Evangelion
- Thread starter looneymoon
- Start date
Unit-01
Might be around.
- AKA
- Sic, Anthony
Well this is as good as any time to make a return.
Just finished watching this movie, a nearly 7 year long wait for me comes to a close.
What a thrilling ride that 2 and 1/2 hours was. I'm glad I just finally got to see it.
Really just in awe.
I watched this first viewing with the English dub, and while I'm happy the main cast came back from NGE.... I couldn't help but feel this dub was a bit rushed. Going to watch through again with one of my friends in Japanese.
Edit- LOL I JUST SAW MY SIGNATURE.....
I should uh change that now.
Just finished watching this movie, a nearly 7 year long wait for me comes to a close.
What a thrilling ride that 2 and 1/2 hours was. I'm glad I just finally got to see it.
Really just in awe.
Shinji finally got a happy ending. The movie definitely had a very similar structure to the way EoE went, but everything was on a better note, and this version of Instrumentality was almost a continuation of what we left off with in EoE.
I watched this first viewing with the English dub, and while I'm happy the main cast came back from NGE.... I couldn't help but feel this dub was a bit rushed. Going to watch through again with one of my friends in Japanese.
Edit- LOL I JUST SAW MY SIGNATURE.....
I should uh change that now.
X-SOLDIER
Harbinger O Great Justice
- AKA
- X
Watched this today.
X
Really REALLY liked how it played with the characters' dynamics and gave them time to process things. Having the juxtaposition between the older ex-classmates and the others really helped in getting to that point of allowing the permanent-adolescents to seize a hold of what they needed in order to grow up. The bits with Shinji being totally numb and then being set off by the collar making him throw up, and the way that they depict him dealing with the trauma in juxtaposition to Asuka being exhausted while "Rei" gets to discover what it's like to be a human were all really fantastic.
Asuka doesn't have to grow up, so she's tired of it, so her role REALLY comes into its own when she gets to go all in and sacrifice things to try to end everything only to find out that they've been out-played. I absolutely LOVE the way that she and Mari interact with each other, and the two of them interact with Shinji. You can feel the relationship that they built while they were stuck not aging, and how much love and respect they have for each other, especially in how they have overly affectionate and demeaning kicknames for one another. Also, Asuka unleashing all of the blocked Angelic corruption and getting pulled into the Unit-13 plug was brilliant.
The parts with Misato openly talking about how she had custody of Shiji and having her own son who's the exact same age being her & Kaji's son was just damn brilliant. It's nice to have her be able to step into the role of a supportive parental figure full on in the very end. I also really like that for her arc, she ends up being the source of cutting off the cycle of anger that's directed at Shinji for his choices, and getting shot for it and pushing into the dialogue that allows everyone to come to terms again.
The real-life tokusatsu stage and increasing just repetition of sets showing that Shinji's conflicts and moments of lashing out at Angels, Asuka, and Misato, and others were all just channelling the same pain that his dad hadn't resolved. I like that it's Gendo who calls out that their conflict of hope & despair can never be resolved through violence and pain, and in the end it's FINALLY the moment that shows the single most important and difficult to grasp lesson for kids who grew up in this sort of environment – Gendo has always been cutting himself off because he's afraid of Shinji.
The most important part of that lesson is that it's SHINJI who's stepping into the role of being the adult. It's INSANELY difficult to convey the way where while the parental figures in your life are almost always in a permanent position of power over you, your exposure to your own growth and the way your parent acts allows you to see the things in them that they've blinded themselves to over years – and thus they prevent their child from ever having the power to change about them because of fear.
This is why it gets to be the happy ending, because Shinji's adoptive guardian genuinely loves, supports, and trusts, and so he has the power to both kill his father as well as pat him on the back and send him on his way all at once. From there, Shinji's ok to let everyone else process their pains and move on without holding on to them for himself. The moment where you get to see the scene of him and Asuka from End of Evangelion where they're no longer both wrapped up and inter-dependent upon one another and reinforcing the self-perpetuating cycle of needing and taking away the thing that they each need from each other. Instead, he's able to honestly tell her that her finally being honest about liking him really mattered to him, and him saying that back is what she needed to hear, and then he's able to let go of clinging onto that version of events and save her from herself.
It's him finally being able to let go of everything like that is where you get to see how others were projecting their needs through Shinji, and it only seemed like the things that he wanted as an extension of their affections, especially with Kaworu and how he was like an idealized version Gendo, but also how he was only bringing Shinji the happiness that would also bring himself happiness. Then at the end of it all, he has a moment where he hits the moment like Asuka does in combat against the Production EVAs in End of Evangelion in realizing that his ACTUAL mother's soul was always there with him. That's when she can finally step in for Unit-01 & Unit-13 to end their own instrumentations and actually let Shinji grow up and take his own path rather than sacrificing himself for their dream.
Then you get the proper end of them all having a world without Evangelion at all, and showing what it's like to just have a reality where they get to just exist was just... perfect.
Asuka doesn't have to grow up, so she's tired of it, so her role REALLY comes into its own when she gets to go all in and sacrifice things to try to end everything only to find out that they've been out-played. I absolutely LOVE the way that she and Mari interact with each other, and the two of them interact with Shinji. You can feel the relationship that they built while they were stuck not aging, and how much love and respect they have for each other, especially in how they have overly affectionate and demeaning kicknames for one another. Also, Asuka unleashing all of the blocked Angelic corruption and getting pulled into the Unit-13 plug was brilliant.
The parts with Misato openly talking about how she had custody of Shiji and having her own son who's the exact same age being her & Kaji's son was just damn brilliant. It's nice to have her be able to step into the role of a supportive parental figure full on in the very end. I also really like that for her arc, she ends up being the source of cutting off the cycle of anger that's directed at Shinji for his choices, and getting shot for it and pushing into the dialogue that allows everyone to come to terms again.
The real-life tokusatsu stage and increasing just repetition of sets showing that Shinji's conflicts and moments of lashing out at Angels, Asuka, and Misato, and others were all just channelling the same pain that his dad hadn't resolved. I like that it's Gendo who calls out that their conflict of hope & despair can never be resolved through violence and pain, and in the end it's FINALLY the moment that shows the single most important and difficult to grasp lesson for kids who grew up in this sort of environment – Gendo has always been cutting himself off because he's afraid of Shinji.
The most important part of that lesson is that it's SHINJI who's stepping into the role of being the adult. It's INSANELY difficult to convey the way where while the parental figures in your life are almost always in a permanent position of power over you, your exposure to your own growth and the way your parent acts allows you to see the things in them that they've blinded themselves to over years – and thus they prevent their child from ever having the power to change about them because of fear.
This is why it gets to be the happy ending, because Shinji's adoptive guardian genuinely loves, supports, and trusts, and so he has the power to both kill his father as well as pat him on the back and send him on his way all at once. From there, Shinji's ok to let everyone else process their pains and move on without holding on to them for himself. The moment where you get to see the scene of him and Asuka from End of Evangelion where they're no longer both wrapped up and inter-dependent upon one another and reinforcing the self-perpetuating cycle of needing and taking away the thing that they each need from each other. Instead, he's able to honestly tell her that her finally being honest about liking him really mattered to him, and him saying that back is what she needed to hear, and then he's able to let go of clinging onto that version of events and save her from herself.
It's him finally being able to let go of everything like that is where you get to see how others were projecting their needs through Shinji, and it only seemed like the things that he wanted as an extension of their affections, especially with Kaworu and how he was like an idealized version Gendo, but also how he was only bringing Shinji the happiness that would also bring himself happiness. Then at the end of it all, he has a moment where he hits the moment like Asuka does in combat against the Production EVAs in End of Evangelion in realizing that his ACTUAL mother's soul was always there with him. That's when she can finally step in for Unit-01 & Unit-13 to end their own instrumentations and actually let Shinji grow up and take his own path rather than sacrificing himself for their dream.
Then you get the proper end of them all having a world without Evangelion at all, and showing what it's like to just have a reality where they get to just exist was just... perfect.
X
Odysseus
Ninja Potato
- AKA
- Ody
I saw that I had gotten a like from "Unit-01" and was like "oh man, the fourth wall really was broken!" Welcome back lol.
I will need to watch this film many more times before I can truly grasp it, that's for sure. I can already say it's my favorite of the rebuilds, though at the moment I still don't think it has the punch that EoE had. I really enjoyed the more down to earth stuff in the town, and Rei Q's abrupt death was really heartbreaking. I do feel like the last act of the film got pretty bogged down in technobabble in a way Eva never quite had before, which dragged it down a bit for me. I've also never been the biggest fan of the extremely busy action sequences in any of these films, it just doesn't hold my attention the way something like Asuka fighting the mass production units did in EoE. The Ramiel battle in the first rebuild is probably still my favorite action sequence out of them. Shinji finally confronting his father head-on was great, however. The idea that Gendo feared Shinji isn't new to this film, EoE and the manga both explore that idea, but I love how they can actually talk it out this time. This is the first time I think I was really sold on Gendo's motivations.
As I expected, the CGI is a point of contention. The giant, semi-realistic Rei head is especially divisive. I myself have made no secret of my general distaste for CGI in anime elsewhere in the forum, but in this case it's so obviously supposed to unsettle the viewer with its uncanniness that it works. I'm reminded of the use of CGI in Twin Peaks season 3, where it's so poor looking as to very effectively convey how unnatural it's supposed to be. We're in an era where complaining about CGI is he norm, so I can't blame people for not getting that it's weird on purpose this time. I don't even like how the CGI Eva fights look half the time, so I'm still partly in that camp lol. As I said, I feel like the film is still just too busy looking sometimes.
I watched in English this time around. AWL is great as Rei fight me. Spike Spencer has gone over the rainbow over the past 20 years; I thought he was dreadful in the ADV dub, but I think he's phenomenal now. Of course, Grant as Asuka is still a highlight as well. Gendo has the same actor as the Funi dub (and the DC episodes of the ADV dub) and while I still think the original ADV Gendo is better, I think he did a good job with his scenes here. I can tell from the recap that his delivery of some lines from the previous three rebuilds got sharper from the forst time he did them too, I miss the Funi Kowru, though.
As I expected, the CGI is a point of contention. The giant, semi-realistic Rei head is especially divisive. I myself have made no secret of my general distaste for CGI in anime elsewhere in the forum, but in this case it's so obviously supposed to unsettle the viewer with its uncanniness that it works. I'm reminded of the use of CGI in Twin Peaks season 3, where it's so poor looking as to very effectively convey how unnatural it's supposed to be. We're in an era where complaining about CGI is he norm, so I can't blame people for not getting that it's weird on purpose this time. I don't even like how the CGI Eva fights look half the time, so I'm still partly in that camp lol. As I said, I feel like the film is still just too busy looking sometimes.
I watched in English this time around. AWL is great as Rei fight me. Spike Spencer has gone over the rainbow over the past 20 years; I thought he was dreadful in the ADV dub, but I think he's phenomenal now. Of course, Grant as Asuka is still a highlight as well. Gendo has the same actor as the Funi dub (and the DC episodes of the ADV dub) and while I still think the original ADV Gendo is better, I think he did a good job with his scenes here. I can tell from the recap that his delivery of some lines from the previous three rebuilds got sharper from the forst time he did them too, I miss the Funi Kowru, though.
Don't suppose they've said what will actually be on this set, have they? ADV or Netflix dub? Fly me to the moon? It drops at 12PM EST on August 19th.
Unit-01
Might be around.
- AKA
- Sic, Anthony
Yeah, it's been a long time since I posted here. Even my discord still has this same profile picture I've had for quite a few years now.
It's crazy to me they got AWL back. She hasn't voiced Rei in roughly 20 years.
__________________________________
It's great reading everyone's deep dives into the movie. I think I need more time and to brush up on Evangelion overall to have any real deep takes into it.
I will say with that though, I caught a lot of the call backs. From some of the shot for shot redraws of Instrumentality, the way Unit-02's head lands next to Misato looking upwards. It all had me going
. At this point I had been waiting for so long, a lot of the ideas I had for the movie disappeared with time, and it's just great that it came out.
Also, according to some of the reddit post, the town Mari and Shinji are in at the end is Anno's hometown of Ube. Which is a wild touch to add.
Also, according to some of the reddit post, the town Mari and Shinji are in at the end is Anno's hometown of Ube. Which is a wild touch to add.
null
Mr. Thou
- AKA
- null
Main takeaway:
NGE/Death/EoE, nope to the rest. No price in sight.
Misato is somehow even hotter. And still the hottest.
NGE/Death/EoE, nope to the rest. No price in sight.
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
Alright just finished the final Evangelion film a little while ago. I went and checked and it was fall-winter of 2013 when I first (and last?) watched the TV series, EoE, and the first three Rebuild movies. I know I watched the TV series and EoE subtitled, and I believe I watched the first two in the English dub, and then 3.0 subbed (because the English dub still hadn’t been released IIRC). So I decided to watch the final film dubbed.
Even though I had already looked up the general broad spoilers/Wikipedia summary months ago, that didn’t really spoil my enjoyment of the film. A plot summary can’t really encapsulate the experience since a lot of the film, particularly the climax, relies a lot on visual imagery/symbolism and abstraction. Though regardless of whether one thinks this is a weakness or strength of the Rebuild film project, the final film basically confirms the “loop theory” many people had, and full appreciation of this final film is largely affected by having seen the original 26 episode series and The End of Evangelion film. Shinji’s role and solution to the latter half of the film as essentially giving mini-therapy/epiphany sessions to the rest of the cast worked pretty well and contrasted nicely to Shinji’s role in the original series climax. Mari is still relatively underdeveloped compared to the rest of the major cast, but she still serves her function well of being a stable “rock” (for lack of a better word) the cast and narrative can lean on. Kinda funny to think that Shinji apparently hooks up from what I understand was his father and mother’s university friend/fellow researcher?
Lulcielid
Eyes of the Lord
- AKA
- Lulcy
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
There’s even more thanks to Death & Rebirth too.
Odysseus
Ninja Potato
- AKA
- Ody
So, as has been theorized in the past, this film confirms that NGE's universe has a looping structure to it, and that Kowru has lived through previous iterations of the story. I wonder if that means it's the same Kowru even in the silly dumb spin offs like the Shinji Ikari Rising Project, Angelic days, and the like. That would be funny.
Strangelove
AI Researcher
- AKA
- hitoshura
is anno making the smug cat face
a day later than i wanted but i watched 3.0+1.0, had multiple little cries during.
for a bit i was thinking 'oh no it's not going to spend ages in this village, is it' but then i got into rei's storyline. and then she just popped and i was shocked. nooo rei
i'm glad they filled in a bit of what happened to characters we didn't see in 3.0 like shinji's classmates and kaji, that was a nagging point i had again rewatching. then i was watching 3.0+1.0 with the japanese closed captions to catch all the technobabble and it suddenly says 'kensuke' and i have never been more happy to see that name. i assume there was a pretty big change in direction for 3.0 since it is pretty different from its 2.0 post-credit preview, but i would have liked a little more covering kaji. what to you mean 'director nagisa'??? what was going on there
also mari. i guess you can piece things together and maybe i will notice new stuff if i rewatched it, but i wouldn't have minded delving a bit more into her character. i kept waiting for her to mention yui to shinji. what did fuyutsuki mean with that 'iscariot maria' line, who did she betray. is it wild speculation to wonder if, given you have the ayanami and shikinami series of clones, is makinami also some kind of clone type thing. i'm grasping at straws here
also wish there were a few more wacky kitbashed evas showing up like the ones in paris, but hundreds of skull faced evas is also good.
i'm pretty satisfied so far. it felt like the anti-end of eva. i'm sure posts online trying to say eoe is a happy ending actually but sorry, if you can look me in the eyes and say that was a happy ending then you're lying right to my face. or maybe i am confusing it with the original series ending, i'm very tired right now
i'm glad they filled in a bit of what happened to characters we didn't see in 3.0 like shinji's classmates and kaji, that was a nagging point i had again rewatching. then i was watching 3.0+1.0 with the japanese closed captions to catch all the technobabble and it suddenly says 'kensuke' and i have never been more happy to see that name. i assume there was a pretty big change in direction for 3.0 since it is pretty different from its 2.0 post-credit preview, but i would have liked a little more covering kaji. what to you mean 'director nagisa'??? what was going on there
also mari. i guess you can piece things together and maybe i will notice new stuff if i rewatched it, but i wouldn't have minded delving a bit more into her character. i kept waiting for her to mention yui to shinji. what did fuyutsuki mean with that 'iscariot maria' line, who did she betray. is it wild speculation to wonder if, given you have the ayanami and shikinami series of clones, is makinami also some kind of clone type thing. i'm grasping at straws here
also wish there were a few more wacky kitbashed evas showing up like the ones in paris, but hundreds of skull faced evas is also good.
i'm pretty satisfied so far. it felt like the anti-end of eva. i'm sure posts online trying to say eoe is a happy ending actually but sorry, if you can look me in the eyes and say that was a happy ending then you're lying right to my face. or maybe i am confusing it with the original series ending, i'm very tired right now
i might try to read the anima books now, and also finish the manga finally
Unit-01
Might be around.
- AKA
- Sic, Anthony
Wanted to look into Anima too, but idk if I will.
Been a few days to mull over everything. For sure need to do a rewatch.
I had been content the past 7 years waiting on this movie, even if it was a long wait I always had something to look forward to, but now there isn't.
Its both a happy and sad thing Evangelion is over(for now). This movie really made me fill satisfied yet empty. I don't know if we'll end up getting anything else with this franchise anime wise. Anno did mention he would like to explore the 14 year time gap, so I guess a Rebuild 2.5. If that happens I don't think it'd happen anytime soon, and Anno might entrust it to someone else.
A slight wish, I would like to see what a version of Evangelion would be without all the psychoanalytical elements. But I highly doubt that would ever get produced or even be any good. NGE and the video game that came out created a lot of background lore that could be explored. It's just a thought, and from what I understand is kinda the direction Anima goes too.
Tetsujin
he/they
- AKA
- Tets
Interesting to hear people say this confirmed the loop theory because imo it kind of doesn't as everyone's "loop theory" for years has been mostly based on stuff like the sea being red and bloodstains on the moon and stuff with the point that this means this is right after End of Evangelion, which it isn't.
It seems that Kaworu is in a sort of loop and aware of other continuities (he hinted at that in the manga as well iirc) but this isn't really the loop as it was theorized way back when.
It seems that Kaworu is in a sort of loop and aware of other continuities (he hinted at that in the manga as well iirc) but this isn't really the loop as it was theorized way back when.
Theozilla
Kaiju Member
Regarding whether EoE is a “happy ending” or not, I feel this metaphor/analogy describes it best (as well as compared to 3.0+1.01):
because even though the ending message of The End of Evangelion is technically coming to same conclusion as the “I want to continue existing in this world!” epiphany/conclusion (from the TV series’ last two episodes); the manner in which it reaches it and ends at, is sorta like the equivalent of someone who was standing at the precipice and chose not to jump/rejected oblivion, but is still kinda left sitting at the precipice. While 3.0+1.01 is the same person person who has long left the precipice for while now and is looking back on reflection of how they left it.
Last edited:
null
Mr. Thou
- AKA
- null
EoE isn't a happy movie, but it's about happiness. It only states the obvious that happiness and pain are opposite sides of the same coin; there's no promise of a payoff, only that avoiding the coin toss guarantees it'll never turn up heads.
It's more optimistic than it gets credit for. In the beginning, Shinji tells Misato he's terrified he'll keep hurting people he cares about, and that by doing nothing he'll avoid making the same mistakes. Toward the end, he realizes that escaping can never lead to true happiness, deciding to move past his mistakes and engage the world. He becomes self-aware, taking responsibility for his happiness, knowing he's not entitled to it and might not ever find it. He says goodbye to his mother; Yui and Misato and Rei and Lilith are gone, there are no more powerful women to take control, make decisions for him, and protect him. He faces the ruined consequence of his mistakes on his own. For her part, Asuka chooses to leave Instrumentality where being abandoned and replaced is impossible, showing her own resolve to pursue true happiness.
In the end he does the exact thing he was afraid of and hurts Asuka. She replies with a gesture of pure affection; he's not avoiding her, and she's not pushing him away. They're not slaves to their trauma anymore. We don't know where they stand now, or if the rest of the world will return; if we did, the ending would become either be happy or sad, and the nuance would be lost. As Anno once said when describing Eva, contact with others is frightening and ambiguous.
Fair warning: ANIMA reads like batshit fanfiction. I love it for that reason, but it's not for everyone.
It's more optimistic than it gets credit for. In the beginning, Shinji tells Misato he's terrified he'll keep hurting people he cares about, and that by doing nothing he'll avoid making the same mistakes. Toward the end, he realizes that escaping can never lead to true happiness, deciding to move past his mistakes and engage the world. He becomes self-aware, taking responsibility for his happiness, knowing he's not entitled to it and might not ever find it. He says goodbye to his mother; Yui and Misato and Rei and Lilith are gone, there are no more powerful women to take control, make decisions for him, and protect him. He faces the ruined consequence of his mistakes on his own. For her part, Asuka chooses to leave Instrumentality where being abandoned and replaced is impossible, showing her own resolve to pursue true happiness.
In the end he does the exact thing he was afraid of and hurts Asuka. She replies with a gesture of pure affection; he's not avoiding her, and she's not pushing him away. They're not slaves to their trauma anymore. We don't know where they stand now, or if the rest of the world will return; if we did, the ending would become either be happy or sad, and the nuance would be lost. As Anno once said when describing Eva, contact with others is frightening and ambiguous.
Fair warning: ANIMA reads like batshit fanfiction. I love it for that reason, but it's not for everyone.
Tetsujin
he/they
- AKA
- Tets
Man, I really hope we'll get the original concept for 3.0 at some point in some form. Even if it's just a manga or just a dang summary. That 14-year gap between 2.0 and 3.0 is just too interesting.
edit:
Also, I watched the movies in Japanese w/ subs but I briefly checked the dub and noticed Mari's singing in 2.22 is still in Japanese and I could've sworn it was dubbed on the Blu-ray (which I can't check bc of reasons >.>) so I compared the other movies with the Blu-rays I have and I guess Amazon just have their own dub. Looks like the dub rights clusterfuck is universal.
...which makes me wonder if the home video release of 3.0+1.0 is also gonna be different from Amazon then.
edit:
Also, I watched the movies in Japanese w/ subs but I briefly checked the dub and noticed Mari's singing in 2.22 is still in Japanese and I could've sworn it was dubbed on the Blu-ray (which I can't check bc of reasons >.>) so I compared the other movies with the Blu-rays I have and I guess Amazon just have their own dub. Looks like the dub rights clusterfuck is universal.
...which makes me wonder if the home video release of 3.0+1.0 is also gonna be different from Amazon then.
Last edited:
Strangelove
AI Researcher
- AKA
- hitoshura
i was wondering if we’d get a 3.33+1.11. i had only seen the original japanese dvd of 1.0 and i can’t remember if they added new content to the bd release, i don’t know if it was new stuff or just not having watched it in a long time but watching the uk bd for 1.11 felt fresh and new. (also the dvd came with a frame of film strip from the film and i was hoping for something cool like an angel or a character and i got… a frame of the umbilical cable or something lol)
also gonna try looking for the psp port of eva 2 since it’s meant to add stuff compared with the ps2 original and also i cba digging out my ps2 but my psp is working fine
gonna get really into eva like i am 15 again
edit; ebay has the psp eva 2/another cases for like £70-90 and i just found a copy with a psp on buyee for like £22
lord help me, i'm back to the old me
spending all my money on eva merch
also gonna try looking for the psp port of eva 2 since it’s meant to add stuff compared with the ps2 original and also i cba digging out my ps2 but my psp is working fine
gonna get really into eva like i am 15 again
edit; ebay has the psp eva 2/another cases for like £70-90 and i just found a copy with a psp on buyee for like £22
lord help me, i'm back to the old me
spending all my money on eva merch
Last edited: