Crisis Core Research Thread

[Shademp]

- In the prison laboratory there are two research documents. I actually didn't find the second document until today. *facepalm* There was an unexpected difference between the Japanese and the English note.

Curiously, the cage numbers are not included in the English note. I have not checked if the numbers in the document exactly matches with the cage numbers of the cages with broken/bent metal bars. If anybody can spot any other curious differences in the content, do let me know. Here is the research document found at the end of the room:

Spoiler

- Glitch/Bug: Just like you can gain multiple Phoenix Downs from the Huge Materia enemies if you kill them at the same time, so can you acquire more than one of some Goddess Keys.

I can't picture this as anything but an overlooked bug, which exists in both the Japanese and English game. The fact that the Goddess Keys are not expended when opening Goddess Gates is also true for both versions (obviously not a bug, just pointing out the fact).


Gaming perfectionists will either want the intended number of keys, one of each, or acquire as many keys as possible; it depends on what type of completionist game save you are going for.

In the first area, Nightmare enemies (purple Dorky Faces) will appear in groups of 2 or 3. They will first give you the Base Key, then once that key is in your inventory you can get the Sacral Key.

Make sure to have proper materia equipped so you can take out three Nightmares at the same time, ensuring that you get three Basal Keys and later three Sacral Keys. Obviously if you are not using save states, some normal resets will be required in order to get this right. ...Or simply escape a battle when you only trigger two Nightmares instead of three BUT THINK OF YOUR SOLDIER HONOR GODDAMMIT! NEVER ESCAPE!

Death Machines (Sweeper type) only ever appear in groups of two, so getting two Throat Keys here is easy. Same is true for the Evil Eye enemies (Ahriman class). Just have the proper equipment ready and you'll be fine in your quest to get as many as possible of these four Goddess Keys.

 

[Shademp]

Going through the tedious process now of doing mission after mission...first in the English game and then in the Japanese game. An ever so slow process, but at least I'm building up my save file list. After clearing two missions in the available categories (Monster Research, Genesis Attacks and Hojo Samples) I then create a new save. This way, one can easily load a save and check what the one-time reward is for any given mission when it is cleared the first time.

- The corrupted G copy boss before the Genesis Avatar battle is called "G Regicide". I didn't know what regicide means. Apparently it can mean "king slayer" or "murder of a king". I wonder if there is any intended symbolism here or if the name was chosen just because it sounds COOL and IMPORTANT. Yeah, a king was killed! Down with the monarchy!

I suppose that "G Regicide" could represent the "end of an era". The end of order.

- A higher level version of the grey G makonoids is the "G Purgatorio" which can be battled in a variety of mission. Just noticed that if you kill this enemy while it is using the Tracking Missile attack, its death animation will look slightly different: The blue sparkling effects of the Tracking Missile attack will still be happening while the makonoid is twitching on the ground.

- For some reason, in the missions where you fight Zack data, the battle music takes about 3-4 seconds into the actual battle before it starts playing. =/ (Missions 5-3-2 and 5-4-5) I need to check if this is true for when playing on the physical console as well.

 

[Shademp]

Finally. Every mission, except for the Minerva battle, have been completed in both the Japanese and English game. Zack is on Lv98. In the Japanese game I just earned the Genji Armor from completing the DMW 100%, but I have some distance left to go in the English game; five scenes left to be unlocked, to be exact.

There are two Magic Pots I have not gotten rewards from, but I only need to get a special reward from one of them: The Assault Targe. All the other items I already have in my inventory.

The plan is that once I have defeated Minerva in both versions I will have a break from Crisis Core. For the sake of principle I am not going to exploit the "Steal 99 Phoenix Down repeatedly from Minerva" plan. I want to see how this slower grinding process goes down in the English game so I can then easier do it in the Japanese game, where the "Steal 99 Phoenix Downs" plan is not available because losing in a mission means Game Over; you can't stack up Phoenix Downs over and over.


- Although I believe that the number of available areas (seven) in the final dungeon is intentional I still can't shake the feeling that more secrets were at the very least intended. All you get from going through Lake of Oblivion, Cage of Binding and Howling Fang is unlocking an alternate path to Portal of Severance. If you are low level, the rewards in the prison area could be moderately useful, but if you play the game like I do then the reward of traversing the full final dungeon will feel very empty: CONGRATS, YOU CAN NOW USE AN ELEVATOR (in Portal of Severance) THAT YOU COULDN'T USE BEFORE!

I feel like an extra section of the cave should be unlockable here:

Just look how oddly darkened that part of the wall is. Almost like the hinting contures of an additional path through the cave. But in the CC Complete Guide there is absolutely nothing to show a secret area. If a secret area exists, it would have to be found in the English game. Though I'm fairly convinced that if you view the Depths of Judgment through a model viewer, you will find that there is no secret path. I'll report back once I'm 100% sure.

***EDIT: Yup, just looked at the model(s) for this area in both the Japanese and English game. There is no secret path.***

That feeling you get in some games where your mind goes "but there is supposed to be more" is so tickling. If Crisis Core: International had been made, which I'm convinced was originally the plan, then I'd bet money that this second Japanese version would have gotten an extra area in the final dungeon.


More random commentary: I find it humorous that the goddess statue in the Light of Doom area was changed so dramatically for the English game, but the Goddess Gates and the Pedestal still use the Japanese contures and design for the goddess. These did not change between versions.

Spoiler: Pr00fz

(LOL Zack is all liek 'WHO SAID THAT?!')

Comparing other gates, signs etc in this dungeon I have not been able to find any version differences.

 

[Shademp]

I confirmed that the numbers of the broken cages and the numbers in the Japanese research document match.

Each of these five broken cages include a message on the wall, presumably written in blood. Odd how all five prisoners got the same idea, right?

The texture used for this "blood text" is the same in both the Japanese and English game. Funny enough, the text is written in Japanese (yes, in the English game too) and the exact same message is pasted onto the wall in all five cages, except that the in-game script will have you reading different stories.

Playing in 3x window size and high resolution, I was able to get some fairly good snapshots of the blood text. However I don't think that even a person who knows Japanese would be able to discern what all the symbols are.

Comparing with the in-game script I was only able to match the first half of the scripted blood note from Cage 036 with what is actually on the wall:

You will spot some tiny rewrites between the wall text and the text box.

In the English game, the text bits that match were translated into this:

I volunteered to be a test subject.
SOLDIER conditioning was just...not enough.

I wanted...I needed to become stronger.

But look at me now...
Better than SOLDIER? Ha! I'm weaker than a grunt!​

It's not impossible that the second half of the graphical wall text matches with some of the other cage notes, as read in the text windows, but that the rewrites are too big for me to spot the similarity. For completion, here are the blood notes from each cage, in both the English and the Japanese game.

Spoiler: Cage 010

Spoiler: Cage 022

Spoiler: Cage 027

Spoiler: Cage 029

Spoiler: Cage 036

 

[Strangelove]

this is where being able to get the textures from the game would be interesting

i managed to make out this out of the second half, which doesn't seem to match any of the other text at all, and by 'make out' i mean i made a bunch of assumptions and guesses and it might not be anywhere near right:

さっき、ここからにげだそうとしているやつらがいるという噂を聞いた
やつらが力を合わせてここからにげだす
今は・・・（解読不能）

earlier, i heard a rumour about some guys who were trying to escape from here
they will work together and escape this place
now... (illegible)

(the end of the second line there looks longer in the game, and 'illegible' isn't written there; i just can't read it)

 

[Shademp]

I have not found a way to rip textures through Noesis yet, so RINOA will have to do for now. There are a few corruptions, due to how imperfect the RINOA software is.

Default resolution:

Three times the size:

Open each picture in a new tab to watch with a white background. The text may or may not be easier to read. Either way, I think it's impossible to make out all the symbols with 100% certainty even if I found a better way to rip the texture.

 

[Strangelove]

the last word of the second sentence looks like にげ？？る (which is some variation of 'escape') and the last line looks like 今は、その？？？？？見つけ？すしか ('now, have no other option but to find those ?????'?)

 

[Shademp]

Thank you for taking a look at this text hito. Seeing this fragment of an unused BLOOD TEXT makes me squee

Just to be on the safe side I looked through the Complete Guide and the Ultimania to see if the full wall text is revealed anywhere, but I could not find it in any obvious pages.

Also, I updated my previous post about the speculated "secret path". Checked the models for the Depths of Judgment in both the Japanese and English game and there is indeed no secret path behind that wall. Bummer.

 

[ExMajik]

This may be of interest to this community...
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/xWIKHhw__RQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[Shademp]

@ExMajik

That is really out of this world. How did you come across this beta intro?

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

The escaped test subjects are obviously those five Makonoids, but doesn't it almost feel like more was meant to be done with them?

 

[Shademp]

@Tres

Indeed. At the very least, I wonder if there is an extra layer of religious references here. Maybe references to the Book of Genesis? I have no idea and I don't have a bible in my apartment to look this up. If one really wanted to make sure that all grounds were covered, one would read The Divine Comedy and the Book of Genesis...neither of which I have read.

It is curious how each test subject has their own story. Something deeper may well be at works here.

 

[Shademp]

- Even though I'm on Lv99, the numbers in the DMW reel lined up to 777 (which is what happens when you level up). I had forgotten this could happen.

- For 4 1/2 hours I've been playing Crisis Core now, trying to unlock the remaining DMW cutscenes in the English game. I did make some good progress in just over an hour, unlocking four scenes out of five, but the last one just refuses. >____<

What remains is the Tseng DMW scene where Zack walks out of the Modeoheim bathhouse. This is more frustrating than the Magic Pot ventures.


*EDIT*



Finally unlocked the last remaining DMW scene in the English game!!

For completion here is a snapshot from the Japanese game.

I have save files from both versions so that you can easily view this reward message at any time.


What this means is that I now have snapshots from every DMW "character cutscene" (summons and creatures thusly not included) in both the Japanese and English game. Not counting the Genesis DMW snapshots (which I placed in a separate Genesis folder), I ended up with exactly 1000 snapshots showing all these cutscenes (the number was not intentional, I swear). Sometimes I took really few snapshots and spared only the bits with actual text, sometimes I really went overboard by taking 2-3 pics per second.


- Click here to download a zip file with the aforementioned 1000 snapshots


Random observation: The fifth Tseng DMW scene is the only time we see Zack with the Buster Sword on his back while still having his 'young self' or 'puppy self' haircut.

 

[Shademp]

- Turns out you can't sell Super Ribbons or any Genji equipment. I was kind of surprised at the Super Ribbon not being sellable, just like with the Fury Ring.

- Currently farming SP in preparation for the Minerva battle, trying on my own to figure out the best farming spot. So far, my best spot is mission 2-5-3 which is only available from the last chapter. Mover EX enemies appear with decent frequency and grant 8000 SP upon defeat which is of course done with a single Costly Punch.

Usually however there will appear Iron Claw (Death Claw type) and Jack o' Lantern (Dorky/Funny Face type) enemies. But I then noticed that this wasn't actually a setback.

Equip Mog's Amulet so that items dropped and stolen are always rare. Jack o' Lanterns will drop Stop materia, each of which can be converted to 3000 SP. Iron Claws will drop Silence Blade in high frequency and each one can be converted to 1000 SP. With Steal or Mug equipped, you can steal one Hero Drink from each Iron Claw. You'll have no difficulty building up to 99 Hero Drinks for ATK bonuses in Materia Fusion. If you can afford it, equip Brigand's Gloves so that a steal is always successful, thus saving you some time.

With the above equipment, make sure that you steal a Flare from each Mover EX, as one Lv1 Flare is convertable to 10540 SP.

Using this method I was able to move up from 2 million SP total to 6 million SP in about 3 hours. Steve recommends that you have at least 10 million SP before the Minerva battle, so that the effects of your SP Master materia (which draws SP to increase your attack and defense) will last for a decent amount of time. So while some grinding is required this method is still better than I expected. You will quickly max out your materia inventory so make sure to SP convert often.

Flare is the rare steal from Mover EX, with the normal steal being 2x Mythril. If you have the patience, unequip the Mog's Amulet for a while so you can accumulate Mythril for SPR effects in Materia Fusion which will be very important for the Minerva battle. This will heavily slow down the SP farming process because you rarely get Stop and Silence Blade drops anymore, but you have to farm Mythril at one point or another anyway.


In the 9-6-1 and 9-6-3 missions you can steal SP Master materia, each convertable to 24010 SP. However the battles in these mission will last way too long, making the 2-5-3 mission the superior SP farming spot thus far.



- Another note about Steve's guide: Have his bestiary change the enemy name "Jack 'o Lantern" to the correct one which is "Jack o' Lantern".

 

[ForceStealer]

Steve's either gonna love you or hate you

 

[ExMajik]

@ExMajik

That is really out of this world. How did you come across this beta intro?

It's on a beta Crisis Core build I own. It has many differences from the final retail build. Sorry the link I posted didn't work. I tried to fix it but this forum doesn't seem to allow regular users to edit posts...

 

[Shademp]

You need to make either five or ten posts (I don't remember which) before you can edit your own posts.

Do you have a forum where you discuss and pick apart this beta build? This is the type of discovery I'd expect to see on the TCRF forum or on Qhimm, but clearly no 0.9 version is being discussed there.

 

[Shademp]

- I can certainly understand how I appear as a bit aloof as I keep pointing out imperfections in Steve's guide, when I could just keep a list of what-needs-updated to myself. But I want to show everyone just how much work I put into the CC research. Plus it's better if I wait until I've played through the English American version too before I message Steve about the corrections and updates, so that I can safely say where the differences are and aren't when comparing the American and European version.

- It is a lesser known fact that rewatching the BBC series The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy is an excellent pastime while you are farming for SP in Crisis Core.

- As it turns out, Steve's guide pointed me to a better SP farming spot: Missions 9-5-2 and 9-5-3 has the enemy Three Stars which is the most powerful Mover enemy. Each one grants 20000 SP upon defeat. Not only that, but I noticed that for each consecutive kill you make without Zack receiving damage, the battle spoils get multiplied with the total number of kills. So in some battles you can kill four enemies, then kill the Three Stars and get 20000x5 SP! Very fast process. Though the 2-5-3 mission was still good for farming Hero Drinks, Mythril and gaining a lot of Rune Armlets (from the Mover EX enemy) that one could sell for a decent price.

Mission 9-5-3 is the best SP farming spot, as the Three Stars enemy only appear as the boss of 9-5-2. You get a lot of Mythril Armlets from the defeated Three Stars, which is useful because they sell for even higher than Rune Armlets! Rune Armlets sell for 4000 gil while Mythril Armlets sell for 10000 gil each!

 

[Shademp]

- Today is a tragic day. Turns out...I missed one mail in the Japanese game. ......Way back in Chapter 2.

The mail was "Personnel Announcement 0012". You get it when you step into the northwest section of LOVELESS Avenue in Chapter 2. This exact spot, right when Zack aligns with the wall parallel to him:

You don't need to go here for anything in Chapter 2, other than getting this mail. What this means is that most of my Japanese saves now have the imperfection of not having the Personnel Announcement 0012 mail. >_____< Freck it all.

Spoiler: Personnel Announcement 0012

- According to The Complete Guide, there are a total of 119 mails one can receive.

Page 256 photo

However, in my final save in the English game I have a total of 117 mails. 116 in the Japanese because I missed one. The anomaly appears to be in the &#12524;&#12450;FC [Rea Fan Club(?)] folder, titled Hero News in the English game. In my saves, there are three Silver Elite mails and three Zack fan club mails, adding to a total of 6 mails in contrast to the number 8 in the mail pie chart.

Page 256 up-close photo

Clearly there are two mails that I have not read. I wonder if these are part of some "lose" scenario, like if you don't join the Zack fanclub or if you join the Silver Elite too late?

I'm guessing that the maximum number of mails one can have in a save file is still 117 but that the total number of mails add up to 119 when including all the variants.

 

[Strangelove]

&#12524;&#12450;FC [Rea Fan Club(?)]

'rare fan club'

there's three messages in the rare fan club set where you will only receive one depending on certain conditions being met. so the max number of messages you can actually get in the game is 117

 

[Shademp]

Looking further in The Complete Guide, I can confirm that the mail in question is the third Zack fan club mail. There are three variants of it.

Page 272 mentions what the conditions are
It says "clear X fan club events". 0-1 cleared events, versus 2 cleared events versus 3 cleared events, each leading to their own variant of the mail. I do not know what these events are.


In page 268 we can read the three variants of this mail.

- Mail A (80) & Mail B (79)

- Mail C (78) (the one most of us will be familiar with)

So in Mail A the number of followers in Zack's fan club are a mere 1024. Mail B shows 51836 followers and Mail C reads 109348 members. The quote in the mail changes in each one.

We are referred to page 271 for an explanation of when these mails are received, but I could only find one passage in that page referring to the Zack FC mails. Does it shed any light on what these "fan events" are?

 

[Strangelove]

is there a note at the bottom of the p.272 chart or page marked '&#8251;&#65299;', or does that just say that you only get one message?

 

[Shademp]

Why yes there is a note!

 

[Strangelove]

then it does name the three events that influence the mail contents: 'a mother's disappearance' (&#27597;&#35242;&#22833;&#36394, 'fan club merger' (&#12501;&#12449;&#12531;&#12463;&#12521;&#12502;&#21512;&#20341, and 'the sephiroth fan club' (&#12475;&#12501;&#12451;&#12525;&#12473;&#12501;&#12449;&#12531;&#12463;&#12521;&#12502

 

[Shademp]

Awesome! Thanks for the fast translation work Hito. Now I know more scenarios to try out in a New Game+ playthrough where I'll be playing through the game very loosely, allowing for lose scenarios and unlocking the alternate final mails for Zack's fan club.