...i am gonna be real with you, i am not gonna read or respond to all that™ because i am currently on my way to tikhfist whilst typing with my thumbs and crouching in the only corner of this kasuwan magani outhouse where i can catch the wee-fee, but
That's fair, I'll just address your main points then. I get what you meant by "post-fantasy" now, anyways.
i also contest the idea that sentient = sapient. i will agree that the og isn't explicit either way, but whereas we know the planet is alive, the nature of that life is quite ambiguous. whether it's in the sense that it's a macro biosystem, a holobiont, or some kind of weird collective swarm organism like a slime mould that is both the sum of its parts and inclusive of everything on it (or a combination of these things). or something else. you could technically fit all those ideas under a strictly animist cosmology.
i'm like 60% teasing, but the point is that you can just as easily attribute the events of the story (including the existence of weapons) to the equivalent of induced hpr or allomones or something. the last question the og left was whether or not human civilisation was too estranged from the natural world to be reconciled as a rightful part of it, but a stringent, literal reading isn't necessary either. i'm not gonna call a cell network sapient because it sent some cytotoxics after a virus.
That ambiguity towards planet sapience exists up until maybe disc 2 when Ifalna dictates how the Planet espoused on its history and conflict with Jenova.
Gast
Ifalna, what exactly does Planet-reading entail?
Ifalna
...I can't explain it very well, but it's like having a conversation with the Planet...It said something fell from the sky making a large wound. Thousands of Cetra pulled together, trying to heal the Planet... But, due to the severity of the wound, it was only able to heal itself, over many years.
Clearly it has to have some means of communicative skill and recollection to be able to recall events that happened thousands of years ago. Which makes sense, given the fact, the entire Lifestream is it's literal soul.
And then as I said earlier, there's the entire premise of Holy itself.
Cloud
Holy?
Bugenhagen
Holy... the ultimate White Magic. Magic that might stand against Meteor. Perhaps our last hope to save the planet from Meteor.
If a soul seeking Holy reaches the planet, it will appear. Ho Ho Hooo. Meteor, Weapon, everything will disappear. Perhaps, even ourselves.
Cloud
Even us!?
Bugenhagen
It is up to the planet to decide. What is best for the planet. What is bad for the planet. All that is bad will disappear. That is all. Ho Ho Hooo. I wonder which we humans are?
The clear implication of
judgment by the planet via the ultimate White Magic spell, Holy. Humanity was placed before the planet's judgment and deemed worthy of a second chance. In part thanks to Cloud and the others fighting to the bitter end to save it from Sephiroth. Something was communicated to the planet that made it decide humanity was worth saving. Because before, the Planet was on its last legs, thanks in large part to humanity.
If there was no sentience to the Planet, why would spirit energy even exist and serve as means of other micro-spirits to be able to communicate? Why would materia and summons exist? Why would there be clear communication to the planet? And why would Sephiroth be able to maintain his ego amongst the flow? If spirit energy is composed of memories, the mind, and experience, why would the largest composite of spirit energy we see thus far, be somehow immune to that logic?
Hell, I even forgot this line from Aerith herself in the Temple of the Ancients.
Aerith
It's full of the knowledge of the Ancients. No... not knowledge... consciousness... a living soul... It's trying to say something. I'm sorry, I don't understand.
No sentience? No sapience?
and yes, i would argue that making the cetra so removed from humanity that their extinction permanently severs the path back towards ecological reconciliation, undercuts the plot. much the same way that i think that failing to emphasise how eldritch JENOVA is and how unnatural sephiroth's abilities are is a disservice to the story. having the two be as incomprehensible and unbelievable to the characters in the story is effective in a way (escalation and) every other blue eyed devil and his mother back flipping over buildings is not.
Not necessarily, because even with the far flung removal of the Cetra, we clearly see Bugenhagen, Cloud, Barret, Tifa, and all the others able to distinctly hear the cries of the planet and understand on a basic level what it says. Even with the lack of clear communication the Cetra are capable of exhibiting, even a lay person who opens their heart are able to hear some of the sounds and feel what the planet communicates. It's capable within everyone, but the Cetra were clearly the masters of it.
And given how Sephiroth's abilities and powers are far beyond every person seen thus far, I don't see how there's a difference. And you say that back flipping over buildings isn't effect, but that's somehow implying or ignoring that those type of extradordinary abilities and powers never existed in the OG in the first place. They exist but much like any "power" there are levels of it, and parameters that exist within said fictional world. Impaling a giant snake on a tree for free, warping reality, and mastery of an alien organism isn't the same level as exhibiting superhuman swordsmanship in a pinch or martial arts capable of suplexing a giant mecha with enough training.
The other concern that I and others keep coming back to is the choice of these words by the real-life people developing the game. It calls to mind too much of the cheesiest, weakest forms of writing.
Again, the concern is not because of an expectation of fate/destiny being used as a plot device, but because so much media that uses these words extensively is the shallowest of shounen or the most juvenile in its narrative aims. The concern here is about the thought processes going into the development of the revised narrative, not so much the plot mechanics occupying the narrative.
Naw, that's an
incredible double-standard then, because
no one would be batting an eye if these ghosts existed in the original game with the
exact same name, look, and function that they have now. It's only because
they're new we're even having this discussion on if they're at odds with the original. And this is FF where these creatures' names are 100% in line with everything shown thus far.
Heck, what of the bearded black mage spirits in the Temple of the Ancients who are trapped there thanks to the Planet? We even had a Guardian of Time spirit there too.
Kaiju monsters at the behest of the planet, erupting from the earth and running amok like something out of Godzilla or Power Rangers? They get a pass.
And where was the concern on how cliche destiny or fate sounded when the word was used over a dozen times in FFXII, or FFX?
What about the Liberali Fatali (fated children) of Garden that had to fulfill "their destiny" and confront the Sorceress from the future?
Or when the literal, rote concept of destiny was used to its fullest effect in XV?
Etc, etc.
The fact is every FF has grappled with implied or some dubiously named element called "destiny." It's part and parcel with an RPG saving the world and fighting evil. And no one bats an eye at it, just like the implied divinity of final bosses and the bond of relationships/friendship offering the hope of triumphing over conflict. If the very name of a plot device is somehow the bridge too far for VII, how or why in the world would any FF fan be still a fan to this day? It's there all the time. I guess FF is cheesy by design then, to which I say, okay. Sure. But
cheese by itself can be a rich and gourmet food when aged and served correctly.
Well, that's our Mako.
He makes damn sure to honor the Bothans who died for us by getting the most out of the page space allotted by the Internet -- never say with 100 words what could be said with a thousand.
Hey, I don't use twitter
for a reason.