The Love Triangle Debate: Another Turn in the Cycle

[Octo]

I thought we were cured?! Call Dignitas!

 

[tron]

@TTM:
The thing with WoFF is, that Terra was talking about a woman Cloud loved. I mean come on, man. Secondly Tifa was also in that game and Cloud showed zero interest in her, so yeah. I think it's obvious which paring is FF7 poster child so I don't think it's far fatched to say we will see a lot more of it.

 

[tron]

Later they'll do something Cloti-centrick in another game.

I was just thinking this. There's been a lot of Cloti stuff in FFRK recently so it was really only a matter of time before SE turned up with something for the other team, being the ship teasing jerks that they are

Not sure what you mean. Since when was there CloudxTifa stuff in FFRK?

 

[Tennyo]

It's the five seconds of Cloud talking to Aerith in KH2 before he goes off to have a side story that heavily involved Tifa.

It's just more of the same: SE taking everyone's chain to rule up the fan base to keep us all interested and give them out money.

Later they'll do something Cloti-centrick in another game.

And on and on and on like they have been doing for twenty years.

Bro, they both are listeted under the pairing section. It doesn't get more clear tbh. It seems SE will go full CloudxAeris in dat Remake

Cloud and Tifa were listed in the pairing section of the FF 20th Anniversay Ultimania with a caption saying they confirmed their feelings match under the highwind.

But I guess it only counts if it's Clerith, amirite?

 

[Strangelove]

i can't believe we're back to 'what do these spin-offs say'

or back here at all

 

[tron]

It's the five seconds of Cloud talking to Aerith in KH2 before he goes off to have a side story that heavily involved Tifa.

It's just more of the same: SE taking everyone's chain to rule up the fan base to keep us all interested and give them out money.

Later they'll do something Cloti-centrick in another game.

And on and on and on like they have been doing for twenty years.

Bro, they both are listeted under the pairing section. It doesn't get more clear tbh. It seems SE will go full CloudxAeris in dat Remake

Cloud and Tifa were listed in the pairing section of the FF 20th Anniversay Ultimania with a caption saying they confirmed their feelings match under the highwind.

But I guess it only counts if it's Clerith, amirite?

As was the Aeris date. I think what I'm trying to say is that SE is going with Aeris as the love of Clouds life while Tifa is more like a consolation prize.http://www.dict.cc/englisch-deutsch/prize.html

 

[tron]

i can't believe we're back to 'what do these spin-offs say'

or back here at all

Nah, I just said that Aeris won the KHbowl. Which is to be fair true.

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

@TTM:
The thing with WoFF is, that Terra was talking about a woman Cloud loved. I mean come on, man.

Oh, I feel you. I get what's implied by that wording. I just remember the selective reading that used to get applied to Nojima's description of Tifa in AC as well. He described her as "like any other woman that's been left behind by a man," and it was insisted upon that each of those words be read separately and literally rather than together in the way any reasonable person would understand "a woman who's been left behind by a man."

So maybe "the woman you loved" should be read the same way? She's a woman. And he loved that woman. Just like his mother was a woman he loved.

Now, obviously it shouldn't be read that way  Both sentences should just be read in good faith and good sense.

Secondly Tifa was also in that game and Cloud showed zero interest in her, so yeah. I think it's obvious which paring is FF7 poster child so I don't think it's far fatched to say we will see a lot more of it.

Of course it's not farfetched to expect to see the same things in the remake that were in the original.

]As was the Aeris date. I think what I'm trying to say is that SE is going with Aeris as the love of Clouds life while Tifa is more like a consolation prize.http://www.dict.cc/englisch-deutsch/prize.html

I'm alarmed at how casually you segued into describing people like things. =P

Granted, they're fictional people, but that's kind of fucked up.

i can't believe we're back to 'what do these spin-offs say'

or back here at all

Nah, I just said that Aeris won the KHbowl. Which is to be fair true.

Maybe if getting with Cloud (any version of him) were an award. In a universe where she had Leon and Yuffie to pick from too, sounds more like she lost that one.

 

[Strangelove]

Maybe if getting with Cloud (any version of him) were an award. In a universe where she had Leon and Yuffie to pick from too, sounds more like she lost that one.

srsly girl,

Spoiler: get yourself a real man

(i'm just now noticing his hat has a belt. i always thought the 'zippers and belts' thing thrown at nomura was a bit overdone but there's at least 4 zips on that outfit and there's a belt on his hat)

 

[tron]

@TTM:
The thing with WoFF is, that Terra was talking about a woman Cloud loved. I mean come on, man.

Oh, I feel you. I get what's implied by that wording. I just remember the selective reading that used to get applied to Nojima's description of Tifa in AC as well. He described her as "like any other woman that's been left behind by a man," and it was insisted upon that each of those words be read separately and literally rather than together in the way any reasonable person would understand "a woman who's been left behind by a man."

So maybe "the woman you loved" should be read the same way? She's a woman. And he loved that woman. Just like his mother was a woman he loved.

Now, obviously it shouldn't be read that way Both sentences should just be read in good faith and good sense.

Welp, I'm not arguring that Tifa and Cloud hooked up at the end of FF7, what I'm saying is that she is obviously marked by SE as his second choice.

[/QUOTE]Of course it's not farfetched to expect to see the same things in the remake that were in the original.[/QUOTE]
I couldn't agree with you more ;^)

[/QUOTE]I'm alarmed at how casually you segued into describing people like things. =P

Granted, they're fictional people, but that's kind of fucked up.[/QUOTE]

Aww, don't be like this, bro. They are after all in a sense only objects so I don't really feel bad for it. Of course I would not speak this casually about a real person who would be in the same situation. And for the record I actually do feel bad for Tifa, she got a pretty shitty life.


[/QUOTE]Maybe if getting with Cloud (any version of him) were an award. In a universe where she had Leon and Yuffie to pick from too, sounds more like she lost that one.[/QUOTE]
Take it up to Nojima and Nomura :3
Edit:
damn did I fucked up that quoting

 

[Tennyo]

As was the Aeris date. I think what I'm trying to say is that SE is going with Aeris as the love of Clouds life while Tifa is more like a consolation prize.http://www.dict.cc/englisch-deutsch/prize.html

Aerith date was included with a caption saying none of the dates were canon. That's why it was there. Different meanings.

Also, consolation prize? That's fucked up. Is this how you view women IRL?

 

[The Twilight Mexican]

To fix those quote tags, just knock out the forward slash you've got in each of those first quote boxes. You only need the one in the closing box.

Sorry if I've been a little bit of a dick here, by the way. I'm just kind of annoyed. I've had my name drug through all kinds of dirt for reporting stuff in this fandom that people simply didn't want to be true, and so it's frustrating as hell to see that some of those same people are now losing their goddamn minds in a frenzy of glee that the same kind of stuff is being said about the pairing they want to see it said about.

Take, for instance, Cloud and Terra's exchange there in the WoFF video. You saw the comparison I made earlier between "the woman you loved" and "any woman who's been left behind by a man," but I decided (bad idea) to look into the actual Japanese used in that scene and what's been said about it elsewhere in the fandom.

You can see the scene in Japanese around the 2:30 mark in this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKI6FO0LkTY

Cloud: ………俺の大切な人を 奪ったんだ

Terra: だから見つけ出して 復讐するの？
大切な人を奪われた怒りをぶつけるの？

Cloud: ………

Terra: 誰かを大切に想う心………愛するということるということを憎しみに変え
今の仲間を見捨てるなんておかしいよ

(official English localization)
Cloud: "He took someone away from me. Forever."
Terra: "So when you find him, what are you going to do? Will killing him bring back the woman that you lost?"
Cloud: "......."
Terra: "This isn't any way to honor her memory. To take your love for her and turn it into hate? Especially when it makes you abandon your friends!"

(a quick translation of the Japanese from me)
Cloud: "......He took away someone precious to me."
Terra: "So you're going to find him and take revenge? Will unleashing your hate take back this cherished person?"
Cloud: "......"
Terra: "That great affection you had for this person......you're changing that love into hatred. It's not right to abandon the friends you have now."

So, that official translation is pretty close. What you don't see in the English localization is Cloud's use of 大切な人 ("important person" or "precious person"). This is typically used in a romantic context.

After looking for this scene in Japanese, I noticed (i.e. I checked) that certain people who have had shit to say about me in the past went sunshiney apeshit to see that Cloud would describe Aerith with this wording.

Like this is even news. As though we didn't have statements that he loved her anyway?

But back in the day when I pointed out that this sort of description -- which has been used to describe Tidus and Yuna's relationship with one another -- was also used for Cloud and Tifa's (she was described as 大切な女性, "important" or "precious woman," to him in the 10th Anniversary Ultimania), I got all kinds of excuses about how it shouldn't be read that way, accused of dishonesty, etc.

This is just such a toxic, irrational minefield of nonsense. I hate that it's still even coming up.

Aww, don't be like this, bro. They are after all in a sense only objects so I don't really feel bad for it. Of course I would not speak this casually about a real person who would be in the same situation.

That was unfair of me. Sorry about that.

 

[Carlie]

Foolish Carlie actually believing this thread had finally been killed off for real.

As was the Aeris date. I think what I'm trying to say is that SE is going with Aeris as the love of Clouds life while Tifa is more like a consolation prize.http://www.dict.cc/englisch-deutsch/prize.html

Yes let's treat females as prizes in the who gives a fuck awards affections from some dude. The remake should just have a Korrasami ending, Tifa and Aerith deserve so much better that this crap by parts of the fandom.

 

[lithiumkatana17]

Oh fuck, I'm away for a few days because of the new semester and this shit pops back up again.

Bottom line is, this pairing is never gonna be set in stone. Who people think Cloud ends up with is a matter of perspective and personal opinion.

It's kinda like... religion. You believe one thing, I'll believe another. It's not necessarily wrong, and it's ok to disagree.

The real issue is when douchebags start trying to force it on people because reasons.

 

[Remnant-of-VII]

I think I can officially say this argument/debate has become worse than the Goku vs Superman one.

 

[Edley]

Can't wait until the remake clears everything up.

 

[Tennyo]

I still don't understand why Cloud can't love both girls. I mean

He's going to never date another girl ever again? Tifa or not?

LTD can go die in a fire because sans CPR mini game it is the least important aspect of the game.

Especially when people who never post here only post here to stir the pot.

 

[Octo]

They're never going to properly commit, they haven't done so for 20 years. Why would they do it now? Especially as obsessives are kind of part of their business model. Why cut out 50% (or more or less) of your fanbase?

Not me though. I don't give a shit. As time goes on I think Tifa is best off with a Malboro. Sure they have bad breath, but you get a bloody good seeing to. And they don't fucking mope about.

 

[lithiumkatana17]

Ain't no point in risking alienating half your fanbase by making it official. Because there are people in this world that will stop supporting fandoms because of stupid shit like that.

You want Cloud to end up with somebody else, fuck, go read some fanfics.

 

[Dashell]

It's kinda like... religion. You believe one thing, I'll believe another. It's not necessarily wrong, and it's ok to disagree.

I don't agree to that

I still don't understand why Cloud can't love both girls.

I KNOW! OMG I KNOW! I hate this "Tifa's just a naggy bitch" and "Cloud only loved Aerith cause of Zack!" nonsense. They're both clearly super important to him and it bugs the shit out of me how people can try to say otherwise

Having said that

First off, I (like Tres) always saw Tifa in KH II as not really human but more of a manifestation of Cloud's inner light, and likewise Sephiroth is his inner darkness. They're both basically part of him and I like how they did it honestly.

Second off... I'm STILL not watching it until I get the game in English but if an Axel/Roxas scene is anywhere near this lovers compilation, I'm going to flip my shit

 

[Tetsujin]

They show Roxas/Namine.

 

[Dashell]

They show Roxas/Namine.

for real?... damn


And Sora and Kairi I'm assuming?

EDIT
just watched it


Kingdom Hearts is dead to me now

EDIT II:

okay watch how I spin this

The couples actually start with the Riku/Sora moment and go from there. All fixed

 

[Tennyo]

Riku/Sora fans will be pleased

 

[tron]

@at all the people who got upset about the fact that I pointed out that Tifa is only a consolation prize to Cloud and that Aeris is shown as the love of his life, I hear you guys but I just want to remind you that even thought you act offended, you can't really rebut the fact, that what I'm saying is very true indeed. It's not my fault that Nomura and Nojima chosed to do that, you know :^)

I still don't understand why Cloud can't love both girls. I mean

He's going to never date another girl ever again? Tifa or not?

LTD can go die in a fire because sans CPR mini game it is the least important aspect of the game.

Especially when people who never post here only post here to stir the pot.

For the record, I'm not denying the fact that, Cloud and Tifa hook up together at the end of FF7. There is enough proof of that. What I'm saying is that Tifa plays only second fiddle to Aeris for Clouds affection.

 

[Tennyo]

^This is literally the most pointless post I have ever read.