Tifabelle
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Tifabelle, Nathan Drake, Locke Cole, Kain Highwind, Yamcha, Arya Stark
That's always how I reconciled it as well. And it makes sense when you think about it. Resting at an inn shouldn't bring you back to life
Spoony versus FFX
- Thread starter Lord Noctis
- Start date
That's always how I reconciled it as well. And it makes sense when you think about it. Resting at an inn shouldn't bring you back to life
Celes Chere
Banned
- AKA
- Noctis
In that case, why a giant monster crushing your character to bits does not kill you, but a sword does, is beyond me.
Obsidian Fire
Ahk Morn!
- AKA
- The Engineer
I never thought the holding-your-breath-for-long-periods-of-time was weird. Mostly it was because none of the FFX characters thought it was unusual.
It was also because compared to other things I read, like Naruto and Bleach, it's not that weird. Square's going to have to introduce far crazier things, like breathing fireballs, or walking on thin air before I think their going to far.
It was also because compared to other things I read, like Naruto and Bleach, it's not that weird. Square's going to have to introduce far crazier things, like breathing fireballs, or walking on thin air before I think their going to far.
Alexia Ashford
SOMEONE IN THE CORRIDOR?
- AKA
- Konneh
I dunno. I guess it's just my personal preference that they at least mention it or something.
It's just mildly annoying to me. Well annoying enough to bring up but it's not like that's all I think about while playing the game.
It's just mildly annoying to me. Well annoying enough to bring up but it's not like that's all I think about while playing the game.
Alex
alex is dead
- AKA
- Alex, Ashes, Pennywise, Bill Weasley, Jack's Smirking Revenge, Sterling Archer
Overall, this was pretty funny. But nowhere near as good as his Highlander reviews, the criticisms about him not being as familiar with the story do really dilute the humour.
This paragraph of stuff from the previous page did catch my eye.
I'm not saying this out of some particular need to defend the guy or anything, but I can easily understand why he chose this review style.
On the characters holding their breath underwater for ages. I didn't mind that. My suspension of disbelief could handle that. What it couldn't handle was the fact that only 3 specific characters could do it. That was pretty bizarre.
This paragraph of stuff from the previous page did catch my eye.
Only if other people are allowed to fault you for having a crap sense of humour. See what I did there? Pretty sure humour is subjective, dudeForcestealer said:
There's a difference between just spewing nonsense for the sake of being funny and deliberately exaggerating your opinions for the sake of humour. Making greater exaggerations will probably make the material more appealing to watch for people who haven't played the game. We're a Final Fantasy forum, we expect more detailed criticisms and in-jokes because its what we find funny. Who's to say what the majority of Spoony's fans enjoy, so he painted the review in the broadest strokes possible.
I'm not saying this out of some particular need to defend the guy or anything, but I can easily understand why he chose this review style.
On the characters holding their breath underwater for ages. I didn't mind that. My suspension of disbelief could handle that. What it couldn't handle was the fact that only 3 specific characters could do it. That was pretty bizarre.
Alexia Ashford
SOMEONE IN THE CORRIDOR?
- AKA
- Konneh
Well that's what I mean. I mentioned before that only a few characters could do it, so why wouldn't they mention it or make everyone capable?
ForceStealer
Double Growth
Only if other people are allowed to fault you for having a crap sense of humour. See what I did there? Pretty sure humour is subjective, dude
I don't recall saying it wasn't.
Bex said:
Except its not quite his "style." In fact its almost a caricature of his style. Did you see the episode of the VIII review for April Fools where he tears FF1 apart on the most menial of things? He described that as parodying himself. This review would suggest that's how he's actually decided to conduct his reviews now.
Especially considering
Bex said:
THAT'S exactly what Spoony does! If it weren't I wouldn't have watched the review in the first place. That's why the FFVIII, Highlander, and most of his other reviews are so funny. That whole Pumpkinhead thing, he couldn't understand the game and so he went out and obtained every single piece of Pumpkinhead media he could find so that he could be as intimately familar with the source as possible. That's precisely his style. And its totally what he broke from here.
Even of the people who like the X review, of which there are plenty, I have not seen a single one say it was better than his VIII review.
Bex said:
If something had to be done deep underwater, be it fetching something that fell in or whatever, who would you trust the task too? Professional swimmers/people who spend their lives in the water/at least specially trained or random person - even if a strong person.
Any time a fight had to be carried out underwater, the guardians trusted the three most suited to that environment to do it. Why Rikku would be trained I don't know, but who knows what the Al Bhed do.
Maybe that's just a cop-out but I think it makes pretty decent sense, and I don't see why it required explanation when it was established so early.. Like I said, Yuna plays Blitzball in X-2, and also everyone survived the trip through the ocean that Sin took them on from Macalania to Bikanel, so obviously other people CAN hold their breath for extended periods. But people who have trained and built up lung capacity to do so would be far better suited.
ForceStealer
Double Growth
I think you saying that actually helped my point.
Vendel
Banned
On wonders what that point was.
But I think you misunderstand me Force. I like this review over every other one he has done (And I have watched most). Because of the amount of bitching it has caused.
It's like quadruple the entertainment value of his normal reviews.
DrakeClawfang
The Wanderer of Time
Big shock, Vendel's opinion goes against the majority.
I think the problem with the FFX review as a whole is that he just complained as opposed to having fun pointing out the things he could complain about. Like FF8, he complained about Laugna being a spaz and an idiot but he had fun with it (the multiple choice "how to help Ward" question for example). Here, he just seems to complain a lot, a lot of his complaints are old news, he repeats himself a lot, and he goes on and on too much.
Like Seymour, you don't need to think hard about ways to make fun of him, the guy *is* a walking visual gag after all. But say, we don't need a rant about how absurd Blitzball is, we *know*. That's the problem with this review, every complaint Spoony had about the game are complaints we've all heard of before. EVERYONE knows FFX was fucked up, reminding us of that alone doesn't make us laugh, you have to remind us in a humorous fashion. Bitching about Blitzball - not funny. Setting up the Dr. Insano skit with the Anti-Magic Field and having Wakka kill it, that's funny. You have to bring something new to the table besides the jokes we've all heard and made ourselves or else you'll lose your impact.
Also, he glossed over a lot of prime material. Like, the Celestial Weapons, he could have had some fun with them. "So yeah, you go into the forest, run around collecting butterflies and eventually you get the Saturn Sigil to power up the Spirit Lance. I'm not quite sure why the sigil that gives on the strongest weapons on the planet is just lying around in a forest with no particular magical seal or ancient beast guarding it, but this *is* Spira after all, where our trained and mighty warriors fight using stuffed animals and soccerballs, a lance, pft, who the hell uses a lance? Seriously, where do these things come from, the most powerful weapons in the world that can kill Godzilla in one attack, and people just left them lying around? Some of these things aren't even hidden in caves or guarded, they're just out in the open for anyone wandering by to take, in fact the Moon Crest can be found in the middle of the beach right when you begin the game, so it isn't like they're hidden very well. But then most people in Spira have the average life expectancy of a fly so maybe no one has lasted long enough to find all of these things until now"
Also, honestly Spoony, you mercilessly wail on the Blitzball but overlook Lulu petrifying enemies by having a magical stuffed Cactuar run up and slap them? How do you miss that?
I think the problem with the FFX review as a whole is that he just complained as opposed to having fun pointing out the things he could complain about. Like FF8, he complained about Laugna being a spaz and an idiot but he had fun with it (the multiple choice "how to help Ward" question for example). Here, he just seems to complain a lot, a lot of his complaints are old news, he repeats himself a lot, and he goes on and on too much.
Like Seymour, you don't need to think hard about ways to make fun of him, the guy *is* a walking visual gag after all. But say, we don't need a rant about how absurd Blitzball is, we *know*. That's the problem with this review, every complaint Spoony had about the game are complaints we've all heard of before. EVERYONE knows FFX was fucked up, reminding us of that alone doesn't make us laugh, you have to remind us in a humorous fashion. Bitching about Blitzball - not funny. Setting up the Dr. Insano skit with the Anti-Magic Field and having Wakka kill it, that's funny. You have to bring something new to the table besides the jokes we've all heard and made ourselves or else you'll lose your impact.
Also, he glossed over a lot of prime material. Like, the Celestial Weapons, he could have had some fun with them. "So yeah, you go into the forest, run around collecting butterflies and eventually you get the Saturn Sigil to power up the Spirit Lance. I'm not quite sure why the sigil that gives on the strongest weapons on the planet is just lying around in a forest with no particular magical seal or ancient beast guarding it, but this *is* Spira after all, where our trained and mighty warriors fight using stuffed animals and soccerballs, a lance, pft, who the hell uses a lance? Seriously, where do these things come from, the most powerful weapons in the world that can kill Godzilla in one attack, and people just left them lying around? Some of these things aren't even hidden in caves or guarded, they're just out in the open for anyone wandering by to take, in fact the Moon Crest can be found in the middle of the beach right when you begin the game, so it isn't like they're hidden very well. But then most people in Spira have the average life expectancy of a fly so maybe no one has lasted long enough to find all of these things until now"
Also, honestly Spoony, you mercilessly wail on the Blitzball but overlook Lulu petrifying enemies by having a magical stuffed Cactuar run up and slap them? How do you miss that?
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The Twilight Mexican
Ex-SeeD-ingly good
- AKA
- TresDias
They're the ones best trained for it, yes. Wakka and Tidus because they're blitzers, and probably Rikku because she's done salvage work underwater.
Also, don't forget FFX: The Eternal Calm, which shows Yuna training herself to hold her breath underwater. This is why she's able to play Blitzball in X-2.
By the way, it was mentioned in an Ultimania or two that the pyreflies in water also play a role in people not getting exhausted while holding their breath underwater for so long.
Celes Chere
Banned
- AKA
- Noctis
I stand corrected.
DrakeClawfang
The Wanderer of Time
I had to dig to find this quote since something just came to mind.
True, it's an accepted part of Spiran life that they can hold their breath for long periods of time. However, there's something that Spoony points out in another review somewhere (don't remember which one but I know he says it) - Tidus is a bit of an idiot when it comes to Spira, but he's supposed to be, he's ignorant about their belief in Yevon and their lifestyles and having him experience and learn about them first-hand gives the game an excuse to educate the player on things that they won't know but are common knowledge in Spira.
Now, why can't they do that with Blitzball? Make the breathing thing something Tidus doesn't fully get. Wouldn't be hard, just have a thing like in the Zanarkand Tidus comes from they have no such pyreflies explanation. Then you could just throw out a line from Tidus like "How come none of you guys need to go up for air while playing?" and Wakka goes "they infuse the water with pyreflies, lets us hold our breath longer. The audience likes it when it looks like we don't need to breath." Not hard. Two lines of dialogue and poof, explanation given.
True, it's an accepted part of Spiran life that they can hold their breath for long periods of time. However, there's something that Spoony points out in another review somewhere (don't remember which one but I know he says it) - Tidus is a bit of an idiot when it comes to Spira, but he's supposed to be, he's ignorant about their belief in Yevon and their lifestyles and having him experience and learn about them first-hand gives the game an excuse to educate the player on things that they won't know but are common knowledge in Spira.
Now, why can't they do that with Blitzball? Make the breathing thing something Tidus doesn't fully get. Wouldn't be hard, just have a thing like in the Zanarkand Tidus comes from they have no such pyreflies explanation. Then you could just throw out a line from Tidus like "How come none of you guys need to go up for air while playing?" and Wakka goes "they infuse the water with pyreflies, lets us hold our breath longer. The audience likes it when it looks like we don't need to breath." Not hard. Two lines of dialogue and poof, explanation given.
ForceStealer
Double Growth
*shrug* Sure they could. They could explain any number of things that don't need explaining. Like why can Yuna walk on water? Why does the storm never leave the Thunder Plains? Why do Lulu's boobs not fall out of her dress? If something is pretty well established as being the case, then what's the problem? The only problem would be if they pulled it out of nowhere all of a sudden.
Furthermore, if that review was any indication, if that line existed Spoony probably would have ignored it and/or bitched anyway.
Furthermore, if that review was any indication, if that line existed Spoony probably would have ignored it and/or bitched anyway.
DrakeClawfang
The Wanderer of Time
These things don't need an explanation? I for one am quite curious as to how there's an eternal thunderstorm with no rain centered around one single area of the planet.
Except it *isn't* well-established. It's established for Yuna and Wakka and the rest, but not to Tidus and not to the player. We don't understand the Thunder Plains, we don't know how Blitzball players can hold their breath for so long. So why is it unreasonable to expect to be told?
ForceStealer
Double Growth
...How is extended breath-holding not established to Tidus? And if I had to guess, I would say they don't know why there's a thunderstorm over the Thunder Plains. Maybe Yevon has some sort of guilt-trip-laden reason, but for the most part people of the world probably accept it. As a said FFs that explain magic are in the minority, no one ever complains about that. "Well its fantasy so I expect there to be magic." Why? Just because other fantasies do? So if we get enough fantasies in which people can hold their breath for a protracted period of time you'll expect that and it need not be explained anymore?
My point we could play this game for anything in just about every fantasy. What are the summoned creatures in VII? How does VI's slave crown work exactly? Why are people always able to fall such hugely large distances?
And in the case of breath-holding, by established I meant that they showed you right from the get-go that these people are obviously better in water than we are.
My point we could play this game for anything in just about every fantasy. What are the summoned creatures in VII? How does VI's slave crown work exactly? Why are people always able to fall such hugely large distances?
And in the case of breath-holding, by established I meant that they showed you right from the get-go that these people are obviously better in water than we are.
Tifabelle
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Tifabelle, Nathan Drake, Locke Cole, Kain Highwind, Yamcha, Arya Stark
Certain things have to be taken on a leap of faith. Just assume that there is an explanation that is never offered. I mean, do you know how or why every single thing in our world is the way it is?
As for the breath-holding, of course Tidus must know. Also, it seems that they train to do that. Yuna was in that little video between FFX & X-2 (Eternal Calm?). Training to hold your breath longer can be done irl too.
As for the breath-holding, of course Tidus must know. Also, it seems that they train to do that. Yuna was in that little video between FFX & X-2 (Eternal Calm?). Training to hold your breath longer can be done irl too.
DLPB
Banned Flunky
- AKA
- Seifer Almasy, DanielReturns
It is called game element, once again. It was that or make the characters wear masks and oxygen tanks. And of course it is a fiction and they can set a new rule there if they want. Personally, I feel it is a time where you just exercise common sense and suspend disbelief.
Why is this so difficult to understand? Underwater gaming is hardly a story breaker.
FFX was more fantasy orientated, FF7 was more technological and earth like. FF9 was almost completely pure fantasy. Use common sense. The main story is what matters, not little niggles like this.
Why is this so difficult to understand? Underwater gaming is hardly a story breaker.
YES. Interpretation. That's how you should view game stories.
FFX was more fantasy orientated, FF7 was more technological and earth like. FF9 was almost completely pure fantasy. Use common sense. The main story is what matters, not little niggles like this.
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Tetsujin
he/they
- AKA
- Tets
Max Payne
Banned
- AKA
- Leon S. Kennedy,Terry Bogard, The Dark Knight, Dacon, John Marston, Teal'c
Wait, a robotic doll, or people jumping 10 ft in the air and slicing concrete in half breaks suspension of disbelief, but people staying underwater for ridiculous amounts of time for no apparent reason doesn't?
what
what
Tennyo
Higher Further Faster
Pyreflies.
Pyreflies.
Pyreflies.
Pyreflies are the new nanomachines.
But didn't Pyreflies come first?
Tetsujin
he/they
- AKA
- Tets