Master Bates
Do you enjoy your life?
- AKA
- Mr. Koiwai
Twice I've shown you I can beat you in a quickdraw, mate. Game over.
SPOILERS LTD Remake — It's like New Coke except ... no, it's exactly like New Coke
- Thread starter The Twilight Mexican
- Start date
Twice I've shown you I can beat you in a quickdraw, mate. Game over.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Yeah, it could be if you are not grounded.
I have done some acting/drama before so I know how big that stage can get. Especially when the lights come on and you feel every ones eyes on you. I used to play the Piano and have had many concerts as well. Yeah, so I know exactly how Cloud felt for the most part. I admit though you do get use to it after so many. But, at first you just want to craw under a table or something.
Scot-88
Lv. 25 Adventurer
- AKA
- Scot
And explained better than me too. I tip my hat sir
Maidenofwar
They/Them
Not what happens Graymouse. He tries to leave, a pair of honey girls try to stop him, he tries to leave again, a pair of honey boys try to stop him, the honey girls and boys already passed, didn't manage to stop him, he sees Aerith, turns around, and goes back to Andrea. Exact sequence of events. I literally have a save set in the Honeybee in Wall Market right before this part.
Scot-88
Lv. 25 Adventurer
- AKA
- Scot
And I wholeheartedly agree it is the best route. I generally can see both perspectives in an argument.
Master Bates
Do you enjoy your life?
- AKA
- Mr. Koiwai
But that'd lead to... pandemonium.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
I am sorry but I disagree. Aerith is not the focal point of the mission not matter how hard you try to spin it. Yes, Aerith watched Cloud but Aerith did not motivate Cloud to dance for her. I am not understanding where you are seeing this. Again, Cloud did not dance for Aerith at all. It was a routine that he had to do to gain Andrea's favor to save Tifa. That is the focus point of that chapter.
Please help me understand where you are coming from? It just doesn't exist in my view point.
Maidenofwar
They/Them
Who is saying Aerith is the focal point of the mission?
Scot-88
Lv. 25 Adventurer
- AKA
- Scot
Actually what happens is he sees Aerith and looks around him in disbelief at the situation. He turns to face Andrea and is challenged with a point of the finger. After a few seconds of thinking he steels himself for what he has to do and walks with purpose to his position.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
You are, in the way you are responding. That is why a couple of people here are confused by what you are saying. Again, I am sorry but Cloud did not dance for Aerith. If anything he danced for Tifa. For Tifa's freedom if you want to nitpick.
LNK
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Nate
Lol shit, it already has lead to... Pandemonium. I wonder if this was why 8, 9 and 10 had the protagonist only go after one heroine?But that'd lead to... pandemonium.
I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I'm done shitposting. Please don't smack me with the hammer.
Maidenofwar
They/Them
No I'm not. Do not put words in my mouth or assume my thought process or train of thoughts thank you. All I did was post exactly what happened in the scene step by step. It is a play by play of how the events that took place (like saying the woman spoke, the woman sat, the woman stood up, the woman moved) People can disagree that Cloud tried to leave, the honey girls stopped him, that he tried to leave again, the honey boys tried to stop him, that he saw Aerith, then turned around and returned to Andrea, but that's what happened on screen.
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LNK
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Nate
You didn't say she was the focal point, but you did say he danced for her
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Ok you absolutely got me there. I shouldn't have used the word focal point. However, by you saying that Cloud danced for Aerith, I assumed that is what you were meaning. I believe that is what others might have thought as well. That Cloud specifically danced for Aerith and only Aerith. That is what you came off as. I apologize.
Scot-88
Lv. 25 Adventurer
- AKA
- Scot
You may not be saying she is the most important but you appear to be saying she is of equal importance.
But you are leaving out what happens in between seeing Aerith and then taking his dance position. He sees Aerith and looks around him in disbelief at the situation. He turns to face Andrea and is challenged with a point of the finger. After a few seconds of thinking he steels himself for what he has to do and walks with purpose to his position. He didn't look at Aerith and decide I must do this for her. He doesn't decide what he is going to do until he faces Andrea.
Maidenofwar
They/Them
Well as I put in the thread earlier I am not anti Tifa so I wouldn't try to make everything in Wall Market not about her at all ?
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
I wasn't aware that there are such things as anti Tifa's? What is not to love about her! Ship Ship Ship Ship
While, playing through the game I did see a lot of touching, hugging, holding hands, and rolling on the ground between Tifa and Cloud.
Scot-88
Lv. 25 Adventurer
- AKA
- Scot
Fair enough
I stand by my position that everything in Wall Market is about Tifa. Just as I stand by the opinion that the siege of Shinra hq is all about Aerith. Just because in one chapter a girl is less important story wise, doesn't mean I think they are not important. They all have their moments in the Sun. 
Master Bates
Do you enjoy your life?
- AKA
- Mr. Koiwai
The Wall Market Sequence was only brought up in the first place to support the point that Cloud wasn't all "AERITH! AERITH! AERITH!", after Aerith shows up, contrary to what BB back there was claiming. That is to say, Cloud isn't a one-track minded robot.
It wasn't brought to the table to downplay Aerith at all.
It wasn't brought to the table to downplay Aerith at all.
Ahhh, the good old LTD. Seeing this thread derailing into madness brings always joy to my heart, even though it's pretty chill right now.
So after finally finishing the remake in hard mode(which was a fucking riot, loved it) I wanted to add my two cents on the subject.
To me it seems that Aerith is kinda playing wingman for Tifa and Cloud and that she is either OG Aerith who already knows the story of ff7 or that she, the more time goes on, receives memories from the future.
Either way, she probably knows that Cloud isn't really himself and about that entire Zack/Jenova fake persona debacle which is the reason why she kinda seems more like a big sis character this time around and way less flirty.
Others have already mentioned it, but that bar scene were she realizes that Cloud gave her flower to Tifa and just smiles about it, is a huge red flag, also after that scene you get that chapter 14 moment where she tells him 'lets stay besties' and after that there is nothing between them anymore.
For some reason they decided to cut out all the sweet Cloud and Aerith Shinra HQ moments from the original. They didn't even give them a touching reunion like in the original.
Fun fact: I played the game with Japanese voices and the amount of times Cloud shrieks 'TIFA!!11' was heartwarming.
Also they brought back our boy Zack. So yeah.
TL;DR: Game sets up Cloud and Tifa pretty hard while Aerith is having a riot
So after finally finishing the remake in hard mode(which was a fucking riot, loved it) I wanted to add my two cents on the subject.
To me it seems that Aerith is kinda playing wingman for Tifa and Cloud and that she is either OG Aerith who already knows the story of ff7 or that she, the more time goes on, receives memories from the future.
Either way, she probably knows that Cloud isn't really himself and about that entire Zack/Jenova fake persona debacle which is the reason why she kinda seems more like a big sis character this time around and way less flirty.
Others have already mentioned it, but that bar scene were she realizes that Cloud gave her flower to Tifa and just smiles about it, is a huge red flag, also after that scene you get that chapter 14 moment where she tells him 'lets stay besties' and after that there is nothing between them anymore.
For some reason they decided to cut out all the sweet Cloud and Aerith Shinra HQ moments from the original. They didn't even give them a touching reunion like in the original.
Fun fact: I played the game with Japanese voices and the amount of times Cloud shrieks 'TIFA!!11' was heartwarming.
Also they brought back our boy Zack. So yeah.
TL;DR: Game sets up Cloud and Tifa pretty hard while Aerith is having a riot
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BlankBeat
Pro Adventurer
Are we going to ignore the red dress reveal in Wall Market? Yes -- optional. But still showcased in the trailers and a pivotal scene. Cloud's jaw literally drops. He is mesmerized.
Sure -- they are rescuing Tifa. But the actual interactions in Wall Market are CxA.
When they go to Shinra HQ, it is Cloud, Tifa, *AND* Barret.
Sure -- they are rescuing Tifa. But the actual interactions in Wall Market are CxA.
When they go to Shinra HQ, it is Cloud, Tifa, *AND* Barret.
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Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Pot meet kettle.
To start off with, the red dress is like you said is optional. Just like you getting to choose Tifa's dress in CH3. If you do not get the "alone at last" discovery, I think Tifa defaults into the Blue dress that we see in the trailer. What 20 year old man will not drool over Aerith in that dress. I mean come on! Let's be reasonable here. Saying other wise is just not genuine. Sorry, that does not mean anything.
Next, the Wall Market chapter, yes it is both Cloud and Aerith running around Wall Market. Again as stated before the focus point of that mission is to rescue Tifa. Sorry, that doesn't help your cause either.
Next, I will admit that the Shinra HQ is all about Aerith as the focal point. However, It is all three of them going to rescue Aerith. Not just Cloud. Before you leave Aerith's house Cloud does say that Aerith is calling out to him. Mind you, Tifa also says this as well, that Aerith is calling out to all of her friends, not just Cloud. So, again sorry this doesn't help you either.
Finally, and probably the most important is we discussed earlier about the flower in Tifa's bar. How conveniently you are ignoring that entire conversation and the dream sequence that most Aerith shippers talk about " Don't fall in love with me" etc etc etc. The bar scene gives that dream sequence teeth. That is why Aerith says that.
*edited to fix my atrocious grammer.... ha ha.
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Scot-88
Lv. 25 Adventurer
- AKA
- Scot
Guy thinks girl is hot. cool. Doesn't change the goal of the chapter. Interactions like what? The colosseum. the dance. the dress? All for the shared goal of saving Tifa. No one is saying your ship is invalid. But I can't think of any interaction outside the optional red dress reveal that can be considered a ship moment. Unless you are claiming the whole dance and dress thing was all for Aerith. In which case go back and read the last few pages of people explaining why it's not. It isn't even a Tifa ship moment. It is a Cloud moment. This is the problem. With all the great moments for Cloud and Aerith in the game. People seem to be claiming moments for their ship that defy logic. Just because for this instant in time your ship isn't the focal point of the interactions does not mean it is diminished.
I'm not even sure what that last point meant. So... okay
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
BTW, don't think that I am diminishing Aerith and Cloud. However, in the examples above the evidence is just not there to support that this is a Aerith and Cloud only moments. Especially Wall Market, where there are other larger plot points being told. Sorry, I just don't see it.