Spam discussion thread

[Ⓐaron]

I don't see why "Who wants to join my tits team" isn't a better topic of discussion than say, "Who likes Oreos and milk" or "Why didn't anyone tell me this place was open," to name two examples of threads that have flown. As for the distraction/drain of resources claim - well, that's possible. But you're asserting it without evidence, and that's essentially the only reason you've given that hasn't been definitively rebutted, and the only reason it hasn't been definitively rebutted is because no one can know whether it will be so until it's actually tried.

also, the only person I've really seen flaming and trolling has been Scott.

 

[Max Payne]

I think those topics are both better than that one. It's just a spam thread.

If those other two have degenerated to nothing but spam, then they should be closed too.

 

[Arianna]

Someone please tell me why the General Conversation area isn't good enough?

 

[Ⓐaron]

Because threads get closed too often in there for people's liking. If people just want to chat shit with friends their threads are closed, and the chit chat thread moves too fast for some people to keep up with.

also,

The best spam sections can bring together a level of bonding that other forums on the don't really manage. It's hard to explain unless you've participated in one, but basically, imagine the Chit Chat thread, except to about ten times the extent. While visitor messages and such can somewhat replicate the experience to a lesser extent, there's something about being able to rant about your shit day to everyone in a forum where no one has to say anything on-topic that just can't really be duplicated in other settings.

That said, I can see why people don't want TLS to be associated with something like ACF's spam section; it would come across as intimidating to newcomers. I think it's possible to run a forum with a section like that and still not have any of it spill over to the rest of the board, but for the most part that didn't happen on ACF because for the most part the staff there were incompetent. The staff here are quite a bit more competent, but they also don't want a spam section which makes it harder

really though, I don't see what harm a section for off-topic posting with otherwise the same rules as the rest of the forum could do to the activity here. If someone acts like a cunt in said section, they'd get b& just as they would in the rest of the forum. It's worth noting as well that much as we try to keep Compilation activity going, at some point there won't be any new material and we'll need something to tide us over. This is already actually happening to a certain extent; it's worth pointing out that General Discussion already contains something like 40% of posts, which I think last week was less. This may just be due to a surge in FF activity the week ACC was released, but idk.

Another factor that most don't usually consider is that in a community setting, people aren't always going to talk about something within a specific topic. IRL or otherwise. Conversations branch off and twist around, etc. That's actually a big part of how people get to know each other. Without some sort of community outlet, there quite simply won't be much of a community.

The chit-chat thread is a decent idea, but in this idiom it is comparable to being in a small room with over a hundred people, all trying to have a conversation at once. At 20+ pages a day (usually much more) it's white noise unless you sit there and hammer F5.

EDIT: Fuck, that was in response to Aaron's post waaaaay up on the page, talk about a 30-crosspost pileup.

Yeah, one big problem with the chit chat thread is that it's difficult to keep conversations about multiple topics going at the same time, so if one person wants to post lolcat pictures and another person wants to talk about tits then they're working at cross-purposes. It also means it's harder for people to find posts they really want to read since the thread isn't really sorted by subject.

and

The thread becomes impossible to follow for anyone who doesn't want to devote upwards of an hour a day to keeping up with it, no one responds to anything that isn't the current topic of discussion so it's hard to keep a conversation going for particularly long, you can't find the stuff that interests you quickly because it's all stuck together in one long thread, the list goes on.

 

[Atticus]

Someone please tell me why the General Conversation area isn't good enough?

General chat always has to be about something so people squirm for ideas and come out with lame stuff and then every post has to support it so hence you have an entire thread that no one really wanted to post but it got posted anyway. Then this continues and pretty soon there's an entire section of threads that shouldn't have really been created.

spam on the other hand, if there's a topic that really needs to be discussed, like politics, then it can. And then people can have the freedom to post that they don't care about the issue and bring up another discussion topic.

I think people are afraid we'll convince everyone else that off-topic sections are good and raise an outbreak against the staff... I think that's why they immediately want to close these threads... that does work... especially in China. I don't think that's what we're aiming for though...

 

[CK]

Because threads get closed too often in there for people's liking. If people just want to chat shit with friends their threads are closed, and the chit chat thread moves too fast for some people to keep up with.

Pretty much. 10 people posting in a thread at a time = me giving up on it.

Anyway i'm all up for a spam section, always have been. And whoever keeps saying having a spam will take away the ff discussion from the site is stupid. This is a ff forum (omfg WOW) and it always will be, so discussion on FF isn't going to stop. And the only people asking for a spam section rarely (if at all) post in the ff sections. So really I think its a moot point.

 

[Ⓐaron]

I post in the FF forums almost as much as I do in other sections. Having an off-topic section wouldn't make me post in them any less. It might actually make me post in them more as there'd be more keeping me on the forum for longer.

 

[Max Payne]

And the only people asking for a spam section rarely (if at all) post in the ff sections. So really I think its a moot point.

Then where is the incentive in giving that minority what they want?

 

[Makoeyes987]

So I guess Yop, X, and I are stupid. Okay

And not everyone is you, V. Using yourself as anecdotal evidence isn't going to change our opinion which we've held since the beginning.

 

[Ⓐaron]

Then where is the incentive in giving that minority what they want?

less drama for starters.

And not everyone is you, V. Using yourself as anecdotal evidence isn't going to change our opinion which we've held since the beginning.

No, but it does punch a nice hole in your hypothesis that everyone will post less in FF sections if you add an off-topic section - which, since it hasn't been tested yet, is only that, a hypothesis.

 

[Max Payne]

Yeah, since people whine and complain we should give them what they want. That works all the time.

 

[Megatron]

Eh, guys, your arguments are really wasted. All Mako's posts in this thread add up to, quite simply, "LALALA, I'm not listening, Me and Yop have big Admin clicky button, we don't have to answer your questions, we don't have to give you reasons, we have clicky button, we close threads."

 

[Ⓐaron]

Yeah, since people whine and complain we should give them what they want. That works all the time.

More that since people have brought up well-reasoned arguments that no one on staff seems to be able to rebut with anything other than hypotheticals we should give them what they want.

 

[CK]

Then where is the incentive in giving that minority what they want?

Of course if the minority don't want it then i'd be fine with it. But the only people I see disagreeing with it are mainly staff members (mind you i've haven't been keeping tack on this shitfest as I was away so I could be wrong)

So I guess Yop, X, and I are stupid. Okay

Maybe I am. Do I get a warning for it?

 

[Max Payne]

There is no benefit to having a spam section other than giving a small minority what they want, when no one else on the board has argued in favor of it?

We're not going to adopt a whole new section on the board to accommodate a few people.

 

[Ⓐaron]

There have been at least ten people arguing in favour of it in this thread, not to mention the several others who have expressed support for the idea in other threads. That's not just "a few people," and if we gave the entire member base an honest proposal for how the section would actually be run I'd suspect you'd actually see quite a fair amount of support for it.

 

[Makoeyes987]

The fact we have a Chit Chat thread, are implimenting teams, have a General discussion section, and plenty of clubs and also Member groups pretty much shoots the need for a spam section in relation to bringing user together dude. We've got enough community and bonding. That point is moot.

And if the Chit Chat thread is going too fast for you. Take your conversation with them to PM. Seriously. We aren't a chat and meeting service here.

 

[Alex]

Of course if the minority don't want it then i'd be fine with it. But the only people I see disagreeing with it are mainly staff members (mind you i've haven't been keeping tack on this shitfest as I was away so I could be wrong)

I'd say that the majority of staff are the ones who disagree most strongly with it, but tbf a fair few members are wary of it too because they've all bandwagoned into the spam = dramarama van.

Just helping you keep track of it there.

 

[Max Payne]

10 out of 500+ is a bloody few.

 

[Atticus]

It's not just a few people dude, there have been at least ten people arguing in favour of it in this thread.

There have also been a number of threads started asking for spam sections since the beginning of this forum. Suteki just started one the other day.

 

[Ⓐaron]

10 out of 500+ is a bloody few.

When only around 50 of those 500+ even post on a regular basis? I wouldn't say that.

 

[Vixenish]

Staff- How lax are things going to be in GC? If you don't have a spam forum then are we allowed to open threads that would have been shunted to the spam forum at ACF? For instance...Can I open a thread of lolcat pictures in GC?

Also the 'no because we said so'/'no because we've discussed it before' attitude is grating. I'm not saying it's been unjustified every time you've said it, but you have to get used to new members not knowing what's happened before. Yeah it sucks to have to give the reason over and over and over...but that's part of staffing a decent sized forum/dealing with the public in any position that requires you to. I've gone thirty pages with username. Effing username. Quadruple that and you'll have the number of rounds I've gone with L/IP and Dee. I know what it's like, I see where you're coming from, but handling it this way actually led to way more drama on ACF than the actual spam forum issues ever did.

By doing this you may be overlooking a vision that isn't actually anything like what you're picturing. You aren't actually asking about what's being proposed, you're just stating that something that sounded similiar was denied. So, automatically this should be too...that's kinda bull. Explain why you chose the compromise you did and what exactly was 'given up' by staff...how were the rules revised? Maybe the changes you made would cover the member request...but since it hasn't been mentioned we wouldn't know.

EDIT- crap...you guys posted two pages while I was typing that...I'll be editing...

 

[A]

What's the deal with having a spam thread? It's not a big loss if there isn't. If the staff doesn't want one, then we don't need one.

 

[Makoeyes987]

I guess my posts refuting the needs for spam got ignored now?

 

[Arianna]

Because threads get closed too often in there for people's liking. If people just want to chat shit with friends their threads are closed, and the chit chat thread moves too fast for some people to keep up with.

Okay, I can understand about the Chit Chat thread now...

Thing is, every forum is going to be by the rules of he or she or they who created it - this one is going to be no different...

All I can say is that some of what I saw on ACF should never have been tolerated - signature banners and icons saying things along the lines of 'if you're going to cut yourself, make sure you hit a vein' or some stupid, cruel, idiot thing of that nature.

Now, you guys can gaurantee no one is going to be passing that same stuff along? You can gaurantee that hate threads and gossip threads are going to be non-existant?

Like off line life/the real world, no one can gaurantee that. We all have to try and get along; there are rules to help that process. The admins are the bosses, and they have to enforce the rules the forum is to abide by.

V, I read your description, and I agree - it sounds nice how you put it, but - I just think it will deteriorate and fast. Personally, I'm starting to think it should all just be in PM.

Whatever, it's my opinion, again put forth.