SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[Stiggie]

Nah it's terrible, especially if the she goes for over ten dates with Cloud in this one is true too. OG Aerith would never wear ribbon for a man, make over 23 wishes, write over 80 letters, etc. It's excessive. OG Aerith wanted to fly in the Highwind, not always cry over the sky,

OG Aerith and Remake 1 Aerith's are best Aeriths imo while Advent Children and CC were on the other end, without context though Rebirth might be the worst.

Bear in mind players have to work hard 75%~ to get the "Intimate" versions of the dates.

Imo, CC Aerith is the best Aerith, because it's the most human and actually makes me understand where the OG Aerith is coming from. It gave layers to what I first saw as a very shallow an poorly written character.

I see a problem with peoples complaints about CC Aerith. "She's not the same fun confident woman she was in the OG!!!!!".......yeah no shit, she's 16.

Like, what are these people asking for? For Aerith to be a fully realized adult at 16 rather than an insecure teenager? These people are literally angry that characters have character arc, that they grow. They're mad that Zack and the things that happened to Aerith affected her. That who she is as an adult is the result of her life rather than just being some static meaningless thing. They're mad that Aerith is realistic.

I really cannot get over how bad I find this criticism.

 

[Maidenofwar]

In OG Aerith goes for one, maybe two dates, then selflessly goes off to pray for Holy.

 

[Stiggie]

In OG Aerith goes for one, maybe two dates, then selflessly goes off to pray for Holy.

This I agree with, throwing in romance bs every two seconds rather than having it be an undercurrent explaining Clouds strange behavior is such a poor choice.

 

[eleamaya]

I see a problem with peoples complaints about CC Aerith. "She's not the same fun confident woman she was in the OG!!!!!".......yeah no shit, she's 16.

Like, what are these people asking for? For Aerith to be a fully realized adult at 16 rather than an insecure teenager? These people are literally angry that characters have character arc, that they grow. They're mad that Zack and the things that happened to Aerith affected her. That who she is as an adult is the result of her life rather than just being some static meaningless thing. They're mad that Aerith is realistic.

This is funny because after I see Rebirth Demo and meet teen Tifa, I love her! Maybe it's just preference, but I really like a girl like that. This Tifa is very different from adult!Tifa and even without reading TOTP of her struggle living in Midgar alone, we still can judge how the tragedy has shaped her to become what she is today.

Sadly, some people (which I mean Clerith shippers), don't apply that to Aerith. They dont see how Aerith losing Zack is tragedy in her life and has shaped her in the present day, too. And her way to cope with Cloud is telling.

she just takes her small and final chance to see he feels the same way, and, well, die knowing, so she tries.

I'm not happy at all that in Rebirth, in the crucial moment she's praying Holy, she looks desperate to confess her feelings for Cloud to the point of recreating a dream-sphere date for her moment with Zack. I can still view it how human she is. Confessing It when dying remind me of Éponine in Les Miserables. But if any Clerith aren't bothered by this, then they are double standard when saying Aerith's character in CC is attributed to a man, because if it's for Cloud, they'll go with that. I personally prefer her love for Cloud is unconditional after death that she doesnt even think nor wonder if he requites her because she's focus on Holy, for saving the world.

.... or maybe it's true that her love isn't unconditional as Tifa's, it's probably not love afterall, since she also question if this liking is the same as "liking"

 

[Maidenofwar]

Also these days I enjoy watching streamers play CC and fall in love with Aerith for the first time, I just prefer OG Aerith, and that's ok. OG Aerith is already realistic and not static for me.

Edit: eleamaya that's from Rebirth, and already without context I don't like it.

Yes, teen Tifa is fun. From what I've seen of Rebirth,, that Tifa is very different from OG Tifa too though (as adult specifically)

I like teen Tifa's spunk. Yuffie has a lot of that too.

Edit 2:

Edit 3: In Ever Crisis we get to

Spoiler

see Tifa in the years before Avalanche, in Midgar, working hard, training, meeting Jessie, scene with cat, hug with Jessie, etc, I really like this, good story

 

[Hix]

Nah it's terrible, especially if the she goes for over ten dates with Cloud in this one is true too. OG Aerith would never wear ribbon for a man, make over 23 wishes, write over 80 letters, etc. It's excessive. OG Aerith wanted to fly in the Highwind, not always cry over the sky,

OG Aerith and Remake 1 Aerith's are best Aeriths imo while Advent Children and CC were on the other end, without context though Rebirth might be the worst.

Crisis Core and Advent Children are canon though? It's not CC Aerith or ACC Aerith, it's just...Aerith. That Aerith in OG? She wrote 88 unrequited love letters over 4 years to Zack (evidently the last one wasn't that long before she met Cloud), wrote 23 wishes about wanting to spend more time with him and wears his ribbon and pink at his behest. That's not a different Aerith, canonically it's the one and same. Ditto the one in ACC.

It's not you, but I've heard this sentiment many times from Cleriths before - with little coincidence that any time Aerith is with Zack that they some find reason to pick holes in her character - like they want to trap a very small window of her portrayal in the franchise in a bottle and envisage that any nuances beyond that deviate from her character and agency.

She can't act like a teenager with a boyfriend, she can't experience trauma after losing said boyfriend, she can't wish for and give her blessing to Cloud being happy after her death. She can't be anything but the Aerith who travelled with Cloud for a few weeks - clearly having been enticed by finding the first real link to/clue about Zack since the events of Crisis Core.

 

[Stiggie]

Crisis Core and Advent Children are canon though? It's not CC Aerith or ACC Aerith, it's just...Aerith. That Aerith in OG? She wrote 88 unrequited love letters over 4 years to Zack (evidently the last one wasn't that long before she met Cloud), wrote 23 wishes about spending more time with him and wears his ribbon and pink at his behest. That's not a different Aerith, canonically it's the one and same. Ditto the one in ACC.

It's not you, but I've heard this sentiment many times from Cleriths before - with little coincidence that any time Aerith is with Zack that they some find reason to pick holes in her character - like they want to trap a very small window of her portrayal in the franchise in a bottle and envisage that any nuances beyond that deviate from her character and agency.

She can't act like a teenager with a boyfriend, she can't experience trauma after losing said boyfriend, she can't wish for and give her blessing to Cloud being happy after her death. She can't be anything but the Aerith who travelled with Cloud for a few weeks - clearly having been enticed by finding the first real link to/clue about Zack since the events of Crisis Core.

"It's stupid that Aerith wears her iconic ribbon in memory of Zack" I am told as I absentmindedly twirl the ring around my finger that my ex made for me 10 years ago and that I have worn everyday since.

 

[sturmgeist2001]

Are you forgetting how Tifa used Cloud when they were teens? Tifa started to become interested only because Cloud promised her to become her knight in a shiny armor. Tifa didn't really care about Cloud before he made that promise.

That wasn't really nice either.

I dont want to start a fight but Cloud was the one who distanced himself from her because he didnt like Tifas Friends and had a superiority complex and was antisocial. Tifa always admired Cloud but believed he was something special that she can never reach but at the Water Tower she realized he was an ordinary boy and she fell in love with him which is why she asked him to make that promise so she can one day reunite with him. When Tifa apologized for not realizing Couds situation when they were kids Cloud himself said its not her fault. Traces of Two Past explained that well.

 

[KindOfBlue]

The ribbon thing is a bit weird continuity wise, since she apparently got it in CC but in Remake we see her wearing it as a little girl.

In my headcanon Aerith lost her ribbon and Zack bought her a new one or something, I dunno.

 

[Stiggie]

The ribbon thing is a bit weird continuity wise, since she apparently got it in CC but in Remake we see her wearing it as a little girl.

In my headcanon Aerith lost her ribbon and Zack bought her a new one or something, I dunno.

It's such a nothing burger of a continuity error imo. The reason small Aerith had a bow is because they wanted small Aerith to look iconic, and Aerith has a bow. Which means that yes, apparently the reason Aerith chose that bow in CC is because she used to have one just like it.
It's not even a plothole, or even headcannon, it's just that stuff happens in between scenes and you're expected to fill in the scenes using Occam's razor. It's like saying "wait a minute, why are the Turk in the mythril mines, last time we saw them they were at Midgar!".....yeah, they
moved in between scenes.

 

[Ryeleigh]

I don't really have anything to add but I just wanted to address a couple of things I saw in the thread.

Cloud is annoyed at Aerith is an interpretation that has been going around forever that was debunked by the Ultimanias saying he enjoys spending time with her. Why would he want a next time if he's so annoyed. Ultimanias confirm that he has a good time while he is with her. The other side doesn't see Cloud being super annoyed at Aerith because they know he's not.

Tbf, Cloud is undoubtedly annoyed at Aerith at times -- at least in Remake. It's evident from his expressions and body language. Such as the moment when he snaps "Quit acting like you know me!" like an irritable little brother, lol. That doesn't exclude him from enjoying her company as they get to know each other. I mean, they're not mutually exclusive? It's called relationship development. He was visibly annoyed with Barret too in the beginning and then they got to know and respect each other, you know?

The real difference is what people choose to focus on.

I've really seen the the worst of takes on the internets like Aerith forces herself on Cloud, is an abuser, a sexual predator, physical/emotional/sexual/mental abuser, mind f*cks Cloud, mentally sexualy abuses him, etc, I won't use the strong word people use because I know it can be triggering for some but yeah, all this and more. All this some think SE make one of their beloved characters be. So many people love her, she's beloved, many on the dev, the staff team love her too. Some think they'd really make that the truth of her? That was not her or their intention.

This is typical ship war hyperbole. In the ATLA fandom, a twelve-year-old boy is also called a r*pist by the opposing shippers because of an ill-timed kiss. I know it's hard and annoying to hear takes like that, especially about a favourite character but the only thing anyone can do is just ignore them and focus on what you love about the character.

Tbh when dev said they'd focus on giving both girl equal contents. I knew what'd be their "priority". So I don't believe it will end, not in part 2.
I'm more worry about the fact that Zack is now a factor and half-alive and so... uh it makes things "weird". Even weirder when the game kinda implies both girls know other loves cloud.

Yeah, having Zack die while protecting Cloud and trying to get back to Aerith, then introducing him back and having him take care of unconscious Cloud and Aerith, while Aerith tries to get together with Cloud(?) at the same time the game is showing Cloud and Tifa's mutual feelings is... certainly a direction, lol.

It's such an assassination of Aerith's character, and reminds me of everything I hated about Crisis Core.

Tbf, the writing in CC isn't particularly good so I always thought that cumbered the representation of the characters. But if you ignore the weirdly bad writing, Aerith is still herself, I think? Like when Zack's all "What do you think? Was I cool?" or something and Aerith is all "Hmm... I dunno!" lol. (Their interaction after their first meeting outside the church.)

 

[Zach1545]

Some of these comments make me sad because my love for Zack runs deep guys. He's just (sighs) the perfect specimen. No stop, please just listen to me for a moment. Not only is this man magnificent, but he's also extremely handsome. It's truly impressive how hot he is. He's over 6 feet tall, has the heart of an angel, and chooses to love Aerith with it darn it. He's not suited for dating, he's suited for marriage. It's a pain to know that I can't kiss him physically because I really REALLY want to.

 

[eggbeans]

Some of these comments make me sad because my love for Zack runs deep guys. He's just (sighs) the perfect specimen. No stop, please just listen to me for a moment. Not only is this man magnificent, but he's also extremely handsome. It's truly impressive how hot he is. He's over 6 feet tall, has the heart of an angel, and chooses to love Aerith with it darn it. He's not suited for dating, he's suited for marriage. It's a pain to know that I can't kiss him physically because I really REALLY want to.

Seriously fr tho how anybody can hate Zack is mind-boggling to me. He’s so pure, 1000% husband material and the way his and Aerith’s story turned out is so tragic to me. I hope we see them reunite in Part 3

 

[eleamaya]

Whether you like it or not Cloud and Aerith are not meant to be together. They are, at best, star-crossed lovers akin to Romeo and Juliet, but Romeo survives while Juliet dies.

To be fair, Romeo & Juliet is more similar to Zack & Aerith.
They fall in love at the first sight because of how young they are.
Unfortunately, they are separated away because of an incident.
Tseng/Lawrence try to be the connector via letter the girl send to the boy, and want to reunite them.
But it goes wrong...

he determines to return to her, to the city of Verona and Midgar even with death threat, to meet her in the church.
And you know the tragedy happens. The girl follows him shortly after.

And if we take Whispers as the Destiny literally, it's Fate who separate Zack & Aerith,
Remake ending plays the inevitability of the two characters' paths crossing.
Rebirth still play with them cannot reunite so damn hard.

But yeah, ACC gives us ending. So, who knows what we'll get in Part 3.

 

[rkss]

Yeah, having Zack die while protecting Cloud and trying to get back to Aerith, then introducing him back and having him take care of unconscious Cloud and Aerith, while Aerith tries to get together with Cloud(?) at the same time the game is showing Cloud and Tifa's mutual feelings is... certainly a direction, lol.

I'm not saying it's the direction. I'm saying it paint bad look on them by having implicit romance between 2 people, whilst the other love interest stands not far from there. It's not a well-thought scenario from director.

Normally, It'd be a fine scene; majority are not shippers ya. But, if the whole game has romance undertone going (this has yet to be seen), then one cannot ignore the other hidden message is being delivered here.

Maybe I'm biased and seeing things that ain't there. But I'm really curious how will this play out, because the nuance between Cloud-Zack-Aerith does not work.
You could argue characters are currently not themselves and they do not know it better; but these are established characters, audiences and authors know it, yet they chose to go that direction deliberately. From Doylist's pov that explanation is weak.

 

[Hix]

the nuance between Cloud-Zack-Aerith does not work.

Actually I agree, but this has been a narrative issue for Clerith from the beginning. No matter what they did with Zack, the mere fact he's existing now is incredibly awkward (at best) for those who want to eschew the canon and pursue Aerith with Cloud.

In my mind, the only two options are you ignore Zack (and Advent Children) and hope he's a non-factor in part 3 - or you re-examine Aerith's feelings for Cloud and why she's doing what she's doing, including the scene in question.

I'm not sure if the Devs are trying to deliberately indicate that she's trying to live out her time with Zack through Cloud, it seems too on the nose to suggest otherwise, but one has to assume they considered the ramifications of bringing him back and have a good reason for it.

 

[aud]

Spoiler

[There's a bit more on a YouTube Channel called Kittara Girl Amv ]

That's honestly cute ngl
I'm 100% a Clerith but this date scene is definitely very cute. I wish they did the same for Cloud and Aeriths date but I'm guessing she has other scenes that might compensate this one... they said they would make it equal between the girls so idk

 

[aud]

It's such an assassination of Aerith's character, and reminds me of everything I hated about Crisis Core.

I mean at the end of the day it's a part of their audience they alienate and convince not to get the game or the next one.

It's not even about shipper it's a beloved character as well.

I agree. CC Aerith is kinda off to me, it feels they toned down her personality to make it fit with Zack better which I think is STUPID cause chaotic Zack and chaotic Aerith would've been 10 times better than whatever we had in CC

 

[Legend45]

That's honestly cute ngl
I'm 100% a Clerith but this date scene is definitely very cute. I wish they did the same for Cloud and Aeriths date but I'm guessing she has other scenes that might compensate this one... they said they would make it equal between the girls so idk

Their relationship is more spiritual rather than physical from what I have gathered so I imagine they might have a special talk that will match it, I suppose.

 

[Maidenofwar]

Yeah, that is why I wait and see aud, I saw that French article about the love triangle debate and making the girls equal too. However from the leaks ... maybe it will all make sense in context

 

[GamerSkull]

Did they say the girls would be treated equally from a romance POV?

Or did they just say they would be treated equal in a general sense? Because they could just be referring to character moments and screen time, and not their relationship to Cloud per se.

 

[Maidenofwar]

Hard to say, the article seems to be in part about the Ltd and they think Hamaguchi is answering it?

Así han afrontado los creadores de Final Fantasy VII el triángulo amoroso entre Cloud, Aeris y Tifa

Durante una entrevista con Yoshinori Kitase y Naoki Hamaguchi, productor y director, aseguran que han tenido este aspecto muy en cuenta.

vandal.elespanol.com

 

[Hix]

Did they say the girls would be treated equally from a romance POV?

Or did they just say they would be treated equal in a general sense? Because they could just be referring to character moments and screen time, and not their relationship to Cloud per se.

Seems like it's from a point of view of screen time? He specifies ensuring every character gets equal attention but this was especially so for the girls.

Spoiler

Obviously one girl getting a kiss and the other not is kinda already proof it's not from a romance POV.

 

[GamerSkull]

Seems like it's from a point of view of screen time? He specifies ensuring every character gets equal attention but this was especially so for the girls.

Spoiler

Obviously one girl getting a kiss and the other not is kinda already proof it's not from a romance POV.

Spoiler

I’m curious about the choice. I suppose it’s possibly they’re laying the groundwork for what should be coming in Part 3 (if they don’t change things.) They have some pretty big cojones to actually commit on the LTD this early.

 

[KindOfBlue]

Or did they just say they would be treated equal in a general sense?

I’m leaning more towards it being in a general sense because if we’re talking specifically about equality in terms of romance? Come on, people. Let’s be honest with ourselves here, especially if the leaks are any indication of what’s happening.