SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke

[Nancy]

But, but Barret told Denzel to look after mother. It’s like, his first line in the movie and stuff.

“Well clearly he didn’t mean Tifa.”

Not the woman Denzel was with a second ago? The one using her body to shield him? The one he lives with and puts food on his table? The reason he’s bloodlusted and charging a dragon? I mean there’s literally no one else here right?

“Aerith is Denzel’s mother so that is clearly who Barret meant.”

… is it actually made clear anywhere that Denzel knows Aerith is his mother? Is Barret telling him to metaphorically look after his dead mother? But Denzel has two dead mothers, won’t he get mixed up? Are we sure Denzel and Barret are on the same page here? Also if they’re not talking about Tifa, isn’t that kind of a random thing to bring up in the moment?

Each new answer unlocks new mysteries…

I'm sorry but in English he's saying "You look after Mama" just after his entrance.

Mighty
Aeris
Marries
As always Cloud

And remember. Denzel drank from the Lake. He has Jenova cells now. When he's watching Tifa, he is in fact seeing his mother Aerith. That's part of Sephiroth plan. I could explain now but I have no time.

You both are wrong. Mother = Jenova. The water Denzel drank from was Jenova's cells.

 

[luminous03]

According to twitter, motion capture has begun


Praying to get ff7 part in 2- 3 years because i am an impatient brat

 

[nars305]

I see people posting mocap pictures, I see some of the actors for FF7, not sure if it’s for part 3 project though?

I want Part 3 so bad so I can be free of this brain rot

 

[Eerie]

Well yeah sounds like it should be for p3, the devs have finished the script some 3-4 months ago now and the voice recording has definitely began (in JP at least). So it sounds on track with what they want. They are targetting a 2027 release if we must infer by what Kitase said (Rebirth really took only 3 years to develop, so I think the target release is for 2027).

 

[pxl_pushr]

I see people posting mocap pictures, I see some of the actors for FF7, not sure if it’s for part 3 project though?

I want Part 3 so bad so I can be free of this brain rot

Bold of you to assume P3 will cure you of the brain rot. You’ve already been assimilated, there’s no going back now!

I’m going to assume closer to 3 years to try and keep my impatience in check

 

[nars305]

Bold of you to assume P3 will cure you of the brain rot. You’ve already been assimilated, there’s no going back now!

I’m going to assume closer to 3 years to try and keep my impatience in check

NO I will set myself free whether I love it or hate it!!

Here is the post buzz:

https://x.com/chan_YAMA/status/1791107628795629985

 

[Ryushikaze]

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The mental gymnastics are fucking crazy I'm sorry

This exact sort of bullshit is what drove me to make up the "water tower baby Denzel" BS, because as fucking stupid as it is, it's more plausible than this bullshit.

If formal adoption exists, Reeve and the WRO would cut that red tape in a heartbeat.

Backdated and everything.

Let us hope she one day admits to having a problem and gets help.

She and everyone else will be better off for it.

Oh that's one of my favorite Carlin bits. Like to me that goes above classics like A Place for Your Stuff.

balance the stupid fucking budget is right up there with worship the sun, pray to Joe pesci.

You will never be equalled, Chell. May your belligerent tenacity inspire us always.

I still want to see a HL and Portal crossover where both characters remain mute on screen, but everyone acts as if they talk non stop the moment you're far enough away.

I'll drink to that! Roll CON.

Depending on what it's for I might not need to roll.

The best thing about playing 2nd Edition is it not mattering to me what WOTC or anyone else does Though obviously i agree despite that.

The problem arises when they think it does matter.

If only they were making cheese instead. It could go with their whine.

Oh so much whine. Shame about the terrible vintage.

I'll go Medic and bring a bonesaw for m'self. Either way, it's gonna get messy.

We'll bring a Pyro to cauterize the stumps.

Extremism is bad y'all. Never forget.

And always do your best to vet and verify your sources, especially if they tell you exactly what you want to hear.

Too true. I forget who all we had actually. I know we had The Thing, Nightcrawler, Wolverine...

We were undecided about Cable for Vincent, and hadn't considered much of anyone outside the party. Might be worth it to make a breakout post.

 

[Hellenic]

They choose to ignore the compilation narrative to feed their head canon.

Edit: honestly just let them be, it’s not worth getting riled up over. Like, I doubt they’ll change their minds, I don’t know if they have the maturity to? Everyone ends up with their respected partners. Yet somehow they twist it to fit their own narrative lol it’s so weird.

They're gonna ignore the whole Retrilogy after part 3 too and go back to OG as the sole thing existing for them.

 

[Rin]

They're gonna ignore the whole Retrilogy after part 3 too and go back to OG as the sole thing existing for them.

I am DEEPLY looking forward to this because those types are the easiest to ignore

 

[pxl_pushr]

I am DEEPLY looking forward to this because those types are the easiest to ignore

Between the upset extremists and the upset “Aerith will live” folks, it’s gonna be a fun one.

“What’s the point of bringing up defying fate if we don’t defy fate?” Allow me to introduce to you a little game called Final Fantasy 8.

 

[Hellenic]

So they cherry pick the negatives and ignore the context of everything that comes along with it? Lol..true fans. I love the part where they always quote the “do you love me” and he doesn’t answer and answers he loves Marlene no problem- and I’m like, so if he says he loves Marlene..what do you think Tifa means to him…of all the freaken ppl? And the fact he goes back to her at the end of advent children?????

Even if you don’t agree with the ship- at the end of the day cloud chooses to be with tifa and their little makeshift family.

No but see, the end of AC does not exist to them. It simply ends at the part where Cloud is in the church or Tifa yelling at him. Nothing else happens in the movie.

 

[Yoru]

They're gonna ignore the whole Retrilogy after part 3 too and go back to OG as the sole thing existing for them.

To be honest, some have already started. The new battle cry is: FF7 OG is not part of the compilation. It's the only complete experience. The rest is fanservice and more or less fan fiction. So we should only refer to FF7 OG when talking about canon.

I don't know how to tell them it doesn't matter. CA is still not happening.

 

[Hellenic]

Is every shipping fandom like this? Like when shit is clear as day, yet people can't get over it and move on? Genuinely is this super common in shipping?

I've never been part of any other shipping community besides this one really and i'm just wondering.

 

[pxl_pushr]

Is every shipping fandom like this? Like when shit is clear as day, yet people can't get over it and move on? Genuinely is this super common in shipping?

I've never been part of any other shipping community besides this one really and i'm just wondering.

Only one I can think of in video games. Seems pretty common in the more popular manga/anime communities. The more popular the IP, the more likely it is to happen with the shippers.

 

[Hellenic]

I know that we generally like to differentiate the "debaters" from the "extremists, but the ongoing meltdowns of kissgate and "Tifa's not a mother so NOT-Happy-Mother's-Day-Tifa" or "Cloud still wants to die" sort of suggests that this is one of those instances where the extremists may actually more accurately define the group since it really feels like these extremes could be the logical conclusion of these debates.

I've seen enough to know that the absolute worst of the Cloti LTD extremists will always find a way to mischaracterize Aerith in some way or offload their own dislike of Aerith onto Cloud and say that "he deeply, deeply dislikes her" (which we know he doesn't). That being said, that's actually sort of all they end up doing - most of what I see when it comes to the debate are Clotis who are usually invested enough to be able to make direct citations, sometimes they get into debate pervert tactics too. They can be sort of mean and often kind of flippant about things and definitely joke about things like Aerith dying, but that's sort of light work in the realm of trolling. I also happen to believe that a lot of these people are the frustrated and embattled of the fandom who have, often cynically, decided to just fight fire with fire, or in this case, be bigger dicks to the current reigning dicks.

On the other hand, Clerith LTD extremists will do any or all of the following: mischaracterize Tifa to be cruel, villainous, or be an "unreliable narrator" and Cloud to be suicidal, quote non-canon materials (Maiden who etc. etc.), handwave canon materials (especially the newer materials like 2000 gil and ToTP), cherry-pick quotes (we can recently remember how they pick out "Tifa doesn't like Cloud" in ToTP and handily leave out the "Tifa learned that she does like Cloud and she actually likes him that way" statement only pages after), accept shoddy and citation-less interpretation as truth (recently, the likely Twitter bot-farmed "interpretation" of why the kiss doesn't matter again, just a couple of weeks ago), disregard inconvenient dev statements (like "the dates are a reflection of what Cloud would do..."), re-interpret dev statements to suggest what they would like them to suggest (... which led to "the dates are not canon anyway"), replace loaded in-script statements that do not benefit their ship to neutral statements (for example the "Cloud's true self comes out with Tifa" vs. "Cloud just speaks plainly to Tifa" debate in 2020, and vice versa for the inverse, naturally), suggest that native Japanese speakers do not know their own language because Japan is an alien and mystical place with an impenetrable and unknowable language laden with ritual and context (a place where intimacy by hand is better than intimacy by lips) (incidentally, this is also a BJ/HJ joke, special apologies to Madam M).

View attachment 16811

A somewhat ancient example of this general lack of academic rigour was when Advent Children came out in the Venice Film Festival and someone went to watch it and went on to summarize the material incorrectly, but, if I'm not mistaken, this became the source of much of the misinformation going around about AC (specifically, "Cloud is suicidal"). The fact that these attitudes persist despite the fact that ACC exists and more materials are now readily available in official format rather than fan translation really makes this particularly frustrating.

God, I feel like there's so much more, but I am also not sure what else to say at this point that wouldn't just be a straight insult. Incidentally, I appreciate academic rigour over the absence of expertise so I would rather debates with some substantive argumentation. Most of the people I end up interacting with seem to have left their rebuttals at home.

Pretty much explained both extreme sides perfectly, though i would add in that there's major hate towards Jessie from the extreme Clotis too such as "Jessie is such a bad friend to Tifa" (not really) or "Jessie tried to drug Cloud with her love potion pizza" (i have no idea why they take the random ass pizza ingredients being used for love potion joke so seriously).

 

[Hellenic]

View attachment 16813

Guys, new meme unlocked
Hope @Yoru add it to his collection

Don't mind if i steal this meme.

 

[Eerie]

Is every shipping fandom like this? Like when shit is clear as day, yet people can't get over it and move on? Genuinely is this super common in shipping?

I've never been part of any other shipping community besides this one really and i'm just wondering.

Trust me there are worse fandoms than the FFVII shipping community. In gaming yes. There are some parts of the gaming sphere where you kind of don't want to be a woman. Not only that, but also some kpop communities are insane. Etc. etc. I feel social media kind of exarcerbate this kind of behaviour (mob behaviour).

"Jessie is such a bad friend to Tifa" (not really) or "Jessie tried to drug Cloud with her love potion pizza" (i have no idea why they take the random ass pizza ingredients being used for love potion joke so seriously).

Don't mind me but I wouldn't want a friend like Jessie as she is described in Remake - although her death kind of redeems her in my eyes. I would want such a friend as she is described in ToTP. Jessie is another "too many writers in the room, and no woman". I also tend to think that Tifa's deleted chapter would have actually helped her characterisation a lot. A lot of Tifa fans tend to take "Tifa's side" because they feel fandom is a lot against her in a way or another (giving her scenes to other characters, not considering her role as important, always forgotten next to Aerith... and that's without even getting on the very toxic CAs and the kind of attacks she's been under since Rebirth) and also feel that the two girls she has as girl friends go after Cloud when both are aware there's something between Cloud and Tifa. Jessie also earned a lot of "dislike points" in her chat with Cloud when she dissed Tifa in her back (yeahhhhhhh I had this kind of friends as a girl and it's not nice, really not).

As for the pizza comment it's just so bizarre. Not sure if it's a jab at Jairus or whatever, it's just so random especially since the way she talked about her ppizza party during her death scene was just so wholesome. I'm not surprised some take it seriously.

 

[Xannis]

Is every shipping fandom like this? Like when shit is clear as day, yet people can't get over it and move on? Genuinely is this super common in shipping?

I've never been part of any other shipping community besides this one really and i'm just wondering.

My wife was a Buffy The Vampire Slayer and Twilight Fan. FF7 LTD debates are pretty tame compared.

 

[Yoru]

As for the pizza comment it's just so bizarre. Not sure if it's a jab at Jairus or whatever, it's just so random especially since the way she talked about her ppizza party during her death scene was just so wholesome. I'm not surprised some take it seriously.

Is it not just related to Barret's dialogue in Rebirth ? When Cloud ask about some ingredients (the same Jessie wanted to use for her pizza) and he tells you "bro, you know it is used as a love potion?"

 

[Ryeleigh]

To be honest, some have already started. The new battle cry is: FF7 OG is not part of the compilation. It's the only complete experience. The rest is fanservice and more or less fan fiction. So we should only refer to FF7 OG when talking about canon.

I don't know how to tell them it doesn't matter. CA is still not happening.

There's also contention about FF7 OG, lol. Is the true canon experience FF7 Japanese original or the FF7 international? The one without Zack scenes or the one with added Zack scenes? You may conclude for yourselves which one the extremes prefer, lmao.

Is every shipping fandom like this? Like when shit is clear as day, yet people can't get over it and move on? Genuinely is this super common in shipping?

I've never been part of any other shipping community besides this one really and i'm just wondering.

Every shipping fandom? Probably not. But any shipping fandom where the non-canon shippers think they're entitled to canon and everybody's validation tends to be really bad. Shipping is supposed to be fun. Just enjoy the ship instead of demanding that everybody else validate it. For a funny and bizarre example, in the Supernatural fandom the extreme Dean/Cass shippers tried to seek validation from Neil Gaiman of all people, lol.

 

[pxl_pushr]

Trust me there are worse fandoms than the FFVII shipping community. In gaming yes. There are some parts of the gaming sphere where you kind of don't want to be a woman. Not only that, but also some kpop communities are insane. Etc. etc. I feel social media kind of exarcerbate this kind of behaviour (mob behaviour).


Don't mind me but I wouldn't want a friend like Jessie as she is described in Remake - although her death kind of redeems her in my eyes. I would want such a friend as she is described in ToTP. Jessie is another "too many writers in the room, and no woman". I also tend to think that Tifa's deleted chapter would have actually helped her characterisation a lot. A lot of Tifa fans tend to take "Tifa's side" because they feel fandom is a lot against her in a way or another (giving her scenes to other characters, not considering her role as important, always forgotten next to Aerith... and that's without even getting on the very toxic CAs and the kind of attacks she's been under since Rebirth) and also feel that the two girls she has as girl friends go after Cloud when both are aware there's something between Cloud and Tifa. Jessie also earned a lot of "dislike points" in her chat with Cloud when she dissed Tifa in her back (yeahhhhhhh I had this kind of friends as a girl and it's not nice, really not).

As for the pizza comment it's just so bizarre. Not sure if it's a jab at Jairus or whatever, it's just so random especially since the way she talked about her ppizza party during her death scene was just so wholesome. I'm not surprised some take it seriously.

I like to think the attempt with Jessie was to make her a microcosm of how Cloud deals with flirting from someone who isn’t Tifa. He’s bluntly repulsed by it, but when he sees what’s up with her dad and why she’s fighting, he shows more interest in getting closer to the Avalanche trio.

Cloud’s relationship with Aerith follows very similar rules. When she openly flirts, he deflects. When she’s openly having a vulnerable moment, he softens up towards her.

I do think they could’ve toned it down with either Jessie or Aerith. You ( and others ) have rightly pointed out that a woman in the writers room may have helped this.

 

[luminous03]

Don't mind if i steal this meme.

All good sister/brother

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

This exact sort of bullshit is what drove me to make up the "water tower baby Denzel" BS, because as fucking stupid as it is, it's more plausible than this bullshit.

It's always sad when a serious reading of WTBD is more plausible than basically anything.

Backdated and everything.

Absolutely. Reeve owes all three of them, after all.

She and everyone else will be better off for it.

I genuinely hope her delusions are at least mostly confined to the LTD, and not leaking out into her wider life. I pity BB more than I despise her if I think about it.

balance the stupid fucking budget is right up there with worship the sun, pray to Joe pesci.

Another classic. Though to be fair, George didn't have many buts that aren't classics now, just degrees of classic-ness. Also could wish that his material wasn't even more relevant now than it was then if I'm honest.

I still want to see a HL and Portal crossover where both characters remain mute on screen, but everyone acts as if they talk non stop the moment you're far enough away.

It'd be worth a laugh.

Depending on what it's for I might not need to roll.

If I'm drinking a toast, I'm having Jameson. Two fingers, beat if someone else is pouring.

The problem arises when they think it does matter.

I remember the great OGL kerfuffle of doom. Between that and how they've fucked around with MTG, WOTC really needed a kick in the ass.

Oh so much whine. Shame about the terrible vintage.

Perfect for serving with a foul heat lamp cheese.

We'll bring a Pyro to cauterize the stumps.

Optionally, we could get Heavy to punch out all their blood before we start.

And always do your best to vet and verify your sources, especially if they tell you exactly what you want to hear.

Take it from the Devil himself, if they say exactly what you wanna hear and you fail to verify for yourself? You just ain't doin' it right.

We were undecided about Cable for Vincent, and hadn't considered much of anyone outside the party. Might be worth it to make a breakout post.

I also recall suggesting Sinister for Hojo.

To be honest, some have already started. The new battle cry is: FF7 OG is not part of the compilation. It's the only complete experience. The rest is fanservice and more or less fan fiction. So we should only refer to FF7 OG when talking about canon.

That's not even a new battlecry It might've been dusty when they picked it up again, but "FF7 is not part of the Compilation" is as old as the Compilation.

I don't know how to tell them it doesn't matter. CA is still not happening.

We been plain speak saying that since forever. CA can happen in their hearts and minds, just not in the actual game.

Honestly, UTH should have settled this all by itself.

 

[Ryushikaze]

There's also contention about FF7 OG, lol. Is the true canon experience FF7 Japanese original or the FF7 international? The one without Zack scenes or the one with added Zack scenes? You may conclude for yourselves which one the extremes prefer, lmao.

And of course the same standard is not applied to any of the other International versions. Those are absolutely the definitive versions. Only FF7 is the exception. Hell, I bet these people are totally fine with Legend of the Crystals and The After Years.
Who am I kidding, they have no fucking clue what those are.

Every shipping fandom? Probably not. But any shipping fandom where the non-canon shippers think they're entitled to canon and everybody's validation tends to be really bad. Shipping is supposed to be fun. Just enjoy the ship instead of demanding that everybody else validate it. For a funny and bizarre example, in the Supernatural fandom the extreme Dean/Cass shippers tried to seek validation from Neil Gaiman of all people, lol.

As I understand it, Supernatural has no Canon pairings whatsoever, and the shipping Fandom is especially fucking insane. The real people shipping Fandom regarding the male leads is especially fucking nuts.
Makes the in character shipper insanity look downright moderate by comparison. Only by comparison, though.

It's always sad when a serious reading of WTBD is more plausible than basically anything.

At least it's theoretically possible, instead of claiming Cloud somehow had an eight and six year old with a woman he met two years ago for two weeks. Or that Sora was their kid.
That was fucking weird.

Absolutely. Reeve owes all three of them, after all.

Damn right he does. Hard to say who he owes most, but I feel like it's Denzel of the three.

I genuinely hope her delusions are at least mostly confined to the LTD, and not leaking out into her wider life. I pity BB more than I despise her if I think about it.

Same here, really. For as much of our lives are tied up in this nonsense, it seemed like her identity is wrapped up in it somehow.

Another classic. Though to be fair, George didn't have many buts that aren't classics now, just degrees of classic-ness. Also could wish that his material wasn't even more relevant now than it was then if I'm honest.

Including the bits about how the usual suspects stop giving a shit about kids the moment they're actually born.

If I'm drinking a toast, I'm having Jameson. Two fingers, beat if someone else is pouring.

Alcohol doesn't do much to or for me, so feel free to have the whole bottle if you like.

I remember the great OGL kerfuffle of doom. Between that and how they've fucked around with MTG, WOTC really needed a kick in the ass.

Hasbro needs the biggest kick in the nads for directing them to do it to save their floundering other divisions.

Perfect for serving with a foul heat lamp cheese.

They should enjoy their creation as best they can. They deserve it, after all.

Optionally, we could get Heavy to punch out all their blood before we start.

Maybe, but there will still be tons of gristle either way. We may want a lubricant.

Take it from the Devil himself, if they say exactly what you wanna hear and you fail to verify for yourself? You just ain't doin' it right.

And if anyone ever tries to hurry you into a deal, abort and escape.

I also recall suggesting Sinister for Hojo.

That got us into a derail about him and hodge and how a fusion would try and kill the other half.

That's not even a new battlecry It might've been dusty when they picked it up again, but "FF7 is not part of the Compilation" is as old as the Compilation.

Though usually it's presented as "The compilation isn't part of FF7"

We been plain speak saying that since forever. CA can happen in their hearts and minds, just not in the actual game.

If they weren't insisting it was the endgame pairing, or that Tifa was "the consolation prize" etc., we wouldn't even be here.

Honestly, UTH should have settled this all by itself.

It did, and then the cope train began. And it's been going since '96.

 

[Ryeleigh]

And of course the same standard is not applied to any of the other International versions. Those are absolutely the definitive versions. Only FF7 is the exception. Hell, I bet these people are totally fine with Legend of the Crystals and The After Years.
Who am I kidding, they have no fucking clue what those are.

The After Years is that FF4 game, right? But Legend of the Crystals doesn't say anything, though I would guess... FF3? Maybe? Maybe not?

As I understand it, Supernatural has no Canon pairings whatsoever, and the shipping Fandom is especially fucking insane. The real people shipping Fandom regarding the male leads is especially fucking nuts.
Makes the in character shipper insanity look downright moderate by comparison. Only by comparison, though.

Supernatural is a bit of a unique case, to be honest. The brothers were canon in the same way they were always canon on the show: platonically. They're basically platonic life partners who ended the show reuniting in heaven. And there was enough subtext and jokes on the show to read something more there if one so liked (because at the end of the day, it was a gothic horror show about family). But the simple answer is that: no, Supernatural had no "canon pairings", lol. Least of all Dean/Cass. Though, to bring this more on topic, I've seen extreme CA shippers who think that Dean/Cass was an actual thing on the show, lol.