Things Tifa is not (Common Tifa misconceptions)

Tifabelle

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Tifabelle, Nathan Drake, Locke Cole, Kain Highwind, Yamcha, Arya Stark
I do think that AC/C Cloud is an improvement over AC Cloud too. It does sync better with who is really is. It's amazing how an extra scene or two can really make the difference. And I think the scene with Marlene is pivotal because it really shows us the moment when he realizes his mistake and resolves to do what's best (and perhaps realizing his own importance and worth to his family).

I didn't hate AC Cloud (don't think I ever could :P ). But it definitely felt... off. I had accepted it as his post-FFVII mourning phase, and understood that he stupidly thought he was doing what was best for Tifa and the children. It didn't feel bad, just that something was missing. AC/C expanded it so that his reasoning was multi-faceted, and created a little more depth behind his actions.

Ryu said:
More of a well intentioned idiot than a dick, I think.

This. Just an idiot, not a dick.
 

Lord Noctis

Harbinger of Darkness
AKA
Caius Ballad
Regarding AC Cloud, the complete ersion definetely improved greatly, but I never felt he was out of character. This is Cloud currently faced with a situation he has no control over, a bad one. Back in the OG when faced with a similiar helplessness (Just after TTOTA) he sank int a very similiar funk to what we see in AC. So him reacting in a simliar manner in AC in response to things that were happening seemed to be in keeping with Cloud's character from the OG.
 

Danseru-kun

Pro Adventurer
Okay I know this is a bit old but I decided to share my very WACKY Tifa defense I posted in tumblr. I also wrote one for Aerith which is more WACKY but I don't know where to post it yet.

I looked around this thread and I know Cloud is not an emo but I used the emo word to mock the term itself (I did put a new note in my tumblr post that Cloud is technically not an emo.) I wrote this when the stress of my acads crept into my head and ate my brain cells so pardon me :wacky:

The AC room Scene: Cloud is still hurt by Aerith and Zack’s deaths but Tifa doesn’t care and nags him for his faults.
Cloud is acting all emo when his kids are kidnapped by creepy manchild dudes! Oh my gosh, Tifa is such a jerk! I mean, he’s the man of the family with a motorbike so it’s not his job right? Maybe she can go there herself alone even if she has just recovered from being beaten by a man twice her body mass.

This Promise is not romantic. Tifa only wants Cloud to be her hero only when he’s famous. Tifa also blames Cloud when he’s helping her, she immediately blames him for being late. Aerith doesn’t blame Cloud at all!
Tifa was unconscious after was slashed by Seph in the reactor. She just mumbled “you’re late” and she didn’t know that he was there. Her dad was dead and Cloud was the only person she could think of that can help her.

Also, about the promise, it shows that Tifa believes that Cloud will be someone great. Maybe she should have said, “Oh Cloud, stop dreaming, you will never be famous or great. I’ll go help myself if I’m in trouble and I really don’t need you.” And Tifa should be mature she’s like 13 years old and should not be having those princess-knight fantasies. Grow up Tifa! Tell him the statistics of making it into SOLDIER and the death rate of boys trying to.

*screenshot of Cloud with a worried face in the AC church after finding Tifa injured* Then “You’re late”
Look how hurt Cloud is by her words!
First, saying something so casual is a proof of closeness, you wouldn’t say that to an unknown stranger. And it can also be a tease. Ever watched Captain America TFA? See the moment when Cap arrives at the camp and after Peggy spends a night of worrying if he’s still alive, her greeting to him was “you’re late.” Such an ungrateful bastard right?

It’s totally not because someone important is lying there unconscious and hurt! It’s because Tifa told him he’s late! Tifa is such a horrible person!
Tifa did not pay any attention to Cloud until a love rival, Aerith, appeared. It was only when Cloud did not want Tifa’s affection that she decided she pursue him.
Oh yeah, Tifa ignored Cloud when he’s lying there at the train station. You should totally leave your childhood friend alone even if he has weird mental moments. On a serious note, Tifa persuaded Cloud to stay with Avalanche not because she wants to get into his pants, it’s because there is something seriously wrong with him.

And Tifa didn’t actively clamor for Cloud’s affection, it’s Aerith who did. Tifa was too shy and even compared herself to Aerith at her date scene.
And just look at Tifa when Cloud was a vegetable after falling into the Lifestream. She looked after him tirelessly, never leaving his side. Note that at this time, she was also confused and didn’t know whether she’s the real Cloud or just a Seph clone.
If only Tifa had told Cloud the truth earlier, he wouldn’t have suffered like that. It’s all because she hid the truth.
Okay, you meet your childhood friend after seven years and he’s fully convinced that he’s there at the scene where your hometown was burned. Not only that, his story is from a perspective of another person named Zack. Not only that it’s creepy, it’s also confusing as well.

What if her memories are the ones that are false? Also, said friend have psychotic fits every now and then, murmuring stuff that didn’t make sense. Tifa is not a doctor, she’s a barmaid, a badass barmaid. Say it’s business as usual and nothing happened in the story, Tifa planned to try to tell it to Cloud little by little. There are moments where Tifa tries to say something but can’t because they’re in a middle of a discussion with other people.
Or say, if she’s not a terrible person she could have said: “Oh hey, childhood friend? Remember 5 years ago? Oh right, you don’t remember because you weren’t actually there. I was there and you’re not. About you accurately describing it, I dunno. But you know don’t worry it’s totally okay.”
Classic argument: Tifa’s outfit makes her a slut!
Then Nomura must have been a pimp!

I’m tired of this, but if Tifa is flat-chested she wouldn’t get this hate. Being sexy is such a crime it hurts. And yeah the typical cliche answer: they designed her like that. And despite this, see how the party members respect her. Nobody in her own universe thinks that she’s a slut.
Tifa’s words in the Highwind scene is an invitation for sex. Such a b*!
Ironically, it seems that Cloud shared your logic minus the b word.
&#8220;Words aren&#8217;t the only way to tell what&#8217;s you&#8217;re thinking&#8221;= &#8220;Let&#8217;s have sex!&#8221;<- Cloud logic

Seriously, it takes two to tango and if even if they called the line &#8220;risque&#8221; what&#8217;s seriously so wrong with a woman wanting to make the most of her last night with the man she loves? And also, feelings are mutual according to SE. Cloud made his choice and he&#8217;s over 18!
She&#8217;s useless because she never does anything
This statement is so full of thought it offers a wide range of interpretations so we got to search our minds for the answer.
When her town got burned and her dad killed what did she do? Ran to Seph and tried to kill him. When Shinra was milking the the Planet? She joined an eco-terrorist group to stop them. When Seph was threatening the planet? She joins the wagon.

Gah answering this is really, really hard.

She isn&#8217;t a good/important heroine compared to Aerith
So what? *good and important is subjective*

Just because Tifa isn&#8217;t a Cetra with Cetra powers it doesn&#8217;t mean that she&#8217;s not good or important. And even she never did anything as awesome as summoning a huge glowing shield or surfing the lifestream, why hate her?

Each heroine must be different from one other. Aerith has a role, Tifa has a role. Aerith&#8217;s fate is to be the guardian of the planet, Tifa&#8217;s role to help him find his true self and stay with him &#8216;til the end. If one is missing, what would happen? It doesn&#8217;t matter how big the piece in the puzzle is, if it has nothing to connect to then it&#8217;s just a misshapen cardboard piece. Aerith and Tifa (and ZACK TOO) are connected to Cloud to make up one epic and beautiful story.

- She &#8216;lied&#8217; to Cloud and caused his mental breakdown
Imaginary scene is the Northern Crater:
Cloud: &#8220;Tifaaaaa! YOU LIED TO ME! YOU LIED TO ME!&#8221;
Seph: Cloud you are just a puppet and you&#8217;re not the real Cloud-
Cloud: TIFA YOU LIED! ARGGGGGHHH
Seph: Hey listen to me-
Cloud: TIFA LIED TO MEEEEE

Hmmm

I actually covered this in my earlier post about Tifa but Tifa lying can&#8217;t be so powerful that it caused a psychotic breakdown from Cloud. Tifa hiding the truth was actually a good decision when she&#8217;s actually trying to make sense of what happened herself. Unless Cloud found out that Tifa&#8217;s boobs were just his illusion, then that must have been a legit reason for him to break down.

- She &#8216;didn&#8217;t care&#8217; when Aerith died
Yeah, it&#8217;s her fault for being not being in your party when Aerith died because you didn&#8217;t pick her. She&#8217;s such a terrible comrade because you didn&#8217;t speak to her at the Highwind during the moments when Aerith was remembered.

But if she&#8217;s not a horrible friend and you actually took her to the altar, After Aerith died, she caressed her face and ran away crying. Also, if she bothered to talk to you in the Highwind she will say how Aerith had always said &#8220;tomorrow&#8221; and was looking forward to the future.

Also in AC, she said smiling &#8220;Somehow, I knew you&#8217;re always there, thank you,&#8221; when Aerith sent a healing rain. Must be that she&#8217;s the only one to notice the leak and she was talking to the drop. And the pink ribbon on her arm? Must be for something else not related to Aerith.

- She gets jealous over Aerith and that makes her &#8216;a bitch&#8217;
Aerith gets jealous of Tifa too.
But yeah, it turns out that every girl who gets jealous seeing the guy they love being affectionate to other girls are bitches! Gosh, I guess we have to go on a therapy that will cure our jealously because it&#8217;s not natural and it&#8217;s a disease that makes you a bitch.

Seriously, everyone gets jealous over little things, over stupid things. Being jealous because of love doesn&#8217;t make jealously a bitchmark. And after Tifa gets jealous, crosses her arms and looks away what happens?

Tifa and Aerith are still buddies. Just look at them at Junon and Costa del Sol. Get over with it.

She&#8217;s clingy
Well probably she trained martial arts so she can grab better onto to him and he could never let go. She probably joined Avalanche to learn how to take him as a hostage. Also, she must have re-established the 7th Heaven Bar to get him drunk so she could get into his pants. My gosh Tifa&#8230; I expected better on you.

His lecture on Cloud when he&#8217;s being emotative when the kids were kidnapped? It actually means &#8220;I need you Cloud, forget the kids stay with me.&#8221; Or Tifa calling him because was off somewhere and the kids were worried is all about her just wanting to hear his sexy voice.

- She &#8216;stalks&#8217; Cloud
*Gasp* Cloud watching Tifa from his window is Tifa stalking him!?

Oh. My. I just realized that all party members were stalking Cloud! They go wherever he goes and visit every place he&#8217;s in! They even travel on a buggy, a plane boat and on an airship with him.

And then when Cloud was comatosed, Tifa nursing him= stalking. Tifa calling him in his phone in AC because the kids were getting worried= stalking.

MIND=BLOWN.

- She isn&#8217;t a &#8216;good mother&#8217; to Marlene and Denzel (I think Denzel would set whoever said this on fucking fire lmao)
Gosh but look at the children&#8217;s room. Clean, neat and luxurious. The drawings on the wall? Tifa was there. When the kids were kidnapped, who snapped Cloud from his emotative state to man up and rescue the kids? Who shielded Denzel from Bahamut SIN? Officially, Denzel sees her as his new mom.

I really don&#8217;t know how to answer this properly but right now whoever said this has his skull cracked by Marlene&#8217;s materia throwing skill and Denzel&#8217;s pipe limit break.
 
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Kermitu Kleric Katie

KULT OF KERMITU
This thread is correct. Though Ryu's right, 5 and 6 are pretty much the same thing. I was unaware people thought Tifa was a stalker. I've seen people who think she's a mean bitch, a nag, and/or a bully, but never a stalker. I've read a fanfiction where she was made into a stalker, but it was for comedy and the story was being told to Marlene by Sephiroth so everyone was out of character anyway. I thought it was common knowledge that Cloud is a stalker.
 

Demona

Dominique Destine
AKA
Sizheng
I think it's bitchin'--it shows he's reading through the archives. I had no idea half of these threads existed and the explosion of discussion is pretty rad.

But yeah, the lad has srs potion skillz.
 

Lex

Administrator
I move for his customer user title to be "phoenix downer" fgj.

Pretending to be on topic: Tifa isn't a whore. Or something.
 

ForceStealer

Double Growth
TLS has never had a problem with bumping topics as long as it's a substantive post. I've never understood that rule on other forums anyway. Again, assuming it's a substantive post - or at least not spam -, why does it matter?
 

Danseru-kun

Pro Adventurer
I wrote a Tifa defense on Tumblr, just want to share it here:

Defense of Tifa Lockhart (Final Fantasy VII)

Defense of Tifa Lockhart (Final Fantasy VII) as a response to this.
(May contain spoilers)
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Tifa Lockhart’s fanbase is probably one of the largest in any Final Fantasy title but has also one of the most rabid hatedoms. Though it’s true that Tifa is definitely not a perfect character, a lot of baseless and highly subjective accusations had been used against her and her fans.
Though not always the case, the hatred for Tifa generally stems from the fact that she is Aerith Gainsborough’s rival for the hero’s (Cloud Strife) affection in probably of the most passionately debated and controversial love triangle in the history of gaming. Tifa surviving and being the mother of Cloud’s family earned the ire of people who felt that if Aerith wasn’t murdered, she would have been in Tifa’s place instead.

Also, Tifa is so popular she has a lot of rabid die-hard fans that annoys people. It also didn’t help that her sexy outfit and voluptuous figure easily make people objectify her at first glance or make people think that she was created solely for that purpose at the first place.

In this defense, we will examine the most common and prevalent accusations to her. Our goal is not to make people stop disliking her since she is a flawed character and people have their own tastes and preferences. The aim here is to discuss baseless accusations, misconceptions on her character and the convenient excuses to hate her; hopefully, better understanding and open-mindedness will be promoted in the fandom.

She’s not Aerith Gainsborough
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Remember this very well since this is the backbone of many anti-Tifa sentiments which will be included in this defense. Tifa gets hate just by being compared to Aerith. From her outfit to her personality, there are fans who hate Tifa just because she didn’t possess a quality Aerith has, or just because Aerith is “better” than her in doing it

Aerith is very forward, Tifa is shy and reserved. Aerith seemed cheerful despite the horrible things, Tifa has a lot of anger inside her early in the story because of Shinra. Aerith has time for humor even in scary circumstances while Tifa is almost always serious. Aerith flirted with Cloud while Tifa didn’t (or is making a poor job out of it.)

Aside from personality we need to note that Aerith and Tifa were from different backgrounds. Aerith lost her parents at a young age but found a new family, she was also struggling to survive in the slums for years but it became her new home. However, Tifa lost her hometown and family all at once so joined AVALANCHE to avenge everything. In terms of love, Aerith had her heart broken before when Zack never returned while Tifa didn’t experience anything like that. Tifa is also 2 years younger than Aerith. Comparison of them without considering these goes to nowhere.
In short, Tifa and Aerith are meant to contrast each other in specific ways rather than best each other. They both have roles fitting their abilities and personalities. You make like the other better but that’s not a reason to hate the other. Loving one does not mean you have to hate the other. Many fans, including the writer of this defense, love both women.

She is nothing but fanservice/Her choice of outfit makes her whorish

The simple answer for this is that unlike humans, fictional characters are born with their clothes on. In Tifa’s case, her outward appearance is defined by her large chest and outfit. It’s something Tifa didn’t choose to have but her appearance is like an irremovable body part.

It wasn’t her choice to wear what she likes, she was born with it when they drew her. We cannot use the standards that we use in real life in terms of decency and practicality. If we use the standards of the FFVII universe, see that everyone, everyone in the story does not disrespect her because of her outfit.
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But to be fair, even if Tifa has a large chest, her main outfits don’t show her cleavage and unless you hack the models, you never get to see what’s under her skirt.

She wasn’t important in the story

Tifa is very important for Cloud and we all know that Cloud is the protagonist and hero of FFVII. Tifa is the reason why Cloud left Nibelheim to join SOLDIER and she was also the one who requested Cloud to join AVALANCHE.

More importantly, Tifa was the one who held the key to Cloud’s past. When Cloud was broken once he realized he has a false persona, Tifa’s memories of him allowed him to find his true self. After Cloud reconstructs himself he set out to defeat Sephiroth once and for all. If he wasn’t helped by Tifa, he wouldn’t be able to do the job and will stay as a person who doesn’t know himself living in false memories.

Officially, as stated by the creators themselves, Tifa’s role is to be the heroine that will stay with Cloud until the end.

She’s weak and makes bad decisions

She caused the deaths of lots of people

Yes she did, as well as Barret, Cloud and the rest of AVALANCHE and they regretted it. They didn’t know that blowing up the reactor will be disastrous and they didn’t expect Shinra would drop a whole plate to get them. When Tifa was actually doing it to save the Planet and get revenge on Shinra Cloud was doing it becausehe was getting paid!

-Too soft to be a fighter

Simple answer: play the game. If you cannot, try to read the script and wiki /watch playthroughs at least which the writer of this essay did before she played the original game.

Aside from blowing up the reactor Tifa was a very important member of AVALANCHE and that means going against a corporation able to conquer countries (Wutai!) Also she’s willing to go to danger (Don Corneo’s mansion and Shinra HQ) to get a job done or to rescue a friend. She doesn’t complain if you include her into your party and is even excited when picked. When Cloud was missing, Tifa was the leader of the Highwind.
And too soft? Just watch the slap duel between her and Scarlet and judge for yourself.

-Her hiding the truth from Cloud about Nibelheim makes her responsible for his mental breakdown

Okay, you meet your childhood friend after seven years and he’s fully convinced that he’s there at the scene where your hometown was burned. Not only that, his story is from a perspective of another person named Zack. Not only that it’s creepy, it’s also confusing as well.
What if her memories are the ones that are false? Also, said friend have psychotic fits every now and then, murmuring stuff that didn’t make sense. Tifa is not a doctor and she didn’t know what to do. Say it’s business as usual and nothing happened in the story, Tifa planned to try to tell it to Cloud little by little. There are moments where Tifa tries to say something but can’t because they’re in a middle of a discussion with other people.
Even Sephiroth said “don’t blame Tifa,” she’s also confused. But even if the Cloud she was with was possibly not the real Cloud, even if there is a little hope that he’s the real one, she stayed and took care of him. She feels responsible even if it’s not exactly her fault.

Also, if Tifa told the truth to Cloud earlier, who he have believed her? Or if he did believe her, do you think he will react nicely and everything’s fine? We don’t know.

Tifa is selfish, she only cares about her own satisfaction

-She ignored Cloud when they were children then forced him to make a promise to her. Only then did she take notice of him.

Being oblivious of Cloud’s feelings is not the same as ignoring him. Also, Cloud, having poor social skills wasn’t able to get through Tifa’s group. Tifa had no idea about Cloud’s crush on her and probably thought Cloud was just some other troublemaker in Nibelheim. She also didn’t know that Cloud followed her when she went to Mt. Nibel.

About the promise, Tifa agreeing to meet Cloud in the well is already something. Despite her not knowing him as someone great, she agreed. Though it was her who strong-armed him into making a promise to help her if he gets famous, keep in mind that is was Tifa actually believing that a small, awkward boy like Cloud could join SOLDIER. She believed in him and that was more than he asked for; just to be noticed by her.

-She tries so hard to push Cloud to be her ideal “knight in shining armor” and it only causes Cloud suffering

The funny this is that Cloud wants to be one for her, and she believes that he can be one but it didn’t work that way! Cloud never made it to SOLDIER and was mentally weak that he needs emotional support from others.
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But one thing important in this is that Tifa believed in Cloud. Like I said earlier, who would think that a small, unimpressive loner like Cloud can be great? Tifa did. And she was not pushing him, she’s supporting him not only in battle. Cloud was far from the ideal knight in shining armor but it turns out that Tifa loved Cloud as Cloud, someone full or faults and flaws.
Also, even if Tifa wanted to be the damsel she’s actually a hypocrite. Yes. She wanted to be the heroine waiting for rescue but while wishing for it she trained herself martial arts and was a tour guide for Mt. Nibel at the age of 15! If you want to know how dangerous the mountain is, try playing the game and then suffer.

- Can get jealous easily of Aerith

Well to be fair, just the mention of Tifa’s name already made Aerith ask Cloud if she’s his girlfriend! Aerith can get jealous as easily as Tifa, the only difference is that Tifa was too shy to approach Cloud directly that Aerith was scoring points when she couldn’t.

And beside that, every human being gets jealous during competition regarding affections. Siblings can get jealous of one another, friends can get jealous of their friends’ friends! If Tifa should be hated because of this then we might as well hate a lot of people we know.

She’s clingy and obsessed with Cloud

Cloud was the one who had a crush on her ever since, watching her from her window, getting into fights with her boy buddies because he couldn’t approach her directly and also, he care about her life and knew how painful it was for her when he mother died. Cloud even followed her to Mt’ Nibel out of concern.

To be fair, they were children that time but an adult Tifa never displayed anything half as close to that level. She wanted Cloud to stay in AVALANCHE because there was something wrong with him and she wanted to find out. Also note that Tifa continued her mission rather than seacrh for Cloud when he fell from the reactor. Cloud was also the one who went on great lengths just to “rescue” her from Don Corneo.

Also, the creators themselves said that they made Tifa “independent and can function without a man.” Unless you think they’re lying you should take it as it is.

- She suddenly becomes weak and emotional from being a fighter when Cloud was Mako poisoned

Like what was said, Tifa cared a lot about Cloud and knew there was something wrong with him. She planned to fix it before it can damage him but it was too late. Even if it was not exactly her fault, she felt responsible. Also not that before finding Cloud in Mideel, Tifa was the party leader while searching for him, only where she saw his situation did she broke down in sadness.

The Cloud she loved was there barely conscious, unable to recognize anybody, unable to talk and very weak. It was a painful sight for anyone to see someone so strong and proud fall into a pitiful state. Because of this she made the decision to stay with him and nurse him.

Think of this; she’s feeding, cleaning and watching over an adult that does not respond to her. IS that obsession? Being clingy? Note that it was what Zack Fair did for Cloud for 10 months! Is that clingy, obsession and weakness?

As what the nurse said, “she must love him very much.” Hard not to agree.

- Proof: In Case of Tifa, she asked him “Do you love me?”

Case of Tifa works in a premise that things will be different for Cloud because he has Tifa in a different way than before. Though interpretations of their relationship range from familial to romantic, asking the question fits the whole story of two people working out to build a family together. The second question was “We’ll be alright won’t we?” then when Cloud woke up, “Do you love Marlene?” in which Cloud answered his issues. Tifa wasn’t trying to keep the attention to her and her alone, she was working out something between her and Cloud for the family.

- In Advent Children, she kept on calling Cloud even if he doesn’t want to answer

Tifa is also the owner of the house along with Cloud and it’s her right to know why a resident is gone. The children were worried that Cloud moved out without saying a word. And keep in mind that during this time, Denzel, the kid whom Cloud said that Aerith gave him was dying because of Geostigma. Tifa has every right to call him over and over.
Also, instead of aggressively searching for Cloud when he was gone, Tifa let him have his space. When she found out that Cloud was staying in the church her reaction wasn’t about related to being jealous to Aerith or Cloud not paying enough attention to her. She was saying how Cloud was running away and don’t want to fight. Clingy and obsessive? No.

She didn’t understand Cloud and picks on his faults and weaknesses rather than support him

- She blames him for “being late” twice, Aerith never blames Cloud
At the first instance, Tifa got just slashed, her dad got killed and her hometown burned to the group. She was in despair and wanted Cloud to help her but she uttered that line without even knowing that Cloud was there. At the second time, Cloud was indeed late (like the first time!)
And to make this short; why is commenting “you’re late” be considered blaming?

- In Case of Tifa, instead of comforting him because of being depressed because of Aerith, she walked away angry

In the greater context, Case of Tifa has Cloud saying to Tifa that because he has her, he can go on. It was a promising future for the both of them but then it turned out remembering Aerith’s death was still painful to Cloud that he turned to alcohol. Tifa wanted to talk to him so she asked if she could join him in drinking. What Cloud replied was “leave me alone.”
Tifa has the right to be angry because before she could even talk, Cloud shut himself off. They were family and they were starting a life together- a mutual decision, not something Tifa forced on him but he was isolating himself again. Instead of shouting at him, she just actually left him alone and told him to drink in another place- not really something that would embarrass or anger him.

- In AC, she nags him for being depressed

Scroll up and return to the quote I posted and I recommend the full dialogue. Cloud was indeed depressed that time not just because of remembering Aerith and Zack’s demise but because Denzel was dying and he was dying himself! But at that time, powerful men had kidnapped the children yet Cloud doesn’t want to act saying that he’s not fit to help anyone. Tifa hit him right at the spot:
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Stop running!
I know, even if you find the kids you might not be able to help them. Maybe something will happen that can never be unhappen that scares you, doesn’t it?! But you need to think about now, really take it in! Look at you; you think you got it so damn hard!
Well you hate being alone so let people in! Sure, you don’t answer the phone, but I don’t see you throwing it away either
—Tifa Lockhart, Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children
According to the writers, they had intended to make Tifa apologize after for being so blunt but they decided they won’t. It’s as if they really wanted to point out Cloud’s weakness and Tifa trying to man him up. I recommend you to watch the entire scene where Tifa tells Cloud that “we can do this together.”

She tries so hard to take Aerith’s place in Cloud’s life but fails

This works on the belief that Tifa has no place in Cloud’s life when she has.

- Cloud considers Denzel as a child Aerith brought to him, but Tifa says “To our home…” as if trying displace Aerith in his heart

One must consider that at this point, Cloud is really guilty on Aerith’s death and blames himself. He desperately wants forgiveness and then a sick child appeared in front of Aerith’s church. When Cloud picked up Denzel, Tifa actually told Cloud to bring the boy home!

Cloud admitted that he felt Aerith must have brought the child to him. Tifa must have said “to us” because of two reasons; affirming Cloud that they’re family and will take care of the boy together and second, he’s not the only one who feels responsible.

- Can’t get along with the children, not a very good mother

Tifa and Cloud are both young and weren’t exactly prepared to take care of children but are doing their best. Marlene has no problems with Tifa and CoT even says they were sleeping together before the house was completed. It was Denzel whom Tifa had problem socializing with. Cloud was able to bond more with Denzel because the kid sees him as his hero. Also, the fact that Denzel was a boy was something we should take note of. Sometimes it’s just difficult for mothers to relate with young boys, same with fathers and young girls. Still, Tifa wanted to be closer to Denzel by asking advice from other children!

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- Always Cloud’s attention all to her, “A memory or us?”

The faithful translation of this is actually, “Did we lose to our memories?”It’s not about forcing Cloud to choose between her and Aerith, it’s about reminding Cloud that he should not lose to his past. At this point, Sephiroth’s remnants kidnapped the children of Edge, including Marlene and Denzel but instead of having a fighting spirit, Cloud was saying he wasn’t fit to help anyone. Tifa was actually telling him not to depreciate himself because he has a family he should protect.

If Aerith had lived, Cloud would be happier and not be miserable being with Tifa

Short answer: It’s not like Tifa killed Aerith or it’s as if she could have done something to save her right?

Cloud is happy with Tifa and the kids as stated by the writers themselves. The more he is happy, the more he became afraid of losing them so when Denzel got sick and he got sick too he ran away because he was weak. It wasn’t because Tifa’s such a pain that he doesn’t want to be with her, it’s because he didn’t like to be seen helpless.

- Cloud leaves her to be with Aerith

Cloud wanted meet Aerith again I’m sure of it but leaving Tifa is not really needed for the equation. Aerith is already engraved in Cloud’s heart and like I was arguing, Tifa wasn’t clawing her out. Cloud didn’t leave Tifa to be with Aerith, he ran away from Tifa because he was afraid of losing his happiness with her and their family. Even if Cloud did went to the church to remember Aerith, it’s not Tifa’s fault or it’s not because Tifa’s wrong!

- She’s not enough for Cloud

Tifa had nothing to do with some of Cloud’s issues especially regarding Aerith. Cloud and Aerith had their own special world that Tifa was not part of. Blaming Tifa or hating her because of Cloud’s personal problems with Aerith is definitely wrong. Also, it doesn’t make her inferior to Aerith or a bad emotional support for Cloud, it’s just that Tifa’s not a perfect person or a divine being that can make Cloud’s suffering go away.
Cloud has his own struggle that he must face himself, alone. If Cloud wins, it’s his merit not because Aerith or Tifa was there. If Cloud loses he has himself to blame not because Tifa or Aerith wasn’t enough. The two women are needed by Cloud, but they’re not everything to Cloud. Cloud has himself too.

Tifa’s character is essentially defined by her relationship with Cloud, without him, she’s nothing
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This is probably the most reasonable critique on Tifa’s character but still not a reason to hate her. Even if Tifa’s past and present are all connected to Cloud, it wasn’t her that needed him, it was him who needed her. Cloud easily becomes depressed while Tifa has a tougher spirit. And even if her role in the story is to support Cloud, she displayed independence and choice. It’s her choice to join AVALANCHE, it’s her choice to rescue Aerith from Shinra, and it’s her choice to fight Sephiroth. She also has a lot of dimensions that does not really concern her romance with Cloud. Tifa was really guilty blowing up reactors and causing the death of many people. Her sins continued to to haunt her but she wanted to live on. She was struggling as a young mother and thinking a lot about family.

When Cloud displays the illusion of an ideal hero when hiding a complex character underneath, Tifa was the same. Her outfit gave us the illusion of sexy archetype character when she was actually very modest and reserved. Even if she fights with fists, Tifa was actually very motherly and caring. And most importantly, she gave us the illusion of a mere love interest needing a hero when she was the one whom the hero needed. When heroines usually have something to wear like wings, flowery skirts, well done hair and dresses to exemplify beauty, Tifa in a simple manner remains beautiful in the outside and inside as she is.
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Final words, tips to not to hate Tifa:


  1. Tifa should not be hated for the qualities the she possesses to contrast with Aerith.
  2. You should not think that whatever Tifa does wrong or lacks Aerith can automatically do it better than her, especially that Aerith isn’t even present at those times
  3. Do not blame Tifa for Cloud’s suffering and don’t put her into a bad light if she was not able to help him right away. Cloud’s weaknesses and inner demons are his own issues.
  4. Tifa never took or tried to take Aerith’s place in the story and in Cloud’s heart, she was doing the role given to her by the writers from the start. If you think she’s doing a bad job read the whole defense again and try to refute it.
  5. Tifa is human and she has flaws, selfish desires and bad decisions, before you nitpick them make sure to look at the whole picture.
The serious version of the defense here:
Anti-Tifa arguments RIPPED APART Part 1 and Part 2
Essay by Danseru-kun
 

Roger

He/him
AKA
Minato
Okay, you meet your childhood friend after seven years and he’s fully convinced that he’s there at the scene where your hometown was burned. Not only that, his story is from a perspective of another person named Zack. Not only that it’s creepy, it’s also confusing as well.
What if her memories are the ones that are false? Also, said friend have psychotic fits every now and then, murmuring stuff that didn’t make sense. Tifa is not a doctor and she didn’t know what to do. Say it’s business as usual and nothing happened in the story, Tifa planned to try to tell it to Cloud little by little. There are moments where Tifa tries to say something but can’t because they’re in a middle of a discussion with other people.
Even Sephiroth said “don’t blame Tifa,” she’s also confused. But even if the Cloud she was with was possibly not the real Cloud, even if there is a little hope that he’s the real one, she stayed and took care of him. She feels responsible even if it’s not exactly her fault.

Also, if Tifa told the truth to Cloud earlier, who he have believed her? Or if he did believe her, do you think he will react nicely and everything’s fine? We don’t know.

She wanted Cloud to stay in AVALANCHE because there was something wrong with him and she wanted to find out.

Like what was said, Tifa cared a lot about Cloud and knew there was something wrong with him. She planned to fix it before it can damage him but it was too late.

Which one is it? Did she keep him close cause she was gonna fix what she knew was wrong with him or did she not tell him cause she wasn't sure he was the one with the problem.

I mean, I'm partial to the latter personally. Their encounters with Pres. Shinra, Hojo and Sephiroth all corrobarate what Cloud had to say about the parts Tifa wasn't even around for, and she can't account for what happened to her wound or how she ended up on the other side of the world. She asked Cloud how had bad her wounds were when he was telling his story.

Cloud was the one who had a crush on her ever since, watching her from her window, getting into fights with her boy buddies because he couldn’t approach her directly and also, he care about her life and knew how painful it was for her when he mother died. Cloud even followed her to Mt’ Nibel out of concern.

I was under the impression that the fighting started after her friends started covering up what really happened on Mt. Nibel between them, her and Cloud. I mean, he didn't have the social skills to reach out to them before but I didn't get he impression that it was making him violent.

Even if Tifa’s past and present are all connected to Cloud, it wasn’t her that needed him, it was him who needed her.Cloud easily becomes depressed while Tifa has a tougher spirit.

I gotta disagree there. It was Cloud who saved Tifa from what was basically a suicide attempt when she was 7. And while AVALANCHE didn't anticipate the plate being dropped, the game makes clear that the reactor explosions DID result in numerous civilian causalties, even if they did in their sleep. Tifa does regret her role in them but would probably still be there, an adult getting sucked into Barret's wrong path in life if Cloud and Aerith didn't take the reigns what AVALANCHE's mission was concerned.

And while Cloud has a problem, that doesn't stop her and AVALANCHE from relying on his judgement to lead them. Even after he beats Aerith to a bloody pulp he's in charge, even after he basically gets Aerith killed he is in charge.

And while, when Cloud seemingly died at the Crater she does initially carry on her dialogue was as follows.

Red XIII: Do you think we aren't strong enough without Cloud? Do you think we can't save the Planet alone?

Tifa: Meteor is coming, and Weapon is on the rampage...... At a time like this, I don't know what I'm supposed to do...... No idea at all...

Barret: Get a hold of yourself Tifa! C'mon, let's think about this! No way we can get offa this train we're on!

Tifa: (worried) ......If only Cloud was here, everything would be fine. Cloud would...... Stand that cocky little way he did, and tell us what to do. He'd say, 'Everything's under control, Tifa'.

Barret: Tifa! When'd you become such a wimp! Tifa: I'm sorry Barret. I'm kind of shocked myself. I'm so depressed.

Red XIII: And Tifa...... the reason why we all thought it was Cloud was because......

Tifa: ......I know. That's why I want to make sure. That's why I have to see him again. Tifa talks to Cid.

Cid: I want you to know that I didn't dislike him. Gotta admit he was a strange dude. Just when you thought he was smart, he'd show how stupid he was. Everything about him from his movements is his speech were kinda odd. Knowin' what I do now, I can see why he was that way. Well, as long as you stay alive, you just might see him again someday, so cheer up, sis.

Tifa: ......I'll be able to see him someday.

Cid: If we can find out where he is, the Highwind'll get us there in no time.

Red XIII: ......Maybe. Cloud is still ground cracked and swallowed him up...... Buried in the depths of the underground......

Tifa: Deep within the earth...... are you talking about the Lifestream?

Red XIII: The Lifestream sometimes gushes out to the surface from cracks in the ocean floor. I heard that such a place exists. Maybe, just maybe Cloud's......

Pilot in training: Waaaah! Captain Cid!

Cid: Tifa, sorry, but I've gotta show this moron how to land the ship. Don't worry, it'll be done in a minute. Oh, and Tifa...... No matter what your goal is, you've got to be prepared. Go to your room and get ready for our operation.

Tifa choose Cid and Barret to be in her group. After that, the Highwind travels to Mideel. In Mideel, Tifa saw a dog.

Tifa: What's the matter? Are you all alone? You got lost didn't you? Separated from someone you love......? Silly thing...

She wasn't coping well without Cloud. And needed t believe she'd meet Cloud again to keep moving forward.
 

Danseru-kun

Pro Adventurer
Which one is it? Did she keep him close cause she was gonna fix what she knew was wrong with him or did she not tell him cause she wasn't sure he was the one with the problem.

It can be both :)

I was under the impression that the fighting started after her friends started covering up what really happened on Mt. Nibel between them, her and Cloud. I mean, he didn't have the social skills to reach out to them before but I didn't get he impression that it was making him violent.
Well I didn't say Cloud was violent, a boy getting into a few fights is not really violent to me.

I gotta disagree there. It was Cloud who saved Tifa from what was basically a suicide attempt when she was 7.
To me it wasn't really a planned suicide, it was a kid thinking that she can see her mom at the other side of the mountain. To me it's just Tifa not being able to realize how dangerous Mt. Nibel is. Also it didn't appear to me that Cloud was able to help her at all, they just fell together. That's why Cloud felt really guilty and desperate to make up for it.

And while AVALANCHE didn't anticipate the plate being dropped, the game makes clear that the reactor explosions DID result in numerous civilian causalties, even if they did in their sleep.
I know that but it just seems that I wasn't able to point that out clearly in my essay. ^^

Tifa does regret her role in them but would probably still be there, an adult getting sucked into Barret's wrong path in life if Cloud and Aerith didn't take the reigns what AVALANCHE's mission was concerned.
Her reaction after the plate dropped looked like the end of her career for me. But she sees Seph's sword in the Shinra HQ herself and I doubt that she won't join the quest to defeat Sephiroth especially that she was more an avenger than environmentalist actually.

And while Cloud has a problem, that doesn't stop her and AVALANCHE from relying on his judgement to lead them. Even after he beats Aerith to a bloody pulp he's in charge, even after he basically gets Aerith killed he is in charge.
But he just snapped at the crater and handed the materia to Seph even asking Hojo to give him a number. Turns out (to me) if Cloud sinks, he sinks lower that Tifa. Also considering Case of Tifa and ACC, even if both he and Tifa self-depreciate themselves it looks to me that Cloud has the tendency to shut himself off from others at his lowest. Despite all the guilt, Tifa was really determined for the kids' sake while Cloud seemingly gave up when he cannot find a way to cure Geostigma.

And while, when Cloud seemingly died at the Crater she does initially carry on her dialogue was as follows.... She wasn't coping well without Cloud. And needed t believe she'd meet Cloud again to keep moving forward.
Yeah she was really broken that time but it's not really "not coping well" to me. Even if she's in despair, she still does something even if her reason is out of love. Also, Cloud appeared to be "dead" since the crater has a huge explosion so I think it's natural for her to react like that.
 
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Vendel

Banned
Yes she did, as well as Barret, Cloud and the rest of AVALANCHE and they regretted it. They didn&#8217;t know that blowing up the reactor will be disastrous and they didn&#8217;t expect Shinra would drop a whole plate to get them. When Tifa was actually doing it to save the Planet and get revenge on Shinra Cloud was doing it becausehe was getting paid!

Actually the only reason Cloud was around was because of Tifa.






I gotta disagree there. It was Cloud who saved Tifa from what was basically a suicide attempt when she was 7.

What?

And while AVALANCHE didn't anticipate the plate being dropped, the game makes clear that the reactor explosions DID result in numerous civilian causalties, even if they did in their sleep. Tifa does regret her role in them but would probably still be there, an adult getting sucked into Barret's wrong path in life if Cloud and Aerith didn't take the reigns what AVALANCHE's mission was concerned.

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here? That Tifa is dependent on Cloud to make her life decisions?


And while Cloud has a problem, that doesn't stop her and AVALANCHE from relying on his judgement to lead them. Even after he beats Aerith to a bloody pulp he's in charge, even after he basically gets Aerith killed he is in charge.

Yes and Tifa wears the pants in their relationship. Everyone has their strengths. Cloud is good at fighting Sephy. Tifa is good at everything else.

She wasn't coping well without Cloud.

I think she copes perfectly well for seeing the man she loves have a total mental collapse and then seemingly die in front of her.


And needed t believe she'd meet Cloud again to keep moving forward.


Yes and Cloud can succeed at life because he has Tifa.

Also let's keep in mind that without Tifa Cloud barely functions as a person. While Tifa can run a business and raise two children by herself.
 

Roger

He/him
AKA
Minato
But he just snapped at the crater and handed the materia to Seph even asking Hojo to give him a number. Turns out (to me) if Cloud sinks, he sinks lower that Tifa. Also considering Case of Tifa and ACC, even if both he and Tifa self-depreciate themselves it looks to me that Cloud has the tendency to shut himself off from others at his lowest.

When he's suffering from GeoStigma (symptoms of which are depression and complete inevitable death), or Mako Addiction or got his mind shattered into dozen pieces, sure.

When they are both of sound mind, I feel Tifa and Cloud are not complete one-sided dependency relationship. I do think Tifa's a little stronger, but I also think Tifa expects more of Cloud then vice versa.
 

Danseru-kun

Pro Adventurer
^

Well the reason Cloud's mako poisoning is so severe at the first place is because he's mentally weak. Also I never said that the dependency is one-sided, but to appears to me that Tifa can function without Cloud while Cloud needs someone like her to function (in ACC and Case of Tifa.) Fair enough, Cloud's been through worse things than Tifa, but that's also another reason why he needs her.
 

Roger

He/him
AKA
Minato

She was going up the ridiculously dangerous jagged mountain to meet her dead mother. Whether she expected to come back is open to the dabate.

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here? That Tifa is dependent on Cloud to make her life decisions?
I'm saying she needed the intervention from her avenger lifestyle up till then.


Yes and Tifa wears the pants in their relationship. Everyone has their strengths. Cloud is good at fighting Sephy. Tifa is good at everything else.
I disagree. Read Case of Tifa. Tifa was in a rut in the (chronological) beginning, she needed Cloud, Barret and Marlene's support.

I think she copes perfectly well for seeing the man she loves have a total mental collapse and then seemingly die in front of her.

Yes and Cloud can succeed at life because he has Tifa.
Yes, believing she'll find the guy she just saw die being the reason she can move forward is coping perfectly well? I disagree.

Also let's keep in mind that without Tifa Cloud barely functions as a person. While Tifa can run a business and raise two children by herself.
Cloud held a job in the military without needing his mother or Tifa before FFVII. He could function. He didn't make SOLDIER, but that's not quite barely functioning as a person. And there really wasn't that long a while between Cloud's leaving and AC. And Denzel was pointed out to be carrying his own weight around the bar (and freeing up all her time by making all the customers go away). And Cloud was still making deliveries from what I understand. Which was kind of a cornerstone of the other business that was bringing the money in.
 

Roger

He/him
AKA
Minato
^

Well the reason Cloud's mako poisoning is so severe at the first place is because he's mentally weak.

He's not part of the ~1% that's right for SOLDIER, but still got put in a Mako shower for 4 years and tossed into the Lifestream. And Zack was immobilised for a long while by the Mako treatment until long after the guards all left too you know.
 

Danseru-kun

Pro Adventurer
^

Zack was injured by Sephiroth and there was nothing in the games that says Mako treatment immobilized him as far as I remember. When Zack escaped the Shinra mansion there are still a lot of guards in Nibelheim.

Also, I remember something that Cloud was physically adept for SOLDIER but he's weak minded for Mako treatment so he wasn't accepted. I just can't find the source.
 

Vendel

Banned
She was going up the ridiculously dangerous jagged mountain to meet her dead mother. Whether she expected to come back is open to the dabate.

I'm sorry but "Tifa wanted to get herself killed" is asinine. Why didn't she just jump off the mountain if that was her plan?

Also to reiterate a point from Danseru. Cloud did nothing but follow her. He didn't save her.


I'm saying she needed the intervention from her avenger lifestyle up till then.

And what exactly was her and Cloud going after Sephiroth? That was entirely personal. Aerith being there and saving the planet was secondary to Cloud. He wanted to find Sephiroth.

I disagree. Read Case of Tifa. Tifa was in a rut in the (chronological) beginning, she needed Cloud, Barret and Marlene's support.

Yes and when Tifa gets into a rut she gets out of it quickly and gets on with her life. When Cloud gets into a rut he barely functions.

Yes, believing she'll find the guy she just saw die being the reason she can move forward is coping perfectly well? I disagree.

Going on despite having seemingly lost everything is coping very well thankyouverymuch.

Cloud held a job in the military without needing his mother or Tifa before FFVII. He could function. He didn't make SOLDIER, but that's not quite barely functioning as a person.

Cloud was a grunt with confidence issues who has to be reassured by Zack. Someone who can't even show his face to the girl he loves because he is so ashamed of himself.

These issues are what leads to his mako poisoning. If he were a stronger person mentally he would have made it through fine. Instead he had his mind shattered.

And there really wasn't that long a while between Cloud's leaving and AC. And Denzel was pointed out to be carrying his own weight around the bar (and freeing up all her time by making all the customers go away). And Cloud was still making deliveries from what I understand. Which was kind of a cornerstone of the other business that was bringing the money in.


I'm not sure how you managed to build this totally backwards view of how the Cloud and Tifa dynamic works. The scenario you have built up is that Tifa can't seem to function without Cloud (or someone else) telling her what to do and having Denzel around before AC to take the burden off of her. Etc etc.

How does that jive with this?

Tifa's profile 10th Anv ult. said:
Apart from being Cloud&#8217;s childhood friend, she is also the woman who understands him all too well and devotedly supports the mentally-weak side of him.
.........
She was reunited with Cloud during one of AVALANCHE&#8217;s activities, and invited him to join the organization in order to watch over him after finding many strange aspects in his speech and behavior. During the time they were participating in the anti-ShinRa activities together, they ended up fighting with Sephiroth for the sake of AVALANCHE&#8217;s aims, which was to &#12300;Save the Planet&#12301;, as well as for her and Cloud to settle their past. Although she was unable to stop his ego from crumbling and becoming Sephiroth&#8217;s puppet, she persevered in helping him stand up once again after that incident.
........
Believes in the strength not to yield to &#8220;Memories&#8221;,
Continues to support Cloud, who has closed his heart to others.
........
Even though being burdened with painful &#8220;memories&#8221; is the same for everyone &#65293; Unable to do much for Cloud who is always dragging around his regrets for the past, she subconsciously raises her voice.

If I wanted I could dig around in the "Case of" stories and other sources to give you in universe examples of what the characters think of Tifa.

She is the rock of the 7th Heaven family. The owner/operator of her second bar/restaurant. And she manages to be an Eco-terrorist and planet saver on occasion.
 
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Kermitu Kleric Katie

KULT OF KERMITU
Actually the only reason Cloud was around was because of Tifa.




Actually, no. The reason he was around, at least at first, was because he thought he was getting paid. He was in his cold mercenary persona at that point. After he dropped that persona, I'd say he probably was around because of Tifa, but I'd say that's the main reason not the only reason. She was what he was fighting for, after all.




They were referring to Tifa climbing Mt. Nibel to visit her mom. Though they got 3 things wrong with this: 1. Cloud followed Tifa, not sved her. 2. Tifa wasn't attempting suicide. She'd heard she could see her mom if she climbed hgih enough up mount Nibel or something like that. 3. It happened when she was 8, not 7.

I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here? That Tifa is dependent on Cloud to make her life decisions?

She clearly isn't. She spent like half of her life barely even knowing Cloud existed, 2 years of her life with Cloud away working for Shinra, and when he finally returned she didn't even know it was him, and the she spent 5 more years of her life with Cloud in a coma and her not even knowing where he was or what he was doing. It's clear she doesn't need Cloud to make her decisions, considering she spent the majority of her life without Cloud being around or at least being consciously aware he was around.


Yes and Tifa wears the pants in their relationship. Everyone has their strengths. Cloud is good at fighting Sephy. Tifa is good at everything else.

You're really overestimating Tifa here. Cloud is stronger than Tifa. Cloud knows how to ride a motorcycle, while we've never been given any indication Tifa does. Cloud is better at casting magic than Tifa. Cloud seems to be a better leader than Tifa.

I think she copes perfectly well for seeing the man she loves have a total mental collapse and then seemingly die in front of her.





Yes and Cloud can succeed at life because he has Tifa.

Also let's keep in mind that without Tifa Cloud barely functions as a person. While Tifa can run a business and raise two children by herself.

Now hold on there, Cloud seemed to be functioning perfectly fine during his years as a Shinra soldier, years spent without Tifa being around. Maybe it was cause he had Zack? :monster:
 

Kermitu Kleric Katie

KULT OF KERMITU
When he's suffering from GeoStigma (symptoms of which are depression and complete inevitable death), or Mako Addiction or got his mind shattered into dozen pieces, sure.

When they are both of sound mind, I feel Tifa and Cloud are not complete one-sided dependency relationship. I do think Tifa's a little stronger, but I also think Tifa expects more of Cloud then vice versa.

You're talking emotionally stronger right? Because physically I'd say Cloud is stronger, do to the fact that his strength stat is higher and he has SOLDIER enhancements.
 

Danseru-kun

Pro Adventurer
^

Matthew, of course Cloud is stronger than Tifa. He can hold out to more than one remnant attacking him when he had Geostigma while Tifa lost to Loz.

We're speaking about emotional strength. Yes, Cloud can function without Tifa technically but we're talking about the context of AC where all of them are carrying sins and mistakes from the past. Tifa is doing a lot better than Cloud in moving on. We can argue that indeed, Cloud had it worse than Tifa but he's shutting himself off from others.

Tifa is like "it's so painful but as a family we can work things out."
Cloud is like "I suck so please don't bother with me..."
 

Vendel

Banned
Actually, no. The reason he was around, at least at first, was because he thought he was getting paid. He was in his cold mercenary persona at that point. After he dropped that persona, I'd say he probably was around because of Tifa, but I'd say that's the main reason not the only reason. She was what he was fighting for, after all.

Tifa found him at the train station. He joined because of Tifa. He stays because of Tifa.

One of the guidbooks even states that it is Tifa and not the money that gets him to stay. Ask Ryu or someone else more versed in the older ones to tell you which.
 
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Kermitu Kleric Katie

KULT OF KERMITU
Tifa found him at the train station. He joined because of Tifa. He stays because of Tifa.

One of the guidbooks even states that it is Tifa and not the money that gets him to stay. Ask Ryu or someone else more versed in the older ones to tell you which.

Really, I didn't know that. I mean I know he joined because of her, but I didn't know that one of the official guidebooks say he stayed because of her. So I guess he did. Guess that's why they say actions speak louder than words.
 
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