...long before I was even familiar with this site, let alone the forum, I was reading the Ultimania translations done by the team here as (I'm sure probably illicitly) posted elsewhere : )
But, even though having the information available in English at all is a godsend (further explanations/clarifications of plot elements that DID make it into the finished game, not to mention all that alternate/unused stuff...the multiple Reds!! Fucking COBALT?? Lol), I still found myself hankering to be able to hold the finished book, with the appropriate images, presentations, screenshots etc, alongside English text. If I wanted to be hardcore, I suppose I could buy the Japanese version, and attempt to 'read along' with the English translations online, but...I dunno if the feeling would be the same, haha.
All that said, for somewhere between 20-30 bucks, even an art heavy book with a small bit of commentary on 7,8, and 9 is still definitely something worth purchasing, for me. As far as I'm concerned, the PSX trilogy is still the FF high-water mark, so. For anyone who has Volume 2...as far as 'text' goes, is it more or less just descriptions? Or is there a bit of developer commentary type stuff thrown in?
The Twilight Mexican
Ex-SeeD-ingly good
- AKA
- TresDias
There are a few direct quote developer comments at the back of each volume, but the text accompanying images throughout the book is what I think you mean when you say "just descriptions."
That said, a number of these descriptions contain insightful details that clearly came from the developers.
That said, a number of these descriptions contain insightful details that clearly came from the developers.
leadmyskeptic
Pro Adventurer
Hmmm...now I'm kind of intrigued, I'll have to find a good example screenshot or some such. I'm imagining like a more detailed 'Bestiary Entry' type of thing? I dunno, I'm sure it's hard to articulae exactly how its presented and all.
ForceStealer
Double Growth
I was amazed in the first volume how they translated the art notes but still looking like they were handwritten, that was a nice touch
pxp
Pro Adventurer
Reminds me of the Clerith limit break that was unfortunately ditched (intended so that Aerith could “pep up” all of her allies, to borrow DQXI terminology, but the storyboard is very Clerith).
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pxp
Pro Adventurer
That’d be the one yes - thanks. I’m really optimistic that some of the old ideas will be reimplemented as you mentioned above. It would indeed be a waste not to and I don’t see why not.Are you referring to this?
That’s what’s so exciting about this - they have so much to work with here, old and new.
X-SOLDIER
Harbinger O Great Justice
- AKA
- X
Not the best resolution, but we do get to see one of these dudes to a backflip in the new trailer, about 10 seconds in.
SUPER long claws, and they're all in a fixed position, rather than doing the idle finger-drumming motion. Additionally, they're all spaced evenly around the front, rather than having the four on top in a finger-like arrangement. Also, their super long feet and toe claws are very prominent. We can tell that their heads are fully contained, without the gaps between the top and eyepiece like the original had.
It's clearly different from the Original and the Mobius Artwork, so it'll be interesting to see if we get any solid details around what these guys are.
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SUPER long claws, and they're all in a fixed position, rather than doing the idle finger-drumming motion. Additionally, they're all spaced evenly around the front, rather than having the four on top in a finger-like arrangement. Also, their super long feet and toe claws are very prominent. We can tell that their heads are fully contained, without the gaps between the top and eyepiece like the original had.
It's clearly different from the Original and the Mobius Artwork, so it'll be interesting to see if we get any solid details around what these guys are.
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X-SOLDIER
Harbinger O Great Justice
- AKA
- X
Thanks to @Cloud_S for the cross-post from Reddit with new images that got these for us:
The detail differences that I noticed are definitely present, but VERY interestingly, the Elite troopers have the viewport gap that the standard variants are missing. I can't make out in the wording on their arm pieces match the original versions for their variants, but there are some notes for their claw articulation and other things, that I'll have to see if I can get some translations on.
X
The detail differences that I noticed are definitely present, but VERY interestingly, the Elite troopers have the viewport gap that the standard variants are missing. I can't make out in the wording on their arm pieces match the original versions for their variants, but there are some notes for their claw articulation and other things, that I'll have to see if I can get some translations on.
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X-SOLDIER
Harbinger O Great Justice
- AKA
- X
The claws are definitely an an interesting shift, but I'm still not entirely convinced that the people inside are normal humans, even just based on the way that the one we see in the short trailer does a backflip to disengage & attack Cloud. That movement isn't really what you see from the MPs and other troopers, and the Shock Troopers don't have any visual enhancements around their bodies that would improve that movement. The only other character we see capable of something like that is Tifa when she's attacking APS. While a game's PCs are often supernaturally capable, you usually don't see something like that from "normal" human enemies, but only ones who are somehow enhanced (like the SOLDIER).
I'm curious if they've kept the Japanese name the same for these units, since it was originally 戦闘員. What's interesting is that they're more closely in line with the Aero Combatants now in that the claws are complete hand covers, and not really implemented like finger-extensions the way that they had been previously (which makes me wonder how they're going to portray the Armored versions when you break the exoskeletons.
While they definitely seem more in the line of the standard MPs and other Troopers when compared to the Mobius artwork, there's still a REALLY weird vibe from them when compared to the standard human troops, even in the Remake concept art. The MPs and such have what you'd expect for armor, and assuming that Cloud's SOLDIER uniform is mostly what you'd expect, the Shock Troopers still have this very... armored bodysuit look to them, but without any functional armor.
The rivet contact points on the darker areas of the suit are especially interesting, because everything about these troops still make it seem like they're assembled into or otherwise bolted in to these suits – in a way where there isn't a clear way for them to disengage them on their own. The only thing with these ones is that by the elbow area there's a seam that makes it seem like they can rotate their hands/forearms, rather than having them locked into position, but it still doesn't seem like they can disengage the actual hand/arm containers on their own.
The detail on the top image makes it seem like the nodes on the helmet are still ventilation like the original, though I'm seeing if I can get some translations of the annotations for that image to see if there's any more useful context to compare with the notes from the other troopers from the OG.
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I'm curious if they've kept the Japanese name the same for these units, since it was originally 戦闘員. What's interesting is that they're more closely in line with the Aero Combatants now in that the claws are complete hand covers, and not really implemented like finger-extensions the way that they had been previously (which makes me wonder how they're going to portray the Armored versions when you break the exoskeletons.
While they definitely seem more in the line of the standard MPs and other Troopers when compared to the Mobius artwork, there's still a REALLY weird vibe from them when compared to the standard human troops, even in the Remake concept art. The MPs and such have what you'd expect for armor, and assuming that Cloud's SOLDIER uniform is mostly what you'd expect, the Shock Troopers still have this very... armored bodysuit look to them, but without any functional armor.
The rivet contact points on the darker areas of the suit are especially interesting, because everything about these troops still make it seem like they're assembled into or otherwise bolted in to these suits – in a way where there isn't a clear way for them to disengage them on their own. The only thing with these ones is that by the elbow area there's a seam that makes it seem like they can rotate their hands/forearms, rather than having them locked into position, but it still doesn't seem like they can disengage the actual hand/arm containers on their own.
The detail on the top image makes it seem like the nodes on the helmet are still ventilation like the original, though I'm seeing if I can get some translations of the annotations for that image to see if there's any more useful context to compare with the notes from the other troopers from the OG.
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Wolf_
Pro Adventurer
I always figured the monsters in the pods were failed SOLDIER recruits. I’m sure I read in one of the books that there was a high rate of failure in regards to their mental capacity and that it was covered up with the whole “accident on a training excercise”. Cloud for example was always physically strong enough, but not mentally. I thought they’d have a physical that needed to be passed, then maybe a psychological evaluation (which cloud failed) then the procedure. There must have been a failure rate even if they were deemed fit for the process. Then being brain dead Hojo could effectively do what he wanted to them. Perhaps weaponise them into those combatants.
LicoriceAllsorts
Donator
Maybe they volunteered to serve in this regiment? I like to think so, but knowing Shinra....
X-SOLDIER
Harbinger O Great Justice
- AKA
- X
View attachment 4988
In the Remake, the Combatants are a part of the Public Security, but they're drugged up & encased in special suits. Their voices are distorted, but they actually have dialogue with Avalanche when you fight them.
When Barret gets attacked, he says, "That all you got?" and he shoots back, but then the Trooper repeats that line back at him in his vocally distorted voice, "That all you got?!"
I'm gonna see if I can do a playthrough again later tonight, and adjust the sound effects in the audio to see if I can compile some clips of the enemy dialogue that's a bit more clear. I know that there are a number of little encounters that have specific dialogue snippits that only come up when using certain attacks, like the second two Guards you fight if you use Fire against them:
Either way, I meant to update this thread earlier, but hopefully there'll be a bit more more goodness to dig into in the Demo – and lots more once April rolls around.
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Strangelove
AI Researcher
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- hitoshura
wait, how do you get that enemy info?
i played the demo, did i just completely miss it?
i played the demo, did i just completely miss it?
X-SOLDIER
Harbinger O Great Justice
- AKA
- X
It doesn't tell you, but you can press the touchpad at any point in combat to see enemy data.
You can see the other enemy data in this post: https://thelifestream.net/forums/threads/final-fantasy-vii-remake-demo-out-now.22313/post-841176
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You can see the other enemy data in this post: https://thelifestream.net/forums/threads/final-fantasy-vii-remake-demo-out-now.22313/post-841176
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X-SOLDIER
Harbinger O Great Justice
- AKA
- X
It's worth noting that the two Shock Troopers in the second encounter have slightly different voices, so it looks like they might play with the pitch/speed of the recorded lines to give identical enemies a little bit of variety, which is really cool. This also helped in catching some of the voice lines, since the first Shock Trooper's higher pitch made a couple of lines a little tough to pick out.
These are the dialogue snippits that I think I've managed to work out:
*maniacal laughter*
"Nice trick"
"Ever been flayed!?"
"This might hurt!"
"Got ya!"
"Nuh-uh!!"
"That all you got?"
"Please."
"So long!"
"Take a hike!"
"See you in hell!"
I'm gonna go back through and turn off the Music AND the Sound Effects during the escape section, and get a more clean recording. I'm also gonna remember to use some magic, and maybe try to let Cloud or Barret get KO'd since there might be some contextual lines of dialogue to low health / KO'd party members, since the "See you in hell!" line only happened once near the end of the second fight.
Either way, there's a LOT of character baked in to these guys from the description and mannerisms, but the line that stood out to me most poignantly as the, "Ever been flayed!?" one. Given that we know they're pumped full of drugs and in special suits, it definitely made me wonder if their suits are actually serving as skin for them given how tight fit they are, and still being described as "reinforced"
Also, I was wondering if I'd be able to bug @Tetsujin & @Strangelove to grab the Enemy Description for these guys from the German & Japanese versions, so that we can see if there are flavor text discrepancies like we had all over the place in FFXV. (Also, if you want to compare dialogue snippits, that'd be super cool, but I don't want to ask too much).
I was thinking I might try to do a little follow-up write-up on these guys before the Remake drops to help spark some extra appreciation for the little details in the game that might be easy to overlook.
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X-SOLDIER
Harbinger O Great Justice
- AKA
- X
I mean, you can change the language and grab those enemy descriptions yourself, you know
You can definitely tell that I make posts as I'm still getting my brain spun up for the day.I will do that then! Would I be able to enlist your assistance in accurate translation of said thing once I do?
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