Something's wrong, and I'm gonna say it - FFXIII Spoilers abound

[Makoeyes987]

Let me preface this by stating that by no means, do I want my own opinion and conclusion to have a negative effect on how anyone perceives this game. I want people to play this and/or look at the facts on their own with an open mind. I am by no means, trying to tell people what to think or ruin this experience for them. But frankly, I think this needs to be talked about, or at least brought to fans' attention.

Now... as most know and have seen, I haven't really been looking at or talking about FFXIII much at all. I wanted to go into the game fresh, like I always do with each main installment of Final Fantasy. Getting spoilers of a main installment kills the experience for me. So if I'm wrong, or there's something I'm overlooking, please. Tell me. And keep that in mind. I don't own this game, nor do I even fully get its story.

However, I have played the demo, have heard from several different people who've seen the game, and have seen an in depth review of its gameplay, done by Wired, which you can read here. And that's what I'm commenting on now.


Now barring some strange, unforeseen miscomunication or misrepresentation of what FFXIII is in terms of its gameplay... There's a problem here. And I'm talking about a big fucking problem. A problem that's not something you can argue away, play semantics with, or ignore.

This game is shit. And I'm not saying that to troll, be witty, or make a point. I'm saying...This game is an inferior product in terms of its gameplay when compared to other installments in its franchise. Or hell, any other RPG or game like it. It's been downgraded to the point it insults me as a gamer of FF, and a consumer. Its features and gameplay are of a spinoff, not a main installment of Final Fantasy. And I don't say this fucking lightly. If you strip away the bells and whistles...what the hell is left? Final Fantasy is close to my heart as one of my favorite gaming franchises since I was a kid. And it not only hurts, it angers me.

I do not spend 60 damn dollars on an RPG to have it be told in chapter installments where the game not only holds my hand..but literally CARRIES ME ON PIGGY BACK through each fight, essentially play its self while I sit down and watch cutscenes, and then repeat again, while I go from one goddamn killing tube, to the next.

There's something wrong here. And unless this storyline makes me piss myself (and I mean literally lose urinary control), ejaculate and cry uncontrollably, there's no penitence for this sin. There just isn't.

I think story is important. I love Final Fantasy for its stories. But for God's sake, they're games for a reason. If they want to just tell stories, JUST MAKE FUCKING CGI MOVIES. Don't dress them up in the package of a goddamn game, and make it nothing more than an interactive movie. It's an insult to my intelligence. The story and gameplay should go HAND IN HAND. It should not supersede the very game itself. My game should not PLAY ITS FUCKING SELF WHILE BABY STEPPING ME THROUGH THE ENTIRE STORY.

I've never, ever, been let down, or truly angry at Square Enix before. They've been my childhood friend and neighbor for years. They've always done right, and while there have been lows, there have also been highs, and over all its been a positive, and healthy friendship and relationship over the years. Hell, we went to barbecues, picnics, parties...we've been through thick and thin.

....And then one day, Square Enix shat on my lawn, threw a rock at me and gave me the finger. And called it FFXIII.

So. Someone tell me. What the fuck is going on? Is this true? Tell me I'm wrong and there are side quests, exploration, travel, interaction with NPCs, actual difficulty in combat, ultimate, optional side bosses, and the ability to not just go from one killing tube to the next. Please, tell me there's some sort of replay value here. I'm begging you. I want to be wrong here, and I'm not lying.

Because, I'm seriously not quite sure I even want to bother buying this game at all. Because its not a game. Not a Final Fantasy one at least. It's a fucking movie that's overpriced by 40 dollars. A PS2 era Final Fantasy, which had less space for data, was better in terms of its content, than this.

It's like Resident Evil 5, except worse, because the drop in quality is all the more steep since it's Final Fantasy. If I just wanted to watch my games play themselves, I'd fucking just youtube it and be done with it.

 

[Dark and Divine]

Mako, have you already read the reports that Hito had been making in the "Final Fantasy XIII" thread?

Hopefully, it will calm you down a bit concerning this matter.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Yeah, I have today at Tresdias's mentioning, and frankly they don't make me feel better at all.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

Any issues that may be there with FFXIII are more than made up for by

Spoiler

FangxVanille

. And Yaag. Because he's awesome.

Seriously, though, the character interaction is great, and if that's what you feel is most important, then you won't be disappointed with FFXIII. Even though that review from Wired is pretty much on the money as far as I can tell.

Mako, have you already read the reports that Hito had been making in the "Final Fantasy XIII" thread?

Hopefully, it will calm you down a bit concerning this matter.

I expect the things hito reported to make Mako more concerned, actually. No shops, but you can buy shit from save points? XD

Mako's gonna shit a brick before this day is over.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Like I said, I find character interaction, development and story to be very important Tres. Definitely.

But there's a point where a game needs to be a game, and be evaluated as such. Again. If I wanted to just enjoy good storytelling, plot development, and character interaction, I'll pick up a book, and read, or watch a good movie. A game should include that, but never forget its also supposed to be a game and hold up its quality as one.

If the story is great, that's fine. But then why the fuck should I bother buying it?

 

[Dark and Divine]

I expect the things hito reported to make Mako more concerned, actually.

I was referring to the part where Hito says that there's a good balance between cutscenes and gameplay, but okay!

But then why the fuck should I bother buying it?

To give Nomura a few more bucks for pornz?

 

[Makoeyes987]

Nomura can make his own porn, with how sexily he draws his ladies.

But seriously, I'm very disappointed in this. I don't understand how this became almost every old school FF fan's worst nightmare.

 

[Alex]

Is this a troll?

 

[Super Mario]

I have a feeling... that I think I'm gonna wait for Versus XIII.........

 

[Vendel]

Let me preface this by stating that by no means, do I want my own opinion and conclusion to have a negative effect on how anyone perceives this game. I want people to play this and/or look at the facts on their own with an open mind. I am by no means, trying to tell people what to think or ruin this experience for them. But frankly, I think this needs to be talked about, or at least brought to fans' attention.

Now... as most know and have seen, I haven't really been looking at or talking about FFXIII much at all. I wanted to go into the game fresh, like I always do with each main installment of Final Fantasy. Getting spoilers of a main installment kills the experience for me. So if I'm wrong, or there's something I'm overlooking, please. Tell me. And keep that in mind. I don't own this game, nor do I even fully get its story.

However, I have played the demo, have heard from several different people who've seen the game, and have seen an in depth review of its gameplay, done by Wired, which you can read here. And that's what I'm commenting on now.


Now barring some strange, unforeseen miscomunication or misrepresentation of what FFXIII is in terms of its gameplay... There's a problem here. And I'm talking about a big fucking problem. A problem that's not something you can argue away, play semantics with, or ignore.

This game is shit. And I'm not saying that to troll, be witty, or make a point. I'm saying...This game is an inferior product in terms of its gameplay when compared to other installments in its franchise. Or hell, any other RPG or game like it. It's been downgraded to the point it insults me as a gamer of FF, and a consumer. Its features and gameplay are of a spinoff, not a main installment of Final Fantasy. And I don't say this fucking lightly. If you strip away the bells and whistles...what the hell is left? Final Fantasy is close to my heart as one of my favorite gaming franchises since I was a kid. And it not only hurts, it angers me.

I do not spend 60 damn dollars on an RPG to have it be told in chapter installments where the game not only holds my hand..but literally CARRIES ME ON PIGGY BACK through each fight, essentially play its self while I sit down and watch cutscenes, and then repeat again, while I go from one goddamn killing tube, to the next.

There's something wrong here. And unless this storyline makes me piss myself (and I mean literally lose urinary control), ejaculate and cry uncontrollably, there's no penitence for this sin. There just isn't.

I think story is important. I love Final Fantasy for its stories. But for God's sake, they're games for a reason. If they want to just tell stories, JUST MAKE FUCKING CGI MOVIES. Don't dress them up in the package of a goddamn game, and make it nothing more than an interactive movie. It's an insult to my intelligence. The story and gameplay should go HAND IN HAND. It should not supersede the very game itself. My game should not PLAY ITS FUCKING SELF WHILE BABY STEPPING ME THROUGH THE ENTIRE STORY.

I've never, ever, been let down, or truly angry at Square Enix before. They've been my childhood friend and neighbor for years. They've always done right, and while there have been lows, there have also been highs, and over all its been a positive, and healthy friendship and relationship over the years. Hell, we went to barbecues, picnics, parties...we've been through thick and thin.

....And then one day, Square Enix shat on my lawn, threw a rock at me and gave me the finger. And called it FFXIII.

So. Someone tell me. What the fuck is going on? Is this true? Tell me I'm wrong and there are side quests, exploration, travel, interaction with NPCs, actual difficulty in combat, ultimate, optional side bosses, and the ability to not just go from one killing tube to the next. Please, tell me there's some sort of replay value here. I'm begging you. I want to be wrong here, and I'm not lying.

Because, I'm seriously not quite sure I even want to bother buying this game at all. Because its not a game. Not a Final Fantasy one at least. It's a fucking movie that's overpriced by 40 dollars. A PS2 era Final Fantasy, which had less space for data, was better in terms of its content, than this.

It's like Resident Evil 5, except worse, because the drop in quality is all the more steep since it's Final Fantasy. If I just wanted to watch my games play themselves, I'd fucking just youtube it and be done with it.

Cool story bro.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Is this a troll?

I'm not trolling, man. I'm serious. Like I said, look at it yourself, and experience it first hand. I'm just going by what I've heard corroborated several times, about its gameplay. If I'm wrong, then awesome. I want to be, cause I've been looking forward to this for awhile.

But I need my games to have content to make me want to play it. Not just watch it, but play it. I dunno, it just seems like its been stripped of that, significantly.

 

[Super Mario]

Stop your ondore's lies god damn, or else I'm gonna have to wait for Versus XIII which I'm sure will probably let me down too!

 

[Makoeyes987]

Stop your ondore's lies god damn, or else I'm gonna have to wait for Versus XIII which I'm sure will probably let me down too!

Dude. Read the review and what hito, Tres, and everyone else has said. You can watch someone even play it.

Again, unless there's some vast conspiracy to hide what FFXIII's gameplay is like, something is seriously missing here. I wish I were lying, but I'm not.

How the fuck can there be any difficulty in a game that heals you after every fight, allows you to re-do a fight you lost, lets you shop at every save point, and controls your party members completely, without any input from the player?

 

[Animexcel]

I'm not really digging any of the characters when I saw the trailer. There was some fluff in there that turned me off. It doesn't belong in the Final Fantasy world, though I wouldn't be surprised if the X-2 girls made a crossover.

 

[Super Mario]

Are you serious??? No sidequests? No nothing? what the hell is this? XII had the elements of a good RPG game! why did XIII degrade?? or rather...DECAYED?

 

[Makoeyes987]

I'm not really digging any of the characters when I saw the trailer. There was some fluff in there that turned me off. It doesn't belong in the Final Fantasy world, though I wouldn't be surprised if the X-2 girls made a crossover.

I'm not really talking about the characters or the design. I love them. They look great, and from what I hear, the story is awesome as is the interaction.

But what about the game? Again, what's the point of it being a game, if its not even going to present itself as a well polished game in the first place? How the hell can FFXII have more exploratory enivronments, difficulty, and RPG content as a game, than FFXIII, which is on a fucking Blu-Ray disc? How the hell did all of that get lost in development?

Are you serious??? No sidequests? No nothing? what the hell is this? XII had the elements of a good RPG game! why did XIII degrade?? or rather...DECAYED?

Someone needs to tell me what they are, because so far I have heard there are none. No optional super bosses, no side quests, no exploration. Nothing. You just go from chapter to chapter (and I fucking HATE chapters) with the story.

It being described as linear is quite literal. It's more linear than FFX apparently. And that's rather bizarre.

 

[Dark and Divine]

There's a side-quest like the hunts in FFXII.

Apparently, you'll hunt monsters for monoliths wich were L'Cie Corpses before they changed into the aforementioned monoliths.

Some of the hunts are quite harder than the final boss.

Other than that, I don't know if there's any more side-quests.

 

[Makoeyes987]

There's a side-quest like the hunts in FFXII.

Apparently, you'll hunt monsters for monoliths wich were L'Cie Corpses before they changed into the aforementioned monoliths.

Some of the hunts are quite harder than the final boss.

Other than that, I don't know if there's any more side-quests.

Interesting. How many are there, and when can you do it?

Although it still is difficult for me to fathom how hard a boss could be given the gameplay mechanics being stacked in your favor so.

But thank you. That's..one. Hopefully there's more.

 

[Super Mario]

There's a side-quest like the hunts in FFXII.

Yes we already know that man.

 

[Dark and Divine]

You can do it in the non-linear part of the game, more or less after Chapter 10 or so.

Don't really know how many, but I think i've read somewhere that they were around 100(?). Not really sure.

 

[Vendel]

Interesting. How many are there, and when can you do it?

Although it still is difficult for me to fathom how hard a boss could be given the gameplay mechanics being stacked in your favor so.

But thank you. That's..one. Hopefully there's more.

Geeze Mako. Reading this thread feels like we're trying to talk you off the ledge.

Calm down. Take a deep breath or two. And give me your admin powers just to be safe.

 

[Dark and Divine]

Yes we already know that man.

Apparently, Mako didn't knew.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Like I said in my original post, no, I've been steering clear of most spoilers of FFXIII. So yeah, that was news to me.

And 100? Well that's not bad. That leaves room for one of them to be fairly challenging.

I feel a bit better, but that doesn't quite make up for the content that's been stripped here.

I think this part of the WIRED review says it best:

Movies abhor nonlinearity. Though Final Fantasy is considered to be one of the game series that pushed the medium toward cinematic storytelling, the RPG genre is now (ironically) one of the least amenable to a strictly linear storyline told with highly detailed graphics. Every bit of customization in an RPG — tweaking your characters, taking branching paths, completing side missions — restricts the designers’ ability to create a thrill-ride, action-packed movie of a game.

So Square dumped it all. Well, not all of it: The developers kept just barely enough that Final Fantasy XIII qualifies as a videogame, not a movie. It’s got one gameplay mechanic: battles. It’s got Gil, shops, Chocobos and Potions, but all these things seem vestigial, there because they have to be, not because they serve any compelling purpose.

Now if that's the case, I'm disappointed. Verily.

Calm down. Take a deep breath or two. And give me your admin powers just to be safe.

You wish.

 

[DrakeClawfang]

Let's be fair Mako, the game has been out for what, a week? I'll bet most players are just zipping through the game AFAP to learn the story and such. Give it a bit longer and let people begin to explore the game, I'll bet there's several sidequests. It's not like we need to know like, *now*, we've got two or three months to hear about FF13 and judge if we want it.

 

[Makoeyes987]

Let's be fair Mako, the game has been out for what, a week? I'll bet most players are just zipping through the game AFAP to learn the story and such. Give it a bit longer and let people begin to explore the game, I'll bet there's several sidequests. It's not like we need to know like, *now*, we've got two or three months to hear about FF13 and judge if we want it.

See, that's what I thought earlier. But the fact the game unfolds via chapters, is disheartening, and all this has been corroborated by several players. You can't turn back. Dark and Divine says there's a point in the game where you can do other stuff after Chapter 11 so I hope there's more than just hunting some monsters.

But yeah, if there's more stuff, that's awesome. And I suppose there's always the possibility of Download Content.

Still am pissed about how much of FF's RPG elements were stripped away out of this. A major part of its immersion and world development has been essentially chucked out the window. That doesn't fly with me. This game feels watered down.