Hopes for Remake & Rebirth (gameplay/combat)

[The Twilight Mexican]

I took them to mean more that it was half-hearted than flawed due to error.

 

[Kain424]

Honestly, it seems like most wait modes. It stops the game flow dead in its tracks. Up to the individual whether or not that kills the game far ya.

 

[Obsidian Fire]

the way it's implemented hasn't made any of the people who wanted it happy. @Obsidian Fire can probably explain their gripe with it -- I do not share the gripe, but my basic understanding is that Tactical Mode cuts up the illusion of battle flow

This is pretty much my issue with it, and worded far better then I was describing it.

It probably doesn't help that I have played ARPGs where the flow of battle doesn't stop (Neir: Automata at one end of the spectrum and Monster Hunter World at the other end) and it feels great. It's all happening in real-time and you can really get into a kind of rhythm with the game's AI. There's not a lot of "start-stop-start-stop" in combat momentum in either of those games.

Honestly, it seems like most wait modes. It stops the game flow dead in its tracks. Up to the individual whether or not that kills the game far ya.

Even in other Turn-Based games, the flow of battle doesn't just "freeze" though. Sure, the characters aren't attacking, but it's not like they stop moving completely, so the energy associated with that movement doesn't grind to a halt either. Turn-Based games usually have "filler movements" that at least keep some kind of sense of "something is going on right now". Like... battles in Opera Omnia feel better to me then what I've seen of the battles in FFVIIR. Mainly because no one in Opera Omnia "freezes" even though the game is turn-based.

The problem I have with the battle going into "bullet time" when using ATB skills is that all the momentum and energy feels lost. The "start-stop-start-stop" nature of the battles just feels jarring watching it and I'd rather they'd have just picked one type of battle system and stuck with it. Forcing the base game to have a "start-stop-start-stop" kind of battle mode feels... weird. The "bullet time" also feels... fake to me. Like how obviously CGI enhanced combat moves in movies feel fake. I guess I just associate slowed-down combat with CGI (thank you Matrix!) and that doesn't have much of an impact on me any more because I've seen slowed-down combat a million times. The loss of momentum plays into that a lot, because it kinda gives my brain space to point out that "this is fake", whereas fast combat is too distracting to do that.

TLDR: The idea of playing games isn't fun when your brain is pointing out "this looks/feels really bad" every time you see combat in a game. And when the majority of how you interact with a games systems is combat.

 

[ForceStealer]

I can only imagine how much you'd hate CRPGs like Baldur's Gate, Icewind Dale, or Dragon Age Origins

 

[Obsidian Fire]

I played Dragon Age Origins for all of... an hour or two and then quit and never went back to it because it was so frustrating. Although... I'd probably be better at it now that I've done some computer programing classes...

That said... I love FFXII:TZA which was what it was based on, because I can quite literally program all the characters with Gambits and then sit back and watch the whole thing unfold without having to do anything... It hits the sweet spot between having so many options its overwhelming and enough options that you feel like you have something to play with.

 

[Ite]

Ironically, in the first matrix all the bullet time features live actors

For me, I like the suspended tension, but I can completely see how it's not to your taste. In movies, I find "ramping" to be a little overdone at this point -- but it's become so commonplace that most twenty-somethings don't remember when it was weird. Lord of the Rings doesn't use slow-mo in its action sequences unless someone is dying. It's the last movie I can think of that does that -- including the Hobbit movies.

 

[ForceStealer]

I mention those games not for the gambit system of DA: O. But that your complaints for this sound like my complaints for CRPGs. They play in full real time, but if you want to actually control your whole 4-6 person party, you need to press space bar to pause constantly. I've found that annoying and wished that they would have just made it turn-based.

But this is not having that effect on me. Part of it might well be the fact that it's slow motion and not frozen, but I think more than that is that you have a more direct way to engage the combat and will spend most of your time doing so. The issue for me with the CRPGs is that the ONLY way for fighting to occur is to issue each member a command (ignoring DA: O's gambits for the moment). And then all the moves take a different amount of time to go off and so now the charcters aren't even synced up for when you should pause to issue new ones, etc. In this you will be fighting in real time while your other characters fight according to their base AI scripts, including with your short cuts, and then only when a bar fills and you need a heal or have an opening or a Limit or something, the action slows enough for you to engage that, and then continues on. And the shortcut settings decrease the frequency with which you'll need the tactical menu further.

Obviously having not played it myself I don't know for certain, but it doesn't give me the feeling that it would annoy me the way those games did.
Another example is FTL. To play best, you do have to pause a lot to issue detailed commands, but a lot of time you can just play on the fly if the battle isn't too intense. And so only pausing when necessary or to use a special missile or something never got on my nerves.

 

[Claymore]

Another example is FTL. To play best, you do have to pause a lot to issue detailed commands, but a lot of time you can just play on the fly if the battle isn't too intense. And so only pausing when necessary or to use a special missile or something never got on my nerves.

OMG you've played FTL. I love that game sooooo much.

 

[ForceStealer]

Materia menu

Summons are definitely still red, just in their own dedicated slot. Also nice little confirmation of Elemental, and it's own leveling progression.

 

[pxp]

Where'd you find these @ForceStealer ???

 

[ForceStealer]

The press site, @pxp

 

[pxp]

The press site, @pxp

Thanks dude!

Edit: do you think we'll get a little something for State of Play then?

 

[ForceStealer]

Still seems awfully close to TGS for anything new.

But

 

[Ite]

Look at that! All five colors of materia are now confirmed!

What do you suppose it means that the summon materia is separated from the others? It looks like to prevent the game from breaking, they are making summon materia differently equippable.

Edit: Looks like star ratings are confirmed for materia as well. Thank goodness. On the materia screen (why does everything have a thumbnail image? lol) it lists the upgrades for Elemental as she levels up. 2-5%? That's weaksauce lol. Perhaps the materia will get new stars in Part 2. I don't see a MASTER level - perhaps it's something they will implement in later games.

Edit2: From Neal's blog post:

Every hero can equip a Summon materia

So one each!

Spoiler: Two new summon screenshots

 

[Cannon_Fodder]

I'm pretty sure that second screenshot it Aerith using some kind of time magic on that dragon-thing from the Train Graveyard.

The scaling for Elemental attack seems weak, good catch. I'm guessing it will make sense in practice (hopefully), but I thought it'd peak way higher--even if it never got to double damage or something like that. I do appreciate having more detail on what exactly changes as materia levels up.

 

[FFShinra]

the armor usage is insane though, on the flipside.

 

[Ite]

You’re right! That’s a deenglow! Probably getting Slow cast on it. I thought it was Shiva getting summoned.

 

[ForceStealer]

The damage might not be all that high because you attack so much more often in this game. It might add up quite a bit, so a higher % could break it

 

[Ite]

Oh wait yeah that makes sense, since it affects basic bi-- attacks as well as ATB abilities.

 

[Jairus]

Do you think Biggs, Wedge, and Jessie will be semi-playable at times? I don't expect anything on the level of the main cast, of course, but maybe with limited abilities and such since we'll apparently be doing a lot of missions with them. It'd be more immersive than them just being tagalongs.

 

[FFShinra]

Maybe FF12 style guest characters who kinda do their own thing but help out? Seems possible.

At the very least it does seem like Biggs helps you out on motorcycle missions with his gun.

 

[mandelbrot86]

The translations of TGS suggested that each character could only equip one Summon. I was curious how they'd implement that. Having a dedicated slot just makes sense. That said, now I've been watching the APS (ABZU?) fight trying to spot if the red materia is visible in Cloud's sword.

 

[Ite]

Certainly the animation/particle effects makes it look like his purple materia is the one doing the summoning. It’s flaring brightly.

Spoiler: pics

Of course the purple glow might also be just part of the animation, and a coincidence? It doesn’t look like you visibly equip summon materia but just kind of have it?

 

[ForceStealer]

It doesn’t look like you visibly equip summon materia but just kind of have it?

"I didn't have it in my pocket."

 

[mandelbrot86]

Certainly the animation/particle effects makes it look like his purple materia is the one doing the summoning. It’s flaring brightly.

Spoiler: pics

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Of course the purple glow might also be just part of the animation, and a coincidence? It doesn’t look like you visibly equip summon materia but just kind of have it?

I dunno. Looking at that Menu it looks like they are implying the Summon Materia is somehow equipped to the weapon. Obviously set apart. I'm curious if they put it somewhere visible. It'll be a bit disappointing if you can't see red materia ever attached to your gear.