SPOILERS The Ending Explained to me by a Reddit Poster (Spoilers)

LNK

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Nate
I mean that’s not what it sounds like Kitase (and thus SE) is saying. From my understanding the Remake and OG are separate entities yes, but both are compatible/canon with the Compilation itself.

Like how the Shōwa and Heisei era Godzilla films are both canon to the 1954 Godzilla film but not to each other.
I'll have to check those out! Maybe I'm misinterpreting what Kitase said. Or, I'm just miss typing what I'm thinking.

I know the basis of the comp will be used in the remake, but it seems like it's going to be used differently
 

Theozilla

Kaiju Member
that is an interesting thing about Holy. So question, did you see in I think it was chapter 5 or 6 where cloud meets aerith at the church. And she shows him her Materia. But for some reason I didn't see anything in her hair where she put it in the original.
Cloud meets Aerith in the Church at the beginning of Chapter 8. And the Holy Materia is obscured by her hair bow because it’s held in place within the bow’s knot. It’s not meant to be directly visible.
 

FalloutCreation

Rookie Adventurer
AKA
Michael
Cloud meets Aerith in the Church at the beginning of Chapter 8. And the Holy Materia is obscured by her hair bow because it’s held in place within the bow’s knot. It’s not meant to be directly visible.
but it IS there, right? I just couldn't see it.
 
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Solordinn

Lv. 25 Adventurer
but now the question is where does Zack come into this story going forward, they made it a point to do a shot for shot remake of his last stand in crisis core, only now rather than lying dead in the rain, he stands victorious and is carrying cloud to midgar.
 

Theozilla

Kaiju Member
but it IS there, right? I just couldn't see it.
Yes, it’s just not visible because it’s inside the bow knot.
but now the question is where does Zack come into this story going forward, they made it a point to do a shot for shot remake of his last stand in crisis core, only now rather than lying dead in the rain, he stands victorious and is carrying cloud to midgar.
As I and others have stated, I don’t think the Remake Zack flashbacks imply Zack is alive, rather that the OG and Crisis Core depictions of his final moments are being combined in a new and unique manner. And that the final flashback cuts off right before he gets fatally shot in the back.
 

Solordinn

Lv. 25 Adventurer
Yes, it’s just not visible because it’s inside the bow knot.

As I and others have stated, I don’t think the Remake Zack flashbacks imply Zack is alive, rather that the OG and Crisis Core depictions of his final moments are being combined in a new and unique manner. And that the final flashback cuts off right before he gets fatally shot in the back.
but then why make it a point to show the whispers somehow bleeding through to the past and Zack seeing the golden explosion.
 

FalloutCreation

Rookie Adventurer
AKA
Michael
Yes, it’s just not visible because it’s inside the bow knot.

As I and others have stated, I don’t think the Remake Zack flashbacks imply Zack is alive, rather that the OG and Crisis Core depictions of his final moments are being combined in a new and unique manner. And that the final flashback cuts off right before he gets fatally shot in the back.
yeah they are probably preserving spoilers for new comers to the game from seeing too much. If you are new to the game you'd probably be like Who in the hell is this guy with black hair and why do I care about him?
The only tie in I can think of is a new gamer saying, "oh wait I remember that scene with Aerith where she talks about an old boyfriend. Maybe this was him?. But the whole shot in the back thing wouldn't be something that they could show just yet.
 

FalloutCreation

Rookie Adventurer
AKA
Michael
This might go a bit off topic, but I want to mention it anyway. Yeah a singularity theory is nothing new. And is not something that exists only for FF7 remake. there have been several visual iterations of it. And the first thing that comes to mind is Star Trek :TNG the last 2 episodes. (Yeah i know I'm a nerd.)
And in the show, if you haven't watched it, It puts 3 indentical ships, each with the name enterprise, from different time periods showing up to the exact same place in known space. The ships eventually meet up at the same place in space where a giant anomaly is forming and they have to stop it somehow. The solution was to move all ships into it at the same time and close the tear in space and time.
So whatever happens in FF7 remake where the tear begins (made by Sephiroth) Cloud and crew have to go in and repair or stop Sephiroth from doing whatever he was planning. Defying fate or something, right?
So anyway, when I saw this in game I thought wow, its just like this show I watched a million years ago.
 

LNK

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Nate
but then why make it a point to show the whispers somehow bleeding through to the past and Zack seeing the golden explosion.
Also, I don't think the Whispers bled through to the past. In this new telling of FF7, I think they've always been there
 

Eerie

Fire and Blood
About the 7 seconds bits, I wish the English translation was like the French translation because it would put theories to rest. The French translation is literally "7 seconds before the Apocalypse" lol.

Also agree that Zack is still dead. Aerith's face is all I need to understand that he's dead when she sees that tidbit - she would be HAPPY if he was still alive. But she knew she saw his last moments alive. And it made her scared because she already dreaded the sky, and Zack just died outside the steel sky. As I said in another thread, in French Aerith speaks of the terrifying sky at the end of the game, and I feel that is much more ominous than the English translation.

Also @Theozilla I went and checked, and we really do say "Aériss", I guess because it's closest to us from the "th" sound. I don't remember where you asked that, so hijacking the thread a little bit, sorry!
 

Roger

He/him
AKA
Minato
The place they are is 7 seconds before the world's end, that's clear. Sephiroth still says that 7 seconds might be enough for Cloud to enact meaningful change, which I would is not 7 seconds until the Planet explodes/become utterly lifeless. That isn't really what he is hinting at here. Likewise the ending tells us the whispers are gone and fate's uncertain now. I feel telling us Zack is sure to die anyway, the whispers shouldn't have bothered showing up for that kinda goes against that thought.
 

ultima786

Pro Adventurer
AKA
ultima
The place they are is 7 seconds before the world's end, that's clear. Sephiroth still says that 7 seconds might be enough for Cloud to enact meaningful change, which I would is not 7 seconds until the Planet explodes/become utterly lifeless. That isn't really what he is hinting at here. Likewise the ending tells us the whispers are gone and fate's uncertain now. I feel telling us Zack is sure to die anyway, the whispers shouldn't have bothered showing up for that kinda goes against that thought.
It isn't clear to me that the whispers are gone. Rather, they are now in the control of Sephiroth (Sephiroth sucked them up, and threw them at the party at one point). But Maybe they died after that Sephiroth [clone?] was defeated by Cloud.
 
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FalloutCreation

Rookie Adventurer
AKA
Michael
It isn't clear to me that the whispers are gone. Rather, they are now in the control of Sephiroth (Sephiroth sucked them up, and threw them at the party at one point). But Maybe they died after that Sephiroth [clone?] was defeated by Cloud.
At the end Seph asks Cloud for his strength. To defy fate. This suggests two things. That Seph has no control over his destiny yet. And 2, the whispers might not be completely gone.

The fact Seph has interest in cloud means cloud is important to Seph getting what he wants. We don't know what yet. The whispers getting involved with events also confirms that events in the Remake are important enough to interfere.
The fact that Seph and Aerith were able to create some portal and take on fate suggests that this isn't the normal Aerith or Seph we are used to. And we can't be sure how far their new abilities go in this game, but we can guess that if they are trying to defy destiny and can physically travel to such a place where its possible to fight it then sure enough then sure enough it adds to the other thing that happens in the story.

The singularity event that appears in zacks timeline. If you know anything about a singularity it might be described slightly different in a dictonary than described here in a game. Since we are dealing with fictional stuff a singularity can be whatever the author wants. In this case it trascends space and time. If its able to do that, it can exist in multiple time periods and in this case be seen. Inside of it, time does not exist essentially. I've seen singularities shown and described in other fictional stories and this looks the same to me. I maybe wrong but it has all the characteristics. The big one being is that you can see it in two different time periods.
 
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Clean Cut Chaos

Pro Adventurer
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Cub Chaos
I'm willing to accept that Zack still dies and the scene they showed cut off before his death, but what's with the alternative Stamp then?
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
Its a pretty thin line. Consider the dodgy replies she gives Wedge and the trainyard scenes leading up to that point. She knows that plate is going to fall. The whisperers involvement only confirms to her during the course of the story that this was a big event that could not be avoided. Even when Aerith and Cloud meet up with Tifa at the dons she acts way too familiar with Tifa and avoids saying more than she knows. Throughout the game she does this.
Its hard to know for sure beyond the events of this current game how much she knows.
The pieces that might be missing because the fates might be taking something away from information from here might be events after the first game. My theory is they are removing knowledge of events that will happen in the new remake. Not necessarily from the OG.

If the Planet has an ability to control fate, it's likely Aerith can ascertain likely outcomes of things by being able to listen to the Planet & the spirits in the Lifestream. If you're about to experience a massive loss of life, or "balancing the scales" as Tseng puts it, that's one of the events that's too big to stop. I think that Aerith knows that something horrible is about to happen and possibly even that whatever it is results in a massive loss of life. I don't think that she knows anything other than that first part or maybe the second. I think that just with that information she has means that along with the detail of learning from Don Corneo that they're going to drop the plate, she's pretty certain of what events are going to take place. This is all because she has extra context clues, not anything amounting to real precognitive information.

That being said, she's all about still trying to do everything possible to stop things and to save people regardless. This mirrors what we see with her all throughout the game, where doing things are still worth doing, even if things don't turn out the way that you want. I think that this is also why she's hesitant to tell people what she's figuring out contextually, because if people know something's fated to happen, they won't try to stop it, they'll just give up and follow the path because they know what's coming.

And that's kind of the core metaphor of the entire game.

Aerith is comforted by having fate, because it lets her know what to expect, even if it makes her hesitant to tell people. She's giving people hope how she can without overdelivering or making them feel like there's no reason to even try, despite literal Fate and Destiny existing. It's why she's conflicted about the very idea of fighting Destiny, but then agrees that they have to at least try. Then when they do stop the Whispers at the end – she's reflective about missing the structure and safety that they provided.

While the Player has access to the full precognitive information, I don't think that Aerith knows any more than just whispers & vague hints that she fills in with the available context as it arrives.



X :neo:
 

Clean Cut Chaos

Pro Adventurer
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Cub Chaos
Aerith knowing Cloud is a mercenary, who is not familiar with the Sector 6 slums (before they ever set foot in the Sector 6 slums), who cannot fall in love with her and even if he did, it would not be real, tells me she at least has some quite specific data on certain not unimportant subject.
Also, when Cloud asks Aerith if she knows who Sehp is. He says that he has a feeling that he isn't dead, and it zooms in on Aerith's mouth as she says "Oh, right" in an almost annoyed tone of voice. She knows something, or at least did before killing fate.
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
Aerith knowing Cloud is a mercenary, who is not familiar with the Sector 6 slums (before they ever set foot in the Sector 6 slums), who cannot fall in love with her and even if he did, it would not be real, tells me she at least has some quite specific data on certain not unimportant subject.

Aerith was almost certainly able to meet with Zack's spirit after he departed – exactly like she's been able to do with others. Even if she doesn't consciously speak to him, the Cetra's connection to the Lifestream is all about them gaining knowledge from it. That means that it's more than likely she'd learn things that were important to Zack right around the moments he died which would include that:
  • Zack passed the Buster Sword on to Cloud
  • Cloud exists as Zack's living legacy
  • They were headed for Midgar & Cloud doesn't know it well
  • They were going to try to find work as Mercenaries
Especially if she's aware of the bits of Cloud's memory that are trapped in the Lifestream from his Mako Poisoning, she'd have even more to operate from. Just with the knowledge from Zack right around the moments of his death gives literally all of context that she'd need to be able to put all of those pieces together the second she sees Cloud.

Even without having to have any sort of precognitive abilities, and literally only the ability to talk to or get knowledge of the desires of the spirits in the Lifestream like she's always had, this is all possible without any precognitive knowledge whatsoever.

Also, when Cloud asks Aerith if she knows who Sehp is. He says that he has a feeling that he isn't dead, and it zooms in on Aerith's mouth as she says "Oh, right" in an almost annoyed tone of voice. She knows something, or at least did before killing fate.

Again – we all know that Sephiroth's body was thrown into the Lifestream, but it won't return to the Planet, and now it's just chilling in the massive nexus of the flow of the Lifestream up in the Northern Crater absorbing knowledge. This is something that she'd absolutely be aware of solely with her ability to speak with spirits in the Lifestream.

This is all how Aerith knows extra things that other people don't, and she's learned how to fake only being aware of the sort of things that should be common knowledge, and just kind of use her cheery ditzy attitude to sort of breeze past those moments. She was described by Elmyra as a chatterbox, but we know that as soon as Tseng shows up, she starts trying to hide her abilities.

This is all well what we should be expecting from OG Aerith given her stated abilities. If we're also adding in the existence of the Whispers here and the existence of Fate & Destiny, that is also portrayed as something Aerith interacts with as the Will of the Planet, but she's afraid of interacting with them, because she loses things when interacting with them, rather than gaining things like she does from the Lifestream. That presents the whole framework of her feeling comforted by being nudged along a path, but also afraid of it because it's extra information from the Planet that's hidden from her.

I think that the whole thing about the Whispers is Sephiroth trying to get access to that knowledge they're hiding by force (hence how we see that information about the future leaking out of the Harbinger and flashes of it in their minds during the attacks against it in Chapter 18. It's also why we see those same little flashes when Cloud is struggling with incursions to his mind from Sephiroth. I think that Sephiroth is the one trying to hold all the cards as a way to prod Cloud's motivations to his own benefit.



X :neo:
 

Theozilla

Kaiju Member
Aerith knowing Cloud is a mercenary, who is not familiar with the Sector 6 slums (before they ever set foot in the Sector 6 slums), who cannot fall in love with her and even if he did, it would not be real, tells me she at least has some quite specific data on certain not unimportant subject.
In addition to what @X-SOLDIER said on the matter of how Aerith's planet connection can give her information on those elements, part of them are just discernible from how Cloud acts (like he definitely indicates he doesn't know his way around the slums) and Aerith being perceptive about their relationship, especially if she is noticing/is more aware of Cloud's connections to Zack.

I'm willing to accept that Zack still dies and the scene they showed cut off before his death, but what's with the alternative Stamp then?
The different Stamp could just being visual symbolism, indicating how Zack is the "original" Stamp to Cloud, since Cloud gets associated with the Stamp character frequently in the Remake.
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
The different Stamp could just being visual symbolism, indicating how Zack is the "original" Stamp to Cloud, since Cloud gets associated with the Stamp character frequently in the Remake.

This is an ESPECIALLY good point, given Barret's line in Chapter 5:

"It's not that I hate him. I hate the face that Shinra took a loyal animal like that and co-opted it for their own self-serving agenda."

That's also basically what's happening to Cloud via Sephiroth. In addition to the "Zack the puppy" being a nickname from Crisis Core, having that following up on an established metaphor from the game about Cloud, that also references Crisis Core, and hints at the connection between Zack & Cloud in that context gives plenty of reason to have focused in & lingered on that image that has nothing whatsoever to do with alternate timelines.





X:neo:
 
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