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[Cat Rage Room]

Your stance is a ridiculous attempt to make the vast population of the forum who can't tell you all 222 shades of black of Sephiroth's coat shown in the latest ACC trailer feel inferior. Not a shocker given that it's you driving this proposal home but still it's a kind of asinine stance for a member of staff to be in.

Oh I'm sorry, I didn't know that not getting arbitrary 'points' for not discussing what the site is centered around and focused on should make someone feel inferior in any way.

He means they justify rewards too, not just your precious FF boards. Too bad, cry moar.

Watch how you speak.

 

[Alex]

I didn't know that members had to be feel pressured into making epic wikipedia worthy analysis of various aspects of Final Fantasy games in order to feel like their posts are worth a damn.

 

[Tetsujin]

Too be honest, I don't see what your problem is now, Ashes.

He was just saying that discussion on FF boards should be awarded with these bonus points as its obviously our main focus.
I don't really see the need for those remarks.

I didn't know that members had to be feel pressured into making epic wikipedia worthy analysis of various aspects of Final Fantasy games in order to feel like their posts are worth a damn.

Oh Jesus Christ, it's just about some bonus points.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

I didn't know that members had to be feel pressured into making epic wikipedia worthy analysis of various aspects of Final Fantasy games in order to feel like their posts are worth a damn.

Huh, I didn't know that members had to feel that their General Chat posts constituted invisible, arbitrarily points in order to feel like their posts are worth a damn.

I mean seriously, what the fuck, they're just some fucking forum points. It's not like it's money or you're getting anything taken away. You would just get an extra something for contributing to what we pay fucking money and donate to keep this site running talk about; Final Fantasy.

 

[Max Payne]

How about this, you get a set number of points for contributory posts in the FF section, but it takes several posts in GC to garner the same amount of points for one post in the FF section?

That better?

 

[Cthulhu]

And I also agree that the FF boards' posts don't all consider stuff worthy of awarding points to. Ideally, we'd have a points system based on unbiased post ratings - i.e. make a good post and get, for example, reputation for that based on the posts's content, without any bias due to who you are and whatnot and get points for that -, but that would be pretty much impossible to achieve.

I've linked to this site plenty of times, it being my main example in a Good Website right now, and they've got a system set up where you get 'karma points' which you can (since just a few weeks, btw) spend on new features such as a weblog and I dunno what else. One gets karma points on there for writing good, quality comments to frontpage articles. The difference with our forum though is that rating comments / posts on there is actually important and is seen as a very important task - people get points for rating other people's posts, of course, but the amount of points someone gets for posting is also determined by what other people think of that post, i.e. that posts's rating.

But the main point is that, on there, there isn't any bias - and if there is, it's merely static, since there's always dozens of people that are busy rating others. So their system is pretty much fair and balanced and whatnot, and the amount of 'karma', or points someone has, is equal to that someone's contributions to the site, both in terms of quantity and quality.

(For the record, I rank #940 on the overall scales on karma on thar, out of 233.342 registered users. And #43 in terms of comment count, out of the same amount of users. zomfg O_o;;

Anyways, /rant. I'm not sure how this particular problem would be solved, but I do have this to add - if we're already arguing about who gets points for what and which is fair and what isn't, I'm not going to install this hack at all. Or at least not the points / shop bit of it - awards could work, since they're a lot more fair, I think.

Also, it's 2 AM here, I'm (finally) buggering off. Must've spent over 13 hours or so at my computer now, with only a minor break for dinner. Lolz

 

[Alex]

Too be honest, I don't see what your problem is now, Ashes.

I don't expect you to.

He was just saying that discussion on FF boards should be awarded with these bonus points as its obviously our main focus.
I don't really see the need for those remarks.

My main issue with this is that, it always seems to be all the same people that make the biggest discussion in the FF sections. Ergo the same half dozen or so people would be the only ones getting awards in some fantastical circle jerk. Which imo, would be terribly disheartening to whatever bright spark comes up with a point of discussion which goes against the estabilished convention, but is still a good point. I don't believe that the with the way things are right now and with the way I've seen discussions go, that the opposing point of view would be merited with rewards/points at all :/

Huh, I didn't know that members had to feel that their General Chat posts constituted invisible, arbitrarily points in order to feel like their posts are worth a damn.

I can't make heads nor tails of this gibberish, sorry.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

I can't make heads nor tails of this gibberish, sorry.

No, I'm sorry. It's clear enough.

but I do have this to add - if we're already arguing about who gets points for what and which is fair and what isn't, I'm not going to install this hack at all.

That's fine by me, we don't need that kind of fluff anyway.

 

[Alex]

Oh wait, I've got it now. You being unable to distinguish between 'arbitrary' and 'arbitrarily' threw me off. I couldn't work out what it meant. That was a combo breaker of your failed attempt to come across as superior and my being tired and slow on the uptake xD my bad.

No, but if you only reward them in certain sections then thats exactly the impression that you'll be giving off, that some of their posts are invisible and that their opinions only matter worth a damn when they're posted in a certain place.

Idk, that just seems wrong to me, why not just have the Final Fantasy reward points be greater than the General Chat/music/entertainment ones? At least that way you aren't making the distinction of what matters and what doesn't.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

Oh wait, I've got it now. You being unable to distinguish between 'arbitrary' and 'arbitrarily' threw me off. I couldn't work out what it meant.

Oh my, I guess I misspelled it.

That was a combo breaker of your failed attempt to come across as superior and my being tired and slow on the uptake xD my bad.

Seriously, I wish everyone would shut the fuck up about this shit. Not that I'm angry with you in particular, but I have no desire to come across as superior or anything like that.

Yes, I like to present my arguments intelligently, and yes, I like to believe that I am correct (if I didn't think I was right, why argue it?), but I do not believe that my points, or myself is intrinsically superior to anyone else's. Stop it. It's getting ridiculous.

No, but if you only reward them in certain sections then thats exactly the impression that you'll be giving off, that some of their posts are invisible and that their opinions only matter worth a damn when they're posted in a certain place.

No, because discussion would still flourish and be heard regardless. It's just some bonus points, and extra something for contributing to the main event, so to speak. People shouldn't even care either way about something so petty. Not getting a reward doesn't mean that your posts aren't important, in fact, it doesn't mean anything. It's just like extra credit in school.

Idk, that just seems wrong to me, why not just have the Final Fantasy reward points be greater than the General Chat/music/entertainment ones? At least that way you aren't making the distinction of what matters and what doesn't.

I've already suggested this and it doesn't seem to be possible. And "distinction of what matters and what doesn't."? You're being way too oversensitive about this.

 

[Max Payne]

this is why we can't have nice things.

 

[CK]

or just drunk, as usual.

 

[Alex]

Oh my, I guess I misspelled it.

For somebody that likes being correct you should know already that you did indeed spell 'arbitrarily' correctly :3

Seriously, I wish everyone would shut the fuck up about this shit. Not that I'm angry with you in particular, but I have no desire to come across as superior or anything like that.

Yes, I like to present my arguments intelligently, and yes, I like to believe that I am correct (if I didn't think I was right, why argue it?), but I do not believe that my points, or myself is intrinsically superior to anyone else's. Stop it. It's getting ridiculous.

Clearly if your attitude has been such an issue with enough members to make it 'ridiculous' then perhaps its time to consider a change yeah? I'm really not trying to sound too up myself or condescending but its like maybe to reconsider how you come across to people if this is such a problem.

No, because discussion would still flourish and be heard regardless. It's just some bonus points, and extra something for contributing to the main event, so to speak. People shouldn't even care either way about something so petty. Not getting a reward doesn't mean that your posts aren't important, in fact, it doesn't mean anything. It's just like extra credit in school.

I know that and you know that, but to people not familiar with it or people coming in with only a smaller interest in Final Fantasy but still a larger interest in feeling a part of the community as a whole. I'd guess it would look quite daunting seeing all the same people being rewarded ad infinitum because they're the ones with the most keen interest. Imo it would create needless factionalism and drama, something this board is all to keen to stamp down on.

I've already suggested this and it doesn't seem to be possible. And "distinction of what matters and what doesn't."? You're being way too oversensitive about this.

No, I'm promoting discussion. I should get reward points. Surely this is how the system would work?

EDIT:

 

[Cat Rage Room]

Clearly if your attitude has been such an issue with enough members to make it 'ridiculous' then perhaps its time to consider a change yeah? I'm really not trying to sound too up myself or condescending but its like maybe to reconsider how you come across to people if this is such a problem.

I'm not saying that people aren't allowed to dislike me, think I'm wrong, or find a fault in my attitude, but in my defense, I've long said that this community is rather oversensitive and has a thin skin. Plus, some of this 'anti Mog' sentiment I'm 100% sure is bandwagoning.

I know that and you know that, but to people not familiar with it or people coming in with only a smaller interest in Final Fantasy but still a larger interest in feeling a part of the community as a whole. I'd guess it would look quite daunting seeing all the same people being rewarded ad infinitum because they're the ones with the most keen interest. Imo it would create needless factionalism and drama, something this board is all to keen to stamp down on.

While anyone is welcome here, why do we have to cater to people with a smaller interest in Final Fantasy? That's what this site is about after all. If you don't like it, fine, but if you don't like it and you're going to contribute to factionalism and drama because of it, then you get banned. Period.

No, I'm promoting discussion. I should get reward points. Surely this is how the system would work?

By that logic, let's give reward points for logging in, clicking any links, and a point for being logged on for every 30 seconds at a time.

 

[Alex]

I'm not saying that people aren't allowed to dislike me, think I'm wrong, or find a fault in my attitude, but in my defense, I've long said that this community is rather oversensitive and has a thin skin. Plus, some of this 'anti Mog' sentiment I'm 100% sure is bandwagoning.

This community does have a thin skin and is rather sensitive, no doubt we can agree on that. But I think thats mainly because as a community thats lasted since ACF, a board that had been ruined by arrogant, asinine staff making bad decisions on behalf of the members. I'd think it has a right to be at least weary about the attitude of its staff.

While anyone is welcome here, why do we have to cater to people with a smaller interest in Final Fantasy? That's what this site is about after all. If you don't like it, fine, but if you don't like it and you're going to contribute to factionalism and drama because of it, then you get banned. Period.

You should be catering to people of all levels of interest or knowledge, not just spoonfeeding those with enough devotion to argue for pages over certain aspects of the game. It seems awfully elitist and divisive to be handing out merit marks for being a bigger fan than someone else. Thats whats going to create the factionalism, not the act of complaining about it.

By that logic, let's give reward points for logging in, clicking any links, and a point for being logged on for every 30 seconds at a time.

I fail to see how any of the examples you listed in this retort could promote discussion of a topic and therefore why they should be given award points. Sorry.

 

[Cat Rage Room]

This community does have a thin skin and is rather sensitive, no doubt we can agree on that. But I think thats mainly because as a community thats lasted since ACF, a board that had been ruined by arrogant, asinine staff making bad decisions on behalf of the members. I'd think it has a right to be at least weary about the attitude of its staff.

Well uh, I guess people are going to have to take my word that I mean no harm and I mean the best for the community. I certainly understand where the thin skinnedness originates from, but that doesn't make it any less irritating.

You should be catering to people of all levels of interest or knowledge, not just spoonfeeding those with enough devotion to argue for pages over certain aspects of the game. It seems awfully elitist and divisive to be handing out merit marks for being a bigger fan than someone else. Thats whats going to create the factionalism, not the act of complaining about it.

This is a Final Fantasy site. This is what the staff and others spend a lot of time, effort, and money to keep up and running. So, anything that the fans contribute toward that end, to improve that, should be rewarded, given a little extra something. It's not to undermine any non related discussion, but that's why it's a bonus and not a requirement; its just something that people get when they contribute to the main focus of the site. It's not taking away from anything or anyone else.

To me, that's most important, and that's what we should be devoting our time and energy to.

I guess this is where we disagree fundamentally, and it's where I'm going to have to respectfully end the discussion here.

 

[Alex]

Thats fair enough tbh. Like what you said, I also just want the best for the community but I guess we're allowed to disagree fundamentally on how to go about that. No hard feelings or ill will to you though dude, whilst youre talking about rewarding those who do contribute to the site and forum (which I do believe is in order) I was only presenting the other side of the coin in those who might feel excluded or ignored because their contributions might go unnoticed. Imo its definitely a side to the discussion that needed to be brought up/considered/ectect

 

[Makoeyes987]

Well since the discussion has pretty much run its course, I'll just say that I'm gonna have to agree with my fellow staff in the logic and idea of awarding the points on our main topic of focus here. Not to take away from the other activity and contributions in other sections, but we are an FF site at our fundamental core.

 

[Max Payne]

I think points should be offered for discussion in other sections to a less degree, but more for the entertainment sections where literature is more likely to be discussed, and the arts section where people put real effort in their craft.

I should think there's a reasonable compromise offered within the system.

 

[Channy]

I'm gonna have to agree with my angry friend and say that awarding points is kinda pointless. lolcwutididthar? Would it be the same as when forums had rep? And what would be the purpose of said points? What could we do with them?

 

[Cthulhu]

Like I said in the first post, they would be twofold: First, one would get an 'award' for getting the most points in a certain category (activity, social group memberships / posts, staff actions, but also thread necrophilia and donations), or a combination of categories (for example most active in both forums and social groups, or whichever arbitrary combination you can think of). This would display that user on some screen and display an image in his profile or postbit, instantly awarding him for something he did (or making him look like an idiot, for that matter).

Second, points (also in any category) can be spent on forum items, initially just a set of imagery to be put in one's profile (think plushies) but, if possible, also certain bits of advanced functionality, such as colored user titles and what-have-you.

Basically, it's supposed to be a system that, ideally, awards the most active and contributive people. There would be the odd person that spams a lot to get more points, but that wouldn't be a big problem I think, considering that posting is just part of your total point count, and getting a warning will cost you points - currently a hundred per warning point, so one spammy post would cost the poster 100 points instead of awarding him with 2.

Anyways, @ topic, I can see that, if this were to be implemented, we'd require a more advanced method of awarding points - a method of awarding different amounts of points in different sections. I could submit that as a feature request in the thread on vB.org, but I dunno if that would actually be executed or how long that would take. The alternative would be to work on it myself, but that would involve me spending a lot of time trying to comprehend the systems / programming - which I doubt is documented properly, let alone formatted / programmed neatly, which means it'll take twice or thrice as long to figure it out then it would if those criteria were met.

[offtopic rant]Fuck, would-be PHP coders all suck ass.[/offtopic rant]

 

[Pixel]

One thing id like to note. If we do go ahead with this, and collectibles are a feature, I think I might try to come up with something other than plushies. I think we need something fresh. And even if we did go with plushies. I'd like to make them a bit different from ACFs.

But anyway, we'll talk about that at a later date

 

[Makoeyes987]

I totally agree Pixel. Very good idea ^^

 

[Cookie Monster]

I really cba reading all this bullshit, so if what i say here has already been addressed, then ignore this post.

Please do. Set it up so points are awarded for the FF sections only.

This retarded. If posts in General Chat aren't going to be awarded points, you might as well rename it the Spam Section. Remember, these points will be used to to purchase additional features and items. Limiting the points to FF sections, neglects an entire population that only posts in GC, myself included, which is not fair at all. There is a lot of substantial discussion in GC, there's no valid reason the participating members in those discussions should be denied points. I know how certain members feel about spam here, but in fact there's very little spam going on in GC if you look at the discussion value in the section as a whole. If posts in GC are going to be neglected, this hack shouldn't even be implemented at all.

 

[Alex]

Throw in a whole bunch of talk about how it's going to engender discontent and factionalism and you've pretty much summed up my side of the argument for the past two pages