Faith v. 3.0 (Cloti Club)

Yumelinh

Yumelinh

Pro Adventurer
Eerie said:
That's because, it's not done in good faith. People who do this either hate Tifa, or the idea of cloti. So they fight against the narrative, which makes their argument well... full of shit.

They think Case of Tifa displays Cloud's unhappiness. But that's not true. Case of Tifa displays Tifa's own insecurities as Cloud fears more and more to lose her and the kids. Cloud has already lost his mother, his hometown, Zack and Aerith. The mere idea of losing the only important beloved ones who are left send him into depression, which causes him to close off and Tifa to fear to lose *him*. All of this gets resolved in AC:C, where Cloud gets healed by Aerith (thanks sweetie <3) and gets out of his depression to not fall back in anymore.
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That's about it. People tend to forget that Case of Tifa is entirely Tifa's POV, aka an unreliable narrator, as she's going through her own fears and insecurities regarding where her relationship with Cloud/her family with him stands. This doesn't begin only when Cloud starts to fall into depression, in fact, she's the only one not so sure about their future when Cloud is the one reassuring her. When he can't do that anymore due to his own problems, that's when she begins to fall even more into her own insecurities.

That's also the reason why CoT focuses more on the Aerith part of Cloud's guilt because this is tied up with Tifa's insecurities as well. But it was never supposed to mean that Cloud wasn't sure about their relationship or something like this, but that Tifa was, due to her own character's flaw. AC:C proves just that as we learn he was also dealing with his guilt towards Zack and his fear of losing the people that were precious to him all over again.

Shadowfox said:
As Eerie said, interpretations like that aren't done in good faith. The ones who do it aren't interested in looking at the story and the characters; they're there to elevate their ship above all else. Tifa can't be seen by them as any kind of person; she's just reduced to the obstacle to their ship who must be removed at all costs.
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That's what I dislike the most about the LTD, really. The LTD in itself is fine, and it works nicely storywise. Aerith is my baby and all her interactions with Cloud are very sweet, I just love them.

But It's how Tifa always ends up getting the short end of the stick when it comes to fan's interpretation overall that really rubs me the wrong way. She doesn't deserve that at all :/

odekopeko said:
Hi guys. Hope it's okay to share some Cloti-related things with you.
Sakurai Takahiro (who voices Cloud) left a message about his history with FF7, how his 13 year old self geeked out to this game, and he reflects on how Tifa stole his heart, and how she has the kind of personality he really likes. Thought it was cute.
View attachment 6337
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Thanks for the info!! Sakurai is working hard to keep his title as Tifa's Fanby #1, huh?! :D


Do you mind telling me where is this from?
 
rkss

rkss

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Me
I did. Felt like this wasn't the place to post it. Ultimania's thread maybe
Carry on. Don't mind me.
 
odekopeko

odekopeko

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Peko
@Yumelinh The quote I put up from Takahiro Sakurai wasn't dated. He was hinting at the end that he would meet Cloud again in a way that he never could have imagined, so I assume it's an older comment, as he's hinting at himself voicing the character.

Also, he was 13 when the first installment of FF came out, not FF7. But since he's still gushing about her in the recent interviews, all I can say is, he's still pretty much in love.
 
Graymouse

Graymouse

Pro Adventurer
Whtat not to love about Tifa? She is a strong independent women who has a steel resolve and yet doesnt mind being helped from time to time.

A person who still have some insecurities but puts other people feeling first before hers. Especially Clouds.

Not to mention she is brutal on the battlefield, and one hell of fighter.
 
M

minami758

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Miiwoo
I find it hilarious that in Japanese, Sakurai speaks Tifa's name like it's some sort of gospel. That "oyasumi, Tifa" made me feel some kind of way.
 
odekopeko

odekopeko

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Peko
I wasn't a fan of Ito's voice acting in Advent Children. But, FF7R really changed my mind. That nervous laugh she did when she came to ask Cloud if he was leaving Midgar screamed, "Tifa!" to me. Personally, I can't imagine anyone else voicing Tifa now.

If you guys like Japanese films, or Shunji Iwai, I hope you check out her performance in About Lily Chou-chou. Thought she, and the entire young cast, was amazing. The strength of her character after experiencing deep trauma is really uplifting. I think I can kinda understand why Nomura chose her for the role.
 
M

minami758

Pro Adventurer
AKA
Miiwoo
I think Ito's improved a lot over the years for not being a VA to begin with. She's used to live-action acting, so it makes sense to me that her performance in AC wasn't as great. And even now, Tifa is the only character she VAs. But yeah, I agree with @odekopeko, I think her work in the Remake is really well done.
 
Eerie

Eerie

Fire and Blood
Oh the pic you're missing from rkss is saying that at the end of ch3, Cloud was supposed to go into Tifa's bedroom and find some XX object lol.

I think the English VA for Cloud doesn't say Tifa as soft as Sakurai's or even the French VA. That "Bonne nuit, Tifa" was almost on par with Sakurai lol, while the English version was very disappointing.
 
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Final_Heaven

Final_Heaven

Pro Adventurer
Eerie said:
Oh the pic you're missing from rkss is saying that at the end of ch3, Cloud was supposed to go into Tifa's bedroom and find some XX object lol.

I think the English VA for Cloud doesn't say Tifa as soft as Sakurai's or even the French VA. That "Bonne nuit, Tifa" was alsmot on par with Sakurai lol, while the English version was very disappointing.
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In terms of tone, Cloud's English VA just gives it a different flavor.

Rather than gentle, Cloud's English varies it a bit between desperate, gentle and neutral.

 
Graymouse

Graymouse

Pro Adventurer
Yeah, I thought Ayumi-san VA for Tifa in the Remake was spot on. You can hear the passion, nervousness, love, and care in her voice. I am so glad what she brought to Tifa's character.
 
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Eerie

Eerie

Fire and Blood
iamhorde said:
Speaking of music, not sure if this has been posted before but there was a recent reddit thread on how Tifa's theme is actually a male / female duet.

Quoting the reddit thread

It begins with male/female parts in harmony, then call and response, then back to harmony. Two voices as variations on a theme, trying to find each other. Pure magic.


There's also an awesome analysis of the theme in musical theory. I'm not entirely sure if Nobuo Uematsu had Cloud and Tifa's relationship in mind when he composed this, but even if he didn't it's almost like the universe is shipping CloTi, this can't be an accident :lol:
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I've rewatched the ch14 scene while focusing on the music, and it's so satisfying. BTW, if you want to see the differences between the EN, JP and FR, I've found a video :monster:


Cloud's "mais non ne dis pas ça !" is just so much kinder than the EN translation.
 
Graymouse

Graymouse

Pro Adventurer
[rant]

So, I went back and looked at the cess pool of replies in the old tweets that you guys were talking about. I know that this was brought up before but Why oh Why do they keep saying the Nojima says that Aerith and Cloud are lovers? I can't believe that they don't know from who's point of view that is. It is from Aerith's point of view not Nojima's.

I guess the High Wind Scene is optional now too.? Also, since when does appearing in the credits of any game make it that canon? Did I miss that chapter in "How to ship a couple" book?

[/rant]
 
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iamhorde

iamhorde

Pro Adventurer
Eerie said:
I've rewatched the ch14 scene while focusing on the music, and it's so satisfying. BTW, if you want to see the differences between the EN, JP and FR, I've found a video :monster:


Cloud's "mais non ne dis pas ça !" is just so much kinder than the EN translation.
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Thanks for sharing this, first time hearing the FR voices and it's pretty good! There's definitely a clear difference in tone by Cloud for the JP and FR version, and I'm not even a French speaker.

There has been several analysis on how the EN script seems to focus on sustaining the LTD in key areas whereas the JP version is much more neutral. The first and probably most iconic scene is at the Train Graveyard where Aerith holds on to Cloud's hand and says "Mine", whereas in the JP version she says "Ne" (ね), which is more like "right?" (source).

Another scene is when there were at the sewers and if Cloud wakes Tifa up first. In the EN version, Tifa is portrayed to be a little jealous by asking "sure there isn't anything else going on?" whereas the JP version was more of a "can we trust her?" notion, which makes perfect sense considering the situation.

I'm curious to find out if the LTD is as strong in JP as compared to outside JP as it seems SE is playing down the LTD in the native language version.


odekopeko said:
I did find another pink object in her room that I thought was XX but it turned out to be pink socks View attachment 6345?
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Pretty sure the SE ethics department would have kept anything risque in the drawers ;)


Graymouse said:
[rant]

Why oh Why do they keep saying the Nojima says that Aerith and Cloud are lovers? I can't believe that they don't know from who's point of view that is. It is from Aerith's point of view not Nojima's.

[/rant]
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I'm hoping they would change that in the Remake, especially if SE are indeed trying to tone down the LTD. Thanks for the fanart btw,
 
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