Edley
Pray for Sound
- AKA
- Issac Dian, Dudley, Chev Chelios
Faith v. 3.0 (Cloti Club)
- Thread starter Tennyo
- Start date
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
What is strange, is that Cloud only did that for a very short time. After being cured from geostigma, didn't Cloud move back to live with Tifa and the kids. So, Cloud jumped right back in bed with Tifa that very night! Without a second thought otherwise.
You don't get to $12K a month in Patreon revenue just by working hard and editing videos with salient points.
Damn didn't realize he made that much. Well, guess a man's gotta eat, lol.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Even, if she hasn't played CC yet, I didn't really get that the game was going Cloud X Aerith direction at all. In fact a lot of people were complaining that it went too much in Cloud X Tifa direction this time around. So, I am not sure how that conclusion could be made. If that is the case I am not sure that I played the same game as everyone else did? Remember we didn't know that Zack might be alive until the end. So, I am left scratching my head on this one.
There was way too much going on between Tifa and Cloud to see otherwise in my honest opinion. I think there have been others who have also blind played through FF7 Remake and thought the other way around. So, I guess different point of views.
Edited to make my sentences more cohesive.
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Yumelinh
Pro Adventurer
Another one <3 I wish I could know what they're talking here.. language barriers sucks ;-;
Edit: fix double post
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Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Another one <3 I wish I could know what they're talking here.. language barriers sucks ;-;
Edit: fix double post
If my Japanese is correct,
The last one is where Cloud says to Tifa, "To hurry back" (this one I am not so sure about)
yeah, what @odekopeko said.
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odekopeko
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Peko
いってらっしゃい means a lot of things, even see you later, like @Graymouse said. It can translate to any of those things in English. 
Shadowfox
You look like you need a monkey
I want to check about this particular line from the scene in Tifa's room:
The line in the Japanese script was:
本当はみんなといっしょに遊びたいのに
どうしても、仲間に入れてって言えなかった
Which looks to me is more: "I really wanted to play with everyone, but I just couldn't tell them to join me/let me in"
Is my reading of the Japanese line correct? Because, IMO, it gives a different read on the situation; that Cloud not being part of the group was due to his inability to open up to the others, not because he wasn't allowed in.
The line in the Japanese script was:
本当はみんなといっしょに遊びたいのに
どうしても、仲間に入れてって言えなかった
Which looks to me is more: "I really wanted to play with everyone, but I just couldn't tell them to join me/let me in"
Is my reading of the Japanese line correct? Because, IMO, it gives a different read on the situation; that Cloud not being part of the group was due to his inability to open up to the others, not because he wasn't allowed in.
Ryushikaze
Deus Admiral Parsimonious, PHD, DDS, MD, JD, OBE
- AKA
- Tim, Ryu
Assuming that PM was here, i got one too. Havent bothered dealing with it yet. Much better things to do.
Vortigern
Pro Adventurer
I've seen alot of good things said about his video series but I can't bring myself to watch it knowing how slanted he is with his shipping. I'm sure the segments not involving Aerith or Tifa are insightful but I don't think I could stomach the other parts. I also don't buy that he got too busy with other projects or whatever his reasoning was that made him stop at the end of Disc 1. It comes off too much a bit on the nose to not even consider picking the video series back up at a later date and to forever leave it with Aerith's last moment.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
In this contex, Tifa is asking what Cloud is doing? Or Why? is the direct translation.
The picture on the bottom left pains my heart. I think her reaction when Sephrioth ran her through, was some of the cutest facial expression on her face, but such heart breaking at the same time. I love it but I also hate it.
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Master Bates
Do you enjoy your life?
- AKA
- Mr. Koiwai
That was my confession to you, Ryu. I wanted to tell you I was secretly a Clerith all along.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Not sure if this is the right place to put this, but I guess I want to vent some frustration that there is a lot of misinformation going around. Or perhaps I just need some vindication and that I am have not gone insane.
I just watched a Cloud X Aerith video, and I am genuinely confused. I am so confused on how some people can twist things so bad and think that Cloud has a resolution scene? When in the FF7R Ultimania only has 3 listed. Cloud's resolution scene is Aeriths CH14 scene? Since this one is the only one that shows up in the credits, that means it is Cloud's resolution? How does one come to that conclusion? Correct me if I am wrong but Cloud X Aerith only believe in "if it is in the credits it is canon" line? I need help out of this craziness.
I just watched a Cloud X Aerith video, and I am genuinely confused. I am so confused on how some people can twist things so bad and think that Cloud has a resolution scene? When in the FF7R Ultimania only has 3 listed. Cloud's resolution scene is Aeriths CH14 scene? Since this one is the only one that shows up in the credits, that means it is Cloud's resolution? How does one come to that conclusion? Correct me if I am wrong but Cloud X Aerith only believe in "if it is in the credits it is canon" line? I need help out of this craziness.
Final_Heaven
Pro Adventurer
Not sure if this is the right place to put this, but I guess I want to vent some frustration that there is a lot of misinformation going around. Or perhaps I just need some vindication and that I am have not gone insane.
I just watched a Cloud X Aerith video, and I am genuinely confused. I am so confused on how some people can twist things so bad and think that Cloud has a resolution scene? When in the FF7R Ultimania only has 3 listed. Cloud's resolution scene is Aeriths CH14 scene? Since this one is the only one that shows up in the credits, that means it is Cloud's resolution? How does one come to that conclusion? Correct me if I am wrong but Cloud X Aerith only believe in "if it is in the credits it is canon" line? I need help out of this craziness.
This is a pretty good post by someone that ships both but originally shipped only Cloud x Aerith until they got the proper info:
Ruri
Pro Adventurer
I follow that tumblr and enjoy that persons thoughts/analysis a lot. They also said some time ago the same thing I wish people would just understand: 'Just accept shit as it is, it ain't that big of a deal and if you can do that, you'll live an easier life' Instead of you know, spending a decent amount of two decades fighting against something that ain't really that deep.
It's also great to see themselves admit to being hesitant to C/T and still preferring C/A because you know even when they are vouching for C/T, it is still going against their bias so it is simply just refreshing to see.
It's also great to see themselves admit to being hesitant to C/T and still preferring C/A because you know even when they are vouching for C/T, it is still going against their bias so it is simply just refreshing to see.
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DutchDread
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Dutch Dread
Yeah, I personally still don't understand why people would like Aerith/Cloud as a story element, although my view might be biased since the entire LTD and flamewars the thing has caused have caused me to actively despise the entire thing even existing. But even I have never felt the need to go out of my way to pretend that Cloud at no point cared for Aerith at all.
I personally don't believe it can be real love because of the time restriction alongside the whole "Cloud isn't himself" aspect, but yeah, when he wasn't himself he seemingly had a crush on both, and even when he was himself, I am sure there was still some lingering affection there, the philosophical debate concerning how much of that is genuine not really being of interest to me. At worst I'd say she's a cherished memory afterwards of unspecified and uncertain emotions.
But when Tifa/Cloud is being pulled down Cloud is presented as an uncaring psychopath who uses women as he sees fit, and only sees Tifa as someone who makes his meals for him while he searches for Aerith until the end of time, an inhuman monster without nuance or growth, while Tifa is a jealous abusive wretch of a woman.
It's really disturbing.
Ruri
Pro Adventurer
Fortunately the type of fan you are talking about get banned from LTD sections for character assassination. If we go by the recent example on this board. Other things too but those also didn't go unnoticed or unpunished. Anyone else who shares that opinion doesn't much venture over here to the LTD discussion. The rest prefer to leave those type of gross interpretations to their fandom corners where people of the same mind can click the 'like' button and fan the flames and allow their iron grip view on the characters to spiral down and down to a point of no return. I can see why debating on 'neutral' ground doesn't gel well with that type of fan.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Yeah, this is the Tifa hate that I can't stand the most. If you are going to debate your point of view, by all means debate it, but when you just out right ignore the other sides opinions and keep throwing out nonsense while looking through rose colored glasses, it gets to a point of where you don't even want to debate any more. When the debate no longer is fun and it becomes work, it is way too bothersome to continue the conversation. The sad part about it is that I see so much of this all around now. Even more so since the Remake. (This could be that I haven't been as invested in FF7 before the Remake, but I have felt that there has been an uptick of Anti Tifa stuff on social media) I hate the entire if our side can't have Cloud neither can yours dichotomy! Could it be that SE is finally providing the information that Cloud X Tifa have known all along?
I just wish that SE would outright decide this LTD and leave no doubts. (whatever side they choose) I think that would be the best thing for all of us quite frankly. The LTD has been going on for far too long and it is almost to a point where enough is enough.
DutchDread
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Dutch Dread
Agreed, I think the LTD was a fun thing back in 1997, it was fun for a while you know, speculating about it, but eventually people want some closure.
When I heard that SE was specifically going to make sure that both girls got equal representation in the remake my first thought was.
"I get that you don't want to upset anyone, and I know the love triangle aspect probably brings in money", but just end it already, give us closure on this so people can learn to enjoy what we have instead of trying to make what we have into the thing we enjoy. The love triangle doesn't become meaningless just because it's eventually resolved. You know how lucky SE was that Zack/Aerith became as popular as it did? That gave them an out.
It's 23 been years, I want to move on, and I want Cloud to move on, AC, CC, everything has slowly worked our ways towards the resolution, now just stick the landing.
Eerie
Fire and Blood
I think they said that for this part, it was especially worrying for cloti fans since in the OG, there's isn't a lot of cloti scenes. The upped parts in cloti representation show just how much it was underdevelopped in Midgar and how much clerith was pushed at that time. And it's like, 25% to 30% of the story game? So it was like, a lot was missing from the get go to make it a believable pair by the end.
I always believed that how much the OG pushed clerith was the reason why the LTD existed anyway, because fans weren't able to accept Tifa as the answer.
I always believed that how much the OG pushed clerith was the reason why the LTD existed anyway, because fans weren't able to accept Tifa as the answer.
DutchDread
Pro Adventurer
- AKA
- Dutch Dread
Yeah, that's what I hope. I understand making it equal right up until either the moment Aerith dies, or until Cloud gets his memories back. But I REALLY hope they don't try to make it equal afterwards.
In my ideal telling of FFVII, think that's where the LTD is supposed to exist, within the narrative of those few weeks. Even though I love Cloti, I DO actually want it to exist in those weeks. I want whether the feelings were genuine or not to stay ambiguous afterwards to some degree, I don't want them to flat out say "it was all Zack", nor do I want them to say "NO!, it was always 100% the real Cloud!". I think both do a disservice to the complexity of what is going on (and I think both are impossible in practice). And I think this is the sort of thing that really cannot be determined scientifically anyway, it really is a philosophical matter of perspective that each one of us has to decide for themselves.
Even between Cloud and the player, even if Cloud decides that he thinks it's genuine or not, the player can still disagree, because it's not objective, it's personal. And I think that's what the conversations should be about, in a friendly fashion.
But after the resolution, I honestly want the LTD gone, I don't care how much lingering feelings Cloud has for Aerith, and whether or not they're genuine, from that moment on, I just want the game to fully embrace the notion that "From this moment on, Tifa is endgame".
And I do think that when playing the game a second time, when you are able to see the game through the underlying plot instead of the narrative, you should be able to notice that there is SOMETHING about Clouds interactions with Aerith that might make them suspect, which doesn't exist with Tifa. It shouldn't be confirmed one way or the other whether it's Zack or not, but that wondering should always be itching.
You should, on a second playthrough, be able to tell that there is more to his interactions with both girls, with Tifa that there is an underlying longing, and a more deep seated love that is expressed more subtly, and with Aerith that despite the more obvious flirtatiousness, that it's more of a crush in comparison, and that there is SOMETHING weird about it. In other words, if knowing the plot doesn't re-contextualize his interactions with both of them, the game has failed imo.
Right now I feel like the remake is doing a pretty good job at that, although I might be reading into it. And statements like how Clouds voice actor should behave differently around Aerith and Tifa really give me hope, as well as the more prominent role of Zack, and Aeriths clear pain at losing him.
Graymouse
Pro Adventurer
Funny, While I was waiting for replies on this thread I came across an LTD article on this very site, that I hadn't noticed before!
https://thelifestream.net/lifestrea...gle-of-ffvii-an-analysis-by-squall_of_seed/7/
That was written back in 2009. If you have about 15 to 30 mins of free time. It is one hell of a read. The points made are rock solid and backed up by official references. It was written by Makoeyes987
@Makoeyes987 If you ever get the time you should update that bad boy since the Remake came out and offers more details on both ships. I know it must have taken you a long time to articulate everything that you did. I really enjoyed the read, and I might have to quote you on some those things in the future!
https://thelifestream.net/lifestrea...gle-of-ffvii-an-analysis-by-squall_of_seed/7/
That was written back in 2009. If you have about 15 to 30 mins of free time. It is one hell of a read. The points made are rock solid and backed up by official references. It was written by Makoeyes987
@Makoeyes987 If you ever get the time you should update that bad boy since the Remake came out and offers more details on both ships. I know it must have taken you a long time to articulate everything that you did. I really enjoyed the read, and I might have to quote you on some those things in the future!