Terminator: Genisys & New James Cameron Film

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
Finished Terminator 2 last night (the extended edition because I apparently own an old DVD that won't play the theatrical version in normal players).

Watching it, I've been trying to get my mind into the different trajectory that Genisys is gonna take things on, and I'm really excited. The shift from the first and second film in terms of tone and character focus is interesting, and I like how this new one looks to be building from it. I also found myself focusing a lot more on the T-800's developments as a character and how the progressions for the new film look to be using them:

• Sarah: Helpless survivor >> Paranoid badass >> Stable & prepared
• John: Future leader >> Pro-human/machine interaction >> T-3000
• T-800: Terminator >> Protector >> Guardian


That's all speculation from ads and whatnot, since I won't see the new film for another 11 hours, but putting the first two fresh in my mind (and having watched all 4 of them at the start of the year to keep the whole timeline that's about to be overwritten in my head for where Guardian is from), I'm in as good a place as I think I can be to take in what the film is going for.

So yeah. Expect opinions tonight from your resident optimist. :monster:




X :neo:
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
First, here's your tl;dr non-spoiler -- It's good, but not mindblowing. It does some things exceptionally well and doesn't do others as well as it could've. Most importantly, there's a mid-credit scene that will make you like the movie a lot more the more you think about it, because it's a HUGE part of why the film is very very clever.

Right - Let's get into it.

The movie feels surprisingly short. It's 2 hours 6 mins, but it easily could've added another 15 mins or so to flesh out
• I'd love to have SEEN Sarah's final moments with her parents, and a little extra around the edges there. I think that establishing the fact that the T-1000 was attempting to track them down for the whole time from when she was 9 until May 12th, 1984 would've added a lot of tension to the early events.
• Getting a little more neutral time together with Kyle, Sarah, & Pops would've been good, 'cause they seem to have good chemistry, but their time together is all very under the wire. (One of the reasons I'm excited about where this could go).
• More Danny Dyson because he was awesome and underrated. Maybe more of him & John.
• A bit more Chief O'Brien.
• The whole scene of Skynet taking out John & the remaining Resistance team, followed by sending John back.

So here's the basics: Terminator's original timeline happens, but there's a change. We get to see the future war that's very accurate to the one in T1/T2. One group goes to attack the Skynet central core (the main fight), while John and Kyle hit the real primary target -- the time displacement equipment. We see it up through Kyle getting sent back, but just as he does -- Matt Smith attacks John Connor.

What is interesting is that this causes an anomaly during Kyle's time travel such that he retains partial memories of himself from the new timeline. One he and the T-800 arrive, they run through the start of The Terminator with their alterations in place. Sarah & Guardian take out the T-800, and get back to save Kyle and another of the miscellaneous cops from the T-1000.

From there, they lure the T-1000 into the trap that they've been setting for it, and also have to fight the T-800 that it manages to reboot (It looks like it's capable of forming itself well enough to repair basic damage to circuitry for other Terminators). There's a lot of addressing the fact that Sarah knowing that she's supposed to meet, fall in love with, and get impregnated by Kyle within 48 hours is super messed up now that she's aware of it and not really being given a choice.

Kyle manages to make a semi-convincing argument that they should be going into 2017 (because he has memories of his other self) rather than 1997 to stop J-Day, and after some debating, they TSCC themselves into the future with Pops left behind because of extensive damage to his arm. They show up on a freeway offramp and get injured being hit by a car before pops can pick them up, which means that -- J.K. Simmons (the cop who saw them and the T-1000 30 years ago) finds out and is determined to find out what's up.

John shows up, and we find out that Skynet took and converted him into a machine at a cellular level (experimentation that it was doing on human subjects to build better infiltrators that Pops knows about), and then it sent him back as a guardian to ensure that it was created, which it is via an interconnected OS app called Genisys, which is built by Danny Dyson. John (who I'll call the T-3000 from here on) uses his knowledge to start building mimetic polyalloy and the time displacement equipment as well as a side project, which he has all the funding he wants for assisting Danny in constructing Genisys on an extremely technical level to add all the Skynet specifics into it.


Kyle, Sarah, & Pops are now our funny little group, and fight off John before departing. Kyle gets to find out that Sarah knows that he dies, and she's determined to stop that as well, and try to choose her own future. They plan to blow up Skynet, but the T-3000 is always a step ahead of them.

More chases and the bus fight happens, then they're arrested and Kyle gets ID'd since he was born in 2004, but since he's 13 his family and him don't ID him. The T-3000 attacks, and they all evacuate (where Sarah tells Kyle the thing that he remembers and told her earlier in the film). They steal choppers to get to Cyberdyne and shut down Skynet. They have a big fight there, where their detonater gets destroyed and Skynet keeps confronting them as it grows through stages until it's back to hologram Matt Smith. To stop it from uploading everywhere and being online and unstoppable like it was in T3, they resort to putting a damaged Pops pinning down the T-3000 into the time displacement equipment and starting the machine to rip them apart and blow them to pieces while Sarah & Kyle go hide.

The T-800's chassis falls into the polyalloy, so Pops is able to repair and save Kyle and Sarah, since he's now a... T-1800. They go to see Young!Kyle again and bootstrap his younger self with a message about Genisys being Skynet to enable them to stop Skynet & helping Sarah trust him. Kyle & Sarah kiss because it's their choice to love each other now, and the three of them go off with some questions still there and looking for ways to find their own answers.

And the stinger is that -- the time displacement device was the ruse this time. Below everything else was the Skynet central core, and it's active complete with hologram Matt Smith (and likely hates humanity for attempting to destroy it as it was growing thus making its own motivation for the war loop back in on itself).


Aside from that, there's one other piece that seems really interesting.

Insofar as I can tell, the alternate timeline happens because someone (specifically left anonymous and erased from the T-800's memory, so that no one can plan to prevent it from occurring) sent pops back to protect Sarah from the T-1000, so it looks like the events of T2 got shifted away by this future not having a John Connor, so she became the primary target.



OK.


What this movie didn't manage to hit in some of its delivery, it manages fantastically in setup. It's got the good bits of T1, T2, & TSCC under its belt in how it used the original two films to build this, and then it made its 3 characters into a solid family dynamic who jumped forward in time and who we can ALL follow from film-to-film. It took the route that T4 shyed away from in making Connor into a machine, and we have a minor nod to T3 in Pops having an endosketeton and mimetic polyalloy skin by the end of the film.

All that setup seems to point towards the three of them doing more time travel in future films and staying a close knit group, and giving Skynet a face and a specific vendetta against the three of them as the examples of humanity it hates was exceptionally clever, and I REALLY hope that it does well enough for them to do a second one, because I feel like this could really find its legs in a sequel now that all the groundwork has been stripped apart and laid out.


But most importantly, Byung-Hun Lee is a fucking awesome T-1000.






X :neo:
 

Carlie

CltrAltDelicious
AKA
Chloe Frazer
I'm glad that you enjoyed it and your eternal optimism was rewarded X. I'm still not paying money to see it.
 
Honestly, I hated the fact they gave Skynet a face. The whole "these people are a threat to my existence so I will remove that threat" is much more effective over the whole wounded entity trying to protect itself and the "evil" humans that want to kill it.
It also brings up the point of why the hell does it think humans are a threat in the first place? In this movie it's because they directly want to destroy it, which is plausible, but since no one was trying to destroy it originally, why did it decide to kill everyone?
Skynet was always True Neutral to me. It's doing it because it's the most sensible thing to do. This movie made Skynet more Lawful Evil. It's killing because it feels victimized and it's protecting itself from all the evil people who want to hurt it for no reason.

Which brings me to my second major gripe. This isn't the same Skynet. There were like 5 or more other timelines in the terminator universe between the last movie and this one. At the end they literally something along the lines of there's infinite realities but one thing will next change, shits gonna go down.
So basically, nothing matters. Things work out ok in this timeline, which makes a new timeline where shit repeats itself. They stop skynet, something happens which makes it happen anyway, they send shit back in time, repeat, only with different changes each time so it's not exactly the same.
Why should I have any stake in any of these movies going forward if nothing matters?

I didn't see the mid-scene clip tho, maybe that'll change my mind about some of this.

And Conner as the villain had no real point. Or at least didn't carry any weight. Could have just made him another random terminator.

EDIT: More J.K. Simmons character!!! He was the best part, and for some reason he had very little time, and had zero importance on the plot.
 
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X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
Honestly, I hated the fact they gave Skynet a face. The whole "these people are a threat to my existence so I will remove that threat" is much more effective over the whole wounded entity trying to protect itself and the "evil" humans that want to kill it.
It also brings up the point of why the hell does it think humans are a threat in the first place? In this movie it's because they directly want to destroy it, which is plausible, but since no one was trying to destroy it originally, why did it decide to kill everyone?
Skynet was always True Neutral to me. It's doing it because it's the most sensible thing to do. This movie made Skynet more Lawful Evil. It's killing because it feels victimized and it's protecting itself from all the evil people who want to hurt it for no reason.

Which brings me to my second major gripe. This isn't the same Skynet. There were like 5 or more other timelines in the terminator universe between the last movie and this one. At the end they literally something along the lines of there's infinite realities but one thing will next change, shits gonna go down.
So basically, nothing matters. Things work out ok in this timeline, which makes a new timeline where shit repeats itself. They stop skynet, something happens which makes it happen anyway, they send shit back in time, repeat, only with different changes each time so it's not exactly the same.
Why should I have any stake in any of these movies going forward if nothing matters?

I didn't see the mid-scene clip tho, maybe that'll change my mind about some of this tho.

And Conner as the villain had no real point. Or at least didn't carry any weight. Could have just made him another random terminator.
I can answer ALL these questions!!

That while everything that we saw in the film was front & center got blown away, the Skynet Central Core was actually brought online. While Skynet didn't spread and take over everything with Genisys, it used the fact that the Time Displacement was the setting of the real final battle in Kyle's Future to draw away from the fact that it managed to keep its central core active -- since Skynet has always had two main components.

Skynet here has a reason for being shown as an entity, which is what they started to show in Salvation - it gives you a way to show Skynet learning over each progressing timeline by giving it an avatar of sorts. There's a reason that it waits to attack John until Kyle leaves - it's trying to ensure its own survival, while keeping as many of the previous factors in play as they were originally. Also, if it gets another John Connor in the upcoming future, it can turn him into another T-3000 to help ensure its survival again - ergo let Kyle Reese go.

Since the T-800 didn't leave its chip behind, Miles Dyson didn't create Skynet for Cyberdyne in 1997, and the timeline's changed (because the events of T2 get altered by someone we don't know yet). Skynet would have to show up later. It uses the T-3000 and has it work with Miles' son, Danny Dyson to build Genisys and is going to leverage that as a dispersal mechanism once Skynet is fully developed (again, a progression we can see in its hologram projections growing older).

When Skynet comes online, Sarah, Kyle, & Pops are direct and continual threats to it. That gives it a reason to work against them right from the start. It's easier to show an AI and its motivations by giving it an avatar rather than just leaving it as a maliciously omnipresent non-entity. If you're going to stop it once it exists, you also need to make it something tangible, because you can only blow up silent computer factories so often and feel victorious. I think think that it holds to the Neutral Evil spectrum in that it views all of humanity as a threat to itself with those three as primary most dangerous targets. That's why it decided to use John as the protector against them, because their humanity makes them weak against someone they know.

Terminator has a cascading timeline, it's certainly not infinite. Winning against Skynet means getting to the final war and preventing it from sending something new back. That's always been the rule. That's why Genisys gives us the three main characters vs. Skynet at the end and gives them a trajectory to go against it as a group in the future and potentially take down Skynet for good.


Hell yes more of detective O'Brien. He's fucking AMAZING.



X :neo:
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
Big interview with the writers that is just as awesome as I'd hoped it'd be.

This basically confirms that Skynet's been tracking its successes and failures
like we see in Salvation and that got to the point that it actually sent ITSELF to deal with the issue by turning John Connor to its side after it manages to move itself into the prime Terminator timeline. That also makes it highly likely that it's at least somewhat responsible for sending the T-1000 back at Sarah rather than sending it after John. Either way, that's hugely interesting and big food for thought.




X :neo:
 

The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
Thanks for posting that link, X. That confirms for me that I have no interest in seeing this and that they won't see one dime from me for it. :monster:

This is more of a hard reboot than anything. It ignores the cascading timeline (the last Judgment Day happened in 2004, not 1997), thus ignoring "Rise of the Machines" and "Salvation" as well -- so it can't be claimed that this new timeline cascades on down from that one. Hell, it's arguable that it ignores T2's effect of preventing the 1997 Judgment Day as well.

For that matter,
it sounds like this movie doesn't even bother trying to make any fucking sense of that whole vision thing that Reese experiences during his first time jump either. The notion that he could see a vision of a timeline that has yet to be created also ignores the cascading effect of the time travel used up to now.

And that's not even getting into the complication arising from the statement in that interview that a Skynet from another dimension arrived in 2029 at the beginning of the film (i.e. it wasn't even that timeline's Skynet that attacked John).

This shit has gotten stupid, and I have no interest in seeing it continue. :monster:

I'm going to echo Carlie and say that while I'm glad you enoyed it, X, I'd rather this whole thing got crushed in a hydraulic press.
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
Actually, I'd say you're totally wrong about it ignoring the cascading timeline, especially because
the Skynet from a timeline cascaded far off arrives in the original timeline. My current theory is that it's been tracking the changes in the cascading timelines like it was doing in Salvation, and has been attempting to find a way to move to a specific timeline and significantly alter the earliest timeline it can reach by what it's managed to learn in the subsequently later futures -- hence why it jumps to the T1 future and it puts things in motion into a timeline where it (Skynet) isn't created until 2017, since it benefits from the natural progression of technology.

Also, it doesn't ignore where Reese's vision comes from, as that's directly explained in the film as
the result of a Nexus Event - i.e. a significant change to the timeline (Skynet turning John into a T-3000) as Kyle's jumping, and he exists in quantum state and partially exists in two timelines at once, and his visions are his own memories from the new timeline crossing with his. Also, the timeline he's moving to isn't just generated by that event, but rather the T-1000 & T-800 sent back to kill/guard Sarah in the early '70s -- which I believe is done rather than sending them to the T2 events, because by doing so, there is no John Connor to protect and they don't need to be send there, thus no need to send the T3 ones either which is why they don't appear.

The framework seems to be pretty solid and doesn't ignore anything that's come before it insofar as I can tell.

Also, I haven't managed to get through the tl;dr, but I think that this might get into it in some detail though I'm not sure how accurate it looks yet: http://www.ew.com/article/2015/06/30/terminator-genisys-franchise-timeline-explained




X :neo:
 

The Twilight Mexican

Ex-SeeD-ingly good
AKA
TresDias
Actually, I'd say you're totally wrong about it ignoring the cascading timeline, especially because
the Skynet from a timeline cascaded far off arrives in the original timeline. My current theory is that it's been tracking the changes in the cascading timelines like it was doing in Salvation, and has been attempting to find a way to move to a specific timeline and significantly alter the earliest timeline it can reach by what it's managed to learn in the subsequently later futures -- hence why it jumps to the T1 future and it puts things in motion into a timeline where it (Skynet) isn't created until 2017, since it benefits from the natural progression of technology.
This may be one of the more nonsensical aspects of the whole thing. Nevermind that dimensional travel to existing (rather than new) timelines is something not seen in this series up to now -- how does Skynet benefit from going to an earlier tier of the cascade (i.e. an earlier timeline) any more than it would benefit from just going to a new tier (i.e. creating another level in the cascade) as it has been doing all along?

For that matter, if Skynet can manage to reach what may well have been the original timeline -- why not just go back a few more decades into that timeline and kill Sarah Connor before anyone could even be thinking about protecting her? Hell, why not attack a few minutes earlier and prevent Reese from ever entering the time machine in the first place?

Which doesn't address the even more pressing logical conundrum the filmmakers may be inserting here if they're trying to integrate into the mythos at this point the idea that time travel to previous timelines is possible. They are then consequently playing around with the notion that changing the past can change the present that you hail from rather than just creating a new branch in time -- at least if that past is a previous timeline that led to the creation of your own. Up until now, the act of time travel has immediately created a new timeline at the point of arrival rather than influencing the dimension the time traveler came from.

In other words, if the dimension-hopping Skynet that shows up to attack John is supposed to be from further down the cascade (e.g. the timeline of "Rise of the Machines" and "Salvation," or even later), then it's just potentially screwing itself by fucking with the events that led to the cascade that created it in the first place -- and doing so with nothing to be gained from taking the risk.

It's stupid as fuck.

X said:
Also, it doesn't ignore where Reese's vision comes from, as that's directly explained in the film as
the result of a Nexus Event - i.e. a significant change to the timeline (Skynet turning John into a T-3000) as Kyle's jumping, and he exists in quantum state and partially exists in two timelines at once, and his visions are his own memories from the new timeline crossing with his. Also, the timeline he's moving to isn't just generated by that event, but rather the T-1000 & T-800 sent back to kill/guard Sarah in the early '70s -- which I believe is done rather than sending them to the T2 events, because by doing so, there is no John Connor to protect and they don't need to be send there, thus no need to send the T3 ones either which is why they don't appear.
The Nexus Event concept is itself utter shenanigans as far as "Terminator" time travel is concerned. Reese shouldn't be experiencing anything as a result of that development in his present any more than he, John and the other lieutenants should have blinked out of existence the moment Skynet sent the T-800 back in time to kill Sarah.

It's already been established -- probably as a direct consequence of the cascading time model, actually -- that the present/future isn't impacted by the effects of traveling to the past. The present/future the time travelers originated from just then belongs to a different timeline. Again, whatever the reason, we didn't see Reese, John or their surroundings affected the moment the T-800 made the jump. We're supposed to buy an immediate effect being felt by something happening in Reese's own present though?

Even with the possible addition to the mythos of dimensional travel to an earlier timeline, that wouldn't have affected this Reese, who is from the earliest timeline.

So, yeah. Utter shenanigans, and I'm calling them.

X said:
The framework seems to be pretty solid and doesn't ignore anything that's come before it insofar as I can tell.
I respect you too much to give this sentiment the epic lol-ing it deserves. =P
X said:
Also, I haven't managed to get through the tl;dr, but I think that this might get into it in some detail though I'm not sure how accurate it looks yet: http://www.ew.com/article/2015/06/30/terminator-genisys-franchise-timeline-explained
That is a great article. Well-written, detailed and makes a sincere effort to make sense of the bullshit at work here.

Since that was written a couple of days before the io9 interview you posted yesterday came out, though, they seem unaware that
the Skynet who attacked John is supposed to be from another dimension and isn't the Skynet of the original timeline.
I think they can be forgiven for that, though, since it sounds like no one did or would be able to figure that out from seeing just the movie.
 
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X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
This may be one of the more nonsensical aspects of the whole thing. Nevermind that dimensional travel to existing (rather than new) timelines is something not seen in this series up to now -- how does Skynet benefit from going to an earlier tier of the cascade (i.e. an earlier timeline) any more than it would benefit from just going to a new tier (i.e. creating another level in the cascade) as it has been doing all along?

For that matter, if Skynet can manage to reach what may well have been the original timeline -- why not just go back a few more decades into that timeline and kill Sarah Connor before anyone could even be thinking about protecting her? Hell, why not attack a few minutes earlier and prevent Reese from ever entering the time machine in the first place?

Which doesn't address the even more pressing logical conundrum the filmmakers may be inserting here if they're trying to integrate into the mythos at this point the idea that time travel to previous timelines is possible. They are then consequently playing around with the notion that changing the past can change the present that you hail from rather than just creating a new branch in time -- at least if that past is a previous timeline that led to the creation of your own. Up until now, the act of time travel has immediately created a new timeline at the point of arrival rather than influencing the dimension the time traveler came from.

In other words, if the dimension-hopping Skynet that shows up to attack John is supposed to be from further down the cascade (e.g. the timeline of "Rise of the Machines" and "Salvation," or even later), then it's just potentially screwing itself by fucking with the events that led to the cascade that created it in the first place -- and doing so with nothing to be gained from taking the risk.

It's stupid as fuck.
Because
If you're jumping around in a shitton of timelines and testing things, eventually you're gonna start running into the TSCC critical mass, where as you keep moving down the cascade, there're more and more variables of other incurring time travelers to account for as it keeps going. If you can go back to the start with all the information that you have from further along, and side-step the other interferences by jumping higher up the cascade somehow, it's a really good move, because you keep your knowledge and don't let the other side keep theirs.

There're also a few reasons that I think that Skynet doesn't jump itself earlier. By staying in a future with the access to the tech that it needs - time displacement equipment, etc. It has all the access to put its own plans into motion, and aid in the assistance of the incoming timeline's creation of an ideally configured Skynet & J-Day scenario - i.e. it ensures its own survival.

Also, the danger of killing Reese before he leaves is that so long as he and John are in the same future together, that Kyle is still that John's father (assuming that it's the earliest possbiel timeline). If Skynet kills him then, who knows how hard it'd fuck up the timeline that it's currently in. That being the case, if Skynet doesn't have a contingency plan set up already in a new timeline to pass that information along and ensure its own creation, it'd be potentially hurting itself by messing with the first time travel variable (Kyle & the T-800) without being able to leverage John's usefulness by having Kyle in that timeline to recognize him and have him influence Sarah and convince her that it IS John.

Once Kyle's gone from that timeline, you can attack/kill him there without too much worry. The key here is that you're using a John Connor they know as a weakness against them (since he was always the Resistance's greatest asset) as well as preventing his generation in the current timeline. That's most of its plan for using John as its T-3000 protector to ensure its own creation and to use it as a safeguard against the others, since it has a face that they know and (due to the nature of the T-3000's creation) actually is/was John.


The Nexus Event concept is itself utter shenanigans as far as "Terminator" time travel is concerned. Reese shouldn't be experiencing anything as a result of that development in his present any more than he, John and the other lieutenants should have blinked out of existence the moment Skynet sent the T-800 back in time to kill Sarah.

It's already been established -- probably as a direct consequence of the cascading time model, actually -- that the present/future isn't impacted by the effects of traveling to the past. The present/future the time travelers originated from just then belongs to a different timeline. Again, whatever the reason, we didn't see Reese, John or their surroundings affected the moment the T-800 made the jump. We're supposed to buy an immediate effect being felt by something happening in Reese's own present though?

Even with the possible addition to the mythos of dimensional travel to an earlier timeline, that wouldn't have affected this Reese, who is from the earliest timeline.

So, yeah. Utter shenanigans, and I'm calling them.
This is the one point where they're pulling with some time travel mechanics in weird ways, and yeah, of all the things in the film, it's the one that bugged me the most. I'm ok with it because it's something that is mentioned to be very circumstantial and helps make Kyle not totally useless.
The T-800 does a relatively good job of explaining that the crossover only occurs because there was a significant alteration to Kyle's existing timeline that occurred while he was in the quantum field and being passed into a different timeline.

Of all the things in the story I'll hands down agree that it's the most Doctor Who-ish in its presentation, and it's used to have Kyle bootstrap some information to himself that his Young!Self receives as a part of his presence in that timeline in a sort of Bill & Ted-ish way. Mainly it's used as a mechanism to get the data they need to push them into 2017, due to the fact that the 1997 Skynet didn't happen -- since Sarah & Guardian iced the T-800 and the chip that Cyberdyne used. The 1997 J-Day is no longer valid, and they need a way to find the specific point in time that their timeline's Skynet would be coming back online, in order to jump forward to stop the later Skynet from coming into being. This is their way of doing that, and it looks like it's something that is gonna be a one-off.

So yeah, shenanigans - but they're the thing that gives Kyle a purpose since he's neither the most expert Terminator combattant nor the 48-hour walking sperm bank that he was in the original film, it gives him one role that makes his fucked up time travel more meaningful and those memories makes him more than just baggage until he finds his role along with Sarah & Pops.



X :neo:
 

Kuja9001

Ooooh Salty!
AKA
roxas9001, Krat0s9001, DarkSlayerZero
Ok so what film do you think does the future war better?

I love the depressing atmosphere of T1's version.
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
• T1 has a depressing hopelessness to it that none of the others match.
• T2 has a more believable setting for humans to have a fraction of a chance in terms of their military presence, since it's a remake of T1.
• T3 has excellent HK's and flyover scenes.
• T4 is an early version of the future war where parts of T1/T2 have come from, but it doesn't really match up.
• T5 is a really good hybrid of T1 & T2 visually and thematically.










It's a super tough call. T1 & T2 are really dated but I think that the T2 reimagining of T1 really does a better job of it. Then having watched T2 and seeing that all brought forward into Genisys was awesome. If I have any criticism of Genisys it's that the HK's cockpit sections look more sleek than I'd thought they would (I love the T3 versions), but all the other elements are really REALLY damn good.

I can't wait to own Genisys just to watch all of those re-created scenes and take them in, because they're spectacular. While it doesn't have the same "mounds of skulls" type feel, I love Genisys' future war because it feels real like T2s even if it has less of the thematic dread that T1 had (where the flashback scenes were meant to feel hopeless rather than on the verge of victory).

In the same way, the T-1000 has always been my favourite, and I utterly love Robert Patrick's version of the character, but dear god Byung-Hun Lee looks like the T-1000 that my mind always remembers when thinking about it. If anything, that's the thing that Genisys did best moreso than anything is they made scenes that look the way that your memory makes them that doesn't feel like moving props or dated CGI.




X :neo:
 

Kuja9001

Ooooh Salty!
AKA
roxas9001, Krat0s9001, DarkSlayerZero
T2 is my all time fav Terminator film soo I majorly agree with you on the T-1000 stuff.

My fav scene from T1 has to be when the Terminator enters the gun shop and asks for a freakin plasma rifle.
 
Finally watched the film. I'll give it a 10 simply for the damn attention to detail in reconstructing - and carrying on - scenes from the previous film. Seriously, my eyebrows wanted to escape my forehead in shock and surprise at how clever it all was. Pretty decent film too!
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
Out of curiosity, what was your favourite thing that they reconstructed in Genisys?

(Additionally, all signs still point to the next film in this new trilogy to still be on track, which I couldn't be happier about).




X :neo:
 
AKA
Jesse McCree. I feel like a New Man
I don't get the negative reviews, it would have been an enjoyable film were it not for the god awful marketing. They fooled half the world into thinking it will be a shitty film when it was an averagely sufficient film and for the first time in history
The T800 survived and got upgraded! HOLY FUCK!
 

Hisako

消えないひさ&#
AKA
Satsu, BRIAN BLESSED, MIGHTY AND WISE Junpei Iori: Ace Detective, Maccaffrickstonson von Lichtenstafford Frabenschnaben, Polite Krogan, Robert Baratheon
Basically reminds me of young Jeff Bridges from Tron: Legacy :monster:
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
Out of curiosity, what was your favourite thing that they reconstructed in Genisys?
You already posted the video but yeah, that entire reconstruction has simply blown my mind. Arnie vs Arnie was just ... wow.
I got to see it again this weekend with some friends from out of town & my partner -- none of whom had seen the previews that spoil the T-3000 reveal. They all enjoyed the hell out of it, and I found that I liked it more the second time, too. I still really want to punch whoever cut their trailers for fucking up how the film constructed its narrative with that reveal.



X :neo:
 
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