SPOILERS INTERmission Chapter 2 Spoiler Discussion

Makoeyes987

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
This is the spoiler thread, so I'm going to post unmarked.

I snuck a peek at the ending because I have poor impulse control and I wanted to know something . And holy shit....

We actually see Zack arriving into Midgar to see Aerith at her church. I stopped watching from there because it was too much of a fucking mind screw to see further. But.

I think this confirms what some of us already sorta figured. Zack's existing in some sort of parallel iteration of FFVII. He's got his own Buster Sword and baby Cloud, and he's searching for Aerith.

I'm not sure how this works but it's happening.
 
Eerie

Eerie

Fire and Blood
Makoeyes987 said:
This is the spoiler thread, so I'm going to post unmarked.

I snuck a peek at the ending because I have poor impulse control and I wanted to know something . And holy shit....

We actually see Zack arriving into Midgar to see Aerith at her church. I stopped watching from there because it was too much of a fucking mind screw to see further. But.

I think this confirms what some of us already sorta figured. Zack's existing in some sort of parallel iteration of FFVII. He's got his own Buster Sword and baby Cloud, and he's searching for Aerith.

I'm not sure how this works but it's happening.
Click to expand...

I saw a screenshot of this and almost yelled at my screen lol. I need to watch the full Intergrade Let's play now. And of course I won't be able to, tomorrow lol.
 
Misterbadguy

Misterbadguy

Phantom Lord
AKA
METEODRIVE
I think it'd be interesting if they did something similar to The Medium, like whilst playing as Cloud you see Zack doing something simultaneously in his reality. Don't know if they'll do that but everything is on the table now.

Seeing the Midgar crew trying to hitch a ride is awesome, man I absolutely love what they did with the characters in this game.
 
Misterbadguy

Misterbadguy

Phantom Lord
AKA
METEODRIVE
I think the way the base game ends disproves that, Zack and Cloud walk right past each other and don't acknowledge each other (plus there's the Stamp packaging thing). Unless that's purely symbolic of the timeline having changed and those two events don't actually happen at the same time, to me that says there's been a timeline split with two alternate realities.
 
Makoeyes987

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
It's not hard to understand at all.

Zack's world/universe exists with Stamp as a terrier dog. This is a significant detail that the narrative set up to differentiate the two settings. Because it's entirely different from the Stamp mascot we've seen in the world Cloud and the others exist in.

Zack is shown carrying mako poisoned Cloud and his own Buster Sword to Midgar.

Cloud is carrying his own Buster Sword with his group and isn't Mako Poisoned.

Cloud and the others are hitching their way to Kalm.

Zack is about to visit Aerith.

It's literally what the Ultimania of FFVII-R stated. Cloud and Zack are simultaneously existing but separately.
 
Makoeyes987

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
To be perfectly frank, that's on you to resolve with your own interaction with the narrative. :monster:

Obviously they're intending to do something, and it's a set up for later on in the story. It's clear that the Remake is doing what it's hinted at and alluded to with the ending and Ultimania commentary. There's a parallel flow of the narrative going on between these two iterations of FFVII. They're gonna ultimately intersect at some point given that they exist and are shown to be important.
 
Roundhouse

Roundhouse

Pro Adventurer
I agree in part, but if we are theorising here (and it's a theory until actually confirmed) we should also be able to support our reasoning with some sort of dramatic justification for that narrative element, otherwise it just feels unconvincing. I think you might well be correct about the alt timeline thing (it's less muddy and confusing than trying to do the same timeline) but if that is true, I definitely expect the two lines to merge at some point, or for something to occur that allows Zack to interact with and influence the normal line.
 
Makoeyes987

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
Zack existing in and of itself is dramatic.

The fact we're seeing someone who should be dead living past his fated conclusion is more than enough dramatic justification.

The fact his existence hangs above the narrative as a sort of Sword of Damocles is more than likely 2/3rds of the intent, right there. This can't be normal or without some sort of consequences. I'm extremely skeptical that Zack living and going along his own adventure will be without consequences for himself or others. It's narrative calm before a hurricane; we're just seeing the build up.
 
Torrie

Torrie

astray ay-ay-ay
Makoeyes987 said:
This is the spoiler thread, so I'm going to post unmarked.

I snuck a peek at the ending because I have poor impulse control and I wanted to know something . And holy shit....

We actually see Zack arriving into Midgar to see Aerith at her church. I stopped watching from there because it was too much of a fucking mind screw to see further. But.

I think this confirms what some of us already sorta figured. Zack's existing in some sort of parallel iteration of FFVII. He's got his own Buster Sword and baby Cloud, and he's searching for Aerith.

I'm not sure how this works but it's happening.
Click to expand...
I've just read that and now I'm screaming internally :aah:

Roundhouse said:
The problem that keeps popping up with the separate timeline idea is.....what's the point if it doesn't impact the main timeline/story?
Click to expand...
Square Enix just want to create a better fanfiction of their own story than the countless works on AO3 tagged as Zack lives.
 
Makoeyes987

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
I think it's more a reference that whatever is going on in the current iteration of FFVII, the timeline Cloud and the others inhabit, is also happening in Zack's. Hence why he's going on his own unique adventure. There's also significance in the state the flowers are in. That's probably visual storytelling, alluding to something significantly wrong.

Given everything that we know and have seen in the Remake thus far, it's clear that they're having these two go on parallel adventures within their own versions of FFVII. It's not really ambiguous unless the ending of FFVII-R is not to be believed for some reason.
 
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Theozilla

Theozilla

Kaiju Member
Regardless of whether alive!Zack and comatose!Cloud are existing in a parallel timeline or are in the main timeline, I won't be surprised if Zack's side story "affects" the main the narrative but without the main characters ever becoming aware of it (though maybe Aerith and Sephiroth might get some degree of awareness). Won't be surprised if it ends with some Doctor Who or Ted Kord Blue Beetle schtick where Zack has to return to his original fate in time in order for the main characters to succeed or something.
 
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Makoeyes987

Makoeyes987

Listen closely, there is meaning in my words.
AKA
Smooth Criminal
Roundhouse said:
I love how this has cleared nothing up. Mako is still confident it's an alt timeline, while the same timeline theorists are still confident it's the same timeline. I really wish we could just get a confirmation one way or another, haha.
Click to expand...

So at what point does it become crystalized these characters are inhabiting two different locations separated by time and space? What more clarification is necessary?

Nevermind the ending that depicts Zack's world carrying a Stamp logo significantly different than the one we see in FFVII-R, or the FFVII-R Ultimania all but saying outright these two cannot inhabit the same time-space due to being a paradox.

Just think about another important detail we see just now.

Aerith's flowers in the church don't wither. Especially not before or during FFVII. Zack's return to Midgar happens in September Eya 007.

Cloud and the others leave Midgar in December of Eya 007. During FFVII, which we have just seen.

Their events are separated by at least 3 months, and we see quite clearly throughout the entire Remake, Aerith's flowers are intact. They've never been shown to wilt and die. Yet, they're shown dying 3 months earlier when Zack supposedly visits the Church.

We only see this in Zack's world. Now why do you think that is?

a_apple 2.0 said:
I think Zack is in the teams timeline. All the people in the church are hinting at the plate collapse so they take refuge there even Aerith being gone hints at this. Also we aren't shown Cloud which is also strange. Maybe there really is a timeline merge?
Click to expand...

Why would the plate collapse happen 3 months earlier during Crisis Core? What?

Zack just survived his last stand in the wastelands of Midgar, escaped with Cloud and is now trying to visit Aerith. Where did the quarter of a year just go? How are they refugees? They're people in a church mourning and the flowers are dying. They certainly weren't dead or dying during the plate fall during the Remake so how are they wilting when Zack gets there?
 
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A

a_apple 2.0

Pro Adventurer
AKA
a_apple
Makoeyes987 said:
So at what point does it become crystalized these characters are inhabiting two different locations separated by time and space? What more clarification is necessary?

Nevermind the ending that depicts Zack's world carrying a Stamp logo significantly different than the one we see in FFVII-R, or the FFVII-R Ultimania all but saying outright these two cannot inhabit the same time-space due to being a paradox
Just think about another important detail we see just now.

Aerith's flowers in the church don't wither. Especially not before or during FFVII. Zack's return to Midgar happens in September Eya 007.

Cloud and the others leave Midgar in December of Eya 007. During FFVII, which have just seen.

Their events are separated by at least 3 months, and we see quite clearly throughout the entire Remake, Aerith's flowers are intact. They've never been shown to wilt and die. Yet, they're shown dying 3 months earlier when Zack supposedly visits the Church.

We only see this in Zack's world. Now why do you think that is?



Why would the plate collapse happen 3 months earlier during Crisis Core? What?
Click to expand...
Dunno, the way how the ending is cut makes it look like Zack arrives at Aerith's church during the time when the team is on their way. I mean look at Zack before he was majorly fucked up after his fight now there is literally no scratch on him anymore
 
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