New year, New LTD thread. (Round 5)

[Dashell]

he mentioned how we talk because cleriths directly effect us. I'm not seeing that I guess. I go about my daily life with the knowledge cloti is canon and I am content with this, and I don't see anyone openly challenging this viewpoint. If I went out to look for it, sure, I would meet people who disagree with this.

Okay did he mean our lives IRL or our lives on the internet? Or maybe our lives in the LTD? Cleriths do effect us. We also effect them. They disagree with us, they make their arguments and we make ours. That's how a debate works. You seem to be under the impression that Ryu was talking about Cleriths effecting us in something other than the LTD. I'm not sure he was.

But I don't see people commenting on cloti arts that I or my friends have made saying that it's horrible and clerith is the true canon. When I go to ctlove on livejournal, sometimes I see a fic that I would disagree with it being classified as cloti, but no one argues with it being posted and no one posts about how they think cloti is fanon or whatever. Can't really comment on youtube cause as mentioned, I generally don't look at amvs.

But again, do these people count or not? And you keep bringing up a point that Ryu did not before. You keep talking about people who go onto Cloti art or ctlove and talk about Clerith being canon. Those people are the ones who count, right? Not those who say Clerith is canon in a Clerith group?

Basically, I am sure if I really, truly looked hard to see people who were trying to say clerith is the one true pair on art and journal entries, I would find it. But I don't cause shockingly enough I don't enjoy arguing enough with people to try and search out people whom I disagree with.

Does looking hard and clicking on an LTD thread fall into the same category? Wouldn't you expect to see some Clerith hate in an LTD thread, and some Cloti hate as well?

Well, I don't go to CxA because I don't agree with them. I am sure if people were bashing Tifa or Aerith or my mother or what have you, I would get annoyed and tell them to shut that shit up. No matter what, it's completely stupid.

So it's okay to talk about these things in your own little groups is what I'm getting. As long as you don't go out of those groups, right? What if people do go our of their groups to do so?

 

[Dana Scully]

I am so confused. What exactly are we arguing about?

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

he mentioned how we talk because cleriths directly effect us.

No I didn't. o.O I actually said the opposite.

Did you really think it was Clerith Fundamentalists I was describing when I referred to one of the two groups (creationists or the members of the CxA forum) as people "who distort the truth and block out any evidence that they're wrong as they proselytize and seek to force change on others' lives," and, thus, that "it doesn't seem as silly to bring up their socially destructive behavior at most every opportunity" (in contrast to doing so with the other group: members of the CxA forum) because "they're actually harming people"?

And that I was referring to religious fundamentalists as "the less relevant group"?

I mean, I know there was that period in my life where I was too involved with FF, but holy crap. o__o Is that how peeps think I prioritize?

So, yeah, again, my most recent post said the opposite of what you took from it. And I also made the point that I don't go out of my way to talk about them (the members of the CxA forum) because I don't give a shit about them, as they don't matter.

Reread my two most recent on-topic posts:
http://thelifestream.net/forums/showpost.php?p=310816&postcount=1423
http://thelifestream.net/forums/showpost.php?p=311041&postcount=1461

The most recent in particular.

In the first three paragraphs I tried to clarify where I think you were misunderstanding Ryu's analogy (and now that you've taken the opposite meaning from my most recent post, I'm convinced that you did misinterpret his as well). In the fourth, I comment on the stupidity of this whole exercise.

In the fifth, I segue into points that were pretty much what you've been saying.

So I is confused.

maybe i have not been going to the right forums, but i generally don't see CxA members running into 4chan and somethingawful and preaching the good news about how clerith jesus died for your sins

And other than that insane bitch Cali you probably won't. That's why I can make comments like this in my most recent post: "The feeling I have about that group is that as long as they stay holed up, I don't really give a fuck about them anymore."

I am so confused. What exactly are we arguing about?

Really hoping somebody can tell me that too.

 

[Splintered]

Against my better judgement, I'm going to comment on all this.

Oh my god, Tres. You just summed up the entire history of the LTD in eleven words. That's amazing.

 

[Celes Chere]

A lot of, "is Tifa a good character" often boils down to, CxT!!!111 which is partly fault by design because Tifa's character dependence, but it would be nice to see an actual conversation that doesn't rely on the power of her vagina.

This. Sure, Tifa is a marvelous character when it comes to Cloud, but he's not the only one she's helped/cares about. He's the one she cares about most obviously, but that doesn't negate all other characters. I like that she's a fighter, a lover, and a mother. c: I don't think she's completely dependant on Cloud either, it's just that she really does love the guy so he's a huge part of her life. If anyone is the dependant one, it's Cloud. He's the one always needed to be helped. He's the one that's the most insecure, and needing of reassurance. I like that Tifa is always there to provide those types of things, when he needs it the most. Her wake up call to Cloud in AC/ACC is one of my favorite parts because she's fed up! And FFS, she should be by this point. It was nice to see her tell Cloud to get his shit together.

When I first came into the fandom, I thought the guy, Jensen and whathisfaceSam's actor where actually in a relationship because the way the fans acted.

Jared and Jensen. Both are taken by women. Interesting that you thought that way 'cause of the fans, though they can be pretty convincing with their photo manips, twisting the words of interviews, and other such things. I never believed that these two were actually together offset, even though they act very touchy feely. They're just messing around, lawl. The biggest factor being they have girlfriends. Actually, I think Jensen married his, but I'm not sure. As much as I love certain TV shows and stuff, I really don't keep up with the actors. I care more about the character in the actual show.

And none of this was said sarcastically.

Lmao, it's even worse when they throw Misha into the mix because it's like Jensen loves Misha, so Jared is jealous. It's liek. Come on now... xD

I left Supernatural fandom shortly after I found one of the fans went to one of the actor's girlfriend and told her to leave because she was ruining the mood of the convention.These fans are batshit. And even then I wouldn't relate them to religious fundamentalists.

WOW, well I've never heard of something quite so insane, but if I went to a convention and saw her being treated that way I'd fucking say something because that is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. IT MAKES ME SAD BEING A YAOI FANGIRL SOMETIMES >:C Shit gets out of hand. I hate when other people are so close minded like that, and I hate when female characters/actors are looked down upon especially because of a ship. I admit, there are not many female characters that I like in Supernatural, but I'd still never act like that. Decency people - YEW NEED IT O_O

And try saying that you like Sam x Jessica or even moreso Dean x Lisa. People will freak the fuck out at you. The only guy/guy I like is Dean/Cas and Sam/Cas and I don't take it seriously at all, lol. I prefer going through the show thinking there are *no* ships. I'm really much more interested in the family bonds and actual storyline when it comes to this series, but I'm forever alone in the fandom when it comes to that. Okay, not entirely there are some pretty awesome fans, so they're not all crazy. But for the most part, yeah, lots of herp derp the more I see of dis fandom.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

@Tiff: About your mention of Tifa always saving Cloud and his character being more dependent on her than vice versa. Didn't Cloud pretty much reference this himself in ACC? Talking to Marlene, he says something to the effect of "You and Tifa are always protecting me. It's time I returned the favor for once." or something.

 

[Celes Chere]

Yes! Absolutely. And yet some people tend to think that Tifa is a big nag, and that she can't do anything because she's too insecure herself. Yeah she's an insecure character (and I actually like that about her), but it doesn't mean she can't stand on her own two feet. She already proved she can kick ass without a man plenty of times in the game.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Tifa is insecure about lovey-dovey relationship stuff. I've never seen her too shy to knock someone out.

 

[Celes Chere]

Scarlet. Dat bitch didn't stand a chance.

 

[Roger]

I don't like the "if anything character A is the dependent one, not character B." Doesn't really improve the story at all. I prefer to see Cloud and Tifa cut from the same cloth.

But either way, Cloud's underlying weakness maybe what defines his character... That doesn't quite equate to dependence on Tifa. He's got Zack and Aerith and Sephiroth to help him in their own special ways. Tifa, whether she's being the strong one or the weak one, could use a few conversations with people beside Cloud, about stuff beside Cloud.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

idk wats goin on anymore.

♥

 

[Madame Mayor]

Scarlet. Dat bitch didn't stand a chance.

More video games need scenes like this.

 

[Frostwave]

My youngest sister recently got to the slapping fight with Tifa an' Scarlet and she asked me to win it for her....

But I was really sleepy and I lost. And she hadn't saved in a while.

AND SHE BEAT ME BADLY FOR LOSING! It was horrible.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

I don't like the "if anything character A is the dependent one, not character B." Doesn't really improve the story at all. I prefer to see Cloud and Tifa cut from the same cloth.

Ya know, I like this whole statement. Cloud and Tifa are cut from the same cloth.

They're both too shy and lacking in confidence to spit it out to each other for most of the OG. They both seem to lack a need for constant displays of affection once they hook up. And neither of them is in the least afraid to kick/slice the ass off of anything that needs its ass kicked/sliced.

Even when they were too weak to actually get the job done, goddamn if they didn't try (see Cowgirl Tifa trying to gut Sephy with his own sword, and pretty much everything Cloud did prior to the experiments done on him excepting times when he suddenly could kick ass). Neither is the weaker individual, and its not that one depends entirely on the other. They depend on each other. Almost like they're a couple or something.

 

[Roger]

Well let's not get carried away.

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

You're no fun

 

[Tifabelle]

My youngest sister recently got to the slapping fight with Tifa an' Scarlet and she asked me to win it for her....

But I was really sleepy and I lost. And she hadn't saved in a while.

AND SHE BEAT ME BADLY FOR LOSING! It was horrible.

I like the video game/real life paralells in this story.

 

[Dashell]

No I didn't. o.O I actually said the opposite.

Oh she meant YOU?... yeah WTF, I thought she meant Ryu XD

idk wats goin on anymore.

♥

Can you respond to my post please?

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Just can't let it go can ya Q? Just gotta pick through the bones of the debate long after everyone else has lost sight of what it was about in the first place... wow that's kinda meta for this thread.

 

[Dashell]

*shrugs*

She seems to be constantly trying to make Ryu look bad by twisting his words, ignoring his posts and what not, I want to return the favorfigure out why.

 

[Splintered]

lol

 

[Celes Chere]

"if anything character A is the dependent one, not character B."

Cloud is a very dependant character, though. It doesn't improve the story or anything, that's just how I see it. I think that Cloud and Tifa depend on each other, but Cloud moreso than Tifa. That could just be me though that sees it like that. And I do see your point and partly agree.

 

[Alessa Gillespie]

*shrugs*

She seems to be constantly trying to make Ryu look bad by twisting his words, ignoring his posts and what not, I want to return the favorfigure out why.

i am sure ryu is a big enough boy to handle someone being mean over the internet, que

 

[Gym Leader Devil]

Watch it Q, next thing you know people will be calling you a white knight. Next thing you know they'll be calling us Sir Black Mage and Dame Derpy Hooves.

 

[Ryushikaze]

i am sure ryu is a big enough boy to handle someone being mean over the internet, que

I am. You're still evading questions and misrepresenting points, though. Do be a dear and be big girl yourself, alright?