Did you like Cait Sith?

Did you like Cait Sith?


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DLPB

Banned Flunky
AKA
Seifer Almasy, DanielReturns
#1
Spoilers in this post:


Serious question. Personally, I thought Cait was a stupid character which deducted from FF7 far more than it added to it.

Cait being a spy was not a bad idea, but the execution was poor. Cait being a robot mounted on a stuffed toy and being controlled by Reeve was just absolutely bonkers. Making a character join you as a fortune teller for no real reason whatsoever was a very weak story point which does not sit well with me.

In any scene he is in, I find it hard to blot him out so that I can appreciate the greatness that is surrounding him. As some of you know, I am removing Cait for PC in an optional mod, with a human character called Skoll Iscarit.

I don't expect the new character to be widely loved or for all people to like what I am doing, but the choice is there.
 
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X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
#2
I generally liked Cait Sith for a couple of reasons:

• He rode a giant stuffed Mog.
- Personally, I really liked the design of his Mog. To me his overall character design fit his "origin" in Gold Saucer, and brought a very different element to your party. To be fully honest, I'd rather Reeve just puppeted the giant Mog as the main character, and Cait Sith was his little support buddy.
• His bit in the Temple of the Ancients, and being a spy, and coming over to your side was something that I liked about his character.

As a battle character, I didn't care for him, because his limit breaks aren't good enough to swap him out for any of the other characters that I used. I don't understand why Reeve would have controlled Cait Sith, who was THEN controlling a Mog, though. Why not save the time, and just have the damn Mog, since it's much cooler, and packs a better punch anyway? :awesome:

POST FFVII, I'm not AS fond of him sans-giant-mog, but I certainly don't dislike him.



X :neo:
 

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Makoeyes987, the notorious liar Marquis Halim Ondore IV, Cupcake, Smooth Criminal, Xelloss, Christian Bale, Ma'at
#3
I think he's a great character who added levity while also giving a different perspective of someone who worked for the Shinra Company. He's loveable in his own silly way.
 

X-SOLDIER

Harbinger O Great Justice
AKA
X
#5
I'll edit Mog's post to show my feelings on Quina in FFIX

S/He's 'aight. I hated him/her back in the day, but over the years s/he grew on me.
Given that comparison, I understand that some people would dislike him, but he's hardly a detraction from FFVII. Looking back AFTER the compilation, he seems a little more absurd, but hardly out of place. I was actually really glad that the Mog made it into ACC, if only briefly.


X :neo:
 

DLPB

Banned Flunky
AKA
Seifer Almasy, DanielReturns
#6
Quen was OK for me, simply because he/she was not nearly an important character with a main role, and because the game itself is much more lighthearted in tone, and more... what's the word... fantasy like?

Infact I loved quen's stupidity in the background and it didn't bother me. With VII it did because it was a much more serious game and was geared much more towards human civilisation and characters and to our real world.

It is like seeing a cartoon where Daffy duck can walk on thin air, that doesn't bother you, you expect it and are happy it is part of the Cartoon.

Different world, different story, different physics, different structure, different view on it.
 
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Tennyo

Paladin of Voltron
#7
I actually really like Cait Sith. I like when stories that have a somewhat-serious context to have goofy little bits thrown in. It's why I like FFVII to begin with. :)
 

Arianna

Holy, Personified
AKA
Katie; Seta.
#8
I cried when Cait Sith 1 died. Seriously.

Then with Aerith's death, even though I knew that was coming.

I like all members of the group. Yuffie and Cait Sith keep them on their toes, sore after treading on them. ;P

Honestly, I don't see anything to hate about Cait Sith, except betraying the group at first.

It's true, Reeve had no other choice, being a Shinra executive and all. It started out as espionage, but then he found he agreed with their missions more so than Shinra's.

I believe him when he said he didn't want to hurt anyone.
 

DLPB

Banned Flunky
AKA
Seifer Almasy, DanielReturns
#9
I don't quite see how anyone could get emotion from that thing, not least because the actual translation makes it clear he is a robot and is expendable.

The sad music is pretty much all there is. I find myself in a minority here but not everywhere luckily. Cait is so out of place that it is painful... I tried to like him but to have a bouncing stuffed toy in the scenes is just too far for me.

:P
 
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Cthulhu

Administrator
AKA
Yop
#10
Wait. Game's made out of Minecraft characters with giant bouncing breasts and swinging 200-pound lumps of metal who get fucked up the ass and someone thinks a cat with a crown riding a fat moogle deducts from the game? :monster:

Really, FFVII's full of bits that are rather silly, so that is hardly the only one. It's actually quite typical really, a lot of Japanese media has rather silly bits in otherwise serious productions. John Cleese would've fit right in there, and/or vice versa.
 

DLPB

Banned Flunky
AKA
Seifer Almasy, DanielReturns
#11
Yeah but none bother me like cait because he is just unbelievable for me. Sure lots of stuff in fiction is that way and ff7 is no different but cait just goes way passed the line. Even more ridiculous when you see him in AC and his Scot accent :P
 

Xpelair

Pro Adventurer
#12
Hhm. I had mixed emotions with Cait Sith. First it was all "Ooh lol look at the funny puffy thingy." then it all turned into "Fucking bastard, get back here yo wit' ma key" and then I eventually liked him again.

My first thought when I was introduced to Cait Sith was Barret in his sailor outfit. I was young and thought that when Barret walked off in a hump at the Gold Saucer, he dressed up in a funny big round marshmallow and pretended to be a fortune teller to get back at Cloud during Costa Del Sol. :/

Slightly off topic, but about why I came to liking Cait Sith was really quite funny. A long time ago my neighbour had a black she-cat with a white chest that reminded me of Cait Sith. My friend and I would nickname the cat Cait Sith. Funnily every time you said the name the cat would look up at you, or if it was off in the distance it would trot over. Long story short, the cat went missing. Me and a close friend tried to help, calling it's name and waving around cat food which didn't help. We ended up screaming Cait Sith as we walked around and found the black cat pop out from the bushes near the school football pitch which we'd walk past EVERYDAY to go to school. Since then on, the owner called the cat Cait Sith. So every time I play FFVII and use Cait Sith, it reminds me of Cait Sith - the black cat. That's why I have a lot of feelings towards Cait Sith.
/fairy tale out

I just wish Cait Sith's introduction was a little more... you know... fitting.
 

minimosey

Pro Adventurer
#13
I voted "no" up there because I didn't like Cait Sith my first playthrough, and for most of the years I've been in the fandom I've thought of him as a way-too-silly character that would have been better as a human character. There are still some things I don't like about him: for example, considering his suspicious, forced entrance and the fact that most players who hit Gongaga will hit it right after Gold Saucer, it's...downright amazingly stupid there's not even a hint of suspicion about him after the party finds Turks are following them. Come on, guys. I would have taken Cloud having a "..." moment and Cait Sith coming up with some kind of excuse, or some type of distraction happening, over Cloud saying "I don't want to believe there's a spy. I trust everyone."

...I guess it's sweet for showing Cloud warming up more, but it just seems to smack of idiot ball that he doesn't even consider it. And no, I would not want to have Cait Sith in my battle party.

However, I do like the idea of him, and it's actually kind of clever in a way how Reeve placed him--stuffed toy robot with a wacky AI in a wacky amusement park, eliminating the need to risk his own life or a subordinate's should Cait Sith be caught. Except then the game does raise the question of if Cait Sith can be considered alive with his sacrifice in the temple. Does Cait Sith #2 have all the memories that Cait Sith #1 had? I wish they'd played more with it after that scene, but no. And Dirge seems to have cheapened any individual Cait Sith's worth.

Basically, I don't mind his form, I like his silly fortunes in the story, I like the question the scene in the temple raises. Otherwise, I don't particularly like the execution, but it's not bad enough to mar my liking of the moments he appears in.
 
#14
They have said that they entire point of the Cait Sith death scene was to almost parody the typical overly-dramatic, long-goodbye'd, "heroic" death (not to mention easily remedied) less than an hour before Aerith gets taken quickly, permanently, and needlessly. It's there as a contrast.
 
#15
I like his style; the way Cait Sith and his "stuffed mog" moves makes me smile because it is so silly.

I am neutral about his role as a playable character; often the characters you have are just icons with very similar characteristics and there are almost never any strategic advantages to choosing one character over another. So among a bunch of several other more "cool" icons, Cait Sith isn't appealing.
If you however master his Slot limit, he will be the most powerful character in your party.


I also like how, as ForceStealer mentioned, his "death" is there as an act of parody. You sense the silliness even without knowing of the interview with the writers.

What I dislike is how poorly thought out his existence is. At first Cait Sith seems like an AI, then an automaton... And when we bring into view Reeve's fabled "Inspire" move, things just go batshit insane and contradictory. Lots of negative points for this one.

But for me the positive and the negative about Cait Sith balances out. I neither dislike or like his character as a whole. Some parts I like, some parts I don't like. What is for certain is that I never joined the group who severely hated him.

Maybe this poll deserves a "Neutral" option.
 
AKA
Noctis
#16
I think Cait Sith is cute! I didn't mind the character, never used him/it/whatever, but I really was never truly annoyed with him. He was just kinda there, and I don't see why lots of fans seem to be SO upset about him being in the game. There's this general idea that his character is useless, but really none of the characters are useless if you know how to use them. Plot wise, whatever. He did help despite what some people think. And he's controlled... by Reeve! I love Reeve. >w<
 

DLPB

Banned Flunky
AKA
Seifer Almasy, DanielReturns
#17
I am not alone.... :P

Shademp, yup unfortunately the slots have a degree of luck if I remember, based on the game timer? A bad flag. Sure Cait's "All Over" is the most powerful move in the game but it is really cheap to beat enemies that way I think. In a hardcore Mod I made the All Over move actually a much weaker attack hehe

But regardless sure, as a battle character he is not that bad, I actually like seeing his toybox and stuff but the problem is that my gripes all come from the story. The forced entrance has been mentioned but I do have a limit of what I can turn a blind eye to, and when it comes to a robot mounted on a stuff toy being operated by a main man of Shin-Ra, to spy on your team, it is just too much.

I know lots of people can ignore that but I can't because I find it interferes with the story which is mostly of a dark and serious nature. I also know a lot of people like him for his appearance and I can appreciate that. But for me personally I demand a fiction to be up to a standard and when FF7 got so much right, I see Cait as a massive blight.

/offtopic but I also have small gripes with other parts which are MAIN story, such as Tifa's dress. I know alot of males like to wank off to her but again, I think it cheapens her character. If she was that way inclined, sure, but she isn't. The Japanese like to do that, but I would have preferred a longer skirt. I used to like characters like that as a teen but now I am older I see it as a blatant exploitation and something which is not at all necessary.
 
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Omega

We have come to terms
AKA
Godot, Joker
#18
I loved Caith Sith the character.

Cait Sith the party member in a battle? Not so much. I don't like Limit Breaks with a chance of instant death, and he's not really standout otherwise.

I love that he beats people with a megaphone, however >:3
 

DLPB

Banned Flunky
AKA
Seifer Almasy, DanielReturns
#21
:P You know that was supposed to be Marvellous Cheer I take it? :) I like that name. HP shout is really just a description of what it does. I dunno how the translators missed that....
 

Tir McDohl

rune bearer
AKA
Yula
#23
Liked him, found him funny and at times endearing and not at all out of place in the VII universe. I can't say I was ever interested in including him in my battle party, but that has less to do with Cait Sith himself than it does my tendency to use my absolute favorite characters as often as they're available(in pretty much all replays, too. my fave party: Cid and Tifa).
 
#24
I'll never quite understand where you got this notion that FF7 is firmly grounded in reality. I NEVER use Cait Sith in battle but I don't really have an opinion about him one way or the other.

And as for your Tifa comment I know plenty of girls who dress more provocatively than they actually are. She IS a bartender in the slums, after all. And I know a ton of girls who are the reverse.
 

DLPB

Banned Flunky
AKA
Seifer Almasy, DanielReturns
#25
It is grounded somewhat in reality. In fact I have said many times that it is fiction but with realistic elements mixed in. It deals with serious issues in the main story, and Cait is a main character so scrutiny is greater.

Fiction does not mean "Can get away with anything", if that is a philosophy of a writer, their fiction will be a failure. FF7 does have gravity which is based on Earth, it does have humans. It does have flesh based creatures and it does adhere for the most part on strict interpretations of real life physics.

Fictional worlds work because of this, because they have rules. They work because you can suspend disbelief, and as I said, if you can do that with Cait, the fiction will work for you. For me, a bouncing, big white stuffed toy witha robot cat on top, controlled by Reeve. A non living character utterly absurd with an absurd story of how he joins your party... spying on you... is just too much for me.

Even if it is fiction, that is too far for me. That's why I dislike Cait, it is because he breaks the realism of the fictional world he is set in. If this thing was a creature in the background, then it could be ignored but it is part of the main arc.

As for Tifa, it was a Japanese deliberate appeasement to male fanboys. I can accept her dress and turn a blind eye to it, but it is still blatant exploitation which would not change anything had she wore something longer.

I'm curious about how you feel about the Wall Market segment. :awesome:

I pass that off as gameplay and a bit of fun. It isn't something dealing with a serious issue at that moment, and it isn't something that breaks the fiction for me (nor does snowboarding down the glacier collecting balloons). A main character with a main arc in the character that is Cait, does.

I accept that games are very different to films and need to have a degree of interpretation and leeway. That's also why AC failed so much with a general audience, because it tries to be a film with gameplay elements. You cannot make a game play like a film, you cannot make a film view like a game.

They are separate media. I don't actually accept that Cloud did squats for a wig or that he went round wall market collecting clothes in mini quests. I see it as Dressed as female > got into Corneos > confronted corneo. The rest is game play. It isn't a deal breaker.

It does not destroy the fiction. It doesn't destroy the game. Cait does, for me.

:)
 
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