SPOILERS FFVII:R Chapter 11 Spoiler Discussion

[Rydeen]

The Promised Land has to be incredibly remote to not be discovered yet, though.

That's another thing - didn't he want to build Neo-Midgar on the Promised Land which was yet to be discovered? It would make even less sense to depopulate Midgar at this point, especially since many more would die than be displaced and have to move to the new city.

 

[Fangu]

@Ryvius lol it is!! I even found a video from 2009 that confirms it's the same voice:

Spoiler

 

[Theozilla]

I ended up going to far in this chapter before I realized I missed the Mythril Rod (I did remember to get the Eligor steal weapon for Aerith at least) in this chapter! And my last other save file was all the way back in Chapter 4 (I very nearly almost considered restarting from there). Is it possible to get the Mythril Rod later in the normal playthrough, or will I just have to wait until chapter select unlocks after I beat the game the first time?

 

[Smoothie King]

I absolutely loved how at a certain point in the train graveyard, before any scripted events, you can see the battle going on in the pillar way off in the distance. Little details like that really make this a living, breathing world. And yeah, "we found you" is probably the line of the entire game for me. Wow.

 

[lithiumkatana17]

Is it possible to get the Mythril Rod later in the normal playthrough, or will I just have to wait until chapter select unlocks after I beat the game the first time?

I did a bit of digging and it looks like the Mythril Rod is only available in that chapter.

 

[Theozilla]

I did a bit of digging and it looks like the Mythril Rod is only available in that chapter.

Luckily, I found out it was actually available to purchase in Chapter 13.

 

[Maidenofwar]

Observations-

*For before the fight with APs (Azbu?) the camera panned to a close up of first Aerith then Tifa before it let me control Cloud to choose which to talk to first

*In the train graveyard Aerith, Tifa and Cloud fall through a carriage, my Cloud asked "You okay", Aerith said said yes and Tifa was something like so yeah I am ok too slightly after

*In another part a carriage falls and my Cloud saved both girls … he grabbed and leapt with both to safety?

*I'm sure there was one more part where Cloud leaps with Tifa to safety, it was either as the ghosts were grabbing Aerith to take her or a stage during the Eligor fight but I decided I wanted to reload so I could backtrack to fight some mobs to work more on Tifa's abilities, so I did, but then I went for a nap, when I came back and played more and progressed again once I was ready that part didn't happen, Tifa just ran behind Cloud as the ghosts took Aerith, I what? Did I dream it? I did get an AerTi moment during the Eligor fight though

What shenanigans are these? Did I somehow upset a delicate affection balance by reloading to do a bit of extra grinding (I also tried mucking around with the restart from last Checkpoint feature which took me back the end of the maintenance building but I discovered that just let me keep exp/levels not ability proficiency bonuses, etc) Why would Tifa lose affection over me switching to her in battle to use her more to work on her abilities though? Help.

 

[Keveh Kins]

These cripshay things can eat a dick. That is all

 

[ForceStealer]

What a terrifying image

 

[Prism]

I never got around to typing my thoughts about the Train Graveyard and beyond, so here’s my take!

It’s interesting how they knew to expand on the train graveyard. I mean, in the original, theoretically it’s no different of a screen than any of the other ones, but it’s so memorable and sticks out - good sense on Square’s part. It’s also explicitly haunted now, instead of ghost enemies just kind of being there. Good expansion.

The setpiece was so controlled that none of it was quite...scary, you know? I feel like chaotic, unpredictable things are key scare factors. The way it went for scares felt kind of like a spook section of a theme park, but I should really emphasize: that doesn’t really take away from the mood overall. The mood is successfully isolating and otherworldly, which is what really matters - though the glitched intercom messages are legitimately creepy. I loved seeing the rustic designs of the trains, the setup had a lot of archaic technology. It really felt like you were exploring one of the earliest developed areas of Midgar.

As I mentioned in the Remake gameplay wish thread, they kept Phoenix Downs being able to defeat ghosts! How’s that for the little details? To me, that shows that Square considered even the obscure details when doing the Remake.

Such a big diversion when the pillar’s getting shot up is a little pace-breaking when players just wanna get to the action, I agree. I think that was all fixed when you’re leaving the train yard and you see the disaster unfolding on the horizon, however - it made the events feel tangible and real.

 

[Strangelove]

It didn't have me actively scared the way the first dungeon in FFXV did

now i want to finish up with this game and start ffxv so i can see what's spooky about that (also finally get around to beating the re:mind super boss in kh3 first)

anyways, stuff

- i liked seeing little flashes of things in the corner of your eye, also the neon graffiti had pretty colours
- how cute are the ghosts, tho. will they make plushes of the ghosts because i might buy one if they did
- the boss ghost was hard, for the first time so far i had to try three times and still struggled. also since i was having to replay it multiple times i forgot to scan the boss the time i actually won so now my enemy report is missing an entry but i did not want to go back a redo the boss at this point
- also i saw when i was having to revive party members that you could use a phoenix down on the boss, and for a moment i hoped it would instakill it like some bosses in past games. sadly you can't do that, nor did potions do damage. until they'd only work in a specific state and i just tried on the wrong one
- but do they damage regular ghosts? can you use raise with the all materia to hit all enemies and take out all at once?
- i stole aerith's weapon from eligor on the first try, which was lucky. i usually steal the first thing after scanning so i hadn't staggered him or anything (i did have the lv 2 lucky materia on though)
- but the battle was kinda annoying, ngl
- i was hoping aerith's judgment ray ability would let me get the battle report for putting the burst gauge up to 200% but i only seemed to manage about 180% so i guess i need another character with a similar ability before i can get that one
- i liked the added backstory bits for aerith

 

[Russell]

Just finished Chapter 11.
I've had a hard time getting into this game, there was a week where I just didn't bother playing it. The characters are great but it feels very padded so far.

I was not to fond of Aerith when it was just her & Cloud but I like her better now she's got someone else (Tifa) to talk to; I liked the Aerith/Tifa friendship. I don't know what it is about Aerith in the remake. I just think she was more adult in the original and is more 'Anime-girl' here.

Worried about going into chapter 12 with the plate about to fall, remembering the original and who dies there.

At this point I'd throw Aerith face first into a wood chipper to keep Jessie alive.

 

[Theozilla]

Really? For me, Aerith felt far more immature/juvenile and inconsistent in the OG in terms of character writing (plus suffered more from translation issues than other characters). The Remake editing out a lot of more juvenile lines really did wonders for he characterization in the Remake IMO.

 

[Russell]

Aerith seemed more street wise in the original:

Yes she's that in the remake to but, I dunno. It really didn't help that her intro to Cloud she had those shadow things after her. I felt she could hold her own in the OG but here in her introduction she is immediately a damsel-in-distress. She deserved better than that.

Might be just her gestures or how she moves?
The OG was really low polygon & text only, so you could imagine the characters how you want.
Like when you read a book an imagine the character one way, but in the film version that character is nothing like you imagined.

Maybe I just pictured her differently? *insert Cloud shrug here*

I've just completed chapter 12 and I loved:

Spoiler: Spoiler for Chapter 12

Taking control of Aerith to rescue Marlene & there interactions together. It's the first time Aerith didn't feel like dead weight.

 

[Makoeyes987]

She was a "damsel in distress" by that logic in the OG. You literally have to help her escape kidnapping from Shinra by pulling a Donkey Kong and rolling barrels at her would-be pursuers. With her yelling "Help me, Cloud! Eek!"

Nothing so damsel-y happens here. Her escape from Shinra is waaaaay more a team effort than the original.

I don't know how she's dead weight or giving a damsel-in-distress vibe, given her wise-ass responses at battle start and her complete lack of fear.

Cloud: Up ahead. The monsters here are dangerous, they instinctually go after the weaker prey.

Aerith: Oooooh.... You better be careful then, Cloud.

Later on.

Aerith: *after being ambushed by Hedgehog Pies* Hmmm... Must've been a new breed...

Cloud: How do you figure that?

Aerith: Because they went after the strongest prey.

Cloud: .......

 

[Theozilla]

Aerith seemed more street wise in the original:

Yes she's that in the remake to but, I dunno. It really didn't help that her intro to Cloud she had those shadow things after her. I felt she could hold her own in the OG but here in her introduction she is immediately a damsel-in-distress. She deserved better than that.

Might be just her gestures or how she moves?
The OG was really low polygon & text only, so you could imagine the characters how you want.
Like when you read a book an imagine the character one way, but in the film version that character is nothing like you imagined.

Maybe I just pictured her differently? *insert Cloud shrug here*

I've just completed chapter 12 and I loved:

Spoiler: Spoiler for Chapter 12

Taking control of Aerith to rescue Marlene & there interactions together. It's the first time Aerith didn't feel like dead weight.

I mean Aerith in the Remake literally says the same stuff you've screen-capped and even stresses the danger of Wall Market and Don Corneo even more than in the OG, so I can't understand the claim she is less street-wise.

And while I can't tell you how to feel about how she reacted to the Whisper's in Chapter 2, I personally don't feel like she was being "damseled", she felt more anxious and bewildered than the former IMO.

But anything that changes from more abstracted to less abstracted depiction in media will likely cause a degree of cognitive dissonance, the idea you once held has become far more specific and defined compared to what before you actively had to perceived on a subjective level.

 

[Russell]

I mean Aerith in the Remake literally says the same stuff you've screen-capped and even stresses the danger of Wall Market and Don Corneo even more than in the OG, so I can't understand the claim she is less street-wise.

My eyes were glazed over by the end of Wall Market, I don't know why I found it a slog, I probably missed alot so I'll take your word for it. (During the dance thing I put the controller on the ground and waited; I just wanted it to end.)
I felt the game slowed down after Cloud landed in the Church. Maybe I'm blaming Aerith for it?

I just liked OG Aeris better than Remake Aerith.

 

[Theozilla]

My eyes were glazed over by the end of Wall Market, I don't know why I found it a slog, I probably missed alot so I'll take your word for it. (During the dance thing I put the controller on the ground and waited; I just wanted it to end.)
I felt the game slowed down after Cloud landed in the Church. Maybe I'm blaming Aerith for it?

I just liked OG Aeris better than Remake Aerith.

That's a possibility, if you weren't enjoying chapter 9, it can be easy to miss out on information, there is much more dialogue in the Remake than the OG.

Ands that sentiment is perfectly valid, sometimes the same basic story told through a different medium can instill a very different reaction in people. Plenty of people who love the Les Miserable play hated the recent Hollywood movie adaptation of it, despite the stories being nearly identical.

 

[Maidenofwar]

Chapter 10 is so short ? I'm back here again.-

 

[jeronimus]

My eyes were glazed over by the end of Wall Market, I don't know why I found it a slog, I probably missed alot so I'll take your word for it. (During the dance thing I put the controller on the ground and waited; I just wanted it to end.)
I felt the game slowed down after Cloud landed in the Church. Maybe I'm blaming Aerith for it?

Although I really did like some sections of Chapter 9, that's where my patience really did start to wear thin. I didn't feel the urgency to keep playing, and I definitely didn't want to clear the chapter in tiny chunks because then it'd feel even longer.

The good news is I've gotten some longer sessions in again. I don't want to put the blame on Aerith, because she's so important to the plot, but I really wanted to get back to the proper plot - which felt like "the real plot" because the game had already been going for twice as long as the Midgar section in the original. It feels way more like being ripped away from what's actually going on than in the original where you're still settling into the pace.

I keep loathing these jukebox machines; not because the remixes are bad, but because they're noise played over the actual background music, making it so that I can't hear either. In general, the music is super hit-and-miss for me. Some old tracks sound incredible and some are remixed to be a noisy, annoying, clunky bother. I really feel like so many of the tracks that defined the sound of Midgar - Rotting Pizza, Oppressed - don't feature as heavily at all, turned into brief musical moments rather than an underscore.

On the plus side, I love Aerith and Tifa. Lesbians in my video games, we love to see it.

 

[Clement Rage]

Spoiler: ch 10

A fairly standard escape, I kept expecting the Aps to pop back up, but apparently he really was just making a break for freedom. Music not really tense enough, but it's a nice touch that instead of trailing you like usual Aeris and Tifa are running. Unfortunately I am an RPG protagonist and so go rummaging in all the corners. Not much happens except some AerTi bonding and Tifa's inexhaustible patience for her teammates being bad at operating machinery.

I die in the last Sahagin fight, mostly because I'm too cheap to use items, leaving my humiliating death count standing at 4. (Roche's bike sequence, Fat Chocobo, the bombs in Sam's Coliseum match, and now the Sahagin. A bit puzzled as to why they want to kill us so badly.

Spoiler: ch 11

So we get into the train graveyard, where we get a strange interlude with the ghosts of lost children, including an illusion of Marlene...and Aerith...huh? Any other time, this would be a good interlude, but we're under too much pressure right now to really spend time playing with ghosts. Their switching back and forth between between Magic and physical could've gotten very annoying, but I was able to use healing magic as a shortcut. Tifa discovers her inner anime schoolgirl in response to the presence of ghosts, while Aeris is fairly happy to play hide and seek with ghosts that immediately try to kill us when found. How many kids wandered in here, anyway?

Elgor catches me a bit off guard, as I'm not expecting a second bossfight, but we manage. We apparently released the ghosts of dead children, which was nice as this is probably their last chance to be freed.

The other friendly ghosts (not the lost children, the other ones) show up briefly to make sure the gang does the same train puzzle as in the OG, I think.

The tone is a bit too calm, although we get cutaways to the Turks at times... who are complaining about their orders.

...They're really going to do it, aren't they? They're going to try and make the Turks sympathetic about this. Given how the rest of Shinra has been portrayed so far, the fact that the Turks of all people are the ones getting played as 'good people with bad orders' is a remarkable choice. While the execs and infantry have had their multifacetedness toned down, the writing is starting to try to whitewash the Turks.

There's still time for me to be proven wrong, but if they're going to do what I think they're going to do...well... I don't know what to say. What a way to undermine every character. We'll see.

 

[Mayo Master]

Moving on to the train graveyard. Except for the boss fight, I couldn't get good combat pictures. I felt like the lighting wasn't helping that.

Spoiler: First part, reaching Ghoul

 

[Mayo Master]

Spoiler: Through the graveyard

 

[Mayo Master]

Spoiler: Eligor

 

[cold_spirit]

What do folks think of the new fog effects in this chapter? Visibility is reduced, which adds to the spookiness, but I kinda feel the level already had a good ambiance?

Haven't played it myself though.