SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[odekopeko]

No worries, and some of it sounds downright savage, but that's what I love about it. I don't see all CxA shippers this way, and I've seen my fair share of toxic CxT shippers as well. I'm not taking this stuff too seriously anymore. It took me a month to realize it, but I just wanna discuss the LTD for fun. I'm not losing any sleep over it.

 

[Eerie]

Wait, you mean there are people who lose sleep over the LTD? My goodness, people need to chill if that's the case lol.

 

[Yumelinh]

I didn’t know the “Good night, Tifa” line was a big deal too to be honest. I think the EN version is fine. Let me try to understand though. I wonder if it has to do with the quality of the VAs voices? Maybe FR and JP Cloud have that natural soft register to their voices that Cody doesn’t naturally have? Sort of like if Jeremy Irons voiced Cloud, there’s no way he can replicate JP Cloud’s “Good night, Tifa” as softly. Poor analogy but you get my drift

It's not that it is a big deal or something, but it's probably where I think the lack of nuance showed up more apparently hehe.

I don't think it has anything to do with the quality of their voices, but how they deliver their lines (I think it goes in hand with how much control you have of your own voice that you can make it sounds the way you want/need in a certain scene).

But then again, this isn't something that happens with FVIIR only. If you used to watch shows/games in Japanese or simply used to their original voices, you'll notice a certain lack of nuance/feeling right away, but this doesn't mean that the EN VAs are bad...it's just a different approach.

Japanese VAs have a lot of control of their voices because these "nuances" are important there ( the devs even spoke about how carefully they were in having Cloud speaking in a different tone with each girl), but in the end, there are things you can't just convey in the same way in other languages and that's fine.

That said, I do get your point that, in the end, the message was still conveyed well and the localizations/VAs works were incredibly good. I wholeheartedly agree ( I'm playing hard mode in English rn and I'm loving it!)

 

[Cat on Mars]

I leave the thread to work and have a life and this thing reaches 100 pages without me! How you dare?!

Well yeah. That just means Cloud officially made Tifa his adopted sister.
*cue I love my imouto tropes*

Argh, I hate that shit, it's the most boring fetish. Don't make me go and find my riding crop, M. Yes I have one.

I take my eyes off my phone screen to go get myself lunch for just one minute and my pure, sappy post about love and confused identity gets buried under incest.

Tell me about it peko. I leave and this becomes Westeros, what is your problem guys. You'all need to accept Sephinova as the superior canon pairing, as Satan himself I intended.

For me, clerith is just that, Disney, and I'm not really into Disney (the only pair I really liked was in Mulan, and uh that was not a classic Disney pair lol). I hate Romeo & Juliet with every fiber of my body, I always have, and I read it as a teen, so when it was supposed to be very romantic in my eyes. Clerith doesn't "talk" to me, I'm not interested in them and I miss a lot of cues. And that's ok. It's not my thing but it's there for others who adore them.

I've been saying this for years, good to see more people telling it as it is.

I really don't think her insecurities have anything to do with Cloud's feelings or pushes Clerith. Or that it wasn't as strongly presented. I never understood that line of reasoning. He obviously cares for both girls and displays that over and over again.

I do think there was less romance/date stuff after Aerith and Tifa meet up in general. We got way more AerTi than we did Clerith or Cloti. I'd say +1 for AerTi, and equally balanced for the other pairings.

'm not sure I agree on Tifa's resolution pushing C/A. It's dismissive of Tifa's pain. The plate just dropped, thousands were killed, her home is gone. Don't make it about romance, the story is more than nitpicking at scenes to allot more points in the direction of another pairing. Cloud and Aerith have a pretty romantic resolution to themselves and it is getting a bit grating to see people use Tifa's trait of being insecure to further a narrative in the other direction. Especially using a scene where she is distraught.

Yes, the devs could have avoided it altogether if they wanted, but it just seems right that Tifa was able to make the obvious connection since the flower was something special to her. And yes, she was disappointed that it wasn't something Cloud intentionally bought with her in mind, especially because of the meaning behind it, hence her sad expression afterward.

I still think it was an odd choice narratively to have Tifa bring up Aerith being the source of the flowers in her resolution scene and when she definitely has bigger losses and worries after the destruction of Sector 7 and the loss of Biggs and Jessie.

Re: the flower
I might be the odd one here, but when I saw the scene I didn't see jealousy, I saw remorse. Tifa looked remorseful, she didn't want to drag Aerith to their fight and now Aerith's fate doesn't look that good. Aerith helps them, rescues Marlene, gives Cloud a flower that became a tresured memento for Tifa... and for all her troubles, Aerith gets imprisoned by Shinra. I see this as something that hurts Tifa, it's another loss for her, and this makes her resolve to rescue her friend final.
People seem to overlook the fact that the characters resolve to go and rescue Aerith after that night. The scenes aren't just about Cloud and maybe his feelings towards Aerith, it's about how Aerith has become a part of their circle of friends too!

I don’t place as much narrative importance on Aerith’s love for Zack in terms of arguing the LTD

Oh, a Clerith shipper ignoring Zack altogether. How novel, I haven't ever seen it before. Welcome to TLSF n' shit, just try to be a bit more original next time.
@Elyssis
Okay, but Zerith already happened. Aerith is trying to move on, it doesn't mean she's succeeded at the task. Also, don't bring supplementary materials to the debate because this one is about the Remake.

 

[odekopeko]

Yes, @Eerie people lose sleep over it. I had a conversation on twitter with some guy who spent nights writing an essay on how Tifa's actions show that she's given up because she knows Cloud loves Aerith. He was really respectful responding to me though, so I actually find him endearing.

About the "Good night, Tifa" thing. I think the fact that Cloud says it after Tifa's already gone, his expression, and that he doesn't take his eyes off the door more than makes up for it. I don't have any issues with that scene in particular.

 

[Master Bates]

I leave the thread to work and have a life and this thing reaches 100 pages without me! How you dare?!

Argh, I hate that shit, it's the most boring fetish. Don't make me go and find my riding crop, M. Yes I have one.

I'm an M. Do you really think I'd be against it?

I kid, mommy! Please don't spank

Yes, @Eerie people lose sleep over it. I had a conversation on twitter with some guy who spent nights writing an essay on how Tifa's actions show that she's given up because she knows Cloud loves Aerith. He was really respectful responding to me though, so I actually find him endearing.

I thought you were exaggerating about losing sleep for the sake of the LTD. I'm done with this shit.

 

[Cat on Mars]

Yes, @Eerie people lose sleep over it. I had a conversation on twitter with some guy who spent nights writing an essay on how Tifa's actions show that she's given up because she knows Cloud loves Aerith. He was really respectful responding to me though, so I actually find him endearing.

Now that's a sad life if I've seen one.

ETA:

I thought you were exaggerating about losing sleep for the sake of the LTD. I'm done with this shit.

So am I.
Now, back to your spanking... riding crop or leather whip? Also, I have an unused dog collar that might look good on you.

 

[Elyssis]

Oh, a Clerith shipper ignoring Zack altogether. How novel, I haven't ever seen it before. Welcome to TLSF n' shit, just try to be a bit more original next time.

This is rude and uncalled for when I have done my best to be respectful and open-minded to everyone else’s points. I very specifically said that Zack will always be important to Aerith and conceded that Zerith may happen in the future of the remake even if SE has already stated before that Aerith loves Cloud more than Zack (in Dismantled even if we throw out Maiden as non-canon).

I won’t bother posting here anymore.

Thank you to everyone else who was incredibly nice and legitimately welcoming. You all made excellent points and have given me a better understanding of Cloti and the LTD in general.

 

[Final_Heaven]

In isolation, I find Cody's delivery fine in that scene.

It's just that Sakurai's delivery is far superior.

I actually prefer Cody's delivery when he's trying to spit out one liners and trying to be cool. I like his default talking voice too.

I prefer Sakurai's delivery when he's interacting with Tifa though and he's being emotional.

It's the same with Britt and Ayumi for Tifa.

I prefer Britt's default voice except when she has to cry and be emotional and that's when I prefer Ayumi's Tifa more.

I leave the thread to work and have a life and this thing reaches 100 pages without me! How you dare?!


Argh, I hate that shit, it's the most boring fetish. Don't make me go and find my riding crop, M. Yes I have one.



Tell me about it peko. I leave and this becomes Westeros, what is your problem guys. You'all need to accept Sephinova as the superior canon pairing, as Satan himself I intended.



I've been saying this for years, good to see more people telling it as it is.






Re: the flower
I might be the odd one here, but when I saw the scene I didn't see jealousy, I saw remorse. Tifa looked remorseful, she didn't want to drag Aerith to their fight and now Aerith's fate doesn't look that good. Aerith helps them, rescues Marlene, gives Cloud a flower that became a tresured memento for Tifa... and for all her troubles, Aerith gets imprisoned by Shinra. I see this as something that hurts Tifa, it's another loss for her, and this makes her resolve to rescue her friend final.
People seem to overlook the fact that the characters resolve to go and rescue Aerith after that night. The scenes aren't just about Cloud and maybe his feelings towards Aerith, it's about how Aerith has become a part of their circle of friends too!


Oh, a Clerith shipper ignoring Zack altogether. How novel, I haven't ever seen it before. Welcome to TLSF n' shit, just try to be a bit more original next time.

This is rude and uncalled for when I have done my best to be respectful and open-minded to everyone else’s points. I very specifically said that Zack will always be important to Aerith and conceded that Zerith may happen in the future of the remake even if SE has already stated before that Aerith loves Cloud more than Zack (in Dismantled even if we throw out Maiden as non-canon).

I won’t bother posting here anymore.

Thank you to everyone else who was incredibly nice and legitimately welcoming. You all made excellent points and have given me a better understanding of Cloti and the LTD in general.

Elyssis has a point, Cat.

He's been very open-minded and respectful. We get our share of trolls and very fanatical people but Elyssis is not one of them.

 

[looneymoon]

Sakurai has been with the character for an incredibly long time. I believe this is Cody's first voice acting job. Also, from what I've gathered of the the main cast, John Eric Bentley (Barret) is the only one to have played the original game.

Off topic: Youtube also recommended me a video of Cody rapping. I watched it and it was really weird.

 

[Cat on Mars]

Elyssis has a point, Cat.
He's been very open-minded and respectful. We get our share of trolls and very fanatical people but Elyssis is not one of them.

Well, it was more a tongue-in-cheek comment about the same arguments being used over and over again no matter the year it is, but this thread has sure showed me that people takes their shipping and themselves way too seriously.

And if something so minor makes him to not post here anymore, I don't see the need to apologize since I wasn't even being mean.

 

[Master Bates]

Sakurai has been with the character for an incredibly long time. I believe this is Cody's first voice acting job. Also, from what I've gathered of the the main cast, John Eric Bentley (Barret) is the only one to have played the original game.

That, and Sakurai's always been a voice actor his entire career. The guy has a lot of experience with voice acting jobs; nuanced delivery should be almost like a walk in the park to him. On the other hand, Cody's a live action actor and an amateur voice actor voicing a popular video game character. I can imagine the pressure.

Add to the fact that Sakurai's also a long time Tifa fanboy it's no wonder we get to hear some of the softest Tifas to come out of Cloud's mouth.

 

[odekopeko]

This is rude and uncalled for when I have done my best to be respectful and open-minded to everyone else’s points. I very specifically said that Zack will always be important to Aerith and conceded that Zerith may happen in the future of the remake even if SE has already stated before that Aerith loves Cloud more than Zack (in Dismantled even if we throw out Maiden as non-canon).

I won’t bother posting here anymore.

Thank you to everyone else who was incredibly nice and legitimately welcoming. You all made excellent points and have given me a better understanding of Cloti and the LTD in general.

Oh wow, I did not read that last part which was directed at you. I hope you do decide to come back.

@Cat on Mars I think it's not as funny to the person we're taking a jab at. I can understand why'd they feel bad. Just my two cents.

 

[Cat on Mars]

I commented on the flower motif and scene, I just happen to have low tolerance for posters that have been already been caught dismissing everything they can't use to build their ship. That, and the fact that I'm out of fucks to give today after reading the last five pages of this thread.
Why do I have to show good faith and intellectual honesty when some shippers don't and won't?


Okay, I'll be nicer. *grumbles*

 

[Master Bates]

Calm down. Don't waste the effects of your great morning sex. Which, congrats by the way.

 

[Odysseus]

L et's
T ry
D ecency?

 

[minami758]

Aw, @Elyssis I second @odekopeko's thoughts, it was really nice discussing with you! Hope you do decide to stick around, it's always good to have a variety of views here.

 

[Eerie]

Oh, I went to look at who was Cloud's VA in French, his name is Tanguy Goasdoué and holy shit, in fact he is Cloud's official VA since Cloud has a French voice, and as you can see on his wikipedia page, he's quite well known. He's both an actor (dunno him) and a VA.

As I can see, Jessica Barrier who is the French VA for Tifa is also a professional. I think everyone is, here. Also I think the one dubbing Barret did an awesome job too.

 

[Cat on Mars]

I edited my post and everything, you guys can stop nagging me now.

Oh, I went to look at who was Cloud's VA in French, his name is Tanguy Goasdoué and holy shit, in fact he is Cloud's official VA since Cloud has a French voice, and as you can see on his wikipedia page, he's quite well known. He's both an actor (dunno him) and a VA.

I thought SE wanted only new voices for the characters. Do you know why they decided aganist it in the French version?

 

[Eerie]

I don't know, it's not like they changed the JP VA either. Maybe they didn't care enough, or maybe they felt he was good enough. Or maybe his contract for Cloud was impossible to break just for the game, IDK. French law DOES protect workers better, so it might be that, or it might be that he was just good. I mean, he's very experienced and has already 20+ years of dubbing. And I thought he would be younger, given Cloud's voice in French.

 

[Cat on Mars]

I really don't know what to think about it, we didn't even get a Spanish dub. Which is a shame because our VAs are fantastic most of the time but also I don't have to worry about Cloud sounding like a Cartoon Network character or some shit so...

 

[Final_Heaven]

I edited my post and everything, you guys can stop nagging me now.




I thought SE wanted only new voices for the characters. Do you know why they decided aganist it in the French version?

I don't know, it's not like they changed the JP VA either. Maybe they didn't care enough, or maybe they felt he was good enough. Or maybe his contract for Cloud was impossible to break just for the game, IDK. French law DOES protect workers better, so it might be that, or it might be that he was just good. I mean, he's very experienced and has already 20+ years of dubbing. And I thought he would be younger, given Cloud's voice in French.

From what I've seen, they only changed out all the English Dub VAs.

 

[RhinoKart]

What I found interesting about Cody's voicing towards Tifa and Aerith is it came across to me as the opposite of what was done in with the Japanese VA's.

Cody comes across as trying to act cool towards Tifa, and acting soft towards Aerith. The "goodnight Tifa" scene came across to me as Cloud longing for Tifa, but not really being soft, it was more sexual tension vibes I got from it, and his delivery of the "beautiful" line with the drink came across as very smooth and confident, but in the Japanese it comes across as trying to be cool but feeling a bit hesitant.

When it came to the resolution scenes, Tifa's really felt like Cloud was trying to impress her, and keep up the "I'm cool and strong" persona, and the Aerith scene his voice was very open and vulnerable. Which would be the exact opposite of what the ultimania said.

I don't mind the voice acting, I enjoyed all of those scenes, but it does give a different impression than watching in other languages does. I still came away from the game with the impression that Cloud had deep feelings for Tifa though, so in general the point still got across.

 

[Eerie]

It's like... completely butchering author's intent and what players can draw from the way Cloud talks... I mean, we're going to have years of fights simply because of that inversion.

 

[Cat on Mars]

Lol you bet. And this was only the first chapter! I can't wait for more debate regarding a VA's delivery of a single line.

This thread is at "how many one-winged angels can dance on the head of a pin?" level of discussion.